scorpio rising characteristics--are their two types of scorpio people?

Are there two sides to the spectrum for scorpio rising people? I don't feel that I'm particularly ambitious but when reading about some aspects in my chart, I found out it's because I have difficulty deciding on a career and I'm indecisive, (which may counteract the typical scorpio rising way). I also either want to go all the way, or not at all--which hinders my success in everything. I read that there's an ambitious scorpio, or an extremely intuitive, emotionally intelligent, spiritual scorpio. Am I off base here? I definitely identify with the spiritual, highly emotional side (I think I'm VERY good at reading people, and immediately pick up a vibe from everyone I meet--I also think I might be an empath). I also read that they don't have to make their presence bold or loud; there are shy scorpios that simply make an impact in some way with their demeanor. Any thoughts or insight would be appreciated

well first one must look at the entire chart as the qualities you have isolated could be described my other planets,aspects and signs.
but focusing on scorpio,there are 3 type of scorpio's which one of the reason scorpios are so "infamous".
all other signs have innately only one or two archetypes to express their characteristics through, wheras scorpio has 3 levels of transformation.
various writers and philosphies differ a bit in the symbols but generally:

the base scorpio is characterized by the scorpio and are extremely selfish and malicious inthat they consider no one but them selves and what they can gain by hook or crook.this level is characterized by a scorpion which will strike itself dead if cornered rather than modify it's will.

the second level is symbolized by the eagle,which soars above others but still has a predatory viewpoint.the difference is that the eagle can see more and hence has a broader undrrstanding of it's place.but it is still very selfish and ego centered.

the third level is the angel or dove.this shows a scorpio who has become "enlightened" and now tries to help others rather than seeing others as it's prey.

so scorpios have the broadest range of spiritual personalities of the zodiac.
you can never be sure of how a scorpio will react.it depends so mauch on their stage of spiritual evolution.

i believe these examples are from isabel hickey,though many writers have expressed similar insights

rahu

of course I wouldn't say that is entirely true of only Scorpio, rahu.
All human beings will at some point or another begin to show growth away from the typicality of their zodiac sign (and it's other influences) based on their spiritual progress.

The archetypes are interesting, Rahu. What I assumed was that there had to be different scorpio variations. However, I've never heard of Scorpio's being "selfish." I've heard that their negative traits are more along the lines of being calculating, and vengeful. But I guess in a way; they can be inadvertantly self-serving? I would say if anything, I'm OVERLY concered with others, especially lovers--constantly worrying and putting myself on the back burner. And I like what you said, Sebastienne--the idea that we spiritually grow beyond what is typical of our sign and our other planetary influences.

The lowest level scorpio that rahu has mentioned has an unconcious "death urge" that drived it to destroy anothers ego after it ensnares it in its web, as Alan Olen says.

The eagle wants to exault the ego, but begins to see the pointlessness of it.

Also if you ever get the urge to do something for the sake of shock and just being different then that is your aquarian influence, as I read you have on another post, I know what thats like because I have aqua AC and venus.

JayM said:

The lowest level scorpio that rahu has mentioned has an unconcious "death urge" that drived it to destroy anothers ego after it ensnares it in its web, as Alan Olen says.

The eagle wants to exault the ego, but begins to see the pointlessness of it.

Also if you ever get the urge to do something for the sake of shock and just being different then that is your aquarian influence, as I read you have on another post, I know what thats like because I have aqua AC and venus.

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This makes me want to get a good book that explores archetypes...

I definitely have the urge to do or say something for the sake of shock--I also used to change my appearance a LOT. I still love changing my appearance or trying to separate myself from trends.

whammy:kiss said:

This makes me want to get a good book that explores archetypes...

I definitely have the urge to do or say something for the sake of shock--I also used to change my appearance a LOT. I still love changing my appearance or trying to separate myself from trends.

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Thats the aquarius part of you wanting independence, aqua's sort of feel like theres a plastic wall between them and everything else, thats general though and somehow your scorpio AC fits into that to mabie give you an extreme look (scorpio has to do with extremes)

Whatever you do dont go with a goth look with black lipstick... lol

lmao definitely not black lipstick--although I'm very drawn to gothic anything--music, occult related studies. I think that might be where my Scorpio comes in--I heard strong Scorpios have an inclination toward mysticism and metaphysics.

hi,
this is an interesting thread.
I really identify with as Iam a 19 scorpio asc with 20 scorpio neptune placed on the asc.
Iam also an aquarian sun merc and venus in the 4th
leo moon mc and tauruean jupiter placed right on the decendant.
... mm so yeah i know bad bad natal chart going on.

as an aquarian i have allways wondered why people ive met instantly like me or are wary of me, men in clubs think im easy to pick up(not so) and some men find me scary like i would be extreemly bossy in relationships..
I get some people just looking at me and i can hear them all saying in their head.. registering... registering.... (does not register) lol

Once past that most people comment on my eyes, they are dark brown but kind of transparent and lucid ( from what i understand thats the aquarian as well as scorpio influance)
Personally iam fixed in nature with what i "DO" know about my likes and dislikes yet quite open to everything in life. ( I have 6 plannets pluss asc in fixed signs) ive been working on being not so fixed in my opinions over the last 10 years which i feel i have achieved.

I will say one thing and mean it and then something similar will come up and i say something else, people dont get me, they think im being a hippocrite but i see things very individually and every question has merrits.

I Find in my working life superiors walk all over me and i have many enamys due to something personal they have against me. mostly women!
iam well liked with my fellow staff members and customers and i am a company person who works hard and loyal.

I know this is going to sound consieted but women bosses are jelous of something about me and they think they can hide it but they must know i can see through them, they dont like that i dont put on no ears and graces with levels of job roles.. I treat all people ( janator, staff, bosses, customers) the same.. with respect and careing nature.

most people once they get past initial stages say im nothing like what they thought. It can be frustrating and sometimes good.

The only thing i cant work out is why im so sensative (i hide it very well most times) but anyone would think i have a cancer moon.. its 5 deg leo i wonder if its cause of the neptune on asc in scorpio or that the moon is close to cancer?

I married a scorpio sun person, we were the opposits of each other and i hated being married to him and did not get on with him, he frustrated me badly. I wonder if i protray this to others?

whammy:kiss said:

The archetypes are interesting, Rahu. What I assumed was that there had to be different scorpio variations. However, I've never heard of Scorpio's being "selfish." I've heard that their negative traits are more along the lines of being calculating, and vengeful. But I guess in a way; they can be inadvertantly self-serving? I would say if anything, I'm OVERLY concered with others, especially lovers--constantly worrying and putting myself on the back burner. And I like what you said, Sebastienne--the idea that we spiritually grow beyond what is typical of our sign and our other planetary influences.

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You need to understand there is far far more to astrology than just ‘sun signs’ firstly there are 10planets in the sky and 12houses and any one of these 10planets can be in any one of these 12 houses – so there’s 144 possible combinations there –

What is vitally important is your ‘time of birth’ and nearest town and then go to free website like astro.com to calculate your natal chart, you may have to reduce the image in Extended chart selection to 63% save to your hard drive, then upload here.

As we are all visual people we need to see charts - for help on this -

How to attach a chart as thumbnail

1) First, get your from chart at www.astro.com by registering yourself there—it’s free

2) Then, save that chart (as a .jpeg, .gif, .tif....file; image file format) on your computer. It is important to reduce the image size to 63% version of the chart (select at the 'Image-size' tab) before saving it, so that the file is not too big when you upload it. Click to get chart, then right mouse click on image, ‘save target image as’ to hard drive.

3) Back at our forum, finish your post; then click on the 'Go advanced' button (it is right below the space, where you key in your message).

4) Now, hit the button 'Manage attachments', which is in the 'Additional- Options' section', at the bottom left of the page.

5) Once the window opens, hit 'Search' to search for the image-file (the chart) that you just saved on your computer. Now upload it by clicking on the 'Upload' button.

6) Finally, post your message, and, this time, it will be accompanied by the chart, which will appear as an 'Attached thumbnail', just like the 'example chart' attached to this post. And don't forget to post your own interpretation of the chart (exception is GLounge) along with it, as our forum rules request.

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http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12126

I'm aware that there's far more to astrology than the sun sign and I have had my chart made from various websites; but thanks for the information on how to make a chart. I have scorpio rising, moon, mars and moon, as well as in the second house. Sorry, I just wasn't wording my question correctly and I came off sounding ignorant. I was simply asking about ambition because I was under the impression that scorpio rising people tend to be ambitious. I have so much scorpio in my chart but I notice I'm especially hesitant and unmotivated about attaining goals or career objectives. I read about certain aspects in my chart that contribute to this however.

whammy:kiss said:

I'm aware that there's far more to astrology than the sun sign and I have had my chart made from various websites; but thanks for the information on how to make a chart. I have scorpio rising, moon, mars and moon, as well as in the second house. Sorry, I just wasn't wording my question correctly and I came off sounding ignorant. I was simply asking about ambition because I was under the impression that scorpio rising people tend to be ambitious. I have so much scorpio in my chart but I notice I'm especially hesitant and unmotivated about attaining goals or career objectives. I read about certain aspects in my chart that contribute to this however.

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How sure are you about your 'time' have your read up on Libra Asc??
Was there any major upheavals around age 7? anyone die, relocate. Age 13 I would expect a relocation, looking at and using Solar arcs

With stellium planets in aquarius in 4th you may like to research further -
http://www.therealastrology.com/HTML/FAQS/AspectPatterns.html#Stellium

I would expect you to be home buff with that stellium. there are a few things in a chart that could suggest an ambitious person, MC sign, planets in 10th house. But all those planets below the horizon suggests a subjective personality and scorpio is a very very private person and not particularly sociable either. Capricorn and scorpio to me are the two least sociable signs, Cappi because they are always working and scorpio because they don't want other people knowing their business. They do however, make great researchers and dectectives and play their cards very close to their chests...

astrologer50 said:

How sure are you about your 'time' have your read up on Libra Asc??
Was there any major upheavals around age 7? anyone die, relocate. Age 13 I would expect a relocation, looking at and using Solar arcs

With stellium planets in aquarius in 4th you may like to research further -
http://www.therealastrology.com/HTML/FAQS/AspectPatterns.html#Stellium

I would expect you to be home buff with that stellium. there are a few things in a chart that could suggest an ambitious person, MC sign, planets in 10th house. But all those planets below the horizon suggests a subjective personality and scorpio is a very very private person and not particularly sociable either. Capricorn and scorpio to me are the two least sociable signs, Cappi because they are always working and scorpio because they don't want other people knowing their business. They do however, make great researchers and dectectives and play their cards very close to their chests...

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I know for a fact that my birth certificate says 12:20 a.m, but it's funny that you mention that, because one of my friends thinks that hospitals don't always put an accurate birth time on your certificate--he said sometimes it's off by a minute or two. He said to look at Libra rising and asked me the same questions about my childhood. My parents had an EXTREMELY volatile, rocky marriage, a divorce occurred when I was a preteen, and fighting and accusations were rampant during this time. I moved CONSTANTLY from the time I was born up until I was in high school and I moved in with my father and step family. When I was 13, (prior to living with my dad and him getting remarried), I moved to Nevada with my mother; a bad decision as my mother always promised great things but never failed to deliver catastrophic events. Are you suggesting that based on my childhood, I'm more likely to be a Libra rising? I'm curious because it's been frustrating thinking that I've been researching scorpio rising for all this time for nothing :-(

I just looked at the link about stellium planets (I'm becoming familiarized with this term so bear with me). I didn't realize they were all in my fourth house. I think my subjectiveness, and my struggle to be objective, along with my reserved nature, almost hinder my ability to go far in terms of career and getting where I want in life. I definitely don't like people knowing my business and hate working for a corporation simply because I feel they're like big brother and constantly invading my privacy outside of work (via facebook).

why not read up on Libra see if you identify with the traits?

http://www.cafeastrology.com/zodiaclibra.html

1' degree on Asc = 4minutes in real time. If you say 13 was most notably time when relocation happened to. It's important if you can jot down events and things that happened mainly upto say age 12-13

Then as a 'fine tuner' Transiting mars and mercury, I've found quite noticeable over Asc and MC. Use an online ephemeris and make a diary note and just observe and watch what happens.

http://www.khaldea.com/kldaephem/2000/jan2010gmt.shtml

here's one I like to use

astrologer50 said:

why not read up on Libra see if you identify with the traits?

http://www.cafeastrology.com/zodiaclibra.html

1' degree on Asc = 4minutes in real time. If you say 13 was most notably time when relocation happened to. It's important if you can jot down events and things that happened mainly upto say age 12-13

Then as a 'fine tuner' Transiting mars and mercury, I've found quite noticeable over Asc and MC. Use an online ephemeris and make a diary note and just observe and watch what happens.

http://www.khaldea.com/kldaephem/2000/jan2010gmt.shtml

here's one I like to use

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I looked at the Libra rising info before, and again just now to refresh--I agree whole wholeheartedly when it talked about "strings of relationships" and needing to be involved. I don't really know about the competitiveness and persuasiveness, however...don't really identify there. I identify more with the Scorpio rising way of "seeing through people." I can't tell you how often I just look at a stranger and instantly feel like I know what they're all about, or if they give me bad/good vibes. Also, I feel a definite power under the surface that I almost don't know how to exert. Is it possible that I possess both Scorpio and Libra rising traits?

What you are describing could well be your Pluto conj Moon aspect -- very psychic, with Pluto in first or conj Asc they always hold themselves a little aloof and there is much more going on below the surface that what is shown.

Basic astrology
Now basically your sun sign is your 'core beliefs, values, ego' and Asc is your physical body, mode of expression and mask and persona that we all wear and hide behind, but definitely not what's going on underneath. What's going on underneath is your Sun sign. Moon sign, house placements and aspects describe your emotional and intuitive responses, also describes your view of your mother, as saturn describes your father by sign and house position.

So, think of a glass milk bottle the bottle is your Asc and your sun the milk, but the milk still has to 'come out' through the glass neck of the milk bottle....

Now aspects within a natal chart represent 'facets' of our personality, because we are all multifaceted beings. What these do is 'break down and compartmentalise' these facets into smaller bite size chunks. This does take quite a lot of self analysis and objectivity to 'see yourself' and why you do certain things and behave in certain ways. Actually it can be quite good therapy...

Remember back to your school days an opposition is 180', square 90', trine 120', and sextile 60' Now challenged aspects are conj (depending on the planets, cos some like each other and some really don't) squares and oppositions. Easy aspects are conj (if the planets get along) eg: Jupiter conj Moon, sextile and trine. Quincunx is inbetween (depending on the planets) causes health strains and unresolved or hard to balance planets/energies.

Angular houses are 1/7th, 4/10th so 1st is your shop window so to speak.
15th September 2010 is when T mars conj Asc 0' scorpio so make a diary note for that cos you will feel and notice it's effects. T Venus conj Asc on 9th Sept and finally T Mercury 21st October.

T mars 15th April goes over MC -- lots energy drive put into work, career, social standing socialising etc.
20 June T Venus conj MC again socialising, partying, pleasure in work area.
13 July T mercury conj MC lots communications, letters, fone calls, meetings connected to work or socialising.

From our AW homepage, go down to bottom left and the search box, searchs within AW and is exceptionally good for natal aspects --

You are likely to experience strong emotions and feelings, whose intensity may dominate choices and decisions, almost as if you lose control over any free will. As your emotional roots are located in the unconscious mind, you may believe there is a compulsive or obsessive fate shaping your life.

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http://www.astrologyweekly.com/astrological-aspects/moon-conjunct-pluto.php

Hope this helps

astrologer50 said:

What you are describing could well be your Pluto conj Moon aspect -- very psychic, with Pluto in first or conj Asc they always hold themselves a little aloof and there is much more going on below the surface that what is shown.

Basic astrology
Now basically your sun sign is your 'core beliefs, values, ego' and Asc is your physical body, mode of expression and mask and persona that we all wear and hide behind, but definitely not what's going on underneath. What's going on underneath is your Sun sign. Moon sign, house placements and aspects describe your emotional and intuitive responses, also describes your view of your mother, as saturn describes your father by sign and house position.

So, think of a glass milk bottle the bottle is your Asc and your sun the milk, but the milk still has to 'come out' through the glass neck of the milk bottle....

Now aspects within a natal chart represent 'facets' of our personality, because we are all multifaceted beings. What these do is 'break down and compartmentalise' these facets into smaller bite size chunks. This does take quite a lot of self analysis and objectivity to 'see yourself' and why you do certain things and behave in certain ways. Actually it can be quite good therapy...

Remember back to your school days an opposition is 180', square 90', trine 120', and sextile 60' Now challenged aspects are conj (depending on the planets, cos some like each other and some really don't) squares and oppositions. Easy aspects are conj (if the planets get along) eg: Jupiter conj Moon, sextile and trine. Quincunx is inbetween (depending on the planets) causes health strains and unresolved or hard to balance planets/energies.

Angular houses are 1/7th, 4/10th so 1st is your shop window so to speak.
15th September 2010 is when T mars conj Asc 0' scorpio so make a diary note for that cos you will feel and notice it's effects. T Venus conj Asc on 9th Sept and finally T Mercury 21st October.

T mars 15th April goes over MC -- lots energy drive put into work, career, social standing socialising etc.
20 June T Venus conj MC again socialising, partying, pleasure in work area.
13 July T mercury conj MC lots communications, letters, fone calls, meetings connected to work or socialising.

From our AW homepage, go down to bottom left and the search box, searchs within AW and is exceptionally good for natal aspects --

http://www.astrologyweekly.com/astrological-aspects/moon-conjunct-pluto.php

Hope this helps

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Thanks so much for responding and providing info. This clears up a little confusion.