Lord of Geniture in 4th House

Waki

Well-known member
Hi everyone,

I am looking for the LoG, the planet that could be my "guide" if only I knew it and how to harness it, but most of my planets are in detriment, fall, or peregrine...

My best planet regarding essential dignity is Mars in 22 Pisces, in its triplicity, term and face. Mars rules Ascendant Scorpio.
Second best and end of the list is Venus with very minor dignity at 15 Capricorn.

I guess have to look for accidental dignities to pick up the LoG. I've read that angularity is then most important.

My dignified Mars happens to be angular... in the 4th. It is also direct and fast.

Moon is also angular in the 7th, but at 5 Gemini, she has no essential dignity.
+ she is slow + square both Jupiter (H9 retro a 2 Virgo) and Mercury (H3 and retro at 2 Pisces) opposing each other. 9th house Jupiter and H3 Mercury sound nice and have their goodies but they are Rx and the mutable T-square with much receptions going on easily makes me drift in much thinking, ideas and also doubts, often getting too fast for others to catch, or lost in the too small or too big picture when applied to my own life, and at times struggling when it needs to be contained and adjusted to. I did publish a few articles and a book though, and I am working on another one, but that does not make me thrive or feel happy.

No astrologer I ever consulted suggested I could rely on my Moon (expected one guy dead fascinated by her being Out Of Bound, which seems to be a kind of amazing dignity in his eyes, especially given that I am a woman), whereas some did point to my healthy Mars.

I am puzzled by Pisces Mars, hate conflicts, and resisted the idea of engaging into the 4th house domestic rooting... I am more of a singular, rootless and traveler person, not very home based, no domestic fascination. I did not found a family of my own. Gemini Moon + Aquarius Sun may explain this, also the violence of Mars in the 4th, and my 9th house Jupiter, that made me travel a lot and even live abroad on a few occasions. In my teens and till 22, I considered my self a citizen of the world, not belonging to a particular place. In my late 30s until lately, I was living in the Indian Himalayas and had little interest in my own Western culture and people.

How can I rely, use and express the H4 angularity which is the main capacity of Mars to act (if I got it well)? Do I need to make a radical change in my life to harness H4?

So far, the way I possibly engaged with the H4 (though maybe this is not h4) is by being fond of profound spirituality. I dedicated the last 20 years of my life to that, but today is my progressed New Mood (in Aries on natal Saturn) and I see the limits of what I have done in the given structures and organisations that frame my spiritual path, and this does not inspire me to go on in the same way. Time for a new Cycle!

Mars other important characteristics are,
- its mutual reception with Venus in Cap in the 2nd house, by exaltation (while Mars rules AS Scorpio, she rules DS Taurus)
- its rulership over my North Node in Aries 5th house (while Venus rules SN Libra). This make me wish to really express and engage with Mars better, because so far I have failed the NNode... Part of the difficulty might be Aries Saturn, restricting Aries natural expression.

Any suggestion or comment would greatly help!

My chart is in the next message. You may note there that Mars is involved with all the transpersonal planets which are all prominent in H10 and AS. But there is no need to linger on that here, I know!
 
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JUPITERASC

Well-known member
My apologies for mentioning Uranus, Neptune and Pluto in this Traditional astrology section. I wanted to present the nature of my natal Mars in more details, since its not expressing any 4th house qualities might appear curious.

You can ignore these planets, I don't mind. Mars being in Pisces and ruling Ascendant Scorpio might be good enough to explain its taste for universal, spiritual and profound matters, utterly neglecting any rooting in domestic affairs.

Please do advise regarding harnessing its angularity and ability to act.
Certainly the outers are irrelevant on the Traditional forum
and
keep in mind there is an option available to you
of simply deleting their mention by you :smile:
on this traditional board
where outers are irrelevant
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
Hi everyone,

I only have planets in detriment, fall, or peregrine, including a number of retrograde... So I guess have to look for accidental dignities to pick up the LoG.

I've read is usually considered that angularity is most important. In that matter, my best planet would be Mars in 22 Pisces, in the 4th house. It is also in its triplicity, term and face. My best bar far in essential dignity.

Now, I am more of a vagabond and traveler person, not very home based, and no family of my own. Aquarius Sun, Gemini Moon may explain this, also the violence of Mars in the 4th, and my 9th house Jupiter, which sounds nice but is in fall and detriment Virgo and retrograde, squaring the Moon in a T-Square, opposing Mercury in detriment and fall in Pisces in 3rd House, also retrograde, squaring the Moon. (BTW does the mutual reception mean I can value this Mercury, otherwise almuten of the chart?)

The main question is how can I rely, use and express the angularity which is the main capacity of Mars to act (if I got it well)?

Mars other characteristics are,
- trine Neptune is Scorpio (not sure if that can be regarded as mutual reception, but it may), while I am Scorpio rising (so, ruled by Mars), and Neptune is almost on the rising point from the 12th

- exactly opposing Pluto in the 10th, and loosely opposing Uranus in the 10th. I guess this adds to the violence and trickiness of Mars being in the 4th. BTW, both Pluto and Uranus are retrograde, and sextile the rising point and Neptune.

- Mars is in mutual reception with Venus in Cap in the 2nd house, each being in the exaltation sign of the other.

- Mars rules my North Node in Aries 5th house. So I would really, really love to express it better, but so far I failed the NNode. Part of the difficulty may be the Pluto/Uranus opposition Mars, which takes a lot of time to digest and master and requires deep work, and another dficulty might be Saturn in Aries, restricting Aries nature.

Any suggestion is welcome.

I am fund of spirituality and dedicated the last 20 years of my life to that, but today is my progressed New Mood (in Aries on natal Saturn) and I see the limits of what I have done, which does not inspire me to go on.

Oh well, thinking further, although I never considered my Moon valuable, she is also angular in the 7th. But at 5 Gemini she has no essential dignity whatsoever. And she is slow. And square both Jupiter (retro a 2 Virgo) and Mercury (retro at 2 Pisces). *and loosely opposing Neptune, out of sign, sshhh*

No astrologer I ever consulted suggested I could rely on my Moon (expected one guy dead fascinated by her being Out Of Bound), whereas some did point to my healthy Mars. But again, I am puzzled by my Mars, still healing it, and domestic stuff is not my stuff, unless I make a radical change in my life....

Mars, by the way, is fast and direct.

these are instructions
HOW TO ATTACH A CHART TO YOUR POST ON THE FORUM :smile:

http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...ad.php?t=12126
Extended Chart Selecton Page at astro.com has options
to choose
from amongst the fourteen currently most popular house systems in use
 

Waki

Well-known member
Ho thank you for pointing this, I had missed the editing option.
Post edited, addenda deleted, chart attached!
here it is.
 

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JUPITERASC

Well-known member


*and loosely opposing Neptune, out of sign, sshhh*
you have already admitted that you are aware that the outers
are irrelevant on traditional board
and it is possible to delete that sshhhhh comment
:smile:
since you have not
then it seems
you wish to have a discussion of BOTH Modernist
AND Traditional interpretation
and so
this thread belongs on our GENERAL ASTROLOGY BOARD
 

Osamenor

Staff member
All respondents, take note: I have moved this thread from Traditional Astrology. While the title is traditional--lords of the geniture being thoroughly traditional astrology--what's actually being discussed in this thread is a hybrid of traditional and modern. Using the outer planets in chart interpretation is only done by modern astrologers. So is using astrology to explain a person's psychology. So is the concept of north node as something you must work toward. Traditional astrology isn't psychological and uses the nodes in a very different way.

All posts on the Traditional Astrology board are required to stick to traditional astrology only. If modern concepts are being included, it is not a traditional astrology topic. Traditional and modern hybrids are fine, but they need to be discussed in other parts of the forum.

Because the OP is providing a lot of self interpretation, I have not made this a Read My Chart topic. Natal Astrology seems the best place for it.
 

Waki

Well-known member
Given the former comments, I have heavily edited the initial post and removed the references to the outer planets, because the topic is indeed Lord of Geniture in the very traditional sense and I got your point.

Have you checked the edited post?

I only mentioned at the end that the outer planet appear in the attached chart.

Let's see if shifting the thread into non traditional helps!

But it's true that I am also into modern astrology. How do you regard the Nodes in traditional astrology? Just as malefic and benefic?
 
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JUPITERASC

Well-known member
Given the former comments, I have heavily edited the initial post and removed the references to the outer planets, because the topic is indeed Lord of Geniture in the very traditional sense and I got your point.

Have you checked the edited post?

I only mentioned at the end that the outer planet appear in the attached chart.

Let's see if shifting the thread into non traditional helps!

But it's true that I am also into modern astrology. How do you regard the Nodes in traditional astrology? Just as malefic and benefic?
Only if the thread remained Traditional
was it necessary to edit the posts
but you did not initially edit the posts :smile:
so
Now a Moderator has moved your thread to General Astrology board
and clearly explained why
so
there is no need to have edited the posts
now your thread is a thread for both Modernist and Traditional discussion

so Modernist members who are interested to do so
are likely to comment using the outers
which is fine now the thread is on General Astrology board
 

Waki

Well-known member
Not exactly. He shifted the post while I was editing it, which took me some time because in editing it, I also combined the 3 posts I had written into one post, and I deleted the 2 others, and then when I submitted the long one, I did it wrong and it got lost (I was handling the deleting and editing at once), so I had to redo the entire editing and rewriting, and then when at last I submitted it, I saw the post has been shifted in between.
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
Not exactly. He shifted the post while I was editing it, which took me some time
because in editing it, I also combined the 3 posts I had written into one post, and
I deleted the 2 others, and then when I submitted the long one, I did it wrong
and it got lost (I was handling the deleting and editing at once), so
I had to redo the entire editing and rewriting, and then
when at last I submitted it, I saw the post has been shifted in between.
But now you are able to have both Modernist and Traditional discussion
so
as that is what you originally wanted, then it worked out fine for you
:smile:
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
some interesting reading on LORD OF THE GENITURE :smile:
Greetings,

This is my first post to the forum. I noticed from my site traffic that some of you had visited my own site so I thought I would return the favor.

The concepts of hyleg, alcoccoden, Almutem Figuris, and lord of the geniture are very similar.
I cover them in a just published working paper:

History and Sources: Astrology of the Soul

http://regulus-astrology.com/pdf/Astrology_of_the_Soul_History_and_Sources_April_25_2012.pdf

I then proceed to test the methods of Antiochus/Porphyry and Ibn Ezra for computing what Zoller named the Almutem Figuris and what Ben Dykes has lately taken to refer to as the Victor.

Sample of Forty Horoscopes (with my own rectifications)
http://regulus-astrology.com/victor_of_the_chart.html

Preliminary Conclusions
http://regulus-astrology.com/pdf/Victor_of_the_Chart.pdf

At this point, I tend to favor the approach by Antiochus/Porphyry over that of Ibn Ezra
however I don't have enough examples yet to make a firm conclusion.
Hope to take the study up to 200 in the next two years.

My time is limited so will probably have limited response capability to this post.
Enjoy these posts. Several hundred pages worth of material

Dr. H

www.regulus-astrology.com
World Class Research in Medieval Predictive Astrology
 
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