Discussion on Difficult Karma

Lets talk about our natal aspects that are difficult especially with Saturn or a planet in a fall. Everything is open though. I would love to hear about peoples struggles internally with their perceptions as "venus in virgo" for example, as difficult, and how they turn it into a talent.

What is your attitude about them? If you are a lot older, how have you come to "own" these hidden talents?

Discussion opener:

Our karma is the container of our spirits. Spirit being the ultimate awareness, and soul being the unique container that it finds in life. Karma is not separate from our identity (soul) and trauma or "bad" karma is really what imprints upon us and sets up patterns of relating. So lets talk about the things that really make us special!

Actually, I ask that we stick to perceptions of the hard aspects, if you want to talk about your drug addiction go ahead, but only to how it relates to your natal chart and I prefer to stick to your present feelings and actions regarding the difficult aspects/placements.

I have a lot of difficult aspects in my chart but my rewards in life come from owning my history and owning my flaws. However, with the moon, saturn and pluto in scorpio (this is the most difficult thing for me) I find there is always a mystery. I struggle to really know all my flaws and there is a constant rise and fall. Personally I find my emotions are the most negative and dangerous thing in my life and saturn (society) sits directly on top of my scorpio feelings - demanding that i shape up/ conform or else. So I life a tightrope of wanting to be accepted and wanting to be left alone. This I cannot escape. Whether I am happy or sad my feelings, views and opinions are always long and intense - and for a long time I was extremely judgemental of myself and my different-ness (my ego taking the role of a destructive saturn - father in a way.) Which made it worse - I only thought however that being judgemental was the way to tame the beast. I only recently discovered that I was still feeding it. To own saturn's wisdom, I have to be patient and let go of my past views of it. Its wisdom is harsh but the lesson benefits everyone. Even when I am being rejected I have to remember that someone somewhere still loves me and that I can be myself as long as I take the negativity away from social situations. Saturn therefore is made strong once I understand it is not my enemy but myself that I am facing. The rise and fall within me like the phoenix is the constant of all life, and is not something uniquely flawed about me. . . Nor is it a problem, because what I am today was created from decisions that have lead to my survival this far. Saturn seems like it doesn't accept me, but in truth that was only my perception. Saturn only teaches me how strong I must be in order to fight for what I care about.

So that's some small part of what I have to go through with this difficult aspect. I have a lot of internal dialogue to share but this is only because I have such a long road in life to travel (we all do.) Actually I spend a lot of time surrendering my thoughts to the goddess because to objectify reality is to set oneself up for a definite reversal eventually. Because in time, all things will happen. My goal and perhaps my ultimate talent, is to choose to surrender all positions, paradoxically by doing this, I choose a position...

I really mean to emphasize how this has lead me to let go of a lot of stupid opinions and stop defending them. In my life I must become strategic, strong willed, forgiving, constant and gentle.


My other hard aspects are

venus leo with leo rising (aching heart, overblown romantism)
venus square saturn (oppression of desire)
sun in virgo (over mental, cutting off fire of god)

I also wanted to mention I don't follow karma as something "to figure out"
Same thing with astrology.. . I just don't take it seriously anymore. It is only a tool. How you use it matters. If you use it emotionally, needing and demanding from the universe ...
I am so fortunate to have come to the point where the circle returns to the beginning, which is to say I remember now that details are important, but what is more important is your relationship with them.

For example. . . in the middle ages, there was a HUGE long argument that has been discovered in church documents about how many angels could fit on the head of a pin.

This argument swept across all of Europe. The argument boiled down to whether or not angels have mass or not, but at that time they didn't have the same ideas of physics as we do. The argument became about church doctrine, and numbers. Petty... basically.

I prefer an intuitive, patient and practical view of the world.

A friend of mine got into astrology too deep and discovered her brother was going to have a short life (via vedic astrology prediction) and that same year he died violently. She quit after that, because she realized it was information she really didn't need to know anymore.

So what is karma? I don't care really, except it I know that it is the mother of us all, and mother likes to be thanked for her gifts.

My Moon and Pluto are applying conjunct in Scorpio in my 1st house, which makes me a very intense, emotional person. I also cannot conceal my emotions very well for better or worse, with them being in my 1st house. Utilizing my Saturn in Capricorn, I've learned to master my emotions. I don't control them like controlling a puppet: it's more like I've learned to surf on top of them, channeling the emotional power that's there into the things I want to use it on.

That's definitely my hardest aspect.

I have a t-square with

Venus Cancer H4
Pluto Libra H7
Jupiter Sag (late) H10

I also have Uranus in H7..

All of my relationships are all of a sudden, and we met in unusual circumstances.

Each one is very intense... But I learn so much about my self, and life in general with each new relationship... Im never the same person after a relationship..
Once I learn something, the relationship seems to die...

Hi there,

I too have Saturn(22*), Moon/Pluto(conjunction 2*) in Scorpio...Saturn in 10th and part of a T-square with Venus and Jupiter....
I have many fears and now is a period I have to deal with them it is obsseising and I feels like crazy.....I don't know what to do ...just waiting for things to settle down.....I'm trying to cure myself from judjing me and others with love and undesrtanding...I'm trying to be open minded...I have to reach the real problem and solve it to get to the Saturn wisdom.....but I feel the barriers(Saturn again, subconscious) I guess the time is not right yet ...I feel tired of Saturn ......I don't know hoe to cope with him...
You have a lot of fire in you....I don't... I'm water and a little earth.....you are optimistic ....I'm melancholic and need hope, fire and willpower......Mars is in Cancer...fall again....
when I read your post I thought "wow it feels like me"

Karma & planets +retrograde
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=290

I have Saturn at late scorpio in the 6th, and Mercury closely conj. Pluto in scorpio also in the 6th. My Sun is in fall in Libra, at almost 20 degrees too:/ And Venus is in fall in Virgo. My ultra scorpio mind makes me a little obsessed with things, it is usually emotional in nature. Virgo Moon close square Neptune, and Mercury/Pluto sextile Neptune in the 8th. I dont think Im 100% on the physical plane to put it that way. Emotional precognitive dreams and other ESP stuff surface now and then. Also sometimes I have strong emotions about people without really knowing the reason.

I just think there is a plan for my life or probably for all of us, and its easier to see if you keep an open mind, instead of being fixed with special indeas and judgement about everything. I have been divorced and miscarried with bad relationships, difficult childhood with no mother. But Im glad I went through all this because it has made me stronger and wiser in a way. Some of my family members are ashamed of my divorce and all the bad stuff and try everything they can to avoid bad stuff. But I think we are here to learn, and the more difficult stuff you get through "alive" the better.

I have Saturn well aspected, sextile mars/venus/moon. So Im guessing thats why I have this "positive" view on hard life experience for learning

Wow
Thanks everyone!

I notice a lot of scorpio issues like me which bring out a lot of intensity and seriousness in life.

Music always helps me and so does humor. I've pretty much given up a lot of my previous ambitions in life - so I can only focus on doing my best to quiet my inner demons.

I do yoga every day and meditation almost every day.

Im not yet at my saturn return but I worry about it a lot especially since it is in my 4th house.

Another thing I mean to mention especially to the user vanilla I have mars in virgo in the first house
sextile pluto in scorpio. I have a very intense destructive mind that likes to pick apart everything.

I have virtually no air in my chart (except an airy 6th house jupiter in aquarius) and to combat your feelings of hopelessness FYI the mixture of fire and water can be explosive! (Think of the trapped water in a volcano which causes the worst kinds of destruction)

Fire and water don't mix well. This is called "Gandanta" in hindi astrology and any period where a planet is changing from water to fire is considered a danger time.

Something I've just accepted karmically is that in my work (cooking) I regularly get hurt more than my co-workers and often its someone else's fault and the accident just comes to me (like a broken glass in the dishwasher, or a pan on the edge of the table, or someone bumping me with a hot pan)

With mars in the first there is tremendous energy, but also danger. . .

with less air in the chart I dunno what I lack . . .but its certainly a job for me in this life to "float" on what happens rather than get sucked into it.

Today for example, I was on a street corner for a friend, directing traffic to her really awesome concert. . . someone called the cops on me thinking I was a prostitute. It was hilarious but also STILL bothered me. . . . hahahah. . .

re: vagabond girl

Your post was inspiring. I appreciate your honesty and I recognize your experience with scorpio's charms . . hahahah


I have similar problems with family. Although they are alright in their own way. . .(ok not totally alright, i had an absent mom too ... due to serious illness) This is probably because my scorpio moon - saturn clusterbomb is in my 4th house.

Thankfully Jupiter is in the 6th which seems to provide for pleasant times in work. (Although with difficulties in the 4th it is hard for me to bring home the bacon and keep it there)

I am really enjoying the posts here this is my first original thread. Chatting is easier for me. Writing threads is a bit scary.

Rushwing said:

Another thing I mean to mention especially to the user vanilla I have mars in virgo in the first house
sextile pluto in scorpio. I have a very intense destructive mind that likes to pick apart everything.

I have virtually no air in my chart (except an airy 6th house jupiter in aquarius) and to combat your feelings of hopelessness FYI the mixture of fire and water can be explosive! (Think of the trapped water in a volcano which causes the worst kinds of destruction)

Fire and water don't mix well. This is called "Gandanta" in hindi astrology and any period where a planet is changing from water to fire is considered a danger time.

Click to expand...

I mentioned it because I know what is to lack fire and air at the same time.....but yours is not easier too.....
loosing hope easily and sinking deep down in sorrow and emotion...self criticism....etc..... it is scorpio trait but when you don't have something to catch for....drowning water.....
and still I'm not sure how to handle all this....
however today is a beautiful day

Hm yes best thing is to stay loyal to those you love and to appreciate the life one has in the present.

Today was a beautiful day.

astrologer50 said:

Karma & planets +retrograde
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=290

Click to expand...

Funny that I should read this. I just came back from my walk, sat down and clicked on this thread first. 15 Minutes ago I was thinking about my 5 retrograde planets in my natal chart and all the nasty things that I have to learn, deal with and make peace with in this lifetime. Not a lot of fun... I've heard that Mars retrograde in natal chart can mean that one has to learn to deal with a lot of anger. I've been very angry about my difficult life. I've been angry too long... I am now deciding to make peace with the whole thing and accept my life. I am not too sure how to go about resolving this 'karma' in this lifetime but I've wasted too much of my life being resentful and not accepting what is.

A while back there was a poll about how many planets in retrograde people on this forum have. I found it interesting that there were quite a lot of people with 4 -6 retrograde planets. I think these difficulties are what draws us to astrology. To try to understand and come to terms with our difficult lives or at least the difficult aspects of it...