Sign Signatures for Natal Charts

Hello,
I have some thing that may catch your interest as it can contribute to answering the question as to why sometimes we run in to people that act somewhat counter to what their Sun Signs are. While outwardly, the Ascendant covers part of that, there is a method one can follow that can determine really what your own individual your "Sign Signature" is. It is fairly easy to determine. Mine for example,
http://img153.imageshack.us/my.php?image=franklintaytlornatalchart5fl.png
If you will look at the lower right side at your Elements to Qualities Chart, you will see that for element Fire I have only two planets Sun and Mercury in the Fixed Quality

For Air, I have no planets so you go on quickly. No imaginary lines(ascend,Nadir,Midheaven,or decendants) or points (north/south nodes) count only planets.

For Earth, I have only two planets Uranus and Pluto in the Mutable Quality.

For Water, I have six planets, Moon, Venus, Mars, and Jupiter in Cardinal, Neptune is in Fixed-Water, Saturn is in Mutable-Water.

So now you may ask "where is he heading?" Well now, you group the planets in the most element (mine is water) then your group the planets in the most Quality (Mine being Cardinal) so you put it together and we have "Cardinal Water"...... Cancer
If you knew me personally I have friends, familiar with astrology, who say I come off as a Cancer rather than Leo until they had become really familiar with me. Tell me what you all think about your own chart when you take this approach.
Take Care.
Franklin

Oooh, I have thought about this ever since I noticed the little diagram on Astrodienst charts that so neatly sorts planets into element and modality. I think that there is great value to this approach!

For myself, if we consider only planets:
6 mutable, 2 Cardinal and 2 fixed
4 Fire, 4 Air, 1 Water and 1 Earth

(if you count chiron, add one to earth and one to fixed)

So, I am primarily mutable fire and air. This makes my actual sun/moon combination, Sagittarius/Gemini, quite descriptive of my whole personality. It explains, to some degree, why my cancer ascendant doesn't "show" very strongly, physically or interpersonally. It took me a while to connect with the idea of having cancer ascendant at all.

Now I realise that I am actually cautious, receptive to my environment, and that my warmth towards people relies on me feeling comfortable in my surroundings and familiar enough to accept the person. It's just that it's hard to SEE these qualities in me becuase I choose to "come out of my shell", as soon as I can, with mutable fire and air.

This crab has a very thin shell, I need it but I don't like to spent too much time in there!

Well you have a heavily aspected Cancer-stellium on your chart so it doesn't really surprise me if you feel more like a Cancer.

There are several methods how to find out what is the strongest sign on your chart, without using any of them I'd say Libra, and I'll go with it. But let's use this for now, I have:
- 3 Air, 3 Earth, 2 Fire, 2 Water
- 4 Cardinal, 3 Fixed, 3 Mutable

So that would make my "Sign Signature" either Libra or Capricorn. I don't really feel like a Capricorn at all, I only have Neptune in that sign and my Saturn is unaspected (except the opposition to Midheaven, but if only planets count...). If you add some common asteroids (Chiron, Pallas, etc.) Air gets even more "points", but then again I have Ascendant, Midheaven and North node in Earth signs. Oh well, I'll stick with Libra, Cardinal and Air - they FEEL right.

When looking at my planets in Element and Mode, I use the South Node and Ascendant included. On the beginners Astrology course, the teacher uses the South Node because this is well developed. You wouldn't use the North Node sign as this is what we are developing this lifetime. The Ascendant is the immediate qualities we possess.

Ascendant Virgo - Earth Mutable
Sun Pisces - Water Mutable
Moon Pisces - Water Mutable
Mercury Pisces - Water Mutable
Venus Capricorn - Earth Cardinal
Mars Aquarius - Air Fixed
Jupiter Leo - Fire Fixed
Saturn Virgo - Earth Mutable
Uranus Scorpio - Water Fixed
Neptune Sagittarius - Fire Mutable
Pluto Libra - Air Cardinal
South Node Pisces - Water Mutable

Fire=2
Earth=3
Air=2
Water=5

Cardinal=2
Fixed=3
Mutable=7

The Astrologer who taught the class said the elements should add to 12, and the modes should have a total of 12. Also when looking at your elements and modes, below 3 is lacking and above 3 is over emphasis.

As you can see from my planets I am very Mutable Water.

Lacking in Fire I can lack drive and initiative. Little get up and go. A want of burning desire.

Earth balanced Practical without being dull.

Lacking in Air Finds it hard to relate or view things impartially. Non or even anti intellectual (charming, I think my stellium in the 7th house may alter this)

Lots of Water over-emotional, Too sensitive, Little sense of boundaries.

Cardinal low Either accept you are a follower rather than a leader, or discover what you want enough to go it alone.

Over Mutable Build your own sense of values and foundation and trust them, do not let yourself or anyone else compromise them.

Very descriptive of my personality.

Miss S

Somewhat divergent but related topic....has anyone considered 'ranking' the strength (power, influence, whatever you call it) of their natal planets?

I ask because I have just, for the first time, downloaded and used astro software to automatically construct a natal chart reading. The program that I used (Astro123) provides values for the "power" of each planet, presumably meaning the its overall strength in the chart. I'm not sure how this is calculated, the program may be bogus (or not), but its analysis of my chart appears relevant. It appears to use dignity and debility by sign and house, and also retrogrades, slow moving/fast moving, to determine which planets are strongest. It does not appear to consider singletons (and probably other things I haven't thought of) as a determinant of power.

My theory is that you can use a combination of the "power" a planet has, with an understanding of how harmoniously it operates. The program also provides a "harmony/discord" balance for each planet, which seems to estimate whether the planet will operate under stress or more happily. I am guessing that this is due to hard or soft aspects, but it's unclear.

The result, in theory, is a score card. Who are the big players in your natal chart, and how "well" do they play with everyone else? Here is a brief description of my results. The percentages are rounded calculations of each planets' "power share" in my natal chart, and the plus/minus points an indicator of relative harmony or disharmony for each planet.

Venus - (16%)..........+19
Sun - (12%).............-2
Jupiter - (10%).........neutral
Neptune - (9%).......+6
Mercury - (9%)........-5
Saturn - (8%)..........+1
Moon - (8%)............-10
Ascendant - (8%)......neutral
Pluto - (8%)..............-4
Uranus - (7%)...........+1
Mars - (5%)..............+5

So in theory, you have:

stronger planets prone to acting harmoniously: like Venus
stronger planets prone to acting discordantly: like Sun
weaker planets prone to acting harmoniously: like Mars
weaker planets prone to acting discordantly: like Moon
and a few acting neutrally

The only one that seems counterintuitive for me is the Moon. It's in 11H Gemini, with one trine and one opposition, and its a singleton by chart placement. Its also my chart ruler. I would have thought it was both more "powerful" in my chart, and less discordant! As I'm not clear on how the program calculates its findings, I can't say why.

Has anyone used this program (Astro123) or similar, for this purpose, or done this otherwise? What do you think of the information it provides? Opinions gratefully accepted - otherwise I will continuously wander around inside my own head questioning the relevance of my discovery

Just looking at this program.
It gives me an head ache

Jupiter is my strongest planet.
Scorpio is my most powerful sign.

Water: 511,32
Air: 309,91
Fixed: 478,52
Mutable: 466,63

I also used Solar Fire, but I could whether be water, air, fixed or mutable,
that wasn't really clear.
Because I have both as many water and air signs in my natal chart.