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  #1  
Unread 06-03-2014, 05:50 PM
stargazer1 stargazer1 is offline
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Question Lilly translation.

Hi,
Does anyone know what William Lilly meant when he said " A planet giving strength to another planet", or "giving virtue to another planet". I am trying to make sense of old english. Or does anyone know of any good websites that does the translating for you. Any help here I would be very grateful.

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Unread 06-03-2014, 06:07 PM
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Kaiousei no Senshi Kaiousei no Senshi is offline
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Re: Lilly translation.

May I have a page where this is mentioned please? I would like to see the full context.
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Unread 06-03-2014, 10:25 PM
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Re: Lilly translation.

Hi,
Its on page 461- Chapter XC- Any man committed to prison, whether he soon shall be delivered. last paragraph. Christian Astrology. There are other pages in the book where he talks of one planet giving virtue to another? If I could de code all these expressions I would understand the meanings so much better. John Frawley explains some of Lillys terminology in his book Horary Practise, but I have not come across them anywhere else. Help with this would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.
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Unread 06-04-2014, 05:41 AM
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Re: Lilly translation.

Hi stargazer,

This is a good observation. Unfortunately this is an example where I believe Lilly is not using correct terminology.

Pushing virtue or power is something that occurs when a planet aspects another planet while that applying planet is in one of its dignities. The Moon in Cancer while applying to anyone would be an example of this. The idea is that the Moon would be pushing its counsel to another planet, but also be able to give them some resources to help that other planet complete the duties the Moon is pushing to it.

So, if the Moon were in Cancer and applying a Trine to Mars in Pisces and the Moon really wanted Mars to build a robot (and it's a day chart so Mars is peregrine in Pisces) Mars would be like "I don't know how to build a robot". The Moon is pushing power or virtue to him, though, so the Moon would be like "Don't worry, the instructions are included" and it would make it easier for Mars to complete the project.

But like I said, I don't think Lilly meant to use or didn't quite know what he was suggesting when he wrote this. I say this because Lilly is basically quoting (or at the very least very closely paraphasing) pg 556 of Bonatti on Horary (the Dykes translation) and here Bonatti says that the Moon or L1 need only being joined with (aspecting) the lord of the Third or Ninth with no mention of pushing power or virtue.

I would also beware of Frawley's explainations. I'm not very confident that man quite understands what is happening in classical texts after his handling of techniques in the past.
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Unread 06-05-2014, 01:49 AM
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Re: Lilly translation.

Hi Kaiousei,

Thank you for your reply. So basically any applying planet, sitting in any of its own dignities, has the strength to give power to any other planet it aspects. I think I understand this. Also, am I right in saying that if you use Ptolemys table of dignities does Mars in Pisces have strength by Triplicity in a day chart, therefore it would not be peregrine. I will be checking out Bonattis work on Horary as I believe he simplifies a lot of the techniques and he is easy to read and understand. As far as Frawley is concerned I will keep an open mind. I have undertaken a lot of charts using his teaching methods and they do seem to work. However I also understand that a lot of people find confusion with his teachings particularly when it comes to his reversal of reception. I suppose when it comes to reception it depends on your way of looking at a situation, and I have found in life that there are definitely two ways of approach, especially in romance Horaries. Anyway, thank you kindly for your input.
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