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  #1  
Unread 05-28-2018, 01:45 AM
KiwiYogi KiwiYogi is offline
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Proof: Astrology in Genesis

In Genesis it says the world was created in seven days:

Sunday……….…Sun….….…Dimanche
Monday……….…Moon……..Lundi
Tuesday………..Mars……….Mardi
Wednesday……Mercury….Mercredi
Thursday…….…Jupiter..….Jeudi
Friday………...…Venus..……Vendredi
Saturday…….…Saturn……..Samedi


Day 1 – And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. (1.3)
Sun governs light.

Day 2 – And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. (1.6)
Moon governs water.

Day 3 – And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so. (1.9)

Mars governs territory.

Day 4 – And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years. (1.14)

Mercury governs knowledge.

Day 5 – And God blessed them, saying, Be fruitful, and multiply, and fill the waters in the seas, and let fowl multiply in the earth. (1.22)

Jupiter governs expansion and abundance.

Day 6 – So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. (1.27)

Venus governs gender.

Day 7 – And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. (2.2)

Saturn governs rest.

This ordering of the planets is found in Brihat Parashara Hora Shastra - an ancient Vedic text on astrology.

Rudolf Steiner and Edward Tarabilda also discuss the esoteric significance of this ordering of the planets.

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Unread 05-28-2018, 03:25 AM
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petosiris petosiris is offline
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Re: Proof: Astrology in Genesis

Quote:
Originally Posted by KiwiYogi View Post
In Genesis it says the world was created in seven days:

Sunday……….…Sun….….…Dimanche
Monday……….…Moon……..Lundi
Tuesday………..Mars……….Mardi
Wednesday……Mercury….Mercredi
Thursday…….…Jupiter..….Jeudi
Friday………...…Venus..……Vendredi
Saturday…….…Saturn……..Samedi


Day 1 – And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. (1.3)
Sun governs light.

Day 2 – And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. (1.6)
Moon governs water.

Day 3 – And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so. (1.9)

Mars governs territory.

Day 4 – And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years. (1.14)

Mercury governs knowledge.

Day 5 – And God blessed them, saying, Be fruitful, and multiply, and fill the waters in the seas, and let fowl multiply in the earth. (1.22)

Jupiter governs expansion and abundance.

Day 6 – So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. (1.27)

Venus governs gender.

Day 7 – And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. (2.2)

Saturn governs rest.

This ordering of the planets is found in Brihat Parashara Hora Shastra - an ancient Vedic text on astrology.

Rudolf Steiner and Edward Tarabilda also discuss the esoteric significance of this ordering of the planets.
This interpretation is absurd. The Two Lights - Sun and Moon were not created until the fourth day - how does 1:16 fit into all this? If this is the esoteric significance, it is not unlike https://answersingenesis.org/days-of...ts-before-sun/

Last edited by petosiris; 05-28-2018 at 03:31 AM.
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  #3  
Unread 05-28-2018, 04:07 AM
KiwiYogi KiwiYogi is offline
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Re: Proof: Astrology in Genesis

Petosiris, I believe the whole creation story in Genesis is a metaphor and not to be taken literally.

For example, in 1.2 it says:
And the earth was without form, and void
How can the Earth be without form? Or void? It can't. So we know from the beginning it is a metaphor - a story to convey the principles of creation.
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Unread 05-28-2018, 04:07 AM
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Whoam1 Whoam1 is offline
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Re: Proof: Astrology in Genesis

Samedi just reminds me of Baron Samedi, in my study of Haitian voodon religion...
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Unread 05-28-2018, 04:11 AM
KiwiYogi KiwiYogi is offline
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Re: Proof: Astrology in Genesis

Maybe because they speak French in Haiti?
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Unread 05-28-2018, 04:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KiwiYogi View Post
Maybe because they speak French in Haiti?
They do, well parts of haiti anyway. However Samedi sticks out in specfic. He is Baron Saturday yes.

Last edited by Whoam1; 05-28-2018 at 04:54 AM.
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  #7  
Unread 05-28-2018, 04:49 AM
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Re: Proof: Astrology in Genesis

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Originally Posted by KiwiYogi View Post
Petosiris, I believe the whole creation story in Genesis is a metaphor and not to be taken literally.

For example, in 1.2 it says:
And the earth was without form, and void
How can the Earth be without form? Or void? It can't. So we know from the beginning it is a metaphor - a story to convey the principles of creation.
What is the origin of the order of the days. Is it Babylonian or is it Hellenistic? It does not correspond to the usual ''Chaldean'' order.
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Unread 05-28-2018, 06:35 AM
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Re: Proof: Astrology in Genesis

KiwiYogi, I don't think you're going to find proof of astrology in the Bible. (By astrology, I mean using stars and planets to understand and forecast human behaviour.) You will find a lot of star lore, or what is termed cultural astronomy. Astrology is a specialized kind of cultural astronomy.

Note that in Hebrew, the language of the Old Testament, and a far older language than English or French, days of the week are simply given a numerical order: first day, second day, third day,.... until we get to the sabbath, the day of rest. They're not named after the planets.

I'm trying to think, though, whether days of the week other than the Sabbath are even mentioned by name in either the Hebrew or Christian Bibles.

The biblical scribes did use Babylonian names for months.
http://www.yashanet.com/library/hebr...nd-months.html
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Last edited by waybread; 05-28-2018 at 06:37 AM.
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  #9  
Unread 05-28-2018, 06:46 AM
KiwiYogi KiwiYogi is offline
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Re: Proof: Astrology in Genesis

Petosiris, I don't know where that ordering came from. Maybe it had its genesis in Genesis.
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Unread 05-28-2018, 07:06 AM
KiwiYogi KiwiYogi is offline
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Re: Proof: Astrology in Genesis

Waybread, astrologers are referred to in other parts of the Bible - and not very favourably. Some are mentioned regarding divination. I found a list of places:

Leviticus 19:26, 31; Leviticus 20:6, 27
Deuteronomy 18:9-14
II Kings 21:6
Isaiah 8:19; Isaiah 47:13-14
Daniel 2:27; Daniel 4:7, 19

I don’t think it matters what names the Hebrews gave to the days. The Sun rules things that are first and Saturn rules things that are last. So the bookends are already established. To me it stands to reason that Saturn rules the sabbath.

As far as proof goes, when I showed this to Vedic astrologer friends they accepted it immediately as self-evident. That ordering is not an abstraction. I heard a Vedic astrologer use this ordering the other day. He said the first house is like the Sun, the second like the Moon, third house is like Mars…. eighth house is like Rahu (North Node). And in reverse too - twelfth house is like the Moon, eleventh house is like Mars….

It’s been a long time since I looked into this ordering. I’m sure there is a lot more info out there about it.
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Unread 05-29-2018, 03:20 AM
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Re: Proof: Astrology in Genesis

Actually there are not specific proscriptions against astrologers in the Bible outside of Isaiah and Daniel. Just possibly the NT story of the 3 Wise Men was a rare favourable mention. There are more generalized proscriptions against soothsayers, diviners, and magicians; but astrology was not the only divination practice common back then.

If you look at different translations of the Bible, you can see how differently they handle Hebrew- or Aramaic-to-English (OT) or Greek-to-English (NT) For Leviticus 19:26, for example, on this site http://biblehub.com/leviticus/19-26.htm you can see a lot of variance as to what this verse actually prohibits.

The thing to remember is that horoscopic astrology of nativities didn't exist when most of the OT was written and codified. It is a kind of hybrid product of Babylonian ("Chaldean,") Greek, and Egyptian astronomy and star lore. We can't pin an exact date on it, but the book of Isaiah was probably codified during the 6th century BCE. Babylonian astrology ca. 500 BCE primarily was what we would call mundane astrology, just changing from constellations to signs. It was what astrologer Bernadette Brady calls "whole sky" or "visual" astrology.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Cao-fyS3Ao

Comparisons with Indian astrology are interesting, but it is important to consider time-frames here, as well. Lunar mansions have a long tradition in India, but the parts of Hindu (jyotish) astrology that are horoscopic probably diffused from Hellenistic astrology.

I think you've contradicted yourself with your days of the week. Note that the Jewish sabbath doesn't even begin and end with a 24-hour day. It goes from sundown on Friday to sundown on Saturday. The Christian sabbath starts just after midnight on Sunday morning. So it's hard to say which day of the week would be first or last, because it depends on the religion.

Also if you use the planetary names for days of the week, they're not exactly in their orbital order.

moon-day (Monday, "Luna's day" in French)
Mars-day (Tuesday=Tiv's or Tiw's day in Germanic languages, the war god Mars)
Mercury-day (Wednesday=Germanic "Wotan's or Odin's" Day, Mercredi in French.)
Jupiter-day (Thursday=Germanic Thor's Day, Jeudi in French=Jove's Day)
Venus-day (Friday= Germanic Freya's day, Vendredi=Venus day in French.)
Saturn-day (Saturday, Samedi in French, from the Hebrew & Latin for sabbath day
Sunday (German=Sontag, French Dimanche, from the Latin, the Lord's Day)
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My friends, love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair. So let us be loving, hopeful and optimistic. And we’ll change the world. Jack Layton, "Letter to Canadians"

I thought we went along paths--but it seems there are no paths. The going itself is the path.
C.S. Lewis, Perelandra.

Life is not about finding yourself. Life is about creating yourself. Message on a refrigerator magnet.
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Unread 05-29-2018, 04:13 AM
KiwiYogi KiwiYogi is offline
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Re: Proof: Astrology in Genesis

Waybread,

>Also if you use the planetary names for days of the week, they're not exactly in their orbital order.

This is the whole point. This ordering of the planets is not a literal ordering, it is a cosmic ordering. It is an esoteric/metaphysical script that shows how life emerges from unmanifest to manifest. How something changes from potential into form. A friend of mine saw this unfolding while in deep meditation.

This ordering is given in the ancient Indian text Brihat Parashara Hora Shastra:

Chapter 3.10: Names of planets: The names of the nine planets respectively are: Sun, Moon, Mars, Mercury, Jupiter, Venus, North Node, South Node.

I think this ordering is embedded in nature - it’s not a man-made ordering. To me it is irrelevant when the Jews begin the sabbath or if the Christians take Sunday as the sabbath. IMO resting on the Sun's day is a departure from the natural order and mistake. They should rest on Saturn's day.
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Unread 05-29-2018, 04:20 AM
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Re: Proof: Astrology in Genesis

If you want to argue your case based on your friend's meditation and an ancient Hindu text, I have nothing more to add to this conversation.

BTW, the lunar nodes are not planets. I think you left out Saturn in your list of 9.
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My friends, love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair. So let us be loving, hopeful and optimistic. And we’ll change the world. Jack Layton, "Letter to Canadians"

I thought we went along paths--but it seems there are no paths. The going itself is the path.
C.S. Lewis, Perelandra.

Life is not about finding yourself. Life is about creating yourself. Message on a refrigerator magnet.
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  #14  
Unread 05-29-2018, 02:53 PM
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Re: Proof: Astrology in Genesis

Quote:
He said the first house is like the Sun, the second like the Moon, third house is like Mars…. eighth house is like Rahu (North Node)
Sixth house is not like Venus, it is like Mars in my opinion.

Quote:
BTW, the lunar nodes are not planets.
For your information, they are considered as grahas (planets) - thus navagrahas in Jyotish astrology. They are used with various aspects, yogas and even the dashas themselves. Thus, they effectively function as planets compared to Western astrology where they are vastly underused, especially in early Hellenistic astrology, where there is no single surviving time lord technique that accounts for the nodes (there is the firdaria in the Persian tradition, perhaps as result of influence both ways, the nodes do have some importance and use in the medieval texts).

Last edited by petosiris; 05-29-2018 at 02:59 PM.
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