Lilith talk!

Victoria

Well-known member
Hello everybody!
I've found there is almost nothing out there on the great wide web about lilith in natal or synastry. Fancy a chat and telling everyone what you know about your lilith, and apects?

I know I have my lilith in the 1st house, libra
conjunct venus.
Also, I have noticed that a special someones lilith falls in my 7th house.
Though his is in aries. Anyone have any info?
if you don't thats okay :)
Just looking for all sorts of things about lilith!


x
 

Rebel Uranian

Well-known member
I'd like to know too. I have it in Leo in the 7th. If I waited a while it would've been conjunct Regulus. I'm glad it's not, but I've heard Lilith is not so negative a thing as some people try to make it look, but it makes you short if it's rising :/ But so does Venus, so...
 

Rebel Uranian

Well-known member
It definitely has a little bit of the dark to it... But that's not necessarily a negative thing, as so do other positive influences. Wrongly demonized, I agree, but I still wouldn't want it (or Venus) conjuct the Asc because I don't want to be short.
 

Victoria

Well-known member
A relationship or fascination short, you mean?
Or physically, I/people with strong liliths are short?

I have been 178 (5"10) since i was about 14, so I don't think i could ever call myself short! Thank you for all your replies!

I havent found any evidence as to why lilit is supposed to be such a dark thing.
A little competetive, maybe, a little possesive.. perhaps.
But not dark, surely?
 

waybread

Well-known member
There are some books out there on Lilith. Try a search on amazon.com .

Basically Lilith is the "bad girl" of the zodiac. In a woman's chart she can show where and how she needs to break the boundaries of conventional, demure, and domesticated femininity. Especially if afflicted, Lilith can bust out in angry, destructive ways. If well-aspected, Lilith shows how a woman can happily express her Wild Side.

In a man's chart, a stressed Lilith can show what kind of woman is is worst nightmare: the evil hag, the "castrating female", the outspoken feminist, the wife he can't control. If his Lilith is well aspected, he may admire and get along famously with self-actualizing women who exhibit a lot of personal freedom.

Although this book doesn't mention Lilith, a really good book that exhibits Lilith's positive nature is: Clarissa Pinkola Estes, Women Who Run with the Wolves.

Because Lilith is not an easy energy, she often shows up as "shadow material"--the unwanted or unacknowledged part of ourselves that we declare is "not me" and paste on somebody else-- like those "shrill feminists" or "promiscuous girls."

In Jewish folklore, Lilith was Adam's first wife--prior to Eve. Lilith refused to submit to Adam as an obedient wife, and so she was banished to the desert, where supposedly she mated with demons gave birth to hundreds of demons. In European Jewish communities, Lilith was a sort of supernatural witch who soured the milk and stole babies out of their cradles.

But astrologically she isn't totally bad, because if we unpack the myths, we can see how they show a kind of abject terror of powerful women who cannot be domesticated. What is unsupportive is to suppress what she stands for.
 

Victoria

Well-known member
AH, thanks! Yes, I shall indeed!

Since I've got a conjunct venus lilith in 1 of libra, I'm guessing that
is, like lilith herself, good and bad.. I do notice there tend to be a view of libra in 1
as a bit of a charmer, so maybe it's my lilith there who makes me quite an indiviualist,
and yes, quite a feminist aswell. Very enlightening, thank you so much for your reply!

I cant find if this man has any bad aspects (or any good, tbh) to his lilith,
and there in no aspect to any of my planets, other than the fact his lilith falls
directly into my 7th house. Does that mean rebellion on my part?
His lilith is aries, my 7th is in pisces.

Simply the title of the book inflames the mind, and I will have a look for it!
Thank you so much for your reply,
and please keep 'em coming! Let's educate ourselves about lilith! ;)
 

Victoria

Well-known member
AH, thanks! Yes, I shall indeed!

Since I've got a conjunct venus lilith in 1 of libra, I'm guessing that
is, like lilith herself, good and bad.. I do notice there tend to be a view of libra in 1
as a bit of a charmer, so maybe it's my lilith there who makes me quite an indiviualist,
and yes, quite a feminist aswell. Very enlightening, thank you so much for your reply!

I cant find if this man has any bad aspects (or any good, tbh) to his lilith,
and there in no aspect to any of my planets, other than the fact his lilith falls
directly into my 7th house.*** Does that mean rebellion on my part?
His lilith is aries, my 7th is in pisces.

Simply the title of the book inflames the mind, and I will have a look for it!
Thank you so much for your reply,
and please keep 'em coming! Let's educate ourselves about lilith! ;)

** when it comes to his lilith, that is.
 

Rebel Uranian

Well-known member
Yes, let's do!

And I'm not saying people with a strong Lilith are short, I'm saying that Lilith conjunct the Ascendant makes you short(er.)

What would you say about Lilith in Leo and rising Sun in Aquarius?
 

bubuza_dulce

Well-known member
I have Lilith exactly on my Desc, close conjunct with Mars, in Libra. I have also Pluto in the seventh house. It affects me a lot. Firstly, I have read that http://www.astrotherapy.eu/BlackMoon.htm (I cannot copy it) about the conj Lilith-Mars and I find it very true. I was beaten in childhood (by family) until I "cracked" and I stopped defending myself for good. At the same time the problem that made me not defend myself was that I loved those people. So I fell in love with someone who at some point used and abused me and I couldn't literally lift a finger to defend myself because it was someone I loved. Again. So I basically chose someone else over me. That lasted until I couldn't stand it anymore and I started to defend myself furiously and physically (before that I tended to be very passive-aggressive) even if I didn't know how and I felt like some "energy" inside me was unblocked. I just didn't feel before that it was ok to defend yourself, those who did it were warriors, soldiers meaning killers (bad people!) and I didn't want to hurt anybody!(Libra...) even with the cost of my own suffering. Now I know I'm "one of them" - warrior, soldier, "killer" and any living being put in great danger does whatever he/she considers it's best to survive. I still don't feel at ease thinking about these things and somewhere inside me there tends to be a judgement and denial towards "soldiers" but I deeply feel this is about me, I definitely am this so the energy switched from "the others" to "me". I practise Martial Arts to better accept those traits as qualities needed in hard times and not as flaws of the "bad people". Because I'm "the bad people" now and I have to live with it! Besides that, I'm strongly attracted to women,... Beautiful, intelligent, strong, bossy, sexy that's my type. Basically a "*****" that I see as a goddess and I adore (at least in the beginning). In relationships with men I can be very nice but it's not me. I feel like I'm pretending all the time, like all of them are boring and I don't need them at all (though I'm not bossy or very strong physically, I'm a regular "tease", cat-like woman, appreciated by men). So I felt so frustrated and uninterested in relationships with men that I decided just to give up. One of my male-friends told me that they feel when they're not wanted by the woman and that's why it doesn't go well (I asked him because I had some "technical" problems with men, always from their part and I couldn't understand why, they seemed to desire me a lot). In bed it feels in a way like we're two people of the same sex if I'm with a man (and even if he's not smart enough to realize it, a specific part of him knows it for sure!). So I reject every single man that desires to be with me because it's pointless. Even the fact that he's fooled by my nice-looking, nice-talking syle proves me he's not worth it because he doesn't "read" me correctly so he's not smart enough and maybe a woman would be more perceptive. I basically had a lack of respect for men (I was "educated" like this) and the first time I had a crush (on a man) I despised him and desired to be with him at the same time. He wasn't "man enough" for me!(but I wasn't attracted by those who were!) so I rejected him. I suffered enough to realize I had a problem (because this proved to be a pattern) and I tried to "heal" it.I despised him mainly for his lack of courage but I was just as afraid as he was (but I judged only men). So the solution seemed to become more courageous or to accept my fears (without judging me) and to have sympathy for weaker men and even if I am attracted by them to accept it. So I try to find respect for men in general, I practise Martial Arts as I said and that gives me the opportunity to see how men try to improve themselves, to understand that even for them strength comes through hard work, maybe to see braver men and admire them. Still I haven't come to the point of accepting a man in a relationship, this "respect" I try to build for them it's still from the distance. I hope this insight of how Lilith works for me it is of help to you. By the way, the woman I was attracted to had Mars and Lilith in the first house. And she is tall!
 

bubuza_dulce

Well-known member
And I also cannot accept men who despise women. I mean mysogins. I've seen women who were even married with this type and endured a lot and it was hard for me to imagine how could they stand that. I mean I'm not revolted and demanding respect but rather I feel so hurt that I could just die if I stood near a man who despises me as woman and treats me as such. And I understand I also have problems with respecting men so it would be fair to let others disrespect my gender as I do with theirs but I just cannot cope with it! If only I see (or imagine I see) a glance of disrespect in the eyes of a man towards me I just walk away. I don't say anything, I just avoid them. That's one of the reasons I have very few relationships with men, of any kind, and the ones I am friends with express their admiration towards me very clearly. I understand I am extremely subjective and all genders should enjoy the same respect but it's just how it is for me.
 

Victoria

Well-known member
Thank you for sharing your story, Bubuza dulce!
I wonder if you havent any other aspects to your lilith/pluto/mars/7th.
You talk about avoiding men because of fear of disrespect.. do you think
that is because of your pluto/mars in 7th or is that a typical Lilith trait?
Pardon my questioning but I am very curious to find out more about this
and I thing its just absolutly fascinating!

Just wondering if you'd mind telling us what your 7th house sign is?


to me lilith and pluto seem a bit similar.. perhaps that is my ignorance?

Anyone else got any info?
 
My lilith is in 10th house, gemini...i've read that's a fine placement. I've always felt able to express my "wild side" with only slightly self-destructive
tendencies :wink:

I feel very connected to the plutopian expression of womanhood; powerful, sexual, a little dark.

And this explains why I am a lot more independent in love than the rest of my chart indicates. I would never dream of "merging" with a lover to the point of my individuality being sacrificed.
 
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Lightrider

Well-known member
My Lility is in Scorpio as well, 5th house. It's conjunct Pluto, trine Chiron and sextile Mars and Neptune. Not sure what this means, i'm a guy.
 

bubuza_dulce

Well-known member
Thank you for sharing your story, Bubuza dulce!
I wonder if you havent any other aspects to your lilith/pluto/mars/7th.
You talk about avoiding men because of fear of disrespect.. do you think
that is because of your pluto/mars in 7th or is that a typical Lilith trait?
Pardon my questioning but I am very curious to find out more about this
and I thing its just absolutly fascinating!

Just wondering if you'd mind telling us what your 7th house sign is?


to me lilith and pluto seem a bit similar.. perhaps that is my ignorance?

Anyone else got any info?

This is my chart. Lilith is conjunct Pluto also (it seems) but not so close.
This description of the conjunction
http://www.astrotherapy.eu/BlackMoon.htm doesn't really fit (actually I'm not sure I understand it well) except for the fear part. I was born feeling afraid but other aspects show that also. With the time the situation has become better. As Mars/Lilith/Pluto is opposing Asc, I've read it can mean feeling threatened by people.(or being around people who hurt you). I've found also something about it on this forum:
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16422
About Lilith and Pluto:
In some respects Lilith is similar to the descriptions of a strong Pluto placement in the chart. Pluto can describe unconscious projections and personality traits which evoke areas for personal growth. Pluto has a hand in behaviours such as transference, blaming, controlling and denial. These are mostly observable behaviours which are tangible compared to Black Moon Lilith. It's from here:
http://kenoath.wordpress.com/2010/02/18/converstaion-with-lilith-resumed/
It says about the passive-aggressive behaviour that can occur when Lilith is strong in a chart. Mars in Libra and Libra in general can be passive-aggressive (because they tend to avoid conflicts but the anger has to go somewhere so they express it in a way that doesn't look like a conflict). Also the passive-aggressive doesn't want to be the "bad person" so they don't express themselves directly in order to be hard to blame. I'm an expert in all of these games of manipulation and blame-casting but I have been aware of them only for some years! (and I suppose I've used them since childhood since I'm so "good" at it!) And since I am aware of them I decided not to use them anymore-if I want to heal myself I need to renounce at my "power" and face my "opponent" -male or female openly,sincerely, in order to give them a fair chance to win the conflict or to understand the situation and express themselves anyway.I've become so good at making people feeling bad and still appearing as the "good" person it's hard to believe. You have to understand people very good in order to realize when the other one is hurting you in a "hidden" way and stop them and the people I know generally don't realize it. Before understanding this part of me I believed "men" are the evil ones because they make wars, destroy the world etc. But now I realize the feminine side destroys souls and it's a very important part and I should take responsibility when I hurt someone even when it's not physical. So I don't see myself only as a "good" person, it's just my "evil" side tends to stay hidden in order for me to pose in the "beautiful soul" I want to be.I think this is all Libra, Lilith and Mars and all. And I'm so grateful I am finally aware of it (I don't imagine I've seen it all). That doesn't mean it is solved but I try to be direct and frank every time I realize I'm hurting someone in a way they're not able to understand.
 

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Victoria

Well-known member
My lilith is in 10th house, gemini...i've read that's a fine placement. I've always felt able to express my "wild side" with only slightly self-destructive
tendencies :wink:

I feel very connected to the plutopian expression of womanhood; powerful, sexual, a little dark.

And this explains why I am a lot more independent in love than the rest of my chart indicates. I would never dream of "merging" with a lover to the point of my individuality being sacrificed.


10 house and gemini lilith! WOW, now that makes for a strong woman in my mind :)
I think you're right when 10th house is involved lilith becomes less of an obsticle and more of a means as to accheave? maybe?

I deff feel the same as you, I am not not not not looking for a soulmate or anyone to save me, thank you! BIG turn off, and more than that plain uniteresting and dull. I do take pride in my womanly strength, though.
Maybe that is because my lilith is in 1? Any ideas, anyone?

If you know where your liliths are in the chart (houses, signs)
please get them written down, really fascinated what everyones experience of their own lilith means to them!

Thank you guys for getting this going, aswell!
 
10 house and gemini lilith! WOW, now that makes for a strong woman in my mind :)
I think you're right when 10th house is involved lilith becomes less of an obsticle and more of a means as to accheave? maybe?

I deff feel the same as you, I am not not not not looking for a soulmate or anyone to save me, thank you! BIG turn off, and more than that plain uniteresting and dull. I do take pride in my womanly strength, though.
Maybe that is because my lilith is in 1? Any ideas, anyone?

If you know where your liliths are in the chart (houses, signs)
please get them written down, really fascinated what everyones experience of their own lilith means to them!

Thank you guys for getting this going, aswell!

Now I had to go back and take a look at my lilith!

All very tight orb aspects (the widest is under 3 degrees)
Square to the sun
Opposite neptune
Trine NN (exact!) and pluto
Sextile Venus

So I guess that's pretty strong lilith energy.
 

Lightrider

Well-known member
Now I had to go back and take a look at my lilith!

All very tight orb aspects (the widest is under 3 degrees)
Square to the sun
Opposite neptune
Trine NN (exact!) and pluto
Sextile Venus

So I guess that's pretty strong lilith energy.

**** that looks terrific! I actually feel relieved coz mine is almost squaring my Sun as well. Pluto squaring my Sun is enough for me, seriously.
 
10 house and gemini lilith! WOW, now that makes for a strong woman in my mind :)
I think you're right when 10th house is involved lilith becomes less of an obsticle and more of a means as to accheave? maybe?

I deff feel the same as you, I am not not not not looking for a soulmate or anyone to save me, thank you! BIG turn off, and more than that plain uniteresting and dull. I do take pride in my womanly strength, though.
Maybe that is because my lilith is in 1? Any ideas, anyone?

If you know where your liliths are in the chart (houses, signs)
please get them written down, really fascinated what everyones experience of their own lilith means to them!

Thank you guys for getting this going, aswell!

1st house lilith...might it alter your impression on people? Do people have extreme reactions to you? Either way, 1st lilith sounds powerful.
 
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