Storm Haiyan Survivor - My family all dead

Hi Marika,

I do not mind reading about it, really as it pushes me onto seeing what's really up. Sometimes words of other people that everything is going to be okay is not working for me.

I need to see what is going on to actually move on.

I got an update just now that the bodies of my family can still be given a burial except my brother's. The bodies of my other family members were trapped in some debris so it wasn't easy to remove them. My brother was been laid in the streets and most likely have been included in the mass grave already. I'm not sure if he let me dream about him since he is now at peace or sad to be separated from the others.

About the part of "karma", what does it mean?

Poyi and Jupiterasc,

Thanks for the interpretations. I can understand technical interpretations, but I can't read a chart technically and thoroughly yet. I'm just all on the basics when it comes to chart reading.

chasama said:

Hi Marika,


About the part of "karma", what does it mean?

Click to expand...

The angle (node to sun in SA chart) has not completed yet which means that it will complete in the near future (less than 1 year).

I expect that this means that you will come to realize that there was nothing that you could have done to change the outcome. It was meant to be. Part of this will involve the realization that it is your path to eventually continue on, it was theirs to be part of the destruction. There will be scars and damage left behind in you (and as part of you) from this event but it shouldn't keep you from eventually enjoying life again. Your fate will be balancing the two of these apparent contradictions.

Question -- are you married? do you have children? The reason that I ask is that your progressed moon is in the 5th and transiting Jupiter will be joining it there next year.

If you like, I will continue and do your brother's in a few hours .... or, maybe this is all too draining. You can always come back in a few months and pose the same questions ....

JUPITERASC said:

Poyi is highlighting that your brother Sioty's natal chart clearly shows Jupiter in Capricorn in 12th house
in partile opposition
with Moon in Cancer in 6th house

AND
Because the North Node is at 17 Libra
then
the South Node is at 17 Aries


SO
Jupiter squares the Nodal axis
and
Moon squares the Nodal axis

FURTHERMORE

Poyi has explained that - according to Liber Hermetis:

Quote:
...this is exacerbated if the natal chart has a malefic aspecting the Sun,
or the Sun is receiving a transit from the malefic.
The worse case expression is death or extreme danger.
The transits of the Moon to the Head or the Tail of the Dragon act as an indication of the timing of the difficult events

Difficult events are indicated on the given date 8 November 2013
Transiting Moon was in Capricorn, conjunct Natal Jupiter
opposing Transiting Jupiter in Cancer
and activating the square to the Nodal Axis
Notice also that on 8 November 2013 Progressed Mars is conjunct the natal South Node also known as the Tail of the Dragon

When we view Sioty's natal chart we note also
that he has Malefic Mars conjunct Sun and Mercury.
With Malefic Saturn close by,
joined to Mars Sun and Mercury by an out of sign conjunction.

Click to expand...

Thank you for JA doing all the checking and typing when I was asleep. Was really tried after doing 8-9hrs of studying the Dragon head and tail. Very impressive techniques Brady and Gunzburg introduced me.

I hope Chasama can get some understanding from it. Sorry I was not very good at explaining and just throw out all the information at once.

I notice that in Cha's own natal chart, his Mars is within 1 degree of exact square to the Nodes (see the thread entitled "Planets at the Bendings")-interesting that in Vedic astrology Mars is considered a karaka (significator) for borthers...

dr. farr said:

I notice that in Cha's own natal chart, his Mars is within 1 degree of exact square to the Nodes (see the thread entitled "Planets at the Bendings")-interesting that in Vedic astrology Mars is considered a karaka (significator) for borthers...

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You are very right dr farr! I missed that bit there.

In Whole sign the bending occurs at the 3rd sign and in Gemini, the siblings (a side information Chinese also describe siblings and friends as your own hands and feet). I support this Vedic view on using Mars as brother.

In Cha's chart, the modern ruler of 11th house Uranus is also received the quincunx from Mars even in 1 separating aspect but Uranus does sextile the North Node fateful event that quick and sudden. While the natal ruler for 3rd house Gemini is Mercury in Pisces and placed in 12th along with Sun, at 0 degrees 17 Aries which square the Chiron. Uranus Pluto square are at MC and opposite/square IC/MC the parental axis Pluto conjoined the Lord of MC while natal Pluto is located in 8th house while the traditional ruler is Mars in Gemini ruling the 8th house.

Furthermore, the natal 4th is ruled by Moon (which is also the progressed 3rd house's ruler overlapping the natal 4th message), progressed Moon in Leo, ruled by progressed Sun in Aries, Mars in Gemini both natal and progressed, progressed Jupiter conjunct Mars the lord of natal 8th.

Sun as the progressed 4th house cusp and where progressed Moon also at, natal Sun is hit by solar arc NN in the progressed 12th by whole sign and edge of 12th by Placidus. Solar Arc Pluto the planet in natal 8th traveling the natal 9th but in progressed 8th.

As usual I do a bit of mix and match here and I do jump between methods and around the house between placidus and whole signs with progressed, natal and solar arc. I might sound very confusing here

Hi Marinka,

Thanks again for the reply. To answer your question, I am not married yet and no children. I do have a partner, we planned to get married sometime this december, but with all things that happened, I think it would be best to move it. What does it mean?

It would mean much to me if you'd continue reading about my brother. Knowing a bit of his dreams and aspirations can help me move on, if there's something from him I can sti continue.

Thank you so much!

Marinka said:

The angle (node to sun in SA chart) has not completed yet which means that it will complete in the near future (less than 1 year).

I expect that this means that you will come to realize that there was nothing that you could have done to change the outcome. It was meant to be. Part of this will involve the realization that it is your path to eventually continue on, it was theirs to be part of the destruction. There will be scars and damage left behind in you (and as part of you) from this event but it shouldn't keep you from eventually enjoying life again. Your fate will be balancing the two of these apparent contradictions.

Question -- are you married? do you have children? The reason that I ask is that your progressed moon is in the 5th and transiting Jupiter will be joining it there next year.

If you like, I will continue and do your brother's in a few hours .... or, maybe this is all too draining. You can always come back in a few months and pose the same questions ....

Click to expand...

Chasama,

Other than all the indicators of possible explanations of the tragedy of your family. I would like to express my concern for you and hope for your life to get better very soon and you may have the strength to move on. I can see that you are hoping to continue things that your brother could not complete during his life time that is a fantastic attitude and it will assist you to gain some positivity from this life changing event.

The natal indicator of your brother's death is there in your chart very strongly in my opinion. So you are right that you want to seek some closure through some astrological explanation. This is fine and will be good for you to look at the issue with logic mind instead of avoiding it and keep all your intense feelings in the closet and may come back to attack you as dreams or other forms. I will also suggest you to go to support group if any available for traumatic event survivor/family members. Often if you don't deal with it early the wound will only go deeper eventually over the years, you still need to deal with it. So good for you to do that now. But don't forget to take time to rest and just do daily normal things to keep your life running as normal as possible while allowing yourself to grief in time don't ask yourself to complete complex healing process too fast.

poyi said:

Thank you for JA doing all the checking and typing when I was asleep. Was really tried after doing 8-9hrs of studying the Dragon head and tail. Very impressive techniques Brady and Gunzburg introduced me.

I hope Chasama can get some understanding from it. Sorry I was not very good at explaining and just throw out all the information at once.

Click to expand...

Your explanations are very clear poyi, however since Chasama is a beginner,
then I had the idea to clarify your comments
and thank you for sharing your recent studies of the Brady and Gunzburg course on the Nodes - that's much appreciated

dr. farr said:

I notice that in Cha's own natal chart, his Mars is within 1 degree of exact square to the Nodes
(see the thread entitled "Planets at the Bendings")
-interesting that in Vedic astrology Mars is considered a karaka (significator) for borthers...

Click to expand...

I noticed Chasama's natal Mars square to the bendings also dr. farr
and the very clear significance in Western Astrology also IF one uses WHOLE SIGN houses

as Hellenistic Astrologers do

but due to Cha's being a beginner
and not understanding the significance of the factor
that the house and sign location of any planet is entirely dependent on the house system used
I wondered how to explain the subject in simplified form

BASICALLY then:

In ancient times astrologers delineated SPECIFICALLY TOPICS with Whole Signs

- and increasingly today's astrologers are utilising whole signs also

THE FOLLOWING ARE 'TOPICS OF EACH HOUSE'

Vettius Valens et al utilised Quadrant based systems for the purpose of gauging planetary strength

BUT
on astro.com Quadrant based Placidus is the default

FURTHERMORE

many are unaware of astro.com's Extended Chart Selection page on which options for fourteen different house systems ARE offered


SO

to continue then


Whole Sign Houses places both Mars and Jupiter in close conjunction in Gemini in 3rd house of siblings
and thus Mars is a clear significator for brothers

Mars is in square to the bendings
from the location of 3rd house of siblings


which verifies Poyi's comment that, and I quote:

poyi said:

Chasama,
The natal indicator of your brother's death is there in your chart very strongly in my opinion.

So you are right that you want to seek some closure through some astrological explanation.

This is fine and will be good for you to look at the issue with logic mind
instead of avoiding it and keep all your intense feelings in the closet and may come back to attack you as dreams or other forms.
I will also suggest you to go to support group if any available for traumatic event survivor/family members.
Often if you don't deal with it early the wound will only go deeper eventually over the years, you still need to deal with it.
So good for you to do that now.
But don't forget to take time to rest and just do daily normal things to keep your life running as normal as possible
while allowing yourself to grief in time don't ask yourself to complete complex healing process too fast.

Click to expand...

REGARDING WHOLE SIGN HOUSES


'...In no other area of astrology is there so much mess and confusion than in the area of the so-called "houses". There are at least twenty or thirty different house systems or means of dividing the so-called "birthchart" into twelve segments of life activity. In astrology, houses, mansions, or domains, represent general areas of life activity and are the grounding areas or arenas of expression for planets. Originally, the words "houses" and "signs" were interchangeable or meant the same thing. A planet in Aries was also a planet in the house of Aries, so that in effect. there were no real houses as we know them today....'


'….Artificial divisions now known as houses were attempts by early Greeks and Hindus to measure strength "points" in the horoscope, which during 7th and 8th centuries AD were construed or confused as means of dividing the birth chart. The ascendant and midheaven degrees and their opposites, for example, were definite power points or areas of intense focus, but not necessarily the beginnings of a house or quadrant. In fact, there is no real basis for the astrological houses at all. They derive from a misunderstanding of the true nature of the Ascendant and Midheaven factors in astrology, Ascendant representing Earth/terrestial sphere, and Midheaven representing Sky/Heaven /celestial sphere....'


'...If any house system should be used at all, it should be the Whole Sign House system, where the ascendant sign becomes the whole first house and the others follow. Ascendant point can then fall anywhere in the first house and the midheaven point anywhere in the upper half of the chart. The Whole Sign House system was used by the ancient Greeks and the Hindus(who still use it today). It is the oldest and simplest house system in existence, and immediately eliminates the awful mess astrologers have made on the issue over the last 1300 years or so....' http://www.librarising.com/astrology/misc/wholesignhouses.html

Chasama, as you have frequently stated that you are experiencing difficulty with technicalities,
there are useful and FREE ONLINE ASTROLOGY LESSONS at http://astrolibrary.org/basics/

I just heard something truly fascinating of the expression of 12th house Sun regarding to unresolved Grief related to Sun in 12th house. It is from Brady & Gunzburg The Houses study kit.

Brady did a chart reading for a 20 years old young man in the past. He just got broke up with his first girlfriend though he didn't love you very deeply and could not understand why he was in such a profound deep grief. Then from exterminating his natal Sun in 12th house, that lead to his father. His father at the age of 20 years old, his first love and the love of his life was killed in an accident. His father as a young man was told by his parents to get over this and go to date then married to this young man's mother for a long time he suppressed his deep grief. Then this karmic link from his father was unusually passed on to him into his natal chart at the same age though he didn't love this woman as much but the suppressed grief of the Sun manifested in his reality.

My own case through not related to the Sun in 12th house (my 3rd Sun rules 12th house) also my 7th house is ruled by the ruler of the 4th house conjuncts SN, my current boyfriend he has awfully similar life pattern to my own father, and his father also had awfully similar patterns. There is a lot of repetitive family karmic patterns carrying on when unresolved. It is best to deal with your grief as my opinion from my own experiences and this interesting real example I just heard.

Hi chasama,

I am really very sorry for your heavy loss.
His 8th house in Virgo ruler Mercury, i have read that sometimes a mercurian 8th house shows death with damage in lungs, maybe in this case drawing.
By Firdaria method the time of his death he was in term of Saturn and Mercury. Saturn was his Asc ruler (traditional astrology) and mercury (as i said) his 8th house ruler.

JUPITERASC said:

Chasama, as you have frequently stated that you are experiencing difficulty with technicalities,
there are useful and FREE ONLINE ASTROLOGY LESSONS at http://astrolibrary.org/basics/

Click to expand...

Yes. I will do a lot of reading soon as there are too many stuff I have to do with moving to another location.

Thanks for explaining a lot of the technical stuff for me. It really is great help for me.

poyi said:

Chasama,

Other than all the indicators of possible explanations of the tragedy of your family. I would like to express my concern for you and hope for your life to get better very soon and you may have the strength to move on. I can see that you are hoping to continue things that your brother could not complete during his life time that is a fantastic attitude and it will assist you to gain some positivity from this life changing event.

The natal indicator of your brother's death is there in your chart very strongly in my opinion. So you are right that you want to seek some closure through some astrological explanation. This is fine and will be good for you to look at the issue with logic mind instead of avoiding it and keep all your intense feelings in the closet and may come back to attack you as dreams or other forms. I will also suggest you to go to support group if any available for traumatic event survivor/family members. Often if you don't deal with it early the wound will only go deeper eventually over the years, you still need to deal with it. So good for you to do that now. But don't forget to take time to rest and just do daily normal things to keep your life running as normal as possible while allowing yourself to grief in time don't ask yourself to complete complex healing process too fast.

Click to expand...

Thank you so much Poyi for all your readings on my chart. It is quite sad to know that even my chart shows such events for my brother, I will also assume that the fate of my (mother and grandma) must be there too.

I was in the point of blaming myself, (since someone from my mom's side actually blamed me) that I couldn't save them.

It would be nice to do some of the stuff my brother wanted to do, he also took up the same course I did and pretty much likes what I like as well, so I think doing better and being the best at what I (we) can do can make him happy.

I don't know if I do find a counselor here, so far my partner has been getting all my thoughts and emotions for the meantime. I do hope I encounter some people who also are in the similar position with me in Haiyan and would be able to relate better.

I just promised on my brother's dead body when I found him, that I'll be the best and be powerful. That was the only words I could say really.

chasama said:

Thank you so much Poyi for all your readings on my chart. It is quite sad to know that even my chart shows such events for my brother, I will also assume that the fate of my (mother and grandma) must be there too.

I was in the point of blaming myself, (since someone from my mom's side actually blamed me) that I couldn't save them.

It would be nice to do some of the stuff my brother wanted to do, he also took up the same course I did and pretty much likes what I like as well, so I think doing better and being the best at what I (we) can do can make him happy.

I don't know if I do find a counselor here, so far my partner has been getting all my thoughts and emotions for the meantime. I do hope I encounter some people who also are in the similar position with me in Haiyan and would be able to relate better.

I just promised on my brother's dead body when I found him, that I'll be the best and be powerful. That was the only words I could say really.

Click to expand...

There might be some support group on Facebook page you never know. There is nothing to blame yourself for. Whatever people say that is their own opinion but extremely unhelpful and lack of sympathy if not heartless. Cause is not the dead that is suffering now but the one alive will live with the consequences, the torment days and nights for many years to come. It is unproductive and destructive to think about what could be done and not done cause you simply unable to reverse what had already occurred, instead the focus should be rebuilding from destruction and transforms it for better cause for the future of common good, such as helping other people.

You do whatever you feel right to overcome right now so you can shorten the negative emotions and be productive to achieve something greater than yourself and for your family. Use the 12th house wisely.

I'm not really sure on what the 12th house may do. I asked it before since I had 3 major planets placed there but I was just told that they were not really relevant and focus more on the planets on my midheaven.

I really thank you for your kind words, as other people who are quite distant relatives of mine were really making me more pissed off and depressed with the things they're saying to me.

12th house when positive is spirituality, unity, and ultimate liberation.

chasama said:

Yes. I will do a lot of reading soon as there are too many stuff I have to do with moving to another location.

Thanks for explaining a lot of the technical stuff for me. It really is great help for me.

Click to expand...

That's ok. You are a strong survivor, you are bravely seeking ways of processing this horrendous tragedy and I am so glad to have been of some assistance to you at this challenging time

chasama said:

I'm not really sure on what the 12th house may do. I asked it before since I had 3 major planets placed there but I was just told that they were not really relevant and focus more on the planets on my midheaven.

Click to expand...

The 12th house has many Traditional significations and to get some idea of the many facets of this interesting house then there are several forum discussions including http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=49254&highlight=slavery

chasama said:

I really thank you for your kind words, as other people who are quite distant relatives of mine were really making me more pissed off and depressed with the things they're saying to me.

Click to expand...

Helpful sensible guidance talk on DEPRESSION http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4N_jjY7W_fs
and also on DEALING WITH DIFFICULT PEOPLE http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jniaUr_7438

Marinka said:

On your brother's chart -

Transits -
- Saturn is conjuncting the mid and this indicates a restriction or focusing of the status. By itself, this happens a few times in a lifetime and while indicating changes, does not necessarily indicate the severity. Saturn is also ruling the 12th house of "unforeseen/hidden enemies and could be construed as the storm (or something else from the storm) that changes the status. Saturn at the pinnacle of the chart would also indicate that there were obligations that were being taken very seriously.

Click to expand...

Because one complete orbit of Saturn around our Sun takes THIRTY YEARS

THEN

Transiting Saturn conjunct the Midheaven occurs rarely in a lifetime


HOWEVER

Saturn conjuncts MC at least three times in one lifetime
IF an individual reaches their 90th birthday

UNLESS Saturn retrogrades on the MC


For example

6 October 2012 Transiting Saturn entered Tropical Scorpio

Then 18 February had reached 11 Scorpio which is very close to Sioty's MC degree

but
THEN
Transiting Saturn retrograded at 11 Scorpio

and did not return to 11 Scorpio until mid-October 2013

By 8 November 2013 Transiting Saturn eventually conjuncted MC of Sioty's natal chart

and also by the way, at the same time
entered the 8th house of Chasama's natal chart

ILLUSTRATION OF RETROGRADE MOTION IN THE SKY USING MARS ORBIT OF THE SUN AS AN EXAMPLE