Progressed Charts

EJ53

Banned
Fermby said:
......(only through trying to impress my mother)

Using your day-for-a-year Progressed Chart for Age 42, the significant "Progressed to Natal Planet" aspects are as follows :-

Psun conjunct Nmoon
Pmoon opposed Npluto
Pmerc sextile Nmars
Pmars trine Nsun
Pmars sextile Npluto

Natally, Sun/Merc sextiles Pluto......and Moon/Venus sextiles Mars and is qcx Chiron.......So, these are the natal configurations being triggered by "progression".

Currently, transitting Jupiter/Neptune/Chiron in Aquarius (and Uranus in Pisces) is activating the Natal Moon/Venus/Mars/Chiron group.......and transitting Saturn in Virgo is energising the natal Sun/Merc/Pluto group.

Both transits are presenting you with an opportunity to learn something from the past (that you missed at the time)........Progressed Sun conjunct Natal Moon provides an opportunity to become conscious of subconscious motivations.......Progressed Moon opposed Natal Pluto, an opportunity to let go of redundant thought patterns.......Progressed Mercury sextile Natal Mars suggests these thought patterns relate to Libra/11th matters.......Progressed Mars trine Natal Sun and sextile Natal Pluto presents an opportunity for self-transformation through action.

Now......the answer to my next question is no-one's business but yours (and may be painful to recall because it involves Chiron).......However, you may benefit considerably from becoming conscious/aware of it yourself.....So :-

Why did the 7-11 year old Fernby believe he had to "impress his mother" (Saturn) rather than just accept that her love was "unconditional"?

EJ:sideways:
 

fernby

Active member
It is very painful but thank you
She made it conditional through emotional blackmail and coldness because she couldn't control me but that is OK because I realise she is human too and only did it because she didn't want me to get hurt (or grow up) just like I may do to my own kids (but hopefully not in the same way!)

Mother stuff huh? must be the root of a lot of people's issues .... how scary to be one yourself but it also allows true insight and forgiveness because you have the choice to realise most parents really do things only because they love you.

I know what I missed I think, you sparked it - I don't ever feel I fit into groups well because she always taught me to be a strong "individual" (shes an Aquarius)
Having said that she also taught me to be a humanitarian and support the underdog

Peace
 

EJ53

Banned
fernby said:
It is very painful but thank you........she always taught me to be a strong "individual"......to be a humanitarian and support the underdog

Excellent teaching............but you have to now consciously review those subconscious/instinctive beliefs you inherited from her......The Piscean ideals will become your own when you temper them with Virgoan logic/pragmatism......Use your heart to identify the right causes, and your head to fight the right battles.

Peace and best wishes.

EJ:smile:
 

EJ53

Banned
fernby said:
Ok I want to have a go at looking at someone's progressions! Any volunteers?

You will learn more from looking at past progressed charts rather than current/future progressed charts...........because the chart owner can confirm what actually happened and how it affected/changed them or their lives.

For example, I have Uranus in Gemini/9th (on MC) opposite Jupiter in Capricorn/4th (on IC) and qcx Sun/Chiron in Scorpio/3rd house.......This became a temporary "boomerang" configuration from 1992-1996, when Mars progressd over the relevant degrees of Capricorn/Aquarius..........And has now become one again, as the Sun is currently progressing over those same degrees........So, I know what the correct interpretation is for the Mars progression (because it's already happened) but I'm still guessing about the interpretation of the Sun progression.........But, whilst learning, we really need immediate feedback on whether or not our interpretation is valid/correct.
 
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fernby

Active member
OK that makes sense ...so I get this right.... the Uranus in gemini 9th (on mc) opp jup in cap (on IC) and qcx Sun/Chiron in Scorpio/3rd house..is the natal or progressed configuration? I am assuming the natal and then the mars was progression and now the sun progressing
How tight is the sun chiron conjunction? _ funny I was just looking into this natal conjunction the other day for a friend of mine - an interesting one

I really do not understand the energies of qcx - I shall investigate but never got my head around what it means that well

I've just realised how visual I am! I cannot see so cannot click with what is going on! I may need the data to see a chart
 

EJ53

Banned
fernby said:
.....I may need the data to see a chart

This is the natal configuration.............Mars progressed through 26 degrees of Capricorn to 2 degrees of Aquarius......contacting natal Sun, Chiron, Uranus and Jupiter as it did so.
 

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fernby

Active member
Oh Gosh I think I have to start with some natal stuff first if that is OK? This is hard! I've never seen a chart with the Asc lined up so neatly to the main angles, seems like it would be easier but not

First thing that jumps out at me is th natal Sun/Chiron in Scorpio/Third - problems with communication (possibly shyness) but has a special gift for it and also with gemini/uranus 10th, quite a bit of a rebel underneath, tendacy to have very inventive ideas but needs to temper them - that must be intensely frustrating. Excellent with detail. I'd be interested where Mercury is? Loss of a sibling or a feeling of loss of a sibling (only child?) or possible power struggles with siblings.

Obviously can't see full chart but this is the most dominant feature here this Sun/Chiron I have a friend who has this conjunction but not as tight in Aquarius and he is a celebrated humanitarian, this conjunction awards feelings of being special (I am here for THIS purpose) the ability to learn to deliver on this specialness but this comes with quite a lot of painful responsibility - yours very intense and surrounding communications and other third house issues.

Taking a guess the Mars progression was inconjunct your MC starting in your fourth hosue - something about struggles with compartmentalising your home/family with career, possibly with a major career change - the way you express yourself is not what people expect(ed) causing "shocks"

But the sextile to Chiron /Sun and the ssx to jupiter perhaps helped you to find something more of your "calling" - it was a brave choice but perhaps instinctive and I think the trine your asc helped the change marry up with what is more the real you - it is a progressed mars so where you are meant to be - a learning? Also your progressed mars changed signs which heralded a new drive and perhaps towards something much more unusual / humantarian.

This feels a bit surface but what I get - I am not very logical.

Let us see you progressed sun will have conjoined your Jupiter 4/10 axis also...did you get some flash of an idea and turn your life upside down to pursue it? That is not meant to be derogatory, I just kind of shoot from the hip sometimes. If you didn't embrace the need for freedom or to not conform then perhaps it happened to you (this is always more painful)
 

fernby

Active member
Sorry the Sun/Chiron in Scorpio and third is also saying to me about an intense need to communicate about pain and loss and re-birth, there is a real understanding about loss and the fear of loss (loss of control, loss of loved things, loss of power) and equally the mastery of those things - I feel a bereavement counsellor - this really is no light aspect to carry, but a true gift if you can find the way to harness it. It is totally not what people would expect of you to deliver though!
 

EJ53

Banned
Fernby said:
This feels a bit surface but what I get - I am not very logical.

I'm gobsmacked by the accuracy of your analysis, Fernby.........(Not happy about having a special gift for being shy though:biggrin:)......Perhaps the only significant matter you've not mentioned is the 10/4 axis as an indicator of my parents..........[Jupiter is my father (pillar of the local community)/Uranus is my mother (unpredictable and gregarious)]

.....I'd be interested where Mercury is? Loss of a sibling or a feeling of loss of a sibling (only child?) or possible power struggles with siblings.

Mercury is in Scorpio/2nd, with a tight square to Pluto in Leo/11th......I am one of eight children, who were engaged constantly in sibling power struggles.
______________________________________________​
Of course, if I'd been consulting you at the beginning of the Mars progression, you would have asked why......and I'd have answered :-

"I've been an accountant for 25 years, but my job satisfaction has decreased over the last 3.........and now I'd really like to retire/do something completely unrelated.

Financially, I'd be ok with that........But the problem is my father......He worked hard to help me get where I am to-day; has an extremely strong work ethic and is very proud of the fact that his local community (of which he himself is a pillar) regard me as a "success"......So, he'd find it hard to cope with me "throwing away my life"......and I couldn't handle his resultant disappointment in me.

Also, I have absolutely no idea of what I would want to do if I left my current career and wondered if you could advise me on that.......assuming I don't opt to stay in my current job until I can formally retire (in 17 years time)."

In reality, what did happen was determined by three specific events which occurred as the Mars progression made the following exact aspects to the natal configuration..........sextile Sun.......qcx Uranus/sextile Chiron.......semi-sextile Jupiter.

At the time of the exact Pmars sextile Nsun, the only transit was retrograde NN conjunct natal Jupiter..........At the exact qcx, transitting Pluto/NN(Rx) were conjunct natal Sun.........At the exact semi-sextile, transitting Chiron was trine natal Uranus and sextile natal Jupiter.

Finally, (17 years later) progressed sun again activates this natal configuration.......co-inciding with the time of my formal retirement.

So, how would you have advised me at the "mars progression consultation" Fernby?

EJ:smile:
 

fernby

Active member
Ha ha - well there was something about siblings in there, interesting the "group" 11 th pluto/merc square - they are a group in themselves! And lot sf squabbles about resources (can be material or love resources) This would happen in any 8 child household but with that square probably set up a scenario that has been very difficult for you.

I never saw accountant!

Well you had a karmic lesson to be learned (NN) regarding father/authority (and enjoyment / pleasure Jupiter after all is the jolly expansive uncle) and that is to follow your own calling, enjoy your life more and to become less under the influence of his "disappointment" This is very difficult but if you didn't you will have to face that later on with more regret than his disappointment. If you had a career of 25 years then you would have been in early 40s? This is well past time to move out of the child/parent model (sorry harsh but true) And astrology aside the critical self love evolves when you challenge that parent/child model and discover they really love you anyway, not just your achievements.

The pluto transit/sun during all the other stuff means this was a complete transformation - a shedding of skin, a re-birth, I would be very surprised that if you didn't CHOOSE to change that something else dramatic didn't force the change. The Chiron transits were very supportive.

Not sure I feel competant to advise but I would have been saying to seek career advice and counselling to help you find what your real fulfillments are - I will look see in a bit to see if any paths jump out - where is your North Node house and sign placement/
 

fernby

Active member
PS In my humble opinion "shy" people are often in a position to contribute to society on a deep level - they have the time to observe, the real crux though is whether they are nurtured - I sometimes work with children in groups and I have an inherent drive to bring out the skills from shy kids - not put them on the spot but gently encourage their input and help them find an outlet for their self expression.

I am really interested in all the aspects of shyness and what lies underneath it because I don't think it is always lack of self esteem at all - I know a few very shy people who have enormous reserves of self belief much more than the seemingly confident outgoing me. I find this fascinating because people tend to assume a lot of shyness stems from lack of self belief.
 

EJ53

Banned
fernby said:
....that (Mercury/Pluto) square probably set up a scenario that has been very difficult for you.

Not actually difficult, but potentially so......I became the "one who broke the family tradition".....by being the first to enter a career/profession requiring formal educational qualifications.....However, the whole family encouraged rather than resisted it.

I never saw accountant!

The Jupiter in Capricorn/4th "pillar of the local community" thing combines with Sun in Scorpio/3rd (enjoys in-depth analysis), conjunct Chiron (skilled "manipulator" - of data in this case) and Uranus in Gemini/9th (breaking with family tradition)......But pointing to "office work" rather than accountancy itself.

....Well you had a karmic lesson to be learned (NN) regarding father/authority (and enjoyment / pleasure Jupiter after all is the jolly expansive uncle) and that is to follow your own calling, enjoy your life more and to become less under the influence of his "disappointment" This is very difficult but if you didn't you will have to face that later on with more regret than his disappointment. If you had a career of 25 years then you would have been in early 40s? This is well past time to move out of the child/parent model (sorry harsh but true) And astrology aside the critical self love evolves when you challenge that parent/child model and discover they really love you anyway, not just your achievements.

Absolutely correct, Fernby!............The first "event" was the death of my father.......Freeing me (at the age of 42) to become EJ53 rather than "my father's son"........and leading directly to my retirement from accountancy, nine months later.

[Note : At age 14/15, I watched my older brother "separate" from my father....through "toe-to-toe" physical confrontations, which greatly upset my mother.....And made a conscious choice to not do anything myself that would "put her through it again".....(plus I had neither the desire nor inclination to trade punches with a father whom I respected/liked enormously.....and was a very tough coal-miner/accomplished amateur boxer!)]



...The pluto transit/sun during all the other stuff means this was a complete transformation - a shedding of skin, a re-birth, I would be very surprised that if you didn't CHOOSE to change that something else dramatic didn't force the change. The Chiron transits were very supportive.

Second event......Death of my mother....."the Sun went down finally on my former life".........and removed the one person who could have manipulated me (through guilt) to resurrect my accountancy career.....or persuade me to take another job I neither needed nor wanted (to comply with the family's traditionally strong work ethic).

At this point, I stopped looking for alternative employment and decided to pursue my hobby as a full-time (unpaid) "career".........[Bear in mind here that I'd realised by then that alternative employment was unlikely - as I was 45; seen by potential employers as "over-qualified"; had chosen to leave my last job and had no desire to do anything that utilised my accountancy training/expertise.]

....I would have been saying to seek career advice and counselling to help you find what your real fulfillments are - I will look see in a bit to see if any paths jump out - where is your North Node house and sign placement/

The advice would have been correct.

My North Node is at 3 degrees Taurus/8th, making a Kite formation with Uranus/Jupiter and Saturn at 5 degrees Virgo/11th........The third/final progressed Mars event was the birth of my second grandchild in hospital.....with complications she might not have survived if it had been a home-birth, as originally intended.

....I don't think shyness is always lack of self esteem

Lack of self-esteem has never been an issue with me.......My shyness stems from a lack of self-awareness........As a child, I was unaware that my unconscious behaviour upset/alientated others.....Later, I became aware of this (through experiencing unexpected rejection) but unaware of what the offending behaviour itself was......And even now (at 60), I still manage to offend others without knowing/understanding why.

When young, I dealt with the problem by avoiding social situations......So, the shyness comes from lack of practice in interacting socially with others/groups.......And disappears when I'm amongst those who "understand me".

EJ:smile:
 
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fernby

Active member
Gosh I guess they were large events (understatement :)), I wasn't prepared for that and your mothers passing yes so linked to re-birth and the Chiron lessons.

The whole north node evolutionary path way did my head in - you must have really struggled yourself to find that fulfilling pathway as North Node Taurus (mine is also 3 degrees Taurus) but in the 8th house - those magnets pulling you one way then the other and such a battle between longing and staying where was comfortable, in a way I think this describes why it took so long. Very confusing!!

So your North Node in Taurus is telling you to get in touch more with your own inner resources, appreciate them, move away from manipulation and setting up unconscious victim scenarios (where you may have been the real instigator) and self defeating behaviours but at the same time you need to apply this learning to the issues in the 8th house....oh boy I can't get my head around it! Maybe it is really saying you need to become self aware (own resources) in order to be able to help other's depths. But how that applies to a career..to be fulfilling it must need to touch on 8th house activity I think, I'm back to the whole bereavement counsellor, marriage counsellor, tax advice (aha you could have used your old skills there, skills about resources) but that would have bored you.:whistling:

Kites can really mess up your career there is a subconscious element of destruction here which can trip up your grand trine gifts - I have to draw it out - I am very visual and if I can't see it I can't imagine it, I shall return
 

EJ53

Banned
fernby said:
....So your North Node in Taurus is telling you to get in touch more with your own inner resources, appreciate them, move away from manipulation and setting up unconscious victim scenarios (where you may have been the real instigator) and self defeating behaviours but at the same time you need to apply this learning to the issues in the 8th house....oh boy I can't get my head around it! Maybe it is really saying you need to become self aware (own resources) in order to be able to help other's depths.

Yes........I think the issue is to find the right balance between my own values and those of others.......Taurus/8th = the farmer with an interest in psychology......Scorpio/2nd = the psychologist with an interest in farming......"planting the right seeds" seems to be the common element in both Nodes.....So, maybe we are looking at a career that somehow involves psychological seed planting.

EJ:unsure:
 

fernby

Active member
Psychotherapist - there are lots of different disciplines and not all may suit, I think something with a structured approach, not looked at Kite influences yet but perhaps hypnotherapy fits the glove...YES you help to plant subconscious seeds that the person can then grow, would certainly appeal to the Scorpio Mercury too, accessing the depths of people's minds. And you have the control and experience with Chiron issues to be able to maintain professionalism yet be empathetic (some people just get too drained by this kind of work)

Maybe it is just coming to mind as I am currently undergoing the training myself! Not sure this is what I want to do in itself but it will be part of whatever I do in some way. Weird.

NLP is quite structured as are CBT therapies, and using astrology (duh - gosh all those numbers, angles and precision will appeal!) in conjunction with other therapies.

Gosh these do not have to be unpaid, and it is not is unspiritual to receive "payment" for therapies. What is important is the truth of the giving behind it. I got mixed up (scammed) unknowingly in quite the opposite where the spiritual energy was completely tainted by greed and human cost - Neptune (and a bunch of rogues) blinded me through enticement with my core beliefs and hopes, what a shock when all was revealed - just hoping currently to extract myself.

I've learned as much or more about myself through looking at this as I have about you - you have been very generous with the feedback as well and what a great way to learn retrospectively!

I have always suspected that could be one reason for shyness as you describe. Was the thing that offended people something along the lines of sharpness, perfectionism (critical) perceived by others as self righteousness or superiority? I would say with your insight into people you could (unknowingly) wound - but we always have the capacity for the opposite eg to heal.

My Sag asc Venus in Virgo gets me into trouble here when I get on my critical soapbox too sometimes but generally I get away with it. I generally ask or say what a lot of people are thinking anyway and they equally love and hate it.
 

EJ53

Banned
fernby said:
....not looked at Kite influences....

The Kite is the key.......Progressed Mars was actually stimulating the whole of this configuration rather than only the natal Sun/Chiron/Jupiter/Uranus....So, it's overall objective was to "put me on the Kite path".

[Note : At age 49, progressed Mars was conjunct progressed Mercury in natal 5th/Aquarius; formed a T-square with the natal nodes and another with an opposition of progressed Asc in Scorpio to progressed Node in Taurus/6th.]

.....you have the control and experience with Chiron issues to be able to maintain professionalism yet be empathetic (some people just get too drained by this kind of work)

It took me a long time to learn through hard experience that helping others requires emotional detachment (professionalism)........Otherwise our health eventually breaks down, making us no longer able to help anyone (and perhaps needing help ourselves.)

....these do not have to be unpaid, and it is not is unspiritual to receive "payment" for therapies.....

The reality is that clients will always value the therapy by how much they pay for it......Human nature inclines us to assume "we get what we pay for".....so, "if we paid nothing for it, then it's worth nothing"

Yet, what I've learned for nothing on this forum would have cost a small fortune in professional consultation fees........As you say, "what is important is the truth of the giving behind it".

....I've learned as much or more about myself through looking at this as I have about you.......what a great way to learn retrospectively!

Retrospective analysis of our charts/events enables us to better understand the future astrological indicators......."Those who fail to learn from past mistakes/events are destined to keep repeating them".

.......Was the thing that offended people something along the lines of sharpness, perfectionism (critical) perceived by others as self righteousness or superiority?

Yes, "holier than thou"........"stating the obvious, as thou others had failed to understand it"......."insisting on the reviewing of past mistakes, as though others had failed to learn from them"......."blocking progress/forward movement, as thou others had failed to think through the potential consequences".

So......not what I did, but how I did it.

My Sag asc Venus in Virgo gets me into trouble here when I get on my critical soapbox too sometimes but generally I get away with it. I generally ask or say what a lot of people are thinking anyway and they equally love and hate it.

My Sag IC and Venus in Libra/1st enable me to be direct with those who know me well, without causing any offence......But, Uranus in Gemini/9th on MC is sometimes like having "punch me and feel better" written on my forehead.:andy:

EJ:smile:
 

fernby

Active member
So what did you "do" after the mars progression and career change? I have no idea... I am flummoxed, my first attempt at astrological career advice down the swanee :biggrin:
 

EJ53

Banned
fernby said:
So what did you "do" after the mars progression and career change?

and

EJ said:
At this point, I stopped looking for alternative employment and decided to pursue my hobby as a full-time (unpaid) "career".........

The full-time hobby is astrology.......Uranus on MC and focal point of Kite formation.

Towards the end of 1996 though, I considered stopping/pursuing something else........because I could see no useful purpose in astrology, beyond character analysis and self-development.

However, in mid-December, I attempted to use astrology to ascertain the date and time when my grandaughter would be born......The resultant chart revealed that something unexpected would happen and my daughter would be alone at the time......So, I advised her to have the baby in hospital rather than at home (as originally intended).....which she did.

My grandaughter arrived breached and late at night, when my daughter was alone in her room and only a night-nurse was on duty.....The nurse responded immediately to my daughter's alarm call and an emergency C-operation was performed by an off-duty surgeon who happened to be visiting his own wife/new born child after finishing his shift at the hospital.

Rightly or wrongly, that convinced me astrology had a worthwhile purpose......so, I continued to study it as a full-time hobby.

EJ :cool:
 
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