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  #1  
Unread 04-13-2015, 11:08 PM
Sagii Sagii is offline
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Who represents the male in relational horary

I apologise if this question has been asked several times, but its really confusing me. I wish to know who represents the male in the relational horary reading? Is it the lord of the 7th house, the sun or saturn?

If someone could please clarify!

Sagii

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Unread 04-14-2015, 12:31 AM
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Re: Who represents the male in relational horary

As a rule, L7 is the party asked about. So if you are asking about a man, that's him, if you were asking about a woman, that would be her.

The sun-Venus thing is appropriately used for gauging fertility more than whether people will get together. But a lot of astrologers use it for back up in 'will they get together' charts.
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Unread 04-14-2015, 03:46 AM
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Re: Who represents the male in relational horary

Sagii

it is a very good question.
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Unread 04-14-2015, 02:01 PM
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Re: Who represents the male in relational horary

I would like to follow up on what Oddity mentioned about the Sun-Venus implications.

Many astrologers asign as co-signifiers the Sun to the man, and Venus to the woman (because this are the natural rulerships of the given planets). There has been a lot of debate regarding this.

I personally, like to avoid using them as co-signifiers in specific questions, when inquiring about a particular individual. I think they only clutter the picture.

However, in more general questions (as in "will I ever marry?"), the Sun and Venus representing men and women can give an answer to the question. This is because they represent the querent uniting to someone of the opposite sex.

It is actually a really hard thing to study if Sun-Venus are co-signifiers. They might seem to work in some charts. In others they don't. I like to check them now and then, but I generally avoid them.

I do however, remain open to the possibility of them being used as co-signifiers. It would be nice if someone could present a specific chart that can only be show to bring a "yes" by uniting querent or quesited with one of these co-signifiers.

So far, I haven't found any

In the context of using them as co-signifiers, I do believe that they are only relevant when aspecting the rulers of the 1st and 7th house.

Example:

Man asks about a woman..

- querent: ruler of 1st is Mercury/Moon,
- quesited: ruler of 7th is Jupiter.

I would only take aspects from Mercury/Moon to Venus, or from Jupiter to Sun....as "valid". I don't think it works from Sun to Venus.

It is a good question, and it would be nice if people could contribute.
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Last edited by Dirius; 04-15-2015 at 02:51 AM.
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Unread 04-14-2015, 03:53 PM
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Re: Who represents the male in relational horary

I've never seen Sun-Venus work alone in a 'will they get together' chart, either, Dirius, which is why I'm so cautious of using it. And would also like to know if anyone has any experience of those two planets alone 'working' when they aren't the traditional (Lord 1 and Lord 7) signifiers.
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Unread 04-14-2015, 05:36 PM
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Re: Who represents the male in relational horary

Oddity

you need L1 and L7 or moon to L7
sun/venus wont work alone .. of course
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Unread 04-15-2015, 03:01 AM
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Re: Who represents the male in relational horary

Quote:
Originally Posted by tikana View Post
Oddity

you need L1 and L7 or moon to L7
sun/venus wont work alone .. of course
Well I don't really mean aspects between Sun or Venus. They actually rarely aspect each other, because the only aspect they can make is by sextile.

I'm going more for something like:

- L1 (male querent) aspecting Venus. No reception or aspect from L7.
- L1 (female querent) aspecting Sun. No reception or aspect from L7.

I'm talking more about the receptions, house placement, aspects between all the planets, etc.

For what I've seen, most charts that do bring people together are usually because of L1/Moon aspecting L7.

But I remain open to the possibility of Venus/Sun bringing together, in specific questions. I just haven't found a chart that shows it. Usually in the charts, either Sun or Venus end up representing other people, or other situations.

I have found them to work in general questions, but the again, they represent "posible candidates", because the context of the question isn't about someone specific.
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Unread 04-15-2015, 03:36 AM
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Re: Who represents the male in relational horary

Dirius

yeah .. receptionwise and aspectwise it is wise to look sun and venus
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