Havoc in love life

ImNotThere9

Well-known member
So. It seems that for years now I've been having one relationship after another successively but nothing has quite stuck. I can say in perfect honesty that this is the bane of my existence! it's intolerable to me. One has just ended, and this time last year another more serious relationship ended after the young woman I was with proved unfaithful, and callously. This caused hurt, as you can imagine, and I've been instinctively more guarded since (to a point that might have alienated the girl I was last with). So my question is: what's going on here? It feels like nothing short of punishment, to have to endure the same cycle of break-up, low spirits (work, everything else then suffers), and then the balance slowly reasserts itself and I'm off on my romantic little pilgrimage again - to the same result, apparently.

I'm thinking of that line by W.H. Auden: 'Every young man fears / That he is not worth loving.' I mentioned the infidelity above. That profoundly affected me in ways I didn't understand at the time. I cut contact with her entirely, had two lousy one night stands, and jumped foolishly into another relationship that ended sourly because we were not suited. So for almost nine months I saw no one, withdrew from dating altogether, until I met the girl whom I was most recently with.

I'm aware of the potential mirroring, and the (potentially excessive) desire for relationships that results from Venus conjunct DC, and also its added strength as chart ruler.


Help would be much appreciated.


INT


P.S. If you would keep from quoting the above in your posts (I may want to take it down for personal reasons when it ages) that would be appreciated too :joyful:
 

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miquar

Well-known member
Hi. One thing that jumps out at me immediately is that you have Sun and Mars in watery Pisces, and Venus and the Moon in Aries and Aquarius respectively. So your so-called 'masculine' personal planets are in signs that need fusion and intimacy on a feeling level, and your so-called 'female' personal planets are in signs that need freedom and autonomy.

It could be that one way forward for you is to reflect upon whether you are living out the Aries and Aquarius energies for yourself. You are perhaps looking for some idyllic intimacy through which you can express that Piscean masculinity, but perhaps some or all of your partners have seen the relationship as just another adventure or experiment. On some level, you may be looking for Aries Aquarius types, for you perhaps need them to learn about different facets of yourself, and quite likely the people you have been involved with are, on some level, looking for some Piscean energy for the same reason. The trouble is that if neither side realise what is happening, the partners become polarised with respect to one another, clinging to their habitual ways of being and letting the other live out the suppressed side for them. So your partner may see you as unduly clingy or sentimental, and you may see the partner as unduly detached or self-centred.

With the packed 5th house, and that chart-ruling Venus on the descendant, its not surprising that you have a certain yearning to be in the right relationship. Another feature of the chart which may be worth looking into is the Mars Saturn Chiron configuration, which may deplete your confidence as a partner/lover.

Your Shakespeare quote perhaps resonates with you partly because of this Mars Saturn Chiron configuration, and also the general Pisces emphasis. Aquarius and Aries have a very different take on life, especially Aries. Its obviously important to honour the needs of your Piscean side, and there may be work to do here in order to cleanse your sensitive nature of 'ghosts from the past'. But as you do this, and free up some energy, it is also important to get the Aries and Aquarius energies going.

Seize your hour upon the stage! Celebrate your significance! Leave the mark upon the story of humanity that you and only you can leave! By all means help in the redemption of the ghosts which clutter the air around you, but speak only your own truth and not theirs - and then you will never sound like 'an idiot, full of sound and fury'.
 

rahu

Banned
hi ImNoThere9

you might read the pluto/node conjunction again.
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=63539&page=2
scroll down to june 17

with mars square to pluto there is an inherent selfishness.
but the current emotional tubulence seem to be coming from transiting node decile to venus and quintile to neptune/uranus.

these ive idealistic but foolish dreams. but the possibilty of building on the relationsip were very real.
but with quintiles and that subset,it is very difficult with quintiles to bind together.the quintile is so idividualistic , that partners with a certain type of strong personality, can't compromise.
with uranus , you have the sudden change and neptune brought the unexpected change.
rahu
 
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ImNotThere9

Well-known member
Hi. One thing that jumps out at me immediately is that you have Sun and Mars in watery Pisces, and Venus and the Moon in Aries and Aquarius respectively. So your so-called 'masculine' personal planets are in signs that need fusion and intimacy on a feeling level, and your so-called 'female' personal planets are in signs that need freedom and autonomy.

It could be that one way forward for you is to reflect upon whether you are living out the Aries and Aquarius energies for yourself. You are perhaps looking for some idyllic intimacy through which you can express that Piscean masculinity, but perhaps some or all of your partners have seen the relationship as just another adventure or experiment. On some level, you may be looking for Aries Aquarius types, for you perhaps need them to learn about different facets of yourself, and quite likely the people you have been involved with are, on some level, looking for some Piscean energy for the same reason. The trouble is that if neither side realise what is happening, the partners become polarised with respect to one another, clinging to their habitual ways of being and letting the other live out the suppressed side for them. So your partner may see you as unduly clingy or sentimental, and you may see the partner as unduly detached or self-centred.

With the packed 5th house, and that chart-ruling Venus on the descendant, its not surprising that you have a certain yearning to be in the right relationship. Another feature of the chart which may be worth looking into is the Mars Saturn Chiron configuration, which may deplete your confidence as a partner/lover.

Your Shakespeare quote perhaps resonates with you partly because of this Mars Saturn Chiron configuration, and also the general Pisces emphasis. Aquarius and Aries have a very different take on life, especially Aries. Its obviously important to honour the needs of your Piscean side, and there may be work to do here in order to cleanse your sensitive nature of 'ghosts from the past'. But as you do this, and free up some energy, it is also important to get the Aries and Aquarius energies going.

Seize your hour upon the stage! Celebrate your significance! Leave the mark upon the story of humanity that you and only you can leave! By all means help in the redemption of the ghosts which clutter the air around you, but speak only your own truth and not theirs - and then you will never sound like 'an idiot, full of sound and fury'.



Miquar,

This is a very thoughtful post and your insight is appreciated.

Can I ask what you mean exactly by getting the Aries and Aquarius energies going as well as the (already-operative) Pisces?
And also, what do you think the effect of that masculine/feminine reversal is that you mentioned initially?

I will certainly look into the Mars-Saturn-Chiron configuration, but right now my internet has gone haywire (I will be lucky to post this).

Thanks a million!

INT
 

ImNotThere9

Well-known member
Rahu,

Thanks for that. I'm aware of that slight selfishness and have worked on being more openly affectionate and inquisitive - though I genuinely am interested - and by speaking of my own concerns more sparingly. That said, things are kept fairly light and humorous, so all goes naturally enough.

----------------------

Losing this last one is a bit harder to stomach, not least because we met at a ceremony where we both were to receive academic awards for literature (both of us are studying at University). We hit it off right away and had a quite similar sense of humour, so if this has crumbled there must be something terribly wrong. Which is why I'm here. This relationship, or whatever it was, should have soared.
 
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mdinaz

Well-known member
Post a chart with some more points in it - add the vertex, the four main asteroids (pallas ceres juno vesta), use the true node and aspect lines to all. I already have a notion of what the issue is but I want some more information.
 

miquar

Well-known member
Hi. Well firstly its based on an assumption that you are more in tune with the Pisces placements. Water signs tend to adapt to life by following self-protective instincts. These instincts (or feelings) provide a sense of what is safe and what is not. Fire and air adapt to life by exploring new possibilities, so they may get suppressed by instinctive self-protection. It would be perhaps useful to read about the particular needs of Aires and Aquarius in a book like The Inner Sky (Forest) or Astrology For Lovers (Greene).

I'm not sure what you mean by the reversal.
 

Zarathu

Account Closed
In the majority of them, who breaks the covenant between you? the woman through something they did or because for some unexplained reason they don't want to see you any more, or YOU?
 

ImNotThere9

Well-known member
Mdinaz,

Thanks. Please find the chart with asteroids attached.

Zarathu,

It has varied widely; in one case it was the infidelity (on her part); there was an earlier love triangle in which I was the third person; but in more than a few cases things progressed wonderfully until suddenly it was broken off without explanation on her part. There were other infatuations, unrequited, but that happens and you can't blame the girl for what she doesn't feel. It's just another sting in the soup, I suppose. We've all turned someone down for lack of mutual attraction.
 

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Zarathu

Account Closed
Did you always feel safe and secure with your Mom? Did you feel that no matter what she was always there for you whenever you needed her?

Or, honestly would you have to say that while she was your mother and we hope she loved you, she wasn't the epitome of security and safeness?

Which?
 

ImNotThere9

Well-known member
Sure, my mother provided security as best she could. She's an admirable woman, difficult but resilient, hard-working and constant in her attentions and affections. That is to say, I've never felt that she wasn't there for me. Etc. Why do you ask?
 

Zarathu

Account Closed
Sure, my mother provided security as best she could. She's an admirable woman, difficult but resilient, hard-working and constant in her attentions and affections. That is to say, I've never felt that she wasn't there for me. Etc. Why do you ask?

I need to try to put this in a way would you won't jump to conclusions which are not meant to be there.....

When we have relationship problems, its not because of the other guy, its almost always caused by something that we do, or don't do, or don't choose to do, or something like that. Even when its the other person's fault its still our issues with having an inability to chose a paramour who is right for us.

So when I look at a chart and its a relationship issue, and I'm not looking at a synastry where there is already a relationship that needs to be fixed, then I have to look at what I call Cognitive Structures of thinking first. This is how you perceive the world and how you react to it.

Some people have really strong cognitive structures which are impacting them, such as T-Squares, and very powerful oppositions. Others have closed down Grand Trines, but you don't have any of this.

Now your birth time could be wrong, but you say its not, so we have to discount that.

When I look at cognitive functioning, I look for these cognitive structures first. But you don't have one. Then I look at the three planets that are most indicative of cognitive functioning---thinking--- that is. For you these three---Mercury, Jupiter, and Saturn, and about the three lowest power planets in your chart. You have no planets OOB. So at least cursorily I have to conclude(assuming again a correct birth time), that your issues may relate more to security, and how you perceive security. Your comment about being profoundly affected by the infidelity is clearly a security issue.

Security is a measure of feelings, and the limbic system, and for me this involves largely your Moon. Your comment that your Mom did the best she could, and was admirable and hard working also suggests a bit distant. Most people who didn't have parents who were just plain awful(like me) have trouble putting them down. But how you deal with early security in life seems to be connect to your Moon and its sign, and for some magical unexplained reason, people's parents and mothers match the sign that their Moon is in.

So I need to look more closely at the Moon and at your security and how you perceive security. I believe this is what might be addressing your issue.

The problem is that NO ONE ever wants to talk about this cognitive stuff, either feelings or thinking. We have a tendency to find ways not to deal with it, or to deny it, or to run away from it. I know this more than most since I spent 40 years of my life in professional counseling(as the counselor, not the counselee).

This moon and security issue as part of the problem was addressed by another responder.

Do you want me to proceed? Or maybe you'd like me to move into a PM for doing it?
 

mdinaz

Well-known member
Here are the things that stand out for me.

Your Mars is in Pisces, which is a very poor position for a man - Mars is all about activity, aggression, conquest - and Pisces is the far opposite of that. Mars is also conjunct Saturn, and both in the 5th house of romance. Mars rules your 7th house with Aries there. With Mars in Pisces and conjunct Saturn, your ability to project manhood/maleness is badly hampered. Venus is in Aries conjunct the 7th house, and quincunx Juno exact - your male pursuer energy is tilted too far to the feminine, and your ideas of love and relationships are too masculine and not inclined to the give-and-take relationships require. This presents a very confusing face for women to react to - who is the pursuer, who is the pursuee? Who is wearing the pants? If you aren't even sure yourself, as your chart suggests, how is a woman to know? Most women still abide by the traditional ideas of relationships - you pursue and conquer, she plays the coy but hard-to-get feminine ideal. With you that boundary is very vague and girls your age have no time, desire or inclination to try and figure it out. With Aries on the 7th and Vesta there in Aries, you are going to attract more determined, stronger and sure-of-themselves girls - which would be fine if you had a strong Mars. But you don't. Most of your personal planets are in emotional or intellectual signs, and your ASC is in Libra, so you project a more sensitive and thoughtful type of individual, but you attract something very different.

Vesta is where we send thoughts and beliefs to the Universe, where those beliefs are converted and manifested into your reality, through the Vertex. Vesta and Vertex are conjunct in the 7th in Aries. Vesta is semisquare Mars - so this feminine energy that you are trying to use to attract mates is at odds with what you desire and are attracting - it is a continual mismatch. With the Vertex there, you continually manifest strong Aries-type women who then also find the Pisces Mars semisquare mismatch, and not surprisingly move on when at their age there are plenty of choices with no guess work.

With Node in the 2nd square Mercury in the 5th, this is your life path. You are going to need to completely change the way you think about relationships and romance. You probably subscribe to the theory I posited above that the man is the pursuer and conqueror, the one that clubs the female over the head and drags her back to the cave, where he rules the roost. That may be true for some, but it is not a Universal rule. There is no reason why you cannot be exactly who you are - more sensitive, kind, thoughtful, and giving - and attract someone exactly the same who is a fit for you. Your relationships are a mirror - you attract what you put out to the Universe. Right now you are putting out very conflicting messages swathed in confusion, and the responses you receive from the Universe are equally conflicted and confused. Ceres is in Taurus in the 8th - transform your images of what a relationship should be, make it more nurturing and kind as you are, and using this energy with the semisextile to Vesta and Vertex will send out a new message to the Universe, while balancing your Node.

This process is not going to be easy. Pluto is square a ton of stuff from the 2nd to the 5th - you are going to have to change everything you think about relationships and love - and with Pluto trine Venus on the 7th, this is the path, the only path you can take. It has nothing to do with how you look, or act, or what you say - it is all about what you believe with regards to love, relationships, and your place in them.
 

ImNotThere9

Well-known member
Here are the things that stand out for me.

Your Mars is in Pisces, which is a very poor position for a man - Mars is all about activity, aggression, conquest - and Pisces is the far opposite of that. Mars is also conjunct Saturn, and both in the 5th house of romance. Mars rules your 7th house with Aries there. With Mars in Pisces and conjunct Saturn, your ability to project manhood/maleness is badly hampered. Venus is in Aries conjunct the 7th house, and quincunx Juno exact - your male pursuer energy is tilted too far to the feminine, and your ideas of love and relationships are too masculine and not inclined to the give-and-take relationships require. This presents a very confusing face for women to react to - who is the pursuer, who is the pursuee? Who is wearing the pants? If you aren't even sure yourself, as your chart suggests, how is a woman to know? Most women still abide by the traditional ideas of relationships - you pursue and conquer, she plays the coy but hard-to-get feminine ideal. With you that boundary is very vague and girls your age have no time, desire or inclination to try and figure it out. With Aries on the 7th and Vesta there in Aries, you are going to attract more determined, stronger and sure-of-themselves girls - which would be fine if you had a strong Mars. But you don't. Most of your personal planets are in emotional or intellectual signs, and your ASC is in Libra, so you project a more sensitive and thoughtful type of individual, but you attract something very different.

Vesta is where we send thoughts and beliefs to the Universe, where those beliefs are converted and manifested into your reality, through the Vertex. Vesta and Vertex are conjunct in the 7th in Aries. Vesta is semisquare Mars - so this feminine energy that you are trying to use to attract mates is at odds with what you desire and are attracting - it is a continual mismatch. With the Vertex there, you continually manifest strong Aries-type women who then also find the Pisces Mars semisquare mismatch, and not surprisingly move on when at their age there are plenty of choices with no guess work.

With Node in the 2nd square Mercury in the 5th, this is your life path. You are going to need to completely change the way you think about relationships and romance. You probably subscribe to the theory I posited above that the man is the pursuer and conqueror, the one that clubs the female over the head and drags her back to the cave, where he rules the roost. That may be true for some, but it is not a Universal rule. There is no reason why you cannot be exactly who you are - more sensitive, kind, thoughtful, and giving - and attract someone exactly the same who is a fit for you. Your relationships are a mirror - you attract what you put out to the Universe. Right now you are putting out very conflicting messages swathed in confusion, and the responses you receive from the Universe are equally conflicted and confused. Ceres is in Taurus in the 8th - transform your images of what a relationship should be, make it more nurturing and kind as you are, and using this energy with the semisextile to Vesta and Vertex will send out a new message to the Universe, while balancing your Node.

This process is not going to be easy. Pluto is square a ton of stuff from the 2nd to the 5th - you are going to have to change everything you think about relationships and love - and with Pluto trine Venus on the 7th, this is the path, the only path you can take. It has nothing to do with how you look, or act, or what you say - it is all about what you believe with regards to love, relationships, and your place in them.

Mdinaz,

This is a really penetrating analysis. I'm going to mull it over before I respond.


Thanks

INT
 

ImNotThere9

Well-known member
Here are the things that stand out for me.

Your Mars is in Pisces, which is a very poor position for a man - Mars is all about activity, aggression, conquest - and Pisces is the far opposite of that. Mars is also conjunct Saturn, and both in the 5th house of romance. Mars rules your 7th house with Aries there. With Mars in Pisces and conjunct Saturn, your ability to project manhood/maleness is badly hampered. Venus is in Aries conjunct the 7th house, and quincunx Juno exact - your male pursuer energy is tilted too far to the feminine, and your ideas of love and relationships are too masculine and not inclined to the give-and-take relationships require. This presents a very confusing face for women to react to - who is the pursuer, who is the pursuee? Who is wearing the pants? If you aren't even sure yourself, as your chart suggests, how is a woman to know? Most women still abide by the traditional ideas of relationships - you pursue and conquer, she plays the coy but hard-to-get feminine ideal. With you that boundary is very vague and girls your age have no time, desire or inclination to try and figure it out. With Aries on the 7th and Vesta there in Aries, you are going to attract more determined, stronger and sure-of-themselves girls - which would be fine if you had a strong Mars. But you don't. Most of your personal planets are in emotional or intellectual signs, and your ASC is in Libra, so you project a more sensitive and thoughtful type of individual, but you attract something very different.

Vesta is where we send thoughts and beliefs to the Universe, where those beliefs are converted and manifested into your reality, through the Vertex. Vesta and Vertex are conjunct in the 7th in Aries. Vesta is semisquare Mars - so this feminine energy that you are trying to use to attract mates is at odds with what you desire and are attracting - it is a continual mismatch. With the Vertex there, you continually manifest strong Aries-type women who then also find the Pisces Mars semisquare mismatch, and not surprisingly move on when at their age there are plenty of choices with no guess work.

With Node in the 2nd square Mercury in the 5th, this is your life path. You are going to need to completely change the way you think about relationships and romance. You probably subscribe to the theory I posited above that the man is the pursuer and conqueror, the one that clubs the female over the head and drags her back to the cave, where he rules the roost. That may be true for some, but it is not a Universal rule. There is no reason why you cannot be exactly who you are - more sensitive, kind, thoughtful, and giving - and attract someone exactly the same who is a fit for you. Your relationships are a mirror - you attract what you put out to the Universe. Right now you are putting out very conflicting messages swathed in confusion, and the responses you receive from the Universe are equally conflicted and confused. Ceres is in Taurus in the 8th - transform your images of what a relationship should be, make it more nurturing and kind as you are, and using this energy with the semisextile to Vesta and Vertex will send out a new message to the Universe, while balancing your Node.

This process is not going to be easy. Pluto is square a ton of stuff from the 2nd to the 5th - you are going to have to change everything you think about relationships and love - and with Pluto trine Venus on the 7th, this is the path, the only path you can take. It has nothing to do with how you look, or act, or what you say - it is all about what you believe with regards to love, relationships, and your place in them.


Mdinaz,

This is a tall order all right. Where shall we start.

So my ideas are too masculine and the expression too feminine, so that (with the help of Vertex in the 7th house) I am unconsciously manifesting these Aries-type women who are not suited? You were bang on there with regards my attractions - I do seem to attract self-actualizing feminists. Do you mean to say that transforming my beliefs will attract more suitable types in that it will naturally alter my approach to relationships? That seems to be the gist.

How, more precisely, does the 2nd-house north node square the 5th-house Mercury relate to my ideas about relationships? I imagine it is intimately bound up with self-worth too.

The position of lilith in the 7th house also seems to indicate misfortune in relationships. How in the world do you think I should go about altering my set-patterns of thinking? I'm at a loss as to where I should start. Being conscious of it is a modest but useful start I suppose.

I may come back to address a point in this post again. It was very thought-provoking stuff, intense.

Thanks,

INT
 
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