Random Thoughts, strictly Text

conspiracy theorist

Well-known member
Nice use of transits. I was thinking particularly of the way her Mercury got her in trouble for something that seems perfectly legitimate. I mean, someone burns you in effigy and puts a price on your head, it seems pretty mild to respond by calling them hooligans. But she was very much made to pay for it.

I've noticed a pattern with Leo ascendants and that is they never back down from a fight and they are willing to go to the mat to hold unto their point of view. An Angular Mars domiciled shows the fighting spirit, not to mention the culminating Uranus.

I wonder, Mercury attached to a fallen Jupiter - voicing the "wrong" beliefs? There is a viewpoint that I've seen some trads espouse that detriment/fall leads to socially unacceptable outcomes from the planet affected. I see some dim connection with Mercury in detriment because it seems that it makes for out-of-box thinking - noting specifically the prevalence of Pisces Mercuries among the intellectually gifted.
 

conspiracy theorist

Well-known member
If you want an example that blows socially acceptable out of the water, we can mention Hitler. A Jupiter ruled by Saturn and Mars is dogmatic, has a narrower focus, hard-lined and willing to go to war unlike the openness and freedom of movement that Jupiter "should" represent.

I'm not bad with compliments, but sometimes I get blindsided by them because my headspace just isn't there. I usually nestle compliments in a broader discussion or for purposes of elaboration so I don't burden the other person with a need to respond, since I'm aware of how awkward people can be with compliments.
 
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conspiracy theorist

Well-known member
I'm digging in my memory and I can't recall anyone who has looked at his chart dynamically/in-movement. A lot of people have discussed his chart, as you'd imagine, and I'm sure some would have also mentioned transits and directions that happened in his chart. There was a discussion on his chart many years ago on this forum that was focused on why he was a Scorpio rising instead of Libra - which was filled with a lot of shallow reasoning because of course no Libra rising could be "evil".

There is also a book about an astrologer who was working in National Socialist Germany, you can find that on skyscript but obviously that's not the same thing.

Here is a broader discussion that used Hitler as the example to get the ball rolling.

https://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=47750
 

conspiracy theorist

Well-known member
And no point in noting that Jupiter and Moon are in fall and pushed around by Saturn in Leo without also observing the nodal axis also involves the three and that Moon and Jupiter are together, presumably resulting in the capacity to connect emotionally with not just masses, but shamed ones.

I've never seen it expressed that way before. I like that take.

Astrologically, I see why he says its an excessive Venus - it's the final dispositor of the chart, directly rules 4 planets, is domiciled and angular. It's a very forceful Venus. Can't deny that he didn't have a talent for connecting with others. To monstrous proportions.

Relevant to me is that his philosophy has taken root in many underground places on the internet, and the position of national socialism is making a resurgence in world politics. Pluto going over his Moon/Jupiter/Nodes perhaps? Shamed ones is a good descriptor of the types that congregate around his ideas.

As to contemporaries having the same chart factors, I've enjoyed this take on that question immensely since it explores the idea a little more than is usually done. https://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showpost.php?p=422783&postcount=20

I've noticed idiosyncratic patterns with close births. Although it's only a few date ranges that I've noticed firsthand.
 
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david starling

Well-known member
Quite a Stellium opposite Neptune!
I'm feeling it as a sort of "controlled volatility", with Mercury trine Saturnus as running the show.
 
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david starling

Well-known member
Saturnus is the Latin for the Greek "Cronos". We should be calling it Saturnus, not the cropped version, Saturn. Since there's no asteroid named Saturnus, I might be able to use "Saturnus" in place of "Saturn" without having to add :)saturn:) at the end in order for it to be understood as the Astrological Planet "Saturn". With Urania as the goddess of the Heavens, it is necessary to add :)uranus:) to avoid confusing the Astrological Planet Urania:)uranus:) with the asteroid named Urania.
 

david starling

Well-known member
The idea was to give all the planets Latin names, but the astronomers (who do the naming) messed up on 2 of them: Saturnus, which they shortened to Saturn; and Uranus, which is Greek with a Latin ending, equivalent to "Zeupiter".
The actual Latin name for :uranus: is "Caelus" , meaning the god of the Heavens, deposed by Saturnus. For some reason, "Caelus" didn't suit their fancy, so they had to concoct a name that's neither Greek nor Latin. It appears they also wanted gods only, no new goddesses allowed when it came to the three Outermosts. That's a total of 7 males and 1 female. Perhaps they were influenced by the fairy tale "Snow White and the 7 Dwarfs", with Venus as Snow White. :lol:
 
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david starling

Well-known member
Ok, it looks like Liz Greene has sketched it very well, for some reason it is easier to talk about the shadowy side of Jupiter’s benefic than Venus, and most Venusian shadow talk is directed more at Libra.

http://songsdomain.tripod.com/taurusshadow1/index.html

Lucifer is the "shadowy" side of Venus. Originally, it meant "Light-bringer", in the context of Venus as Morning-star, but Milton changed that when he identified Lucifer as a beautiful guise of the Devil in Paradise Lost.
 

david starling

Well-known member
David, any good sources you can think of on shadow Venus or Lucifer that are not religious in origin? There is an overweening sense of patriarchy potentially corrupts analysis, or at least stacks the deck lopsidedly against the Earth.

The first reference to the planet now known as Venus is from ancient Sumeria's "Queen of the Heavens", Inanna/Ishtar, who was goddess of war and justice as Morning-star, and goddess of love as Evening-star.
We're dealing with astrology that uses the names of the ancient gods and goddesses relating to what Jung called archetypes.
 

david starling

Well-known member
Hitler's Chart in 12/12 is rather weird. His Libran Asc leads to a Squared resonance between a most elevated and Exalted Saturn in Leo and a nearly exact Venus/Mars conjunction in Taurus. Venus in Taurus is Exalted, whereas Mars in Taurus is "in its Fall" (since Mars in 12/12 is Exalted in Scorpio).
 
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conspiracy theorist

Well-known member
Ok, it looks like Liz Greene has sketched it very well, for some reason it is easier to talk about the shadowy side of Jupiter’s benefic than Venus, and most Venusian shadow talk is directed more at Libra.

http://songsdomain.tripod.com/taurusshadow1/index.html

Mercury and Venus as well as their signs are often sold short. Venus in particular I think it's underrated which is funny because there doesn't seem to be anything more maddening in the world than romantic love and feeling a connection to other people/humanity, if all the lamentations in music, art and market forces are anything to go by.

Having so many Taurus individuals in my life, this is something that I've actually picked up about them with a lot of the characteristics that Liz Greene outlined showing up. Energetically it feels dull, block-headed and "inanimate" when it at it's worst. Like you're interacting with an automaton.
 

david starling

Well-known member
You're right about Venus and Mercury being generally underrated by astrologers. Of course, we do have that Venusian association with Love, to go along with the expression "Love conquers all." And, the association of Venus with Victory in the Kabbalistic Tree of Life.
 

conspiracy theorist

Well-known member
You're right about Venus and Mercury being generally underrated by astrologers. Of course, we do have that Venusian association with Love, to go along with the expression "Love conquers all." And, the association of Venus with Victory in the Kabbalistic Tree of Life.

But how many people actually take that seriously? That love conquers all?
 

david starling

Well-known member
But how many people actually take that seriously? That love conquers all?

It's an Age of Capricorn situation: The tropical Age of Capricorn has Domicle-ruler Saturn, and Regulating-ruler Venus locked in struggle for dominance. The general view is that mortality, the death of the physical body as represented by Saturn, conquers all.
 

david starling

Well-known member
"That love is all there is,
Is all we know of love"-{Emily Dickinson}

John Lennon echoed that sentiment. But you're right, most of us are focused on the inevitability of death. The grim reaper is pictured as holding Saturn's harvest scythe.
 

david starling

Well-known member
I’ll delete this but domestic politics is money all the way. My state just (1 hour ago) passed a bill forcing kids who have been harmed by vaccination to submit to additional vaccinations without any exceptions. That may play like Jupiter on the surface, but it is nothing but craven grab for money and power, irrespective of consequence.

One definition of "evil" is causing great harm in the the guise of being helpful.
 
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