Intercepted and Duplicated signs

Hey all!

All right, first post. Hope *fingers crossed, ..."when you wish upon a star" playing in head* that it makes some sense. *deep breath* OK, so I just read up on intercepted signs and what it says rings so true. I have intercepted Cap/Can in the 4th and 10th houses, respectively, and they are covered by Sag/Gem. The inaction thing is SO TRUE, and there is nothing I want to do but stop with the indecisiveness.

"In the horoscope of a person, an intercepted sign shows a blockage. The qualities of that sign have difficulty coming out. It is like a room in your house that can only be reached by first going through another room." - Bob Marks

However, I'm not sure of the best way to access this energy, partly because I'm unsure what my duplicated signs are. One chart says it is Virgo/Pisces ruling the 12/6 and 1/7, much as EJ's, and the idea of "service and self-sacrifice being the way to go" as the old, learned, but wrong lesson through 6/12 is 100% ON TARGET. However, I feel that following the energies of these signs gives me no release, and instead entrap me WAY more (Mercury Rx in the 12th House gives me difficulty communicating and lead me to think in circles (and in solitude) and Neptune in Cap is trapped in the 4th).

Oh right, and

"You can also look to the ruling planets of your intercepted signs. The house and sign positions of these planets, as well as the aspects they form, can show another way to solve the problems caused by your intercepted signs. Sometimes though, one of these planets is also placed in an intercepted sign. That’s like having your keys locked inside your car. It usually means that this planet cannot be used to overcome the interception." - Bob Marks

Saturn and Moon are both locked in 4th. -____- Great!

A different possible double-duty placement that rings much more true for me is Libra/Aries on 1/7 and 2/8. I can't tell you how many times I've heard people tell me that I "just need to be more assertive," and the house placements of these planet rulers (Venus in 11th, Mars in 9th) are definitely my outlets and have shown me the way to happiness (friends and associations, spirituality). I feel that this is a more likely placement. If that's the case, and higher 2/8 is the axis of growth or the way to establish ourselves, what is a good way to access this energy? Does it mean being more fair and just (Lib energy) in trusting myself, building my own resources and standing on my own two feet while being active and assertive (Aries energy) in trusting others?

Thank you so much! Any help would be so greatly appreciated. Great energy in this forum like I haven't come across before (I love this community!!!)

Best wishes!

Take care,
jennazhu

If you can post your natal chart then some of us may be able to help you.
We need a `picture' to look at!!

Oh, right! OK, here's the first one.



And here's the second one.

In this case, it would actually be Sag/Gem intercepted in 3rd/9th (gah! There I go with the miscommunication. Darn being unable to separate the wheat from the chaff!) ;p

Thanks again! Best wishes.

I read something in one of Jeffrey Wolf Green's books that shed a new light on intercepted signs for me. I tried to find the exact quote just now, but I couldn't locate it. He states that in some charts an intercepted sign is an indication that the soul has sufficiently worked through the lessons of that particular polarity enough in past lives that the soul doesn't need to actively focus on that polarity in the current incarnation. This wouldn't be true of all intercepted signs but definately for some. This is similar, in some regards, to some of the other ideas that have been put forth on this thread.

R4VEN said:

Yes, the interception would do that, but also you have this stellium in the 8th house, where they can also be quite `hidden within' anyway, even without the interception.

That sounds like projection to me............. that is, where you become uncomfortable, or even outraged when another person displays the negative traits you have been working hard (perhaps unconsciously) to hide. In a strange way, that response to another person is a clear acknowledgement of your own negative Virgo traits.

There is probably a process going on here for you, the outcome of which may be for you to access your own Virgo self - eventually.

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That is interesting. I have never even thought about it from that viewpoint. In fact, I never even thought that I may be trying to hide my Virgo traits.

Anything is possible though.

lilllybelle said:

.....Jeffrey Wolf Green.....states that in some charts an intercepted sign is an indication that the soul has sufficiently worked through the lessons of that particular polarity enough in past lives that the soul doesn't need to actively focus on that polarity in the current incarnation.

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I was not aware of this, Lillybelle..........but it seems right to me.

In that situation, I guess the Soul might use the duplicated houses to increase the lessons of a polarity which they do need to focus on in the current incarnation.

This makes sense, and (sigh) is likely to modify my approach to interceptions.........Thanks for the new information, Lillybelle.

EJ

lilllybelle said:

I read something in one of Jeffrey Wolf Green's books that shed a new light on intercepted signs for me. I tried to find the exact quote just now, but I couldn't locate it. He states that in some charts an intercepted sign is an indication that the soul has sufficiently worked through the lessons of that particular polarity enough in past lives that the soul doesn't need to actively focus on that polarity in the current incarnation. This wouldn't be true of all intercepted signs but definately for some. This is similar, in some regards, to some of the other ideas that have been put forth on this thread.

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Yes, lillybelle, that has been stated on this thread - I think by EJ53 - and seems to be the case, even though I also know of some people - generally still quite young adults - who appear to be clueless re the intercepted signs. This may just be a maturity thing, and lack of major transits to the ruling planets of the intercepted signs.

And to jennazhu - I reckon your intercepted Sagittarius and Gemini are only likely to be a `problem' if you have difficulty with your Jupiter or Mercury placements. Mercury is cool in Virgo, and with the 12th house placement it can be slow to emerge for you, but that's OK. Jupiter is sextile Mars - nice - but inconjunct Uranus, which can be a bit iffy - inconsistent drives.
I'd suggest that you view your natal chart as a framework, rather than a series of problems to be `solved'. If there are problems, then Life will throw you as many opportunities to find solutions as you need. In my experience you rarely need to go looking.

PS: We posted together, EJ. Obviously it wasn't you who said that about intercepted signs. Sorry for that.

R4VEN said:

Yes, lillybelle, that has been stated on this thread - EJ.....Obviously it wasn't you who said that about intercepted signs.

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Hi R4VEN.............Hope you are enjoying the current "Pom bashing" Ashes series over here in the UK.

I think Lillybelle is saying something new, that extends what I've said on the thread......(Hence, her reference to Jeff Green's statement being "similar to some of the other ideas put forth on this thread".)

I've said the intercepted signs are "locked away" until the individual's Soul has ensured that the Ego will use them safely in the current lifetime........Jeff Green/Lillybelle is saying that they are sometimes "locked away" because the individual's Soul has no use for them in the current lifetime.

However, both ideas see interceptions as a mechanism used by the Soul to achieve a particular objective in this lifetime.......Only the objective itself differs.

EJ

EJ53 said:

Hi R4VEN.............Hope you are enjoying the current "Pom bashing" Ashes series over here in the UK.

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Mmmm.... cricket has not held the same attraction for me since the retirement of characters such as Darren Lehmann, and Warnie - now, Shane Warne's astrology chart would be an interesting one........ chosen to represent his country because there was no-one else available, then all his public shenanigans. When Flintoff retires the game will be as dull as.. If I see Ricky Ponting frown one more time I'm throwing a brick at my TV!

EJ53 said:

I've said the intercepted signs are "locked away" until the individual's Soul has ensured that the Ego will use them safely in the current lifetime........Jeff Green/Lillybelle is saying that they are sometimes "locked away" because the individual's Soul has no use for them in the current lifetime.

However, both ideas see interceptions as a mechanism used by the Soul to achieve a particular objective in this lifetime.......Only the objective itself differs.

EJ

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I think that the reason varies with the individual.
I know of people who could certainly use their intercepted signs............. but then again, perhaps their soul needs them to access some other method of dealing with a situation in life.
Just a thought...........

Hi everyone (I apologize beforehand for a long post!),

Flea said:

I also have sun sq pluto. It raises the issue of how power is used....I think that is
the relation to Liberty and Law, both concepts exert a power.

I have dealt with people who overstepped my boundaries all my life,
it was quite late in life, late thirties that I stopped allowing this situation. I had
recognized a pattern. Unless the individual recognizes the pattern and does something about it.... i think the power figures will just kept getting replaced until the necessary
shift in consciousness has taken place. It was something i went through alone, the initial break with a pattern.

So there is a basic learning about power that this soul is going through.

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Yes. I agree with what you say and honor you, Flea, for experiencing
and describing your shift in consciousness! Your description rings true for me
and I also have sun sq pluto natally: 5th house Sun (15* Taurus)
and 5th house Venus (20* Taurus) square
8th house Pluto (14* Leo), Ceres (17* Leo), Moon (19* Leo).

Plus, my Leo/Aquarius is conceivably the polarity of intercepted signs
in my natal chart (using Placidus, that is; but using Koch,
everything changes to make Virgo/Pisces the intercepted signs!).

This posting is my attempt to describe the turning point for me.
This week I really stopped to open myself to
the possibility that Virgo/Pisces were intercepted signs...
I thought about my "inability to see the big picture" and "inability to
use discipline and organization to achieve my 9th house goals."

OmiGoddess! Suddenly I was remembering: there I was in pre-med,
unable to ask for a tutor for organic chemistry and thus in denial about
having to knuckle-down in preparation for multiple-choice tests...

and my Pisces intuition--where was it?
How unable I was to see the big picture and go in the direction
I needed to take the steps necessary to fulfill what I thought was an
authentic "destiny" -- (medical school) -- but which actually was a projection.

...remembering being lost, lost, lost in space and time (and 2nd Saturn return).

Then, this week I did some more research and read this comment by Robert Wilkinson:

http://www.aquariuspapers.com/astrology/2007/09/intercepted-pla.html

and began thinking...it's through the function of the planets in a sign (i.e.,
using a sign's energy) that
the personal breakthroughs of each house's meaning (psychological activity) emerge.
I had no planets in Virgo/Pisces -- only a Virgo
Part of Fortune currently conjunct transiting Saturn!

So, I wondered, could it be that it's really Aquarius/Leo that's
intercepted in my chart!?!

Looking at Placidus system, I see all my 8th house intercepted Leo
activity, and think about the meaning of my intercepted
airy Aquarian Jupiter (and Psyche cj Eros) in 2nd house...

Wilkinson believes that those houses where a sign is intercepted
(being a big house)
signifies not planetary "weakness" or a "bad corner" karma
due to past life malfeasance, but
rather a wider range of experiences there.

So, what mysterious 2/8 house polarity applies? According to Candy Hillenbrand
http://www.aplaceinspace.net/Pages/Astrobasics.html#astroalphabet)
it involves personal resources and shared resources....

My "personal resources" were hidden from me, it seems.

Maybe I was "covering" my highest ideals and deepest personal values
(I do agree with Michael Parenti, who says: "Capitalism is self-inflicted
apocalypse...." I'm definitely not a consumer/humanoid, nor am I a
communist -- just a simple philosopher-type with Sag rising...).

Anyway...

looking at my 2nd house cusp in Capricorn I could say that
whereas my heart is with evolutionary group values (Aq)--I have often
attempted to work 9 to 5 and "just fit in." But that never felt authentically
me.

My heart has an affinity for dramatic Leo, the sign ruled by our star, the Sun.

Unbelievably, Leo is intercepted in my 8th house of personal
transformation, other people's money, sex, life-and-death -- and
has Cancer on my 8th house cusp! That is hardly bold
and courageous and daring and dramatic! Wow.

This makes sense to me...so when did all
this shift in consciousness intercepted houses occur?

This week, when our Sun was about 3* Leo (cj my natal Vertex and cj
my Solar Return Ascendent!)

Next, I will think about how duplicated house/sign pairs --
12th/1st in Sagittarius and 6th/7th in Gemini -- point to insights about myself (which is
a lot of what astrology is about!) and directions to take to fold in all the facets of...
me, integrating psyche, emotions, experiences, astrological insights, mind and body!

...looking for freedom, and balance.

Waybread, you said:

If anyone else would like to work out their charts, I would be curious
to learn what you come up with.

Click to expand...

Thanks for inviting us to describe the intercepted/duplicated meanings we
have found in our charts! (I've also been looking at my progressed chart
and finding resolution to...my natal chart that lacks water (except for
Pallas Athena and the centaur Asbolus in Cancer)...but
that's another thread!@!

Salud, astrologers!

C1

MTTY05 said:

I'll chime in since I've got an interception that I've been researching recently in my astro studies.

Aquarius is intercepted in my 1st, with Leo intercepted in the 7th house. I guess the Aquarius/1st house int. means that I have problems presenting myself differently than others, but personally, I don't feel that's the case at all as I am very unique compared to other people. Maybe my Uranus qualities are easily accessed because it's in the 11th house which happens to be a duplicated house.

And I assume that the Leo/7th interception means that I have problems taking center stage and gaining recognition in social relationships, which is something I can totally relate to. As a matter of fact, I really don't feel any Leo qualities at all in any sphere of my life. However, my Moon progressed into Leo last month, so I'll see how that goes.

So there is my amateurish astrology interpretation! Hope it's not too off the wall, ha!


And, I read somewhere that a 7th house interception can mean 2 marriages. I'm not sure if it's true or not, but I thought it was interesting.

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If you use equal house or whole signs method for instance, doesnt it all go away??? I mean is there any validity at all to the interceptions. I dont think so.

I also wonder what purpose my soul can get out of my intercepted planets. And I agree that it seems like an interception is a nasty joke that life throws at you. I have fourth and 10th intercepted in scorpio and taurus, respectively. Leo and aquarius are duplicated on the first and seventh. Where's the way out? In a nasty twist of things, My sun, pluto and venus are intercepted in the fourth. It's like butting my head against a stone wall.

and what irritates me further, is that any astrological interpretation i come across talks about my love of domestic things and nurturing people and family pride and blah blah blah. All those things are foreign to me, probably because of the interception of the house. nor do I really wish to develop those traits.

Claire19 said:

If you use equal house or whole signs method for instance, doesnt it all go away??? I mean is there any validity at all to the interceptions. I dont think so.

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Good point, Claire.

My current view is that intercepted signs/duplicated houses provide an opportunity to quickly synthesise the meaning of several inter-related astrological indicators in a chart......So astrology students can use the former to "fast-track" the painstaking identification/interpretation/synthesis process of the latter.

Thus, I avoid using equal house/whole sign/other systems that deprive me of this option......But it's a matter of choice for each astrology student, since (imo) a complete chart interpretation can be achieved using any house system and without reference to intercepted signs/duplicated houses.

bluemascara said:

I also wonder what purpose my soul can get out of my intercepted planets......

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We need to see the chart, BM.

Thanks for the reply EJ.

When I read your proposed example re Saturn, my immediate thought thereafter was my fear of failure and not beleiving in my capabilities / intelligence to complete any form of higher education. I have had several education paths that I would have liked to follow, some being in the medical field, but held myself back because of these fears.

At the age of 37, I know that I am not on a career path of my choice but find myself where I am, through choices I have made...accepting "second best".

Communication has become an important factor and I am exploring ways of increasing communication in my daily life, perhaps incorporating it into a career path via books, blogs, public speaking etc.

Thanks for your help with this aspect. I appreciate it....

But, what might be the "inappropriate" attitude that caused this 07.Re?
For example, might you be from a family who beileved that "education and/or careers are for boys".

[Note: I have to break-off from my computer now, but will pick this up again when I return/]

This is an interesting question and one I don't know the answer to.

My parents go divorced when I was 10 years, and my Mom became my sole guardian. She was very career orientated and did well at work. My sister who is 10 years older than I am, studied to become a Chartered Accountant, failed the exam twice and passed on the third attempt... so clearly I have had good role models. My Mom is also very pro girls studying and when I completed grade 12 with a university exemption (which meant my grades were high enough to be accepted in a uni without further testing), suggested I do a secretarial course to "fall back on" until I knew the path I wanted to take.

So really, I am scratching my head wondering where I formed the belief that I was not clever enough to go to uni. Having 7 air signs and 1 fire sign, means that I start projects with ease, but don't necessarily finish them, hence my apprehension at starting a course and not seeing it through.

ETA: Self acceptance is something that I lacked while growing up... only now do I feel comfortable in my own skin and have learnt that imperfections are only human. This belief of not being clever enough, pretty enough, confident enough, has kept me from achieving much in my life and these fears have held me back... again.... I don't know how or when they manifested. I would compare myself to others and rate myself second best, accepting that others had more to offer. I hid my light under a bushell and it affected potential growth in my life.

But I will give this some more thought and see where it leads.

EJ, here's my chart. It really beats me what the point of my life would be to have the ruler of my duplicated sign, my intercepted signs, and the ruler of the sign on the cusp of the intercepted house actually be intercepted. Seems a little cruel. Thanks in advance for any input!

I think intercepted houses do add to chart interpretation. I sometimes wonder whether people who dispute them don't have any in their charts. I realize that some people are committed to the whole-sign or equal house systems as traditional astrologers or for philosophical reasons; but I support a position taken by Australian astrologer Alice Portman, that different individuals resonate more strongly to one particular house system or another. Working extensively with your chart should help to fine-tune the house system that is best for you as an individual.

07.Re, you have quite the turbo-charged first house! Notably with that big trine to Saturn, who should take the brakes of your self-expression. Normally I would expect you to come across as a highly dynamic, forceful individual. [Yes, even for a Libra--we recall that some famous generals are sun-sign Librans.] If you feel this expression doesn't get the traction that you feel within you, then I would suspect that big intercepted sign of Libra. I note that Chiron opposes your sun, which could reinforce a feeling of not being able to express what you have within you.

It is interesting that Sag. and Gemini are your dupicated signs on house cusps. Your Gemini ruler in the 1st might not help much, but Jupiter is outside of the box, conjunct your IC. Depth psychology and developing a personal philosophy would seem to build on your strengths.

Blue mascara--your soul is bigger than your chart. I like the idea that souls choose a particular time to incarnate that best encourages the life-lessons they wish to learn. With an interpception, your soul may have wished to focus on other areas; or to develop those areas extra-strongly to counteract the effect of the interception. [I am no fan of heavy-duty past-lives karma, BTW.]

With so much focus on your 4th house of "home" and early childhood conditioning, depth psychology would seem to be important to you. Do you keep a journal, or express your deepest feelings through some creative outlet? Your planets in the 9th, including Jupiter, would seem to encourage your developing a powerful life-philosophy.

waybread said:

07.Re, you have quite the turbo-charged first house! Notably with that big trine to Saturn, who should take the brakes of your self-expression. Normally I would expect you to come across as a highly dynamic, forceful individual. [Yes, even for a Libra--we recall that some famous generals are sun-sign Librans.] If you feel this expression doesn't get the traction that you feel within you, then I would suspect that big intercepted sign of Libra. I note that Chiron opposes your sun, which could reinforce a feeling of not being able to express what you have within you.

It is interesting that Sag. and Gemini are your dupicated signs on house cusps. Your Gemini ruler in the 1st might not help much, but Jupiter is outside of the box, conjunct your IC. Depth psychology and developing a personal philosophy would seem to build on your strengths.

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Hi Waybread, my 1st house is certainly interesting...I also have Pallas conjunct Asc, but having Venus placed in 12th house hampers many of the energies. I suspect that having Saturn transiting through Libra, will wake up many of these energies and so it should be an intersting few years ahead.

I have done research into Chiron - Sun opposition and identify with many of the negatives. When I was younger (at school), I chose to make myself invisible but as I have aged, I have become more extroverted.

I will research more on Jupiters placement... thanks....

waybread said:

Blue mascara--your soul is bigger than your chart. I like the idea that souls choose a particular time to incarnate that best encourages the life-lessons they wish to learn. With an interpception, your soul may have wished to focus on other areas; or to develop those areas extra-strongly to counteract the effect of the interception. [I am no fan of heavy-duty past-lives karma, BTW.]

With so much focus on your 4th house of "home" and early childhood conditioning, depth psychology would seem to be important to you. Do you keep a journal, or express your deepest feelings through some creative outlet? Your planets in the 9th, including Jupiter, would seem to encourage your developing a powerful life-philosophy.

Click to expand...

nope. i suck at jounal keeping.I find it boring... I have trouble accessing my emotions which is what is frustrating me...i think its because my only planets in water are intercepted. But what's the way out if all the key planets out of the interception seem to be intercepted? Except for mars and uranus but...one can't trust uranus too much and my mars is in detriment. FAIL, lol.

Also, I that to access an intercpeted sign a person must first master the sign on the cusp. So for my fourth house, where my major planets are, that would be Libra -> Scorpio. So i'd have to master Libra to get to the energies of my sun,pluto, venus etc. But my SN is in Libra, so supposedly I'm supposed to be letting go of the Libra. Sounds Absurd to me at this point. Like a Catch 22.