The Moon Male or female

beatnikgirl

Well-known member
I know traditionally within modern western astrology the moon is always seen as female, but I've recently looked at a couple of friends charts and their Moon seems to signify their Father. Is the Moon just a symbol of what gives us emotional encouragement nurtures us, if this is the case I guess the moon could be either gender.
In my own case The Moon I think symbolizes my Grandparents and older females who often take me under their wing because I think they sense a deep absence of early nurturing in my childhood.
All the long term relationships I've had with men I've found they have Moon in their first house, they often take on a nurturing role which can be hard work, because I lack trust in their sincerity because care without strings attached or having to be manipulative in order to get love and attention is the only way I got this kind of love.
Curious about others thoughts on the gender of the Moon.
In the equal house system my Moon sits my 10th House and and Saturn sit in opposition in my 4th house I wonder if this colours my experience of the Lunar gender.
 
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eternalautumn

The Moon is feminine.

Your discovery only highlights the fact that universal significators are flawed. If you look at enough charts, you could make any planet represent the father. I believe that only the domicile ruler of the 4th house represents the father.

That being said, the popular significators for the father are the Sun and/or Saturn. I recommend just sticking to those.
 

beatnikgirl

Well-known member
Well yes from a Western perspective, but in some cultures the moon is seen as male and even in ancient Babylon the moon was a male god called Sin

In inuit culture the Moon is male

Sun and Moon were sister and brother. They always took part in the copulation games in the young people's house. But one night, as Moon was trying to decide which girl he would try to find when the light was dimmed, his eyes fell upon his sister, and he thought she was the most beautiful of all. He noticed how her clothes were made, and when the lamp had been put out, he found her by feeling his way.

He did this many times. At last, Sun became suspicious, and she took a little soot from the lamp upon her fingers. During the copulation she pressed her fingers against the forehead of the man who took her. And when the lamp was lit again, she saw her brother Moon with soot on his face.

Sun became red and hot with shame. She took a whisk of moss from the heap by the lamp, dipped it in the blubber and lit it, and she ran out.

Moon wanted to follow her, but he was in such a hurry that he didn't get his moss lit very well.

"We must run far away and never see each other again," said Sun. And at the same moment they became spirits and were lifted up in the sky, where they continued their flight.

But Sun has the stronger warmer light, because her whisk of moss burns clearly. Her brother Moon, who pursues her but never can catch up with her, has the weaker colder light


basically I don't think such fixed gender specifics need to always apply, after all in the past many cultures thought the Sun was female the moon was male the sky was male and the earth was female.

in the past gender roles were so fixed, but as society and attitudes change so do our beliefs. As a above so below.

I think the softer more nurturing traits of the peronlity fit the moon and tradtionally that was seen as only female, but it could easily apply to either sex.

There has often been much discussion which house represents the mother and father, whether 10th/4th, and I think the general
view is whoever nutures and is the centre of the family is the 4th and who financiallly supports or brings power or wealth and prestige to the family is the 10th, but you can see these days that could work with either gender.

I'm pretty openminded about gender and planetary energies.
 
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eternalautumn

Okay, just to be clear, as far as astrology goes, you can safely interpret "feminine" to mean "receptive, nurturing, sensitive". The term doesn't mean that the Moon is a female entity, or else we would say the Moon is female. It's just to show energy. That's also why there are distinctions between night (feminine) and day (masculine), north and south, east and west, fire and water, earth and air, higher and lower, etc., in astrology.

And to top it all off, masculine (positive) was considered good, and feminine (negative) was considered bad.

You have to be careful not to mix human gender and sexuality in with the system of astrology, as they have nothing to do with each other.
 
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eternalautumn

Some of the many significations of the 4th house were the Earth, property and estate, immovable posessions, mining, agriculture, and other trades of the Earth, the grave, the beginning and end of all things, and ancestry. In ancient times, and today, you inherited your name from your father, among other things, so when circumstance called for separating the parents in a chart, the mother was moved to the 10th house. But for the most part, both parents are represented by the 4th house and its rulers.

The only reason people today associate the mother with the 4th is because of the artificial linking of the Zodiac with the houses, which is a false idea. They are two separate things, even though they are used together.
 

Claire19

Well-known member
I know traditionally within modern western astrology the moon is always seen as female, but I've recently looked at a couple of friends charts and their Moon seems to signify their Father. Is the Moon just a symbol of what gives us emotional encouragement nurtures us, if this is the case I guess the moon could be either gender.
In my own case The Moon I think symbolizes my Grandparents and older females who often take me under their wing because I think they sense a deep absence of early nurturing in my childhood.
All the long term relationships I've had with men I've found they have Moon in their first house, they often take on a nurturing role which can be hard work, because I lack trust in their sincerity because care without strings attached or having to be manipulative in order to get love and attention is the only way I got this kind of love.
Curious about others thoughts on the gender of the Moon.
In the equal house system my Moon sits my 10th House and and Saturn sit in opposition in my 4th house I wonder if this colours my experience of the Lunar gender.
Moon in the 10th is classic for the father being the nurturing figure and grandparents belong in the 1st and 7th houses and their aspects. However your Moon does denote females in general and you may find that a boss at work or someone connected to your career takes a mothering sort of role. Saturn in the 4th is also indicative of father being the domesticated nurturing one also. So you have a double whammy there. Often Saturn in the 4th can mean lack of nurturance in the family home
depending on its aspects. A lack of warmth and sometimes comfort. Sometimes the mother is out in the world and working a lot and does not have the time or the energy to give the nurturance or is a cold distant figure.
 

dr. farr

Well-known member
Some ancient astrological traditions regard the Moon as changing in "gender" according to phase: New = "female", waxing = "male", Full = "male"; waning = "female"

For me, the various male/female allocations to planets and signs is a misunderstanding of energetic modulations; like eternalautumn I believe what is really (actually) involved is modulations of + and - subtle energetics; I myself follow Taoist concepts elaborating Yin and Yang principles in these matters, rather than medieval European/Islamic based ideas, relative to this subject.
 

Claire19

Well-known member
The Moon is feminine.

Your discovery only highlights the fact that universal significators are flawed. If you look at enough charts, you could make any planet represent the father. I believe that only the domicile ruler of the 4th house represents the father.

That being said, the popular significators for the father are the Sun and/or Saturn. I recommend just sticking to those.
THe Moon represents the feminine or yin energies. I prefer to use yin and yang rather than masculine or feminine which is limiting especially in today's world with stereotyping of the sexes being less rigid i.e. Aquarian age.
Some men stay home and are house husbands and the woman is the breadwinner but I still think the 10th represents the authoritiarian parent who is out in the world, and the 4th represents the home and the domestic issues and our sense of roots and hereditary.

Traditionally Saturn rules the 10th and Moon the 4th but when they are in reverse houses then the reverse applies. When the Moon is in a yang sign and Saturn and Sun in yin signs then the stereotyping is also challenged.
 

Nexus7

Well-known member
Well, I do tend to experience the Moon as being to do with the 'yin' polarity.

I remember that in some cases where the Moon is male, it is then called the 'true husband' of all women. In some European countries, curtains are closed at night so the Moon can't come down in the night and interfere with innocent maidens as they chastely slumber. An old landlady of mine in Hungary also expressed sentiments such as these on bright moonlit nights...
 

beatnikgirl

Well-known member
Thanks skillcoil. It Would be interesting to see if others with Pallas in the 1st have similar experiences.

I like to think as human consciousness expands and our experiences diversify astrology our experience and reading of the astrological symbolism will expand it is perhaps wrong to cling too rigidly to strict gender constraints.

In the ancient world if a woman had a poorly aspected/populated 7th house which signified her unlikliness to develop a relationship it would probably be expected that she would also be unlikely to have children. Because of social constraints, but we all know that isn't the case in modern times, attitudes have changed and Nature and technology have found a way.

Also someone with Saturn in there 7th would signify widowhood or lack of relationships, where now it would probably signify if not poorly aspected an older spouse or a relationship later in life, because of the way science and societies attitudes have changed it's more likely and acceptable to have an older partner whether your male or female and life expectancy has increased. Even a hard aspected saturn could just signify divorce, something not available or accepted when the foundations of astrology were being formed.

So I think we need to address how things have change, the babylonians changed many of their original concepts of the gender rulership of planets, because society moved from being mainly small rural farming matriarchal centred communities to growing city trading labouring patriarchal societies.

we need to be just as flexible and mindful of our own experiences and perceptions of how astrology expands and manifest.
 

Claire19

Well-known member
Okay, just to be clear, as far as astrology goes, you can safely interpret "feminine" to mean "receptive, nurturing, sensitive". The term doesn't mean that the Moon is a female entity, or else we would say the Moon is female. It's just to show energy. That's also why there are distinctions between night (feminine) and day (masculine), north and south, east and west, fire and water, earth and air, higher and lower, etc., in astrology.

And to top it all off, masculine (positive) was considered good, and feminine (negative) was considered bad.

You have to be careful not to mix human gender and sexuality in with the system of astrology, as they have nothing to do with each other.
Likewise active and passive used to describe the masculine and feminine energies. In some cultures misogyny was rife so why take any notice of those descriptions?
 

Claire19

Well-known member
Thanks skillcoil. It Would be interesting to see if others with Pallas in the 1st have similar experiences.

I like to think as human consciousness expands and our experiences diversify astrology our experience and reading of the astrological symbolism will expand it is perhaps wrong to cling too rigidly to strict gender constraints.

In the ancient world if a woman had a poorly aspected/populated 7th house which signified her unlikliness to develop a relationship it would probably be expected that she would also be unlikely to have children. Because of social constraints, but we all know that isn't the case in modern times, attitudes have changed and Nature and technology have found a way.

Also someone with Saturn in there 7th would signify widowhood or lack of relationships, where now it would probably signify if not poorly aspected an older spouse or a relationship later in life, because of the way science and societies attitudes have changed it's more likely and acceptable to have an older partner whether your male or female and life expectancy has increased. Even a hard aspected saturn could just signify divorce, something not available or accepted when the foundations of astrology were being formed.

So I think we need to address how things have change, the babylonians changed many of their original concepts of the gender rulership of planets, because society moved from being mainly small rural farming matriarchal centred communities to growing city trading labouring patriarchal societies.

we need to be just as flexible and mindful of our own experiences and perceptions of how astrology expands and manifest.
Absolutely brilliant comment. Saturn actually is exalted in Libra and the 7th house you may say as it describes loyalty, endurance and a real attitude to relationship with a sense of responsibility and without Saturn contacts, even the challenging ones we do not have long lasting relationships of any kind. I believe it is involved in karmic debt and credit.
 

Claire19

Well-known member
Well, I do tend to experience the Moon as being to do with the 'yin' polarity.

I remember that in some cases where the Moon is male, it is then called the 'true husband' of all women. In some European countries, curtains are closed at night so the Moon can't come down in the night and interfere with innocent maidens as they chastely slumber. An old landlady of mine in Hungary also expressed sentiments such as these on bright moonlit nights...
I agree that it is the yin polarity and has to do with domestic issues, the home and emotional conditioning that comes from that and is also hereditary traits as well as nurturance issues. In this modern world we dont have to stick with the traditional male and female roles as we all have yin and yang energies. There are same sex families and parents now for instance.
 
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eternalautumn

In this modern world we dont have to stick with the traditional male and female roles as we all have yin and yang energies. There are same sex families and parents now for instance.

My point was, and still is, is that we shouldn't think about "male" and "female" in human terms, but in natural ones, and using the above examples all as synonyms for the same duality...
 

dr. farr

Well-known member
My point was, and still is, is that we shouldn't think about "male" and "female" in human terms, but in natural ones, and using the above examples all as synonyms for the same duality...


I fully agree with this point of view, and that's why I have, for my own work, substituted yin/yang subtle energy concepts for "gender".
 

Pallas-trine-Mars

Well-known member
I think female/feminine work. Would you say Mars is a girl and Venus a boy? Well who knows. Of course, it's important to remember what terms like feminine and masculine mean, receptive, dynamic etc.

But remember, the names and descriptions come from a culture that had personified it's gods.
 

Claire19

Well-known member
The Moon is feminine.

Your discovery only highlights the fact that universal significators are flawed. If you look at enough charts, you could make any planet represent the father. I believe that only the domicile ruler of the 4th house represents the father.

That being said, the popular significators for the father are the Sun and/or Saturn. I recommend just sticking to those.
I dont agree about any planet representing the father unless in the 10th or ruler of...
.
The 4th is traditionally the nurturer, the one at home and usually the mother. Ruled by the Moon and Cancer. That doesnt change.
In this day and age there is often role reversal but traditionally the 10th is the authority figure, usually male, the one out in the world and the career person. Ruled by Capricorn and Saturn.
 

Claire19

Well-known member
I fully agree with this point of view, and that's why I have, for my own work, substituted yin/yang subtle energy concepts for "gender".
I find it much more suitable also. I am predominantly yang and a woman that is still perceived as quite female....Okay I have a Pisces, very yin, ascendant. So to use masculine and feminine terminology is restrictive and not really representative. Some use active and passive but I prefer yin and yang...In this day and age of gender bending and stereotype breakdowns i.e. Aquarian age, where there are househusbands and career wives for instance, it is appropriate. NOt to mention more acceptance of homosexuality and those who are transgender or transvestite.
 
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Humanitarian

Well-known member
Moon can be both female and male, as in modern societies, we see the Moon as female and the Sun as male, but in the ancient times, it was vice versa, Sun was female and Moon was male. But, back then, female were more active than males, because of ancient matriarchy and nowadays, males are more active than females, because of modern patriarchy, so Sun is active/yang, Moon is passive/yin, which are more accurate terms than human genders. Maybe passive males are Lunar, and active males are Solar? But maybe passive masculine people can be Lunar men, and active feminine people can also be Lunar men? I see that men you met are more an active feminine kind of men, rather than the passive masculine kind.
 
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