What sign I am, Leo or Virgo?

Michael

Well-known member
The tropical zodiac says that I'm a Virgo, while the sidereal says Leo.
In the tropical one, my 12th house is in Leo. And according to some
modern astrologers, that's my hidden sign, thus my real nature, so
I'm Leo. Judging from the chart I have 6 fire signs, 2 earth signs, 1
wind sign and 2 water signs. So I'm Leo, any ideas?
 

Kaiousei no Senshi

Premium Member
It depends which system you're willing to sell yourself to.

If by the tropical means you're a Virgo. You're a Virgo. If by the sidereal means you're a Leo. You're a Leo. Just depends on which system you choose to go with. Sidereal goes with Vedic astrology, while Tropical goes with Western.

I've never heard of the Twelfth being the 'hidden sign', if so I'm an Aquarius...strange, almost scary thought there.
 

unukalhai

Well-known member
Michael said:
any ideas

My idea would be that you are a combination of all 12 signs, just like everyone else. I dont think it's wise to assign ourselves to any single sign, but to understand which signs are the strongest in our chart.

The signs are simply modes of the elements... Fixed Fire = Leo, Mutable Earth = Virgo, etc, so one way of judging an important sign is to look at which element and mode is strongest in your chart. For you, you have the most placements in mutable fire, Sagittarius, making your Jupiter Uranus and Neptune Sagittarius placements quite important. Since you are mainly fire, but closely tied between fixed and mutable, your Leo placements also gain importance, Venus and Mars.

Your only air placement is Pluto, and is also your only cardinal placement. Your Sun and Mercury are the only ones in earth.

You do, however, have Mercury placed in your 1st house (important to the self, big part of the personality) and also in it's own sign, Virgo, making it both ascendant lord and final dispositor. Mercury also rules your Midheaven. This does boost the important of both Mercury and the earth element.

In those terms, you are mainly Leo-Virgo-Sagittarius, with the important addition of your emotionally-distrustful Scorpio Moon adding a penetrating overtone to your expressive-analytical/critical-philosophical combination.

I'm not a fan of sidereal, I don't see any basis for positioning the ecliptic against distant stars. If we're going to use the stellar constellations, then we would use 13 signs of varying widths, as they are in the sky. For something that claims to be star-real, it seems more of a psedo-star-real reality. At least the tropical zodiac is what it is.

As far as your "hidden sign" goes, it is correct the sign on the 12th house cusp can be obscured from visibility, and represents a place of inner refuge, yet I don't see it being any more important than any of the other 12. By unlocking one's 12th house we do gain access to things that would otherwise be burried or hidden, but people with important 12th house placements such as yourself often have natural access to both those planets and the sign on the cusp. It's pretty hard to consider your 12th nearly as hidden as many horoscopes with expressive Leo on the cusp and both the relating planets present. In fact, you may be able to access your inner self with intensity of expression and willful action, all done in harmony. With Mars there, it's going to be a natural drive for you. I'd bet you live in your 12th house far more than most folks, and either are or will become quite comfortable in that refuge. I have Venus and Neptune there, with Sagittarius on the cusp, making my 12th a nice spot for me as well. People with an active 12th house tend to enjoy solitude, time by themselves, and value their own company, although that does assume positive and constructive 12th house placements. While most folks feel "out of the water" when they lack relationships, and thus establish a sense of loneliness, 12th house types may be more unbalanced when they lack sufficient alone time to connect with their inner self, often gaining more from inner work and the peacefulness of one's own company than through relationships with others... They still do, however, require 7th-house style relating, but often will engage in the 7th house process of relating for a limited time, then take those lessons back to the 12th house for review, reflection and integration. They will then, later in time, experience those 12th house reflections again through the 7th, and build upon them. The process repeats, much as a squirrel builds up a cache of goodies hidden in his nest. The healthy and loving 12th house type will share those goodies with others who are close to him/her, both awakening the other to their inner selves as well as offering unique viewpoints collected from one's inner resources, while the other helps to fulfill the 12th house person's need for external contact, even it they do trend towards "oneness" with the self.

Just my 2¢ :)
 

johnmike59

Well-known member
Unukhahli, what is the difference between Vedic and Sidereal vis a vis Tropical and Western? Can you give me a brief response or is this grist for another thread?

Thanks very much -- I always enjoy your posts for their intelligence and wit.
 
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