Thoughts about my tradtional chart

[sinhtheslumberingdragon]

Hello,


I am seeking interpretations of my traditional birth chart, espically with regards to fame and career, and what challenges I will face.

[JUPITERASC]

In order for a relliable consideration
of any natal chart
we begin by establishing
whether or not the chart timing is reliable
i.e. whether the time of birth is based on medical records
or
possibly memory/hearsay
or
a birth certificate

If birth in this case
occurred merely twenty mintutes later
then the following sign may have been the ascendant

Originally Posted by sinhtheslumberingdragon

Hello,

I am seeking interpretations of my traditional birth chart, espically with regards to fame and career, and what challenges I will face.

[sinhtheslumberingdragon]

Originally Posted by JUPITERASC

In order for a relliable consideration
of any natal chart
we begin by establishing
whether or not the chart timing is reliable
i.e. whether the time of birth is based on medical records
or
possibly memory/hearsay
or
a birth certificate

If birth in this case
occurred merely twenty mintutes later
then the following sign may have been the ascendant

The birth time is accurate (birth certificate), and also I have many physical feature of a taurus asc.

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by sinhtheslumberingdragon

The birth time is accurate (birth certificate), and
also I have many physical feature of a taurus asc.

An issue with birth certificates is
that the time is written AFTER the event
often many weeks, months AFTER THE EVENT

and therefore
while it is great to have
a birth time noted on some form of official record
that does not necessarily mean it is the accurate time of birth
and so
a serious astrologer would rectify any chart
prior to delineation

keep in mind that
"A Taurus ascendant" has Venus as planetary ruler
therefore
the appearance of "A Taurus ascendant" varies
dependent on a number of factors
such as

for example
whether one of the seven visible planets is conjunct ascendant
and/or
the sign location of natal Venus
as well as the condition of natal Venus

Originally Posted by petosiris

Introduction to Hellenistic Astrology Part I - Zodiac

The image of the Bull is feminine, nocturnal, solid, terrestrial, quadrupedal, notable, vocal, semi-fertile, passionate, incomplete, missing limbs, rising backwards, sitting and of the south wind. It indicates celebrations, affairs, agriculture, family and property. Depending on the placement of the houseruler, men born under the influence of Taurus are disproportioned and awkward, energetic because of the hard-working strength of the Bull, industrious, supervisors, luxurious, wealthy, generous, distinguished, charming, with full face, broad forehead, large eyes, large nostrils, big lips, pointed chin, square neck and broad outward brows, prudent, skillful, pleasure-loving, music-loving, disturbing and enraging, priestly, brilliant and worthy of crowns and of the purple. The front is robust, but the back is weaker.

Domicile of Venus, exaltation of Moon, it controls the neck, the olfactory system, the reproductive organs and the secondary sex characteristics. It causes blindness on account of the Pleiades. It is like-empowered with Cancer, like-ascending with Sagittarius and like-engirding with Libra, medium in both Hemispheres. It is vernal, hot and moist for the north, and autumnal, cold and dry for the south. Taurus commands Capricorn for the north and obeys it for the south. Taurus controls Parthia, Media, Persia, Cyclades, Cyprus and Lesser Asia. The beginning of the truncated body and the Pleiades are rising up to the 8th degree, the Hyades up to the 14th, the face and Aldebaran up to the 22nd, the beginning of the horns up to the 27th, and the tips of the horns up to the 30th.

The first 8° belong to Venus - love, skilled in the arts, graceful
The next 6° belong to Mercury - peaceful, leadership, trustees
The next 8° belong to Jupiter - beauty, reputation, unexpected advancement
The next 5° belong to Saturn - relaxations, reduction of wealth
The final 3° belong to Mars - violent, condemnations, lawsuits, injuries

Beginning - Venus and moderately Saturn
Pleiades - Jupiter and the Moon
Hyades - Saturn and moderately Mercury
Aldebaran - Mars
Tips of the Horns - Mars


Such, then, are the observations of the effects of the stars
as made by our predecessors. Let us now proceed with the seven-zone.

Bibliography:
Ludwich, A. (Ed.). (1877). Maximi et Ammonis carminum De actionum auspiciis reliquiae: accedunt Anecdota astrologica. BG Teubneri. Retrieved from https://archive.org/details/maximiet...00ludw/page/n3
Manilius, & Goold, G. P. (1985). Astronomica. BG Teubner.
Robbins, F. E. (1940). Ptolemy: Tetrabiblos. William Heinmann, London. Retrieved from http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/...blos/home.html
Schmidt, R. The Astrological Record of the Early Greek Sages. Project Hindsight.
Valens, V. Anthologia. Translated by Mark Riley. Retrieved from https://www.csus.edu/indiv/r/rileymt...s%20entire.pdf

[sinhtheslumberingdragon]

Originally Posted by JUPITERASC

An issue with birth certificates is
that the time is written AFTER the event
often many weeks, months AFTER THE EVENT

and therefore
while it is great to have
a birth time noted on some form of official record
that does not necessarily mean it is the accurate time of birth
and so
a serious astrologer would rectify any chart
prior to delineation

keep in mind that
"A Taurus ascendant" has Venus as planetary ruler
therefore
the appearance of "A Taurus ascendant" varies
dependent on a number of factors
such as

for example
whether one of the seven visible planets is conjunct ascendant
and/or
the sign location of natal Venus
as well as the condition of natal Venus

I'm not old enough for a rectification yet, so that time is the best I have to use for now

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by sinhtheslumberingdragon

I'm not old enough for a rectification yet,

so that time is the best I have to use for now

on the contrary
age is not a problem when rectifying a natal chart

and
because
our forum is an astrological learning forum
petosiris has generously posted the following rectification guidelines
for anyone who is sufficiently intereted to learn the method

Originally Posted by petosiris

Yes, nowadays I ignore the syzygy and focus on the planet which makes the closest exact aspect to the Asc (and Dsc) or the Mc (and Ic). A major technical difference between this and the Ptolemaic Animodar is that mine requires a planet to be at the angle or in aspect, while Ptolemy seems to allow it to be disjunct, only requiring the numeric degree it has passed within its sign to be the same (it is like an exact semi-sextile or inconjunct modern ''aspect''). This does not seem physical to me, but rather numerological and uncharacteristic of Ptolemy's intentions of astrology.

So I recommend that one follows a more limited approach with regard to aspects, but more broad approach with regard to rulers. Often, the two methods (the Ptolemaic Animodar and the Petosiris Animodar) will give the same results, since they are based on similar physical reasoning.

I recommend one step - a planet in conjunction, sextile, square, trine or opposition with an angle. Take for example the chart of Ptolemy's second biggest fan (after me) - Girolamo Cardano - https://www.astro.com/astro-databank/Cardano,_Girolamo

There is no planet in aspect with an angle at 18:29 when the Ascendant is at 6° 22' Taurus. But noticing that Jupiter is nearby, we can put him exactly at the Ascendant giving us 18:20 time, or a 9 minute rectification. Jupiter rising rather than declining may better explain his life and fame.

having briefly tested the petosiris method
on charts with reasonably reliable times of birth
the method holds true for same chart whether using Aldebaran 15
and/or Tropical Whole Sign
simplifies considerably - many thanks

.

[sinhtheslumberingdragon]

Originally Posted by JUPITERASC

on the contrary
age is not a problem when rectifying a natal chart

and
because
our forum is an astrological learning forum
petosiris has generously posted the following rectification guidelines
for anyone who is sufficiently intereted to learn the method


having briefly tested the petosiris method
on charts with reasonably reliable times of birth
the method holds true for same chart whether using Aldebaran 15
and/or Tropical Whole Sign
simplifies considerably - many thanks

.

I'm not sure if I understood that correctly, but he talks about having a nearby planet make a conjuction with the AC/IC. If this is the case, then the only two nearby planets to the AC is Saturn/Jupiter, however with current birth time, Saturn is already conjuct the AC? So what do I do in this case?

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by sinhtheslumberingdragon

I'm not sure if I understood that correctly, but he talks about having a nearby planet make a conjuction with the AC/IC. If this is the case, then the only two nearby planets to the AC is Saturn/Jupiter, however with current birth time, Saturn is already conjuct the AC? So what do I do in this case?

Check several different methods

https://heavenastrolabe.wordpress.co...rchants-chart/

[waybread]

For most purposes a birth time from your birth certificate is good enough-- especially for a younger person. Saturn sitting right on your ascendant squaring Mercury in the (angular) 10th house is a stressful aspect, but it probably means that you will work very hard (Saturn square) in a field ruled by Mercury such as communications. Jupiter in your first house in Mercury's sign of Gemini should further benefit a Mercurial profession.

[sinhtheslumberingdragon]

Originally Posted by JUPITERASC

Check several different methods

https://heavenastrolabe.wordpress.co...rchants-chart/

I'm not sure if that would be a good method for me, it took a while to deliver me.

[sinhtheslumberingdragon]

Originally Posted by waybread

For most purposes a birth time from your birth certificate is good enough-- especially for a younger person. Saturn sitting right on your ascendant squaring Mercury in the (angular) 10th house is a stressful aspect, but it probably means that you will work very hard (Saturn square) in a field ruled by Mercury such as communications. Jupiter in your first house in Mercury's sign of Gemini should further benefit a Mercurial profession.

What else do you see in my chart? I might try to get into politics, would I do well there?

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by sinhtheslumberingdragon

I'm not sure if that would be a good method

for me, it took a while to deliver me.

That's not unusual apparently
nevertheless the method works well


.

[sinhtheslumberingdragon]

Originally Posted by JUPITERASC

That's not unusual apparently
nevertheless the method works well


.

I had a birth complication with delayed my conception by 15-20 minutes, which moves my ASC right over saturn.

[sinhtheslumberingdragon]

Originally Posted by JUPITERASC

That's not unusual apparently
nevertheless the method works well


.

Interesting, I checked the method. The moon is earlier than my AC, but it is not by much.

[waybread]

I think the best way to get into politics is out of a desire to improve people's situation, not simply to attain personal status or power. Your 10th house Mercury is plenty ambitious, but I'm not sure that your improvement-oriented Virgo moon and caring Pisces sun, widely opposed, are strongly motivated to help people. If you feel differently, that's fine.

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by sinhtheslumberingdragon

Interesting, I checked the method.
The moon is earlier than my AC, but it is not by much.

compare with another method such as for example
rectification using THRASYLLUS method
https://www.astrologyweekly.com/foru...&postcount=343
With many thanks to petosiris
for providing it originally on another thread

Originally Posted by petosiris

Another example, with the newly elected Mexican President - https://www.astro.com/astro-databank..._Andres_Manuel

According to the AA source, the birth occurred at 2:00, quite unlikely, like most rounded off births. Let's use Thrasyllus' method again.

1) We determine the ascensional degrees from the Sun to the Moon. We mark 81 as the solar gnomon.
2) We determine the ascensional degrees from the degree opposite the Sun - this is 23.
3) We multiply 23 by 12 and again by the hour of the nativity, with the fractions. Since the birth occurred at the beginning of the ninth hour - 23 x 12 x 8 - 360 x 6 = 48 which is less than the solar gnomon.
4) We add 7 minutes to the time of birth and with 23 x 12 x 8.12 - 360 x 6 = 81 and we get the ''real'' Ascendant.

Jupiter is Lord of the Year and in the place of Good Daimon with Fortune. The Lightbringer also profects to its exaltation. Note that he was not elected with the same profections 12 years ago. Since the Ruler of the Peak was in the place of the Bad Daimon in the 2005 solar revolution, in this Revolution she is with Jupiter to the degree making a phase.

Since the rising time of Libra is 32.5, doubled it makes the stellium operative. And since the rising time of Gemini is 33 and of Virgo is 31.25, it makes the Jupiter square Mars productive of rank, politics and authority (as are the rising times of Virgo and Capricorn for that partile trine). And since half of the rising time of Gemini is 16.5 and 4 times the years of Jupiter = 64.5, it makes it even more operative.

And since the year is multiple of 5, which is the special interval point of Venus (inferior trine), it makes the profection of Jupiter and Fortune even stronger than the last one, and according to Valens ''The configurations of the stars and their aspects with each other (especially the aspects with the Lot of Fortune) are effective in the chronocratorships which are in harmony. (The whole is seen and arises from the aspects of the Lot of Fortune and from its ruler'' - https://www.csus.edu/indiv/r/rileymt...s%20entire.pdf

[sinhtheslumberingdragon]

Originally Posted by waybread

I think the best way to get into politics is out of a desire to improve people's situation, not simply to attain personal status or power. Your 10th house Mercury is plenty ambitious, but I'm not sure that your improvement-oriented Virgo moon and caring Pisces sun, widely opposed, are strongly motivated to help people. If you feel differently, that's fine.

I am curious, what other career do you suggest? And yes, I would use politics to help others. I wouldn't use it to be corrupt lol. I am still not sure about my Sun. I don't embody many traits of Pisces, however I could just be looking at it wrong.

[sinhtheslumberingdragon]

Originally Posted by JUPITERASC

compare with another method such as for example
rectification using THRASYLLUS method
https://www.astrologyweekly.com/foru...&postcount=343
With many thanks to petosiris
for providing it originally on another thread

I'm sorry to say but the Thrasyllus method is a bit lost on me.

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by sinhtheslumberingdragon

I am still not sure about my Sun.
I don't embody many traits of Pisces, however I could just be
looking at it wrong.

keep in mind that traditional astrology IS NOT "Sunsign astrology"

Originally Posted by petosiris

Introduction to Hellenistic Astrology Part I - Zodiac

The IMAGE OF THE FISHES is feminine, nocturnal, double-bodied, watery, oceanic, notable, silent, fertile, passionate, missing limbs, two-coloured, mobile, lying and of the west wind. It indicates governorship, travel, wealth, water and summons. Depending on the placement of the houseruler, men born under the influence of Pisces are small, disproportioned and awkward, complicated because of the directions of the Fishes, changeable, restless, mystical, slight, wandering, popular, slightly sallow, delicate, with ruddy head, fish eyes, beautiful hair, soft hands, bright voice, white in complexion, traders, endowed with genius, unsteady, trustworthy, full of ideas, philosophers, commanders of fleets, marines, sailors and business expediters.

Domicile of Jupiter, exaltation of Venus, depression of Mercury, it controls the feet, the reproductive system, the digestive system and the integumentary system. It causes skin diseases on account of the rough skin. It is equinoctial, like-empowered with Virgo, like-ascending with Aquarius and like-engirding with Sagittarius, short in the Northern Hemisphere and tall in the Southern Hemisphere. It is vernal, hot and moist for the north, and autumnal, cold and dry for the south. Pisces controls Phazania, Nasamonitis, Garamantica, Lydia, Cilicia and Pamphylia. The southern fish body is rising up to the 12th degree, the southern fish tail up to the 16th, the southern cord up to the 19th degree, the northern fish up to the 28th, and the bond up to the 30th.

The first 12° belong to Venus - fertile, jealousy, with many enemies
The next 4° belong to Jupiter - advancement, elevation, commanding
The next 3° belong to Mercury - intelligence, well-grown, highly frivolous
The next 9° belong to Mars - violent, excessive, with many accusations
The final 2° belong to Saturn - virtuous, wise, dominant

Head of the Southern Fish - Mercury and moderately Saturn
Body of the Southern Fish - Jupiter and Mercury
Southern Tail and Cord - Saturn and moderately Mercury
Body of the Northern Fish - Jupiter and moderately Venus
Northern Cord - Saturn and Jupiter
Bond - Mars and moderately Mercury


Such, then, are the observations of the effects of the stars

as made by our predecessors. Let us now proceed with the seven-zone.

Bibliography:
Ludwich, A. (Ed.). (1877). Maximi et Ammonis carminum De actionum auspiciis reliquiae:

accedunt Anecdota astrologica. BG Teubneri. Retrieved from https://archive.org/details/maximiet...00ludw/page/n3
Manilius, & Goold, G. P. (1985). Astronomica. BG Teubner.
Robbins, F. E. (1940). Ptolemy: Tetrabiblos. William Heinmann, London. Retrieved from http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/...blos/home.html
Schmidt, R. The Astrological Record of the Early Greek Sages. Project Hindsight.
Valens, V. Anthologia. Translated by Mark Riley. Retrieved from https://www.csus.edu/indiv/r/rileymt...s%20entire.pdf

[sinhtheslumberingdragon]

Originally Posted by JUPITERASC

keep in mind that traditional astrology IS NOT "Sunsign astrology"

Yes.


Do you see any eminence in my chart?

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by sinhtheslumberingdragon

Yes.
Do you see any eminence in my chart?

RANK OF FAME THREAD
https://www.astrologyweekly.com/foru...ad.php?t=49203

Originally Posted by Omnisphericus

There are many different methods

calculating the Rank of Fame in someones chart.


I will try here to discuss all the methods of which I'm aware.
I will start from a mix of medieval astrology method of seeing the Rank of Fame with that of Ptolemy, and than in some other post I will present some of the Hellenistic methods.

1. First we look at the Sun, if it is in 10th or 11th house. In lasser degree fame is indicated also by Sun being in 1st, 4th and 7th.
Sun in aspect to the MC brings fame.
Sun in succedent house and especially if it is aspecting the MC can brings fame.

This is the general indicator. It doesn't necessarily means that if you have Sun in 10th, you will be famous.
Sun is analogous for Fame, so there fore we first start examining the Sun.

The Sun in 5th cuts the fame in half (except when it is in 5th).
Sun in 5th indicates success in arts and entertainment fields.

Sun's aspects are very important. Afflicted Sun by some hard aspect with strong malefic may bring infamy.

Sun's dispositor and its relationship to the Sun is also very important. The dispositor will show the origin of the fame of the native.

The dispositor of MC and its Almuten as well the aspects to the MC, will show for what will the native gain fame, because MC represents the native's actions.

[sinhtheslumberingdragon]

Originally Posted by JUPITERASC

RANK OF FAME THREAD
https://www.astrologyweekly.com/foru...ad.php?t=49203

It seems there is some level of eminence in my chart, sun in 11th house lord of 11th house in 2nd house, 2nd house lord in 10th house, 10th house lord in first house (right on asc).

However, my lumanires are in fem signs, and my sun is aspected by saturn. My moon is seemingly well aspected (aspect to Jupiter+mc) but also aspected by saturn.





I'm not sure if my mercury counts as doryphory for sun.
I'm not sure how those saturn aspects play out (if they block eminence or if they just delay it)
I'm also not sure how the sun/moon opposition works out for eminence as well.

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by sinhtheslumberingdragon

It seems there is some level of eminence in my chart, sun in 11th house lord of 11th house in 2nd house, 2nd house lord in 10th house, 10th house lord in first house (right on asc).

However, my lumanires are in fem signs, and my sun is aspected by saturn. My moon is seemingly well aspected (aspect to Jupiter+mc) but also aspected by saturn.

I'm not sure if my mercury counts as doryphory for sun.
I'm not sure how those saturn aspects play out (if they block eminence or if they just delay it)
I'm also not sure how the sun/moon opposition works out for eminence as well.

Advanced Considerations on Judging Eminence in a Birth Chart
© 2010 Curtis Manwaring
http://www.astrology-x-files.com/x-f...deminence.html


.

[sinhtheslumberingdragon]

Originally Posted by JUPITERASC

Advanced Considerations on Judging Eminence in a Birth Chart
© 2010 Curtis Manwaring
http://www.astrology-x-files.com/x-f...deminence.html


.

My trigon lords are pretty poorly placed.... 12th 8th and 5th... (venus mars moon)



that kind of ruins my eminence

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by sinhtheslumberingdragon

My trigon lords are pretty poorly placed....

12th 8th and 5th... (venus mars moon)
that kind of ruins my eminence

House location is dependent on reliable time of birth


.