Exalted planet conjunct a debilitated planet

J

Jadi

Well-known member
So, I've got Mercury and Venus conjunct in Virgo. Quite tightly within 1 degr orb. Mercury is also the dominant planet in my chart. When Astrologers look at my chart they always point out how strong my Mercury is; In domicile and exalted. But they never mention the debilitated Venus next to it.

Also both are within 10/11 degrees from the Sun so technically they are 'under the rays of the Sun' so to speak. So yes, my Mercury is exalted but somehow I feel the debilitating effects of my Venus more. Mars might also play a role in this, it's squaring the conjunction from Gemini.

I wonder how you guys would judge this, could this conjunction cancel out the exaltation?
 
Last edited:
K

katydid

Well-known member
The conjunction does not cancel out the exaltation of Mercury. That is there and running full speed.

What the conjunction does, in my opinion, is 'cancels out' the strength of the Venus. Venus becomes debilitated even more by the square from the Mars in Gemini, which is disposed by Mercury, once again giving strength to that Mercury.

I think your venus is overwhelmed by mercurial influences making it difficult to FEEL Venusian, feminine, trusting, vulnerable, etc. She is still all of those things but Mercury gives so much more power and emphasis to the mind that she gets overlooked.

Venus in Virgo by itself, can be a very lovely, sensual, nurturing placement. But when Mercury is dominant it can kind of get in the way of the Venus power and take over. Venus in Virgo likes to be a protector, care giver, nurturer and an earthy lover. But Mercury keeps trying to take it to the mental level, and it can be a buzzkill. :love:
 
Kitchy

Kitchy

Banned
Mercury holds strength in such conjunction by it's rulership of Venus. Neither is really too harmful in terms of causing badness or grief when they are aligned. As KD mentioned, venus needs to accomodate mercury to hold her strength of qualities - which merc in virgo much appreciates because mercury doesn't rule with an iron fist unless it is in cahoots with something like saturn or pluto.

mercury venus in virgo - in any chart - indicates a skill for fine art - especially realism, life drawing, stills, photography.

I imagine the most troublesome aspect of this conjunction is the noting of patterns that can upset or disharmonize venus. Merc in Virgo - both note patterns in daily life, when things are different or out of whack, this combo can become fretful, worrisome or sometimes avoidant denial by keeping busy to avoid the unpleasantries of relationship problems or obligations.

I have a long time friend with merc taurus and venus gemini - mutual reception - but when things get really stressful for her in her relationship, she 'checks out' by becoming workaholic.

I think this combo in any aspect goes back to the old saying, "idle hands do work for the devil" - because of the mercurial aspect of hand/mind relationships. Also, interrupted sleep from worry can be an issue.
 
Last edited:
A

Arena

Well-known member
It's impossible to tell you if you don't post your chart. There may be other aspects that matter in this picture. And then again you might not have an exalted Mercury nor a debiliated Venus at all (if they fall into sidereal Leo).
It might be just the square from Mars giving you the effect that you are talking about - but it is not clear to me how exactly you are feeling this.
 
J

Jadi

Well-known member
katydid said:
The conjunction does not cancel out the exaltation of Mercury. That is there and running full speed.

What the conjunction does, in my opinion, is 'cancels out' the strength of the Venus. Venus becomes debilitated even more by the square from the Mars in Gemini, which is disposed by Mercury, once again giving strength to that Mercury.

I think your venus is overwhelmed by mercurial influences making it difficult to FEEL Venusian, feminine, trusting, vulnerable, etc. She is still all of those things but Mercury gives so much more power and emphasis to the mind that she gets overlooked.

Venus in Virgo by itself, can be a very lovely, sensual, nurturing placement. But when Mercury is dominant it can kind of get in the way of the Venus power and take over. Venus in Virgo likes to be a protector, care giver, nurturer and an earthy lover. But Mercury keeps trying to take it to the mental level, and it can be a buzzkill. :love:
Click to expand...
Thanks, katie. I have no problem accessing the venusian energy when I'm at peace. It's only problematic when that peace of mind becomes disturbed, I can shift very quickly from being 'in the moment' peaceful and loving to being a total a**shole. Neptune and the ruler of my ascendant, Uranus, are also making a trine, I've read that having Uranus trine Mercury can make you two-faced. Which is exactly how I feel.
 
Last edited:
J

Jadi

Well-known member
Kitchy said:
Mercury holds strength in such conjunction by it's rulership of Venus. Neither is really too harmful in terms of causing badness or grief when they are aligned. As KD mentioned, venus needs to accomodate mercury to hold her strength of qualities - which merc in virgo much appreciates because mercury doesn't rule with an iron fist unless it is in cahoots with something like saturn or pluto.

mercury venus in virgo - in any chart - indicates a skill for fine art - especially realism, life drawing, stills, photography.

I imagine the most troublesome aspect of this conjunction is the noting of patterns that can upset or disharmonize venus. Merc in Virgo - both note patterns in daily life, when things are different or out of whack, this combo can become fretful, worrisome or sometimes avoidant denial by keeping busy to avoid the unpleasantries of relationship problems or obligations.

I have a long time friend with merc taurus and venus gemini - mutual reception - but when things get really stressful for her in her relationship, she 'checks out' by becoming workaholic.

I think this combo in any aspect goes back to the old saying, "idle hands do work for the devil" - because of the mercurial aspect of hand/mind relationships. Also, interrupted sleep from worry can be an issue.
Click to expand...
Thanks Kitchy. The bold and the last line are very spot-on :biggrin: My mind is always 'on the go' and a single bump on the road can ruin my day. The only other tight aspect it receives is a trine from Uranus(4 degree orb) which is the ruler of my ascendant and Neptune(1/2 degree orb), not sure if that counts too.

This is quite fascinating though, I've been diagnosed with AS/PDD-NOS from childhood, and this shines a whole different light on it.
 
Last edited:
J

Jadi

Well-known member
Arena said:
It's impossible to tell you if you don't post your chart. There may be other aspects that matter in this picture. And then again you might not have an exalted Mercury nor a debiliated Venus at all (if they fall into sidereal Leo).
It might be just the square from Mars giving you the effect that you are talking about - but it is not clear to me how exactly you are feeling this.
Click to expand...
Most of this forum is dedicated to tropical astrology and in traditional astrology these dignities are taken into account without ever looking at the sidereal zodiac. But you're right, they are in Sidereal Leo and thus by Vedic standards both aren't debilitated nor exalted.
 
Last edited:
P

pharvey0829

Active member
I do know that mercury is a very changeable planet and it takes on the characteristics of planets that it is next to. Perhaps your mercury is taking on some of the characteristics of your venus.
 
J

Jadi

Well-known member
pharvey0829 said:
I do know that mercury is a very changeable planet and it takes on the characteristics of planets that it is next to. Perhaps your mercury is taking on some of the characteristics of your venus.
Click to expand...
It's also retrograde. Maybe that weakens it somehow.
 
K

katydid

Well-known member
pharvey0829 said:
I do know that mercury is a very changeable planet and it takes on the characteristics of planets that it is next to. Perhaps your mercury is taking on some of the characteristics of your venus.
Click to expand...

That is an interesting observation. I do think that conjunctions can work that way.

This thread is titled- exalted planet conjunct a debilitated...

I have that in my 8th house.

My debilitated Moon is in 8th @ 4 Cap. :sad:
But my exalted Mars is in it's domicile, @ 7 Cap. So Mars is exalted and in it's own house, and is the dispositor of my Scorpio Sun and Mercury.

And Mars has no squares, just a wide opposition to Uranus. And has a trine to Jupiter and a sextile to the Sun.


So all of that is to say that I believe my debilitated Moon is enhanced and strengthened by her association with the exalted Mars. And I believe that because my Moon seems to do her job well in my life. I am a great mother, in my opinion, and in my husbands and kids opinions too. I do have a few faults of course. :wink: But I do not vibe with the usual descriptions of Cappy Moons. I am not cold or distant or strict with my family. Controlling, um...maybe sometimes...:sideways: But passionate, engaged, enthusiastic at doing my job as a stay at home mom, YES---and I think that is because of the conjunction with the exalted Mars. He rubbed off on my Moon. :devil:
 
Claire19

Claire19

Well-known member
Jadi said:
So, I've got Mercury and Venus conjunct in Virgo. Quite tightly within 1 degr orb. Mercury is also the dominant planet in my chart. When Astrologers look at my chart they always point out how strong my Mercury is; In domicile and exalted. But they never mention the debilitated Venus next to it.

Also both are within 10/11 degrees from the Sun so technically they are 'under the rays of the Sun' so to speak. So yes, my Mercury is exalted but somehow I feel the debilitating effects of my Venus more. Mars might also play a role in this, it's squaring the conjunction from Gemini.

I wonder how you guys would judge this, could this conjunction cancel out the exaltation?
Click to expand...

Mercury is always reasonably close to the Sun in everyone's chart as is Venus, and Mercury is used for the ruler of Virgo for now but is not really the right one. So I would not take that as being so strong. 10/11 degrees from the Sun is not really a conjunction, certainly at best a very weak one.

If Mercury is in the 3rd house for instance and has strong aspects then it is very significant.

I dont use words like debilitated or exalted. It gives the wrong impression and is rather old fashioned.

Mercury conjunct Venus in Virgo, you would be detail oriented, perhaps love to be of service, practical and very analytical. You may have a love of craftwork and be quite meticulous. This can be the hardworker and one who partners up for practical reasons.

However again citing an aspect without seeing the chart as a whole, is not really valid.
 
Last edited:
J

Jadi

Well-known member
Claire19 said:
Mercury is always reasonably close to the Sun in everyone's chart as is Venus, and Mercury is used for the ruler of Virgo for now but is not really the right one. So I would not take that as being so strong. 10/11 degrees from the Sun is not really a conjunction, certainly at best a very weak one.

If Mercury is in the 3rd house for instance and has strong aspects then it is very significant.

I dont use words like debilitated or exalted. It gives the wrong impression and is rather old fashioned.

Mercury conjunct Venus in Virgo, you would be detail oriented, perhaps love to be of service, practical and very analytical. You may have a love of craftwork and be quite meticulous. This can be the hardworker and one who partners up for practical reasons.

However again citing an aspect without seeing the chart as a whole, is not really valid.
Click to expand...
I guess I should've posted it in the Traditional section since it's just an inquiry about how certain combinations would affect planetary dignity, not how it would apply in a birth chart. Most Modern Astrologers do not take that into account.
 
JUPITERASC

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
Claire19 said:

I dont use words like debilitated or exalted.

It gives the wrong impression
Click to expand...
Would be useful if you would explain
how the words "debilitatated" and "exalted"
give "the wrong impression"
Claire19 said:

and is rather old fashioned.
Click to expand...
"Exalted" and "debilitated" are terms in common usage amongst astrologers today :smile:
and also form the entire rationale of this thread
clearly you disapprove of the use of those words
but that's the thread title the OP chose
 
JUPITERASC

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
Jadi said:
I guess I should've posted it in the Traditional section
since it's just an inquiry about how certain combinations would affect planetary dignity,
not how it would apply in a birth chart.

Most Modern Astrologers do not take that into account.
Click to expand...
Jadi, to have the discussion you intended
consider reposting your opening post on a new thread on the Traditional board
and then
this thread could continue on this General Astrology board
where of course BOTH Modern AND Traditional discussion is fine
as it is interesting to have good discussion of BOTH perspectives :smile:
 
A

aldebaran

Well-known member
I suppose this conjunction could create this sort of effect:

Most of the time you act Mercury, a Venusian Mercury, but still Mercury: thoughts, words in your mind - and you probably have a talent for writing beautiful and with harmony, it seems a great placement for poetry.

Most of your time you'll be analising(Virgo) things with your mind(Mercury), but in a more affectuous way than most people.

Less often you'll act Venus - a Venus with lot's of movement - thoughts, words, reasonings in the mind, not so busy though only because of the calmness of Virgo.

So, your Venus will only "appear" when the situation is propicious - when it's way more propicious to it than to Mercury. Look at the house where the conjunction is located, if it's a house more propicious to Venus, that is the exact house where the planet will appear more often.

That's not a so big deal, though, because even if Venus don't appear so often, your Mercury is already much more Venusian than most of people's - though you might not always note it.

ps: I think I wrote it badly, in fact, once they are in conjunction, in theory, they are always acting together:
Venus never really "disappear", she is always together with Mercury.
But, sometimes you might miss a more "intense" Venus - this is what I called the "appearing" of Venus, when it gets very intense and less rational - this will happen when circumstances are favorable.
 
Last edited:
obsidianmineral

obsidianmineral

Well-known member
In my opinion Venus isn't necesarily debilitated by the placement. Venus is in its fall therefore it's in a very weakening position, and therefore it can't act like it wants. However, she is conjunct a very powerful Mercury in its own sign and exaltation sign. A planet in its fall is like someone who is very badly received in a place, while a rulership and exaltation planet is extremely well received and probably boasts more power than the planet actually has. And since they're conjunct, it's like the prisoner of a country acting with the king of that country. Venus has the opportunity to act and affect many things since it's in this position, since it gives her a lot of power, but the bad thing is that she can't act the way she would like to. She has to act with devotion, work, mental processing, close-mindedness, etc.

You also mentioned that both of these planets are near the sun and therefore their lights couldn't be seen since the Sun was close. This means that their energies are absorbed by the Sun. Check the Sun's condition in the natal chart. The good thing about Sun conjunctions is the fact that the Sun CAN receive these energies that the planets are producing. Don't know much about what traditional astrology says about the manifestation of Sun conjunctions or planets near the Sun, but I believe that the Sun is able to manifest a lot of energy, even at the expense of the other planets, especially if the Sun is in a good condition or in any essential dignity.
 
Top