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Chinese Astrology 本板块使用英语讨论中国占星术。This forum will hold discussion on Chinese Astrology in English language.


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  #1  
Unread 09-14-2013, 12:17 PM
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Antisicia in Chinese Zi Wei Dou Shu System

I had suspected the similarity of Western Traditional Antisicia/Contra Antisicia system is the same as the Chinese Zi Wei Dou Shu's concept of "Secret Palace". I managed to read some articles about it in Chinese. Finally I found article that is written in English to explain the Western and Eastern system are just THE SAME!!!! So I share here for those interested.

After struggling to understand Antisicia from English for a long term, only to find out I knew the system from Chinese already

http://asabovesobelow108.wordpress.com/tag/antiscion/

This blog is excellent for those wanted to learn the basic ZWDS in English....however in Chinese will be so much better!!! Here is the home page of the blog. http://asabovesobelow108.wordpress.com/about/

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I believe there is something of the divine mystery in everything that exists. We can see it sparkle in a sunflower or a poppy. We sense more of the unfathomable mystery in a butterfly that flutters from a twig--or in a goldfish swimming in a bowl. But we are closest to God in our own soul. Only there can we become one with the greatest mystery of life. In truth, at very rare moments we can experience that we ourselves are that divine mystery. --Jostein Gaarder, Sophie's World

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  #2  
Unread 09-14-2013, 12:55 PM
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Re: Antisicia in Chinese Zi Wei Dou Shu System

http://www.fushantang.com/4000/03/q1000.html

This site is unfortunately all in traditional Chinese, but is just like the Chinese version of Skyscript for study of Chinese Traditional astrology, 8 characters, and all Chinese Occult Sciences. All the articles are written in ancient Chinese format.

The table are there for people to draw their own charts manually. All formulas are designed as Songs, you sing it and memories them in your head. On the right hand side are all classic text, and discussion of the 144 patterns of charts from ancient texts.

There are 14 mains stars (Class A) in Chinese system, 12 palaces, 48 flying stars as per the 12 years cycle, each group contain 4 flying stars, and then we have Class B, C, D, E stars in total 62-69 some used up to 115 stars in total depending on which school of ZWDS.

The Stars can be further classified as Northern stars group, Southern Stars group and Main Sky; there are 12 palaces in cycle from before birth to death placed in each palace to describe the peak and fall of life cycle.

The MAJOR limitation is lack of further researchers doing research on charts with foreign born natives. Perhaps there are advanced Chinese astrologers do know how to.

However, it works perfectly well for those born within the Chinese time zone regions, you can predict romance, marriage, funeral major events easily. As it is all formulated as Cycles in it own unique way even without birth time accuracy to minutes. So I highly recommended those whom can read Chinese and born within the region to explore ZWDS.

Chart generating engine:
http://www.math.ncu.edu.tw/~ziyou/ziwei/wziwei.cgi
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I believe there is something of the divine mystery in everything that exists. We can see it sparkle in a sunflower or a poppy. We sense more of the unfathomable mystery in a butterfly that flutters from a twig--or in a goldfish swimming in a bowl. But we are closest to God in our own soul. Only there can we become one with the greatest mystery of life. In truth, at very rare moments we can experience that we ourselves are that divine mystery. --Jostein Gaarder, Sophie's World
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Unread 10-24-2013, 04:38 AM
cupidsrose cupidsrose is offline
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Re: Antisicia in Chinese Zi Wei Dou Shu System

Hi, everybody, I am a new friend.:微翘:
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Unread 12-29-2013, 11:50 AM
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Re: Antisicia in Chinese Zi Wei Dou Shu System

The way I learned about the Western antisica and contra antisica are more based on my understanding on the Chinese system as I once mentioned.

First I must explain, in Chinese ZWDS there is no degrees, we only have major aspects like the western: at the palace (inside the house), opposition, similar to three trines; we call this "三方四正" meaning Three Directions Four Angles which is similar to Vedic as in no need to be having actual aspect in orbs but purely based on house placement.



The current most popular schools of ZWDS, first school called 三合派 (Tripicity) Three directions are the red lines similar to the Tripiclity, including the blue line together as the Four Squares/Angles. Each house is read with these Three direction and Four squares as well as the antisicia and contra antisica. Very standard way of delineation. But the there are two mains school of ZWDS.

The other school is called 飛星派 (Flying stars).

The Three Directions of Flying Stars.


And the Four Angles of Flying Star.


While with Chinese version of antisicia, that is automantic based on signs and no need to even consider the degrees. In Western seem to be more precise to have to have the actual mirroring degree. In Chinese practice, the effect is more like in full sign/whole house, automatically in effect.

暗合宫 in Chinese system is the same to Antiscia but not restricted by degrees only by signs. Like the following. Together 6 pairs of favorable antiscia "地支六合" basically the best mate ever.



Then this is the example of Contra antisicia. Also total of six pair of contra antisicia "地支相衝"

They both hate each other so much and equal in strength is like each stabbing each other one stab during a fight eventually may kill each other/die at the same time or with given other support, one may won over the other.
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I believe there is something of the divine mystery in everything that exists. We can see it sparkle in a sunflower or a poppy. We sense more of the unfathomable mystery in a butterfly that flutters from a twig--or in a goldfish swimming in a bowl. But we are closest to God in our own soul. Only there can we become one with the greatest mystery of life. In truth, at very rare moments we can experience that we ourselves are that divine mystery. --Jostein Gaarder, Sophie's World
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Unread 12-29-2013, 12:12 PM
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Re: Antisicia in Chinese Zi Wei Dou Shu System

I am still yet to see the similar feature of the 地支相害 地支相刑another malefic combination existing in the Western system.



And there are more, as summary, the negative groups 地支相衝, 地支相刑, 地支相害, 地支相破
The positive groups are 地支六合, 地支三合, 地支三會.

From now you may start to notice, in ZWDS you really don't need to have stars or aspect but purely by house placement alone you can see fateful irreversible power struggle/balance, the obvious allies, the secret allies and the open and secret enemies all in the chart, again with or without anything inside the palace/house. Degrees is totally Non-existence which I am then suspect the reason of never need to have correct birth time by minute need for the ZWDS. As long as you have the birth time within the 2 hrs window of each ruling element. Unfortunately, I have never learned from the Master, so I never able to dig deep enough to do specific chart analysis like looking at the same period of chart to delineate specific information. Only want to share what I know of so far.

All the above are the Earthly Steams of the element alone which I had not talked about the Heavenly branches.

Some English reading materials for those would like to uncover some basics of the mysterious Chinese System.

http://www.chinainfoonline.com/Chine...y_Branches.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heavenly_Stems

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earthly_Branches

http://www.taoiststudy.com/content/s...rthly-branches

http://www.masterwu.net/MasterWuGan.html
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I believe there is something of the divine mystery in everything that exists. We can see it sparkle in a sunflower or a poppy. We sense more of the unfathomable mystery in a butterfly that flutters from a twig--or in a goldfish swimming in a bowl. But we are closest to God in our own soul. Only there can we become one with the greatest mystery of life. In truth, at very rare moments we can experience that we ourselves are that divine mystery. --Jostein Gaarder, Sophie's World
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Unread 01-31-2014, 08:44 AM
apple tree apple tree is offline
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Re: Antisicia in Chinese Zi Wei Dou Shu System

Good day poyi,
One cannot interpret zwds base on single palace. Could you please help give some insights on given natal chart: 地空,紅鸞on life palace, 天同祿,巨門,地刧 in career palace, 天機權, 天貴in wealth palace. 太陽,天喜, 天梁, 天鉞in travel palace. With negative stars 地空, 地劫 in important palaces, what career would best suit the chart owner?
Thanks
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Unread 01-31-2014, 01:26 PM
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Re: Antisicia in Chinese Zi Wei Dou Shu System

apple tree, I don't do any reading for people not born in China, Hong Kong, Taiwan as the system itself not being full tested for oversea born natives. The other reason is I can't explain myself fully without talking in Chinese. I have stressed about this issues many times about Chinese astrology, you will have to learn the language to even get to the surface of the system.

For the very basic. You must learn the meanings of all those stars from the meaning of the words, then the mythology same as you learning the Western Zodiac, you will have to learn the mythology behind it. There are many more in the system. Each chart, has it own elementary cycle in the bottom of each palace, that is similar to the Profection or Progression in the Western system. The strength of the stars will fully depending on what palace of what element for both Heavenly Stem and Earthly Stem they are at in what combination if the star is strengthen or at his own home or several debilitated like the Domicile and Exaltation, Detriment and Fall.

For both Western and Eastern astrology, there is no quick fix. And I am not here to lie to you. The hardship you must overcome to learn the tool.
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I believe there is something of the divine mystery in everything that exists. We can see it sparkle in a sunflower or a poppy. We sense more of the unfathomable mystery in a butterfly that flutters from a twig--or in a goldfish swimming in a bowl. But we are closest to God in our own soul. Only there can we become one with the greatest mystery of life. In truth, at very rare moments we can experience that we ourselves are that divine mystery. --Jostein Gaarder, Sophie's World
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Unread 01-31-2014, 01:37 PM
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Re: Antisicia in Chinese Zi Wei Dou Shu System

The only chart program that I personally trusted is this one which was designed by University of Taiwan which is free and most systematic available online.

http://www.math.ncu.edu.tw/~ziyou/ziwei/wziwei.cgi

Again all in Chinese. All the other English sites, only provide incomplete chart and data. The weakness of this program is built for Asian born within the nearby time zone however, this program provided the full package of stars that we used. Also from one birth chart, it can further divide into Heaven, Earth and Human chart. Human chart is the original native birth chart, but there are more advanced system of Heaven and Earth charts which I myself not even know how to use. But the professional Chinese Astrologer know. That is based on the system of your personal fate, the timing of the sky given to you and opportunity from the time of birth. Sort of like a full package of life path from 3 angles.

You can also add the wandering Year Lord in the chart. Also allows to insert your parents, lover, friend birth data to identify their first palace in your natal chart.
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I believe there is something of the divine mystery in everything that exists. We can see it sparkle in a sunflower or a poppy. We sense more of the unfathomable mystery in a butterfly that flutters from a twig--or in a goldfish swimming in a bowl. But we are closest to God in our own soul. Only there can we become one with the greatest mystery of life. In truth, at very rare moments we can experience that we ourselves are that divine mystery. --Jostein Gaarder, Sophie's World
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Unread 02-01-2014, 02:30 AM
apple tree apple tree is offline
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Re: Antisicia in Chinese Zi Wei Dou Shu System

Thank you poyi for the web link of zwds chart. I am from manila and i think very few people here are aware of zwds, we are more accustomed to bazi. I got interested in zwds just last year and i found that there are very few books on zwds compared to bazi. I know how to speak and read chinese characters but not on a profound level as the chinese in taiwan, hk and china. Just asked for a little insights on career of given chart because i do know a lot of people study and get into career which later prove not to be suitable to their charts thereby not drawing out their best potentials. Anyway , thanks for the link and can you recommend some books or links as to star interpretations?
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Unread 02-01-2014, 03:34 AM
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Re: Antisicia in Chinese Zi Wei Dou Shu System

That is great if you can read some Chinese characters. ZWDS is really not being studied enough by the westerners, and truly very hard to translate the concepts and the language well. This is the link that I use to study since I left Hong Kong in 2001. When I was a teenager, if you go to Hong Kong or Taiwan, you can find these books easily in the usual book stores but the more advanced would still have to be learned from Masters directly. All those available books are still based on the classical texts provided in this site. So read the original if you could understand the language.

http://www.fushantang.com/4000/03/q1000.html

The site teaches you how to manually draw the chart based on the system as long as you have a Chinese lunar Calendar. My greatest concern as I don't know how accurate ZWDS truly be for foreign born natives. This is for yourself to discover. I have not read any scholar done any extensive studies on this for foreign born which is very disappointing indeed. I must say that Chinese astrologers are mostly uninterested on sharing this tool to the foreigners but I do hope eventually some people can assist with this translation. It is extremely hard to find texts translated into English. But I do hope this will somehow be discovered and learned by the foreign born. ZWDS is still currently commonly used in Hong Kong, Taiwan, Japan and Korea.
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I believe there is something of the divine mystery in everything that exists. We can see it sparkle in a sunflower or a poppy. We sense more of the unfathomable mystery in a butterfly that flutters from a twig--or in a goldfish swimming in a bowl. But we are closest to God in our own soul. Only there can we become one with the greatest mystery of life. In truth, at very rare moments we can experience that we ourselves are that divine mystery. --Jostein Gaarder, Sophie's World
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