Transit Chiron conjunct my Sun - pain

My natal Sun is at 22AQ58, so transit Chiron has been conjoining it since December 7th. I thought I was doing pretty well until today.

Today Chiron is just 7 minutes applying to an exact conjunction to my Sun.

In all truth, I have never felt such unrelieved despair and emotional pain. It's frightening me. Nothing even touches the dark, painful emptiness I feel today - there's not the usual relief from a few glasses of wine, from a xanax, or from sex (which is now just a loathsome thought to me, a normally sexual person).

Yesterday, Xmas day, as I was sitting alone in my house, it hit me hard that my younger sister, my only living sibling, whom I practically raised, really does not love me as I have insisted on believing all these years. I spent Xmas alone for the 7th year in a row, after my sister had promised once again to "try" and bring her family to spend Xmas with me. But then I got no e-mail, no card, no phone call, no gift, nothing. And no family.

My sister is far more mobile than I am, with a boyfriend who's a mechanic, but she has never visited me at any time in over 10 years - and she's only 3 1/2 hours away. She's never seen my house, my pets, or my work. However, it also hit me yesterday that in the past decade she often visited a friend in prison (and took my nephews) only an hour from where I live.

I decided about 7 years ago that I would stop the one-way driving to see my sister and invite her to come visit me for a change. I developed agoraphobia, and traveling is quite stressful for me, and I also have a 21-year-old cat that I don't want to leave to die without me - which my sister says she "totally understands" and tells me that she loves me "sooo much!!!!" for being such a caring person.

With the Chiron conjunction this year, and with absolutely no communication, no card, no gift, no visit from my sister, I think that the falseness of my sister's love must be my deepest unhealed wound - my Chironic wound. I've never admitted it before, but she has hurt me so many times, and I have forgiven her again and again, and I've spent lots of money on her to "assure her that I love her" - thousands of dollars to bail her husband out of bankruptcy, to bail her out of jail, to make sure my nephews had decent Christmases every year.

Could this incredibly painful emptiness I feel be the beginning of healing? Or is it only the realization coming to the surface? How can I heal this wound? I can't bear to go on feeling like this!

I know I must put my sister out of my life and move on, and I guess my heart is breaking.

Can anyone recall Chiron conjunct your Sun feeling like this? I'm uploading my chart again, but don't know if it will be accessible considering the technical difficulties in the website.

Bless you for any comments,

Byron

PS: I'm still in the process of my second Saturn Return, so I suppose that also means a painful maturing to a new level of awareness.

Here's a direct link to my chart:

http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/album.php?albumid=149&pictureid=660

Hope this one works.

Hi Byron

Im a 21.7 degree aqua and I can empathasise with you. Unable to read your chart the link did not work. the attachment - I think I can view but not in the pc Im currently on. so will look at that next week from another pc)

You mention is this the start of healing, very definitely it is. that is the best way to go with it. U will also have neptune and jupiter conjunct your sun also so these will make it difficult to see on one level(neptune) and perhaps amplify the pain. (jupiter)sorry

my sun is in 4th house conjunct IC. the chiron transit over the last few months and now direct as resulted in a house move being forced on me. Its something I have not been dealing with. I know that the move with be beneficial but the process of moving I have put off. I have good reasons for not having done this sooner. (I have had lots of other stuff going on in my chart recently too)

so without knowing where chiron is in your chart I cant see how this could affect you - although it is clear from what you say that this relates to your emotions. Try and use the combination of these planets energies to get the best solution for you. Neptune is about infinite compassion at its highest level and jupiter is abundance these are both over your sun. Maybe you just have to forgive you sister and move on. Chiron is an opportunity to heal. Are you experiencing vivid dreams?

maybe some type of healing for yourself, therapy course, workshop where u begin to meet new people but in estoeric related fields.

your second saturn return maybe an opportunity to explore something new.

so on the one hand I have been forced to move but then the same week I receive contacts from two clinics asking me to work as a healer in new year. (I qualified this year) so maybe by moving I will free myself to do this....

good luck with it

Byron said:

Could this incredibly painful emptiness I feel be the beginning of healing? Or is it only the realization coming to the surface? How can I heal this wound? I can't bear to go on feeling like this!

I know I must put my sister out of my life and move on, and I guess my heart is breaking.

Can anyone recall Chiron conjunct your Sun feeling like this?
PS: I'm still in the process of my second Saturn Return, so I suppose that also means a painful maturing to a new level of awareness.

Click to expand...

Byron, I have experienced Chiron conj Sun, and to be honest, it was nothing - that is, having just come through a devastating Pluto square Sun prior to this, I felt nothing unusual with the Chiron conj Sun.

I suspect something else. Pity we can't see either chart you posted. My experience of Chiron transiting is that it is most powerfully felt when it is either conjuncting, squaring or opposing itself. I have not found it to be terribly noticeable when transiting other planets. Unless your Sun has some tricky placements, such as with Pluto or Saturn - then it may be Saturn doing the deed.

"Could this incredibly painful emptiness I feel be the beginning of healing? Or is it only the realization coming to the surface? How can I heal this wound? I can't bear to go on feeling like this!"
A feeling this deep is a good thing. I suspect it has been there for a long time, and this year - with the powerful slap-in-the-face reality that is a Saturn Return (even the second one) - Mr Reality has come to call, and so some emoting is necessary. Let it happen and you will feel better. Holding it in and hoping for others to treat you differently is a road to depression and hopelessness.

R4VEN said:

I suspect something else. Pity we can't see either chart you posted....I have not found it to be terribly noticeable when transiting other planets. Unless your Sun has some tricky placements, such as with Pluto or Saturn - then it may be Saturn doing the deed.

Click to expand...

Thank you R4VEN. My natal Sun is opposite my natal Pluto.

Below is my DOB data, if anyone cares to run it up on their own software. I can't to seem to make my chart visible for others on this website in any way, though I can link to it myself - which doesn't surprise me, considering how everything else is going. The theme seems to be that I can't connect with anyone.

Byron
12 Feb 1951
5:55 A.M.
26N09, 97W55

OK, just as I suspected, there is a bit more to this. What Caro mentioned about the whole 3 of Chiron-Neptune-Jupiter is worth noting. These 3 have been hunting in a pack for most of 2009. The effect of this is that your whole life until now is being `exposed' to you. It is the spiritual/emotional equivalent of waking one morning and finding that the walls of your house have gone, and that you are fully `exposed'. The exposure is chiefly to yourself from yourself. Most of us lie to ourselves, and this is so that we can keep going in our lives without totally losing our minds. The triple conjunction of Chiron-Neptune-Jupiter is showing us how these lies are destructive, and it is also showing us the power of compassion - towards ourselves, as well as towards others. The combination of (in particular) Chiron and Neptune conjuncting your Sun will expose all your weak spots, and I suspect that this is what is occurring in your life currently. Neptune is responsible for making you feel very weak and ineffectual at present. It is breaking down all the emotional structures you have created to get by in your life.

I notice that natally you have Neptune (in the 9th) inconjunct Mars in the 2nd house. Unfortunately this can render you a bit of a push-over, so that people with less scruples than yourself can take advantage of you - as it appears your sister has done. I also have Neptune in Libra in the 9th, and I can be such a wuss where others are concerned. People can lie to my face - and I will know they are lying - and yet I will still believe in their inherent `goodness', much to my detriment.

I think another timing factor is that tr Mars - which rules your 3rd house of siblings - is also currently in your 7th house, retrograde, and conj your natal Pluto, and so I think this retrograde motion of Mars in Leo is dredging up some things deep within you which you need to first see, then feel, and eventually accept to do with your sibling relationship.

Remember that your sister's behaviour is not about you, it is about her. Her almost dismissal of you is not your fault, but shows a flaw in her own character -- and this is also not your doing.

Now, your mention of Chiron took me to your natal Chiron - in the 11th house, and in the first degree of Capricorn. Transiting Pluto has been forming a conjunction with your Chiron on and off for around 2 years, and I have experienced this (I am two-and-a-half years older than you) and found it liberating, but tough, as it demanded a lot from me. Also transiting Pluto squares tr Saturn and your natal Saturn, and this means that the structures you have set up in your life to support you - or your sense of who you believe yourself to be - are outdated, and have to go. With natal Chiron in the 11th, one of your wounds is that of feeling left out, or rejected. What you continue to `tell yourself' - or what it is you believe about yourself and others - is so you do not actually feel this sense of rejection. I would say that this whole complicated mix of planetary transits is leading you to letting go of the games you have played with yourself to prevent you from feeling rejected/unloved. And perhaps your soul needs for you to go there.

As I said in an earlier post, this is a good thing. Holding in this level of lying-to-oneself has the power to make you very ill. The truth of your situation will eventually free you.

Two more brief observations.................
Your natal Taurus Moon is in the 3rd house - of siblings - so there will be on & off fluctuations with your sister, and your responses to her with fluctuate also.

2nd observation is that your Asc - if your birth time is correct, as even a minte or two later would bring your Asc to Aquarius - is in the final minute of Capricorn. Capricorn is quite a `heavy' Asc to have, and so one is prone to deep feelings of depression and you can also tend to be very hard on yourself. A Cap Asc person is quite unforgiving of themself if they consider they could have done better. When you get down, you can really go down, so keep checking your own thoughts as a measure of maintaining a grasp on reality.

....and to add to the above post - something I just thought of.................

Byron, you have both Chiron and your Asc in Capricorn, so there is some lesson here which fits under the Capricorn umbrella. I suspect that you handle responsibility really, really well!!! After all, you pretty much brought your sister up.
But - how are you at being responsible for yourself? For your feelings, sensibilities, and your emotional responses? Your current pain may just provide a pathway to understanding the degree to which you have failed to properly take care of yourself. Perhaps your pain at how your sister continues to treat you is actually about how badly you have allowed yourself to be treated. This is a very Capricorn wound - the wound of taking care of everything other than your own personal needs.

If this rings true for you, then I suspect that the underlying issue is being described by tr Pluto conj your natal Chiron. The other transits are pushing this emotion to the surface.

Thank you with all my heart, R4ven! This is a lot of valuable work that you have put in! A lot of valuable information for me to study and work on.

I considered answering you privately, but I thought my confirmations and observations might be helpful to other astrologers and students of astrology.

First, I got chillbumps when you mentioned my "lying to myself"!

Another astrologer who looked at my chart very recently also told me the very same thing, that I was lying to myself, and that I would soon be forced to stop doing so. But I didn't get to finish that conversation and find out just WHAT these lies are. I desperately wanted to know...and still do.

You're right about Neptune at work with Chiron. The closer tr Neptune got to my Sun (direct or retrograde), the more vulnerable and weaker I felt – literally like a turtle or an oyster out of their shell. I just wanted to drink and hide away to stop feeling so exposed and "in danger". (And Caro, I think you're right - Jupiter just exaggerated it.)

R4ven, you are also right on the beam about my 11th House Chiron bringing a fear of feeling rejected or unloved – being square my Saturn and opposite my Uranus probably doesn’t help. My mother (whose Sun was square my Chiron) often “abandoned” me to punish me, saying she “may never come back” (for not cleaning my room, leaving my shoes at the door, etc.). Plus, I was moved so often during school years that I was always "the new kid" and was left out of a lot - had few close friends and lost them when I was moved again.

That theme was reinforced in a big way about a decade ago when a hateful rumor was spread about me in my hometown, without my even knowing or being given the chance to prove it false, and I was rejected by a number of people I believed were my dearest friends, who won’t speak to me to this day…though the rumor was completely false.

I think I see the lying game I now play with myself to protect myself from the above. I won’t let myself get really close to anyone at all anymore, telling myself I need lots of solitude to rest and restore myself, and "friends" would intrude on that.

It also is true that the Capricorn Chiron and Asc. have made me hyper-responsible – no matter what the problem, my automatic response is to believe it's my fault/my responsibility to fix, to work assiduously until it’s solved, and to make sure people are never disappointed in me. And your description of a Capricorn Ascendant at the end of the first message is so ME that it's scary! Reading that, there's no chance I'm an Aquarius Rising, though I sure wish I were!

Again, thanks so much! There's so much for me to ponder and absorb and work on in what you have written! I still have quite a bit of time on my 2nd Saturn Return, so maybe I'll get it all right by the time that's through! But I've sworn I don't want to hurt like this anymore.

...a horrible thought just crossed my mind…I don’t even like my sister! I don't want her phony, sloppy, cigarette-reeking self in my house! Was this the first lie I stopped telling myself?

Byron said:

...a horrible thought just crossed my mind…I don’t even like my sister! I don't want her phony, sloppy, cigarette-reeking self in my house! Was this the first lie I stopped telling myself?

Click to expand...

Byron, maybe that is a horrible thought, but it also sounds like an honest one. And that is a brilliant start to the No More Lying To Myself campaign!!

In relation to lying to yourself, I was going to mention that perhaps since you were a functional parent to your sister, then you may be expecting her to somehow `repay' you for your `sacrifice'. That is, your perception of the arrangement with her just may be that seeing that you gave so much of yourself for her, then when is she about to recognise that??? (Capricorn Rising people also have a need to be recognised for their efforts, and their sacrifices and the responsibily they show towards others. Funny thing is that this almost never happens!! I have Cap Rising also, so I am familiar with this!!) Perhaps your idea of a `recognition' of your input into her life would be for her to visit you at Christmas. The fact that she has not done this for so many years is a bit hard to ignore!!! It seems unlikely that your sister has any idea at all of how her behaviour is affecting you. This points me to agreeing with your assessment of her.

Byron I am about to share with you a similar - but different story of my own. I was born the 4th child - and only female - after 3 boys. My next-eldest brother literally hated me! He told me so most days, and demonstrated this with some rather intense and regular bullying, much of it physical in nature. When he reached 14-15 he discovered athletics and girls, and forgot about me. As we both neared adulthood, I had already developed a kind of `pleasing/appeasing' behaviour, just in case he changed his mind and became a tyrant once more. I convinced myself that I loved him, and that he loved me, and that he would kill anyone who treated me badly. (I'm sure that my imagination was in overdrive during those years!!) It was not until around 5-8 years ago - when I last saw him, and actually saw him clearly for the first time since we were both children - that I admitted to myself that whilst I didn't hate him any more, I certainly didn't like him - probably never had - and would no longer try to please him by being agreeable. That recognition of the truth about how I really felt about him acted for me as a release from the personal prison I had created for myself.

I suspect that your own `imprisonment' of yourself in your home is in part because you have been judging yourself (something Cap Rising people do magnificently!) and finding yourself wanting - perhaps you have seen yourself as not quite loveable, which could be one `explanation' of your sister's not recognising you. Putting your mother's harshness on you at the core of this, I am certain that your natural reaction to your sister's insensitivity would be to find yourself wanting.

Just ignoring Chiron's place in the mix for a moment - your natal Saturn Rx, early in Libra in the 8th house is a tough placement without it being your Asc ruler!!! It is a placement of self-denial, of putting the needs of `the other' ahead of your own. It is also normally a difficult placement for letting go, but perhaps your Saturn return is timely, and with tr Pluto's square to it, the only way out of this dilemma is to kill a few sacred cows!! (I apologise for my metaphors - I get carried away sometimes!)

Another feature about this Triple Conjunction - Chiron, Neptune & Jupiter - conjuncting your natal Sun is that recently it has been trining your natal Neptune. This trine in transit is an opportunity for allowing in new realisations which can benefit you in your life from here on. I suspect that you have been bombarded over the past few months with insights, and perhaps you have misinterpreted these. That's normal enough, given your previous persepctive about what has been happening in your life.

The natal trine between your Sun and Neptune is a very sensitive and creative/artistic placement. You can also decide to bury it under masses of alcohol, pills and other methods of escape. Perhaps the time has come to "tune in and drop in" - I'm trying to paraphrase Timothy Leary's `turn on, tune in, drop out' message, which may have been fine in the 60's but resulted in a lot of lost opportunities.

Other astrologers on this forum will remind you of the necessity for forgiving your sister. That is fine for further down the track. Firstly you have a need to recognise and admit to yourself how you truly feel about her in this present moment. Having been there myself I know that only from a position of truth can you enter into a journey of personal healing.

There's more, but I feel that is enough for now.
(As to the effort I have put in, I never do any astrology which I don't want to do, and once I begin to follow a chart, it kind of takes me over, so the examination of your chart was in no way a chore.)

so is the neptune, jupiter chiron conjunction also about
establishing boundaries, ie telling these people that you are no longer going to tolerate their treatment/behaviour. (Im finding this in some of my relationships) Ive always been told not to rock the boat.
not easy but I think this is the step to taking care of you once you do this then the neptune view of universal love.compassion can come into play.
You have to acknowledge the pain first.

hope things get better

Thanks Caro and R4ven!

An update on this transit:

Now that Chiron is separating from my Sun, I feel less and less the level of excruciating emotional pain that I had when it was applying to exact. That was truly some of the most painful time I've ever spent in my life.

Perhaps because I have my natal Chiron square my Saturn (ruler of my Ascendant) and opposite my Uranus (ruler of my Sun Sign), and perhaps because tr Pluto has been conjuncting my natal Chiron, squaring my current Saturn Return, I am particularly sensitive to Chiron's effects now.

Symbolically, I have developed a sore (a wound) between my eyebrows that I cannot explain, and it has not healed yet. I interpret this as the physical representation of the emotional wound that I have not paid attention to, but I MUST SEE now (because it's right between my eyes! Chiron's right on my Sun!)...and I must see to healing it.

The wound IS my sister and the lie I've been telling myself - that she loves me with all her heart (her words). I know now that if I desperately needed her help, she would not be there for me. Six years ago, a year after we had lost both our brother and our mother (and I had bailed her out of jail and driven her to our mother's bedside just before Mother passed), my beloved cat Chloe was killed by a car right in front of me. I called my sister, crying hysterically, begging her to come be with me. As always, she had an excuse not to come (3.5 hours by expressway - "M route") but she promised "to be there in spirit and pray" for me anyway.

[By the way, all the above occurred during my "Dark of the Moon" progression - the passage of my progressed Moon from my natal Sun position to my progressed Sun position. Yeah, I've had quite a series of ****** transits and progressions since the Fixed Grand Cross of 1999, which cost me my job and my home.]

Her not coming when I needed her most is where I should have started waking up and realizing that I was talking to someone who really didn't care about me at all. When I had bailed her out to be with Mother before she died, my sister was more interested in whining about the injustice of the system that arrested her for the possession of marijuana, a handgun and having a felon in her car than she was in Mother's impending death...and the fact that I had had to drive 500 miles in 24 hours to get her back to Mother's bedside.

Okay. I've got too much Pisces. Sitting duck...ready-to-wear victim. It's written on my forehead.

But no more. The good part is that Chiron showed me how wounded I really am, and the Chiron-Neptune-Jupiter conjunction to my Sun along with my 2nd Saturn Return in progress is pushing me to get beyond the lies I tell myself - the lies that rob me of freedom and happiness. And yes, I have always judged myself harshly - somehow I always saw everything I've described above as ultimately my fault somehow or other. That is another lie that I will not tell myself any longer.

The fact is my sister does not love me - and the fact is...it's not my fault. As an I Ching reading told me, there is a cold heart within her. I would never really accept that until now. Despite what my Pisces might tell me, there would never be enough love to fill that black hole (thank you, Stephen Hawking).

Byron
12 feb 1951
5:55 am CST
Mercedes, TX

Sister
15 feb 1962
7:47 am PST
Las Vegas, NV

Byron, your sister has some features on her natal which make it difficult for her - but not impossible, certainly. She has quite a packed 12th house, and a Pisces Asc, but perhaps worse than that, her Asc ruler - Neptune - is Rx in the 8th, as is your own!!!! Thus, your sister and you appear to have been bound by misfortune, death, and with the possibility of mutual transformation. The drug/checking-out for her is much stronger than it is for you, I'd say, as would be her propensity for kidding herself.

Some other connections between your charts, which I'll leave you with:

• Your Sun conj her MSN
• Your Moon square her Saturn-Merc conjunction
• Your Anti-Vertex conj her Venus, and then perhaps most importantly,
• Your Pluto conj her MNN, which appears to me - along with the Sun conj her MSN - to be the karmic connection between you.

And as you have already figured, you cannot be expected to `carry' her. She has to pull her weight if she wants to benefit from these connections.

Hi Byron

I hope you can begin to let go of this pain. I have lots of pisces too (11 Feb 1967 12.30am! ) I have on occasion tried to be the saviour in relationships. it doesnt work. made myself ill. a very tough lesson.

although qualified as a healer you can only really heal yourself. through doing that you do help others.

I hope the move of jupiter into pisces is a good one for you.

Caro

hi Byron and all the members here.

firstly HAPPY 2010 to you all.. Im hopeing for a better one for everyone!

Im so sorry you had this happen to you, i felt your pain as you were describing the events that have happend and i sympathise with you for all that you were and still feeling.

My sun is 25.39 Aquarius and in my 4th house also.
venus is also placed there at 11.33 Aqarius mercury 18.15...

my asc scorpio has neptune placed right on the asc at 20 scorpio and my jupiter on the decendant opposing that is 18.08 taurus....

appart from haveing it tough through all those aspects i found when trans chiron conjuncted my natal mercury in my 4th (gemini rules my 8th) exacly the same degrees as my natal mercury i had my mother and my sister shun me out of their lives...
it had been comming for a while as since my mum has her own issues with my brother had spilled to her feeling responcible has over compensated by trying to make us all do things we dont want to do concerning him... and my sister who i allways made plans with and allways included in all family matters took it as a opportunic time to get in with my mum closer(once again due to her own emotional issues of feeling left out growning up) and ditched me to... ( im still haveing propblems getting over that one)

Its like these issues had really nothing to do with me but ive been make the escape goat to challenge their own issues in there life.... (thats exacly how i feel about everyone now) im everyones escape goat and learning tool.. ( to be used)

chiron is trying to heal this wounded person through these issues only my natal chiron is 16 degrees pisces it opposes my uranus and pluto in the 11th house. i wonder if i must wait till transpecting chiron to reach my natal chiron to be healed though this manner in the 11th? it will trine my neptune an sextile my jupiter then?? think i hit on something there...

you were saying about lying to yourself, I dont know anyone who doesnt lie to themselves about something its our coping mechanism its our makeup our emotional bodies go into this involentary, then something happens where its brought out to the surface then we are left to deal with it or not...
I feel you are a very good and kind person who unfortunalty others lean on without appreciation, has this lead to you only seeing someone when they need some type of suport from you?
I dont like it myself when people say change who you are, becuase I feel its not natural to do this, and leads to other problems, but you could alter this by an example... you sister needs money..? you want to help her.. make her come and get it and visit you and make a good time of it and tell her this.. make her respect you and have a plan in place to get your money back... You have probably allready thought of this i dont know im just thinking it may be a way of getting the respect and love back..

I really hope you do, and im going to need it soon too by the looks of it.

Chiron does not contact your sun natally so that is not the problem. THere is however Mercury conjunct your Moon in the 4th with my equal chart method and in Taurus, it is bringing up issues of money and assets. I think u know that your sister has been taking advantage of you and actions speak louder than words. That you have a strong 2nd house Pisces you need to watch falling victim to the sob stories and giving to those who are addicted etc and being an enabler in that way. That your North Node is there means you need to give to those who truly deserve it and can profit it from it in a positive manner. I would say that addictions are a major factor with your sister. Trying to win the favour of your sister by buying her and you feel that as you raised her, she should love you but ultimately her character is her own and you are not responsible for that. Pluto is opposing Uranus from the 12th of sub conscious issues and karma. Self undoing and neuroses. Neptune is conjuncting your Sun in the 1st and you have victim or user issues coming to the fore.l You are naturally a compassionate and kind person but need to careful about who you give to. "Biting the hand that feeds" to be avoided.

I had similar problems with my sister with my Moon in Taurus in 3rd, trying to buy love but I woke up to the fact that you cant force others to love you and just because they are family doesnt mean they will. I pulled back and no longer bought unreciprocated gifts or cards and sent unanswered emails. Since I have pulled back she seems to have become more appreciative and responsive. THe pressure that she felt with me trying to win her favour has dissipated. I also came to the realisation that her life has nothing in common with mine and that we are very different people and that there are things that I dont like about her as she doesnt, about me. That is okay and we still love each other but there are no agendas now.

People will use you if you let them. You need to let go of any expectations of her. This is painful as I well know. Is it the lesson of unconditional love which cant be hurt by lack of reciprocation??? You dont like as she is a user, unreliable and ultimately a liar and you have faced up to that. So you can love her but not like her. I send you some white light to ease the pain of the reality hit which has beset you but you will get stronger and can operate from a more realistic standpoint in the future.

I wish you the best.

HAPPY NEW YEAR TO EVERYONE - MAY THIS NEW YEAR AND THIS NEW DECADE BRING BEAUTIFUL CHANGES TO US ALL. This last year, this last decade, has brought so much pain and fear.

MY SINCERE THANKS FOR ALL YOUR ADVICE!

I'd like to respond to several things you all have written, perhaps to make the astrology of all this more helpful to students. First a quote from R4ven:

R4ven: "She has quite a packed 12th house, and a Pisces Asc, but perhaps worse than that, her Asc ruler - Neptune - is Rx in the 8th, as is your own!!!!"

Sorry to differ, R4ven, but as you noted above, my Libra Neptune is in the 9th House. There is no question about that placement - my career is teaching foreign university students exclusively (how 9th can one get?). This has been my one success in life. With my Neptune trine my Sun and sextile my Pluto in the 7th (resolving my Sun/Pluto opposition), being my most elevated and best aspected planet, and in mutual reception to my Venus, I am grateful to have the gift of intuiting internationals' needs and how to communicate with and teach them in ways that are clear but not condescending or demeaning, thus "keeping me in demand" with them.

My sister's Scorpio Neptune is in her 8th House, as you said, square her Mars and her Nodes. Fortunately it is trine her 4th House Cancer Moon, which is by far her best planet. Whenever she is working from her Moon is when she is the sweetest and most caring. I think her Moon has made her a relatively good mother.

Claire: Chiron does not contact your sun natally so that is not the problem.

But I'm here to say that Chiron transits count! Chiron conjoining my Sun HURT! It exposed my wounds.

"There is however Mercury conjunct your Moon in the 4th with my equal chart method and in Taurus, it is bringing up issues of money and assets. I think u know that your sister has been taking advantage of you and actions speak louder than words."

I'm assuming that you're referring to my progressed Mercury. Actually that's been working out more in the Placidus system - I've been at last working on a textbook for a class that I teach, which is more 3rd House stuff. My 3rd H Taurus Moon seems to give me the ability to phrase things in clear, concrete ways, no matter how chaotic my own inner thinking may be. A good trait for a teacher.

"That you have a strong 2nd house Pisces you need to watch falling victim to the sob stories and giving to those who are addicted etc and being an enabler in that way."

This is absolutely correct. Years of therapy trying to get me out of the enabler, co-dependent mode.(My mother was an alcoholic.)

"That your North Node is there means you need to give to those who truly deserve it and can profit it from it in a positive manner."

And sometimes that's the hardest part to figure out.

Claire, you and I have had a very similar experience with our sisters!

"I send you some white light to ease the pain of the reality hit which has beset you but you will get stronger and can operate from a more realistic standpoint in the future."

Bless you! I really can feel your light.

DiDi: "I feel you are a very good and kind person who unfortunately others lean on without appreciation, has this led to you only seeing someone when they need some type of support from you?"

Thank you. And yes, unfortunately, I've let others do to this to me. But this has been changing inside me. I've already cut off a few people who only call when their computer crashes or they need someone to water their plants while they're gone, etc.

Caro: "I hope you can begin to let go of this pain. I have lots of Pisces too (11 Feb 1967 12.30am! ) I have on occasion tried to be the saviour in relationships. it doesnt work. made myself ill. a very tough lesson.

Oh WOW, Caro! Do you ever have Pisces in your chart!!! You poor dear sweet child! I hope you're an artist. Fortunately, you also have that mutable Grand Cross with Jupiter and Neptune. If you can hold yourself above the weaknesses of heavy Pisces, you can create some of the most beautiful dreams and inspirations for the rest of us. And you're so right about the saviour thing - we instinctly want to save (and when we're not self-aware, we get ALL our sense of self-worth, our self-esteem, from "saving" others - not a good thing)...we also get caught in the undertow of opportunistic people who see us as saps and will suck our spirits dry. [Whoa - talk about mixing metaphors!] As Claire wisely alluded above, we have to learn selectivity - that's a hard thing to learn - find the ones who really deserve saving. They're usually not the ones asking for it.

In closing, thanks again, everybody. All your input has been so helpful through this inner crisis; you've pointed out so many important things to me. I must add that as Chiron separates from my Sun, I definitely feel less intense emotional pain. I'm looking forward to mid-January when it will be completely out of orb!

Byron

Byron said:

R4ven: "She has quite a packed 12th house, and a Pisces Asc, but perhaps worse than that, her Asc ruler - Neptune - is Rx in the 8th, as is your own!!!!"

Sorry to differ, R4ven, but as you noted above, my Libra Neptune is in the 9th House.

Click to expand...

What I meant by the statement above is that you both have your Ascendant rulers in the 8th house - she has Neptune (I don't envy her that at all...) and you have Saturn. Now, with Saturn in Libra in the 8th, you have had to be the wise and balanced grown-up, which somehow seemed to give her the `permission' to be the eternal child. Saturn in the 8th frequently confers added responsibility for other family members, so it is as though you were born to look after her, and she was born in turn to be looked after. However, I think this was only meant to be for the duration of her childhood and adolescence!!

And a Happy New Year to you, Byron. May it all be up and up from here.

Hi Byron

I think I am anything but sweet. ha ha. some of my friends call me 'evil' ha ha. I have a good sense of humour.

unfortunately not an artist - no talent there at all except for sketching birds when I was a kid. maybe I shoud revisit that. Surrounded by artist friends these last few years though! (Also no musical talent)I think it will be writing that I try to get to grips with hopefully saturn in pisces in 5th will give me the discipline. I have a very vivid imagination. But yes I have been training to work in therapies/healing reflexology - all I guess using this piscean energy(spent the last 8 years doing this). Find I can help people even without nowing it release stuff.. I have a grand trine in water signs dont see the grand cross - will take a look at that.

Didi - our charts practically mirror each other. Although I would say you must be a 1964 aqua. As I have jupiter in cancer in 9th house. its interesting but I have had to make a stand with my family of late since since the saturn in virgo conj with my natal pluto/uranus conj. This discussion has really made me look at this again to see where this may be heading. My family would like me to live next door and look after them. I dont.

Actually I am concerned about friends as pluto moves into my 3rd house and then for me squares transit of saturn in libra in 12th house. (I have mars there) I have noticed a shift quite recently - I used some of my friends as case studies in my therapy work but now I will charge for therapy. Two of these people I have noticed a real change in them and it is not pleasant. (both of them have lots of sagi)

Byron - dont give your sister anything else. She needs to sort herself out. See I can be quite hard.

I agree with both Didi and Byron that chiron has been part of this but there is also a lot of other stuff going on neptune and jupiter esp.

Byron - look to what you love to do. I did look up cap rising - what about enviromental projects/geology? or yes try some healing therapy groups or one to one. take good care of yourself.

I have certainly learnt the hard way about friends. Im still very wary now.

best of luck to all for 2010. I really hope it gets better for you.

no but close im 65 aquarian

Hi Didi

you mentioned about when is good time to start healing.

I think time you become conscous of this which sounds like now for you in relation to your family dynamics. it is not always possible or advisable to confront people sometimes best just to distance and work on yourself. healing can take many forms.

Ive heard the scapegoat used before for chiron and also 4th house and 12th house placements. As an aqua you can detach from this. I think I am the mediator in my family I have libra in 12th house

I think the issue for us all is to come from the centre of the charts and not to be pulled out of balance by the dynamics of the transits. not easy!

Byron - another thing I guess that you have pluto now transiting 12th house. This could bring up possibilities of exploring deep stuff and using your experiences to help others.

got to go and find a place to live....................