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  #1  
Unread 11-20-2016, 07:20 PM
MadArchitect MadArchitect is offline
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Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

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Unread 11-21-2016, 06:28 AM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

Anyone???????????????

Last edited by MadArchitect; 11-21-2016 at 10:54 AM.
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Unread 11-21-2016, 03:47 PM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

OK, have mentioned this before but one chart I'm fascinated by is Ayrton Senna, he had Saturn in the 12th in Capricorn as you do, and Mars I believe.

Definitely a case of a total compulsion for ambition and recognition and being too driven to stop, being the self-undoing.

Also his ambition and drive created hidden enemies.

Not saying your chart is the same but you may want to look at his chart and biog online, if there are any similarities. It seems Saturn in Capricorn is very intense and harsh, and doubly so in the 12th.

However, you have Uranus conjunct Saturn, personally I would see this as a very positive aspect, whereas the opposition is trouble.

It means an ability to blend to nonconformist and erratic and original in Uranus with the conformist, conservative and disciplined nature of Saturn.

It's sort of an aspect of creating, or wanting to create revolution or change from within a pre-ordered system, as I see it.

So as it's in Capricorn could it be something about changing an organization or power structure or way of doing things?

The 12th could mean that this is risk of self undoing, or it could be that you feel it as a compulsion, or it could be a subconscious dream.

The sun is in there so it seems your sense of identity or destiny is bound up with these two, and it may be something buried in the subconscious, or hidden from others..

You may want to look to Chiron too as it is regarded as the bridge between Saturn and Uranus so would play into their dynamic. It's a maverick and a teacher and in the fifth, so maybe creative problems but also talents and ambitions?
Fortune in Sag in 10th, in contrast to the 12th Cap planets, says maybe you need to take risks to overcome doubt and find career fulfillment.


Just some initial ideas, let me know if it is anywhere near.

Last edited by Chillaxer; 11-21-2016 at 03:53 PM.
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  #4  
Unread 11-21-2016, 06:04 PM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

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Originally Posted by Chillaxer View Post
OK, have mentioned this before but one chart I'm fascinated by is Ayrton Senna, he had Saturn in the 12th in Capricorn as you do, and Mars I believe.

Definitely a case of a total compulsion for ambition and recognition and being too driven to stop, being the self-undoing.

Also his ambition and drive created hidden enemies.

Not saying your chart is the same but you may want to look at his chart and biog online, if there are any similarities. It seems Saturn in Capricorn is very intense and harsh, and doubly so in the 12th.

However, you have Uranus conjunct Saturn, personally I would see this as a very positive aspect, whereas the opposition is trouble.

It means an ability to blend to nonconformist and erratic and original in Uranus with the conformist, conservative and disciplined nature of Saturn.

It's sort of an aspect of creating, or wanting to create revolution or change from within a pre-ordered system, as I see it.

So as it's in Capricorn could it be something about changing an organization or power structure or way of doing things?

The 12th could mean that this is risk of self undoing, or it could be that you feel it as a compulsion, or it could be a subconscious dream.

The sun is in there so it seems your sense of identity or destiny is bound up with these two, and it may be something buried in the subconscious, or hidden from others..

You may want to look to Chiron too as it is regarded as the bridge between Saturn and Uranus so would play into their dynamic. It's a maverick and a teacher and in the fifth, so maybe creative problems but also talents and ambitions?
Fortune in Sag in 10th, in contrast to the 12th Cap planets, says maybe you need to take risks to overcome doubt and find career fulfillment.


Just some initial ideas, let me know if it is anywhere near.


thanks for your answer seriously i have now idea whats the meaning of this stellium....
my chiron is in 6th btw..
good point about ayrton senna (im a big fan) ,but ayrton had a completely different natal chart and life than me.
he was aries with aquarius rising while im a full capricorn i have 4 planets and rising in capricorn

Last edited by MadArchitect; 11-21-2016 at 06:11 PM.
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Unread 11-21-2016, 09:12 PM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

Try casting your chart in whole signs houses. With Capricorn rising, it will move your Capricorn planets into the first house.

Don't overlook your sun square Pluto. This can generate a real "dominate or be dominated" type of personality.

A fair number of politicians have 12th house suns. I think they succeed by identifying with a cause or group of people larger than themselves.

Even if you don't feel this way now, it will be important to think of how you can serve less fortunate people in your life, such as those in prisons, hospitals, or institutions. If you don't you may manifest another 12th house meaning, which is that people may begin to experience you as deceptive, and then try to undermine your efforts.
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Unread 11-22-2016, 01:49 AM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

I deal with incarnations in this lifetime. I can't comment on past lives that may never have happened.

Keep an open mind about whole signs. Generally I use Placidus, but sometimes another house system better explains a person's personality and life events.
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Unread 11-22-2016, 10:49 AM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

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I deal with incarnations in this lifetime. I can't comment on past lives that may never have happened.

Keep an open mind about whole signs. Generally I use Placidus, but sometimes another house system better explains a person's personality and life events.
i mentioned previous life

Because 12th house has to do with karma,not to mention saturn(planet of karma)
Here its in rulling position(capricorn)
and in 12th,so it can be a possibility..
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Unread 11-22-2016, 11:10 AM
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Smile Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

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i mentioned previous life

Because 12th house has to do with karma,not to mention saturn(planet of karma)
Here its in rulling position(capricorn)
and in 12th,so it can be a possibility..
Personal hopes and dreams can be considered H12, and Capricorn is known as an ambitious Sign. And that Moon in Scorp Conjunct Pluto in H9, which is also about hopes and dreams, but includes others as well! All those wild and crazy feelings you have to control and channel into something (materially) successful! More power to you, hope you can make it happen! What areas of occupations are most appealing and available to you? Travel guide, life-coach....? Etc. Are you currently an architect of the Mind, or actually in that profession?

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Unread 11-22-2016, 11:13 AM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

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thanks for your answer seriously i have now idea whats the meaning of this stellium....
my chiron is in 6th btw..
good point about ayrton senna (im a big fan) ,but ayrton had a completely different natal chart and life than me.
he was aries with aquarius rising while im a full capricorn i have 4 planets and rising in capricorn
I know, it's just I find Saturn Capricorn 12th a very striking combination, that's why I mentioned it.
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  #10  
Unread 11-22-2016, 06:08 PM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

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Personal hopes and dreams can be considered H12, and Capricorn is known as an ambitious Sign. And that Moon in Scorp Conjunct Pluto in H9, which is also about hopes and dreams, but includes others as well! All those wild and crazy feelings you have to control and channel into something (materially) successful! More power to you, hope you can make it happen! What areas of occupations are most appealing and available to you? Travel guide, life-coach....? Etc. Are you currently an architect of the Mind, or actually in that profession?


no. mad architect its just a nickname.

im doing jobs that i dont like,for living .at the moment and since a teenager
never had the chance to do what i like for living(it is normal) economically we live in very very rough ages..

i have tendency for music and acting, mostly music and sound engineering or anything studio music production related
but you know times have changed .....

being a musician or even actor its tough its really tough...
now what is my future and what im going to end up doing as a profession?
i have no idea seriously, im hella unsure about my future

Last edited by MadArchitect; 11-22-2016 at 08:54 PM.
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Unread 11-22-2016, 06:10 PM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

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I know, it's just I find Saturn Capricorn 12th a very striking combination, that's why I mentioned it.



hey no worries
i got your meaning you re right saturn influence and especially in 12th its hella intense ....
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Unread 11-22-2016, 06:29 PM
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hey no worries
i got your meaning you re right saturn influence and especially in 12th its hella intense ....
I'm already wondering about the effects of Saturn Transiting Capricorn in a couple of years. Whatever it will be like, you'll be feeling it for sure! I'm wondering if Cap Suns get any immunity from a Saturn-Return in Capricorn, or if it's just the reverse.

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Unread 11-22-2016, 06:37 PM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

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I'm already wondering about the effects of Saturn Transiting Capricorn in a couple of years. Whatever it will be like, you'll be feeling it for sure! I'm wondering if Cap Suns get any immunity from a Saturn-Return in Capricorn, or if it's just the reverse.
im pretty sure it will not be a very pleasant experience(for me) or a walk in the park for sure....

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Unread 11-23-2016, 01:38 AM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

Hi,

Your natal 12th house contains only one personal planet, the Sun. This could mean that 12th-house issues (introspection, taking the time to think about yourself/ life/ your own weaknesses and failures) are your focus in life. Since the other two planets are not personal planets really, you might not be a recluse or want to work in a mental institution.

You might come across as a bit cool and aloof in the first instance, which is basically because of your Capricorn Asc. and Sun, and, yes, because the Asc. ruler, Saturn, is in the 12th house and your Sun, too. Therefore, you do need your retreat and just being by yourself, too. That said, the Moon and Venus (both are personal planets) want to actually be amongst people and out there in society. You actually might even love being amongst friends/ groups.

Could I ask what you do for a career wise?
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Unread 11-23-2016, 01:51 AM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

Kind of what Aquarius7000 said, you only have one personal planet in the 12th house. Neptune and Saturn are generational planets so they don't really mean much personally. Saturn and Neptune kind of blend into your 12th house too. Neptune naturally fits in the 12th house and Saturn joys in the 12th house traditionally. If you had Mars or Mercury in there then maybe you would feel the 12th house more prominently.

Besides, You have planets all around your chart; they aren't set in a particular spot.

Being a Capricorn person, no matter where your planets are, is going to make you ambitious; especially, in aspect to Pluto. Pluto and the Moon are also conjunct the MC which also generates a lot of ambition and desire to be successful and to seek recognition.
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Unread 11-23-2016, 03:41 AM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

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Originally Posted by MadArchitect View Post
i mentioned previous life

Because 12th house has to do with karma,not to mention saturn(planet of karma)
Here its in rulling position(capricorn)
and in 12th,so it can be a possibility..
The 12th house and Saturn have to do with karma only in certain astrological systems. Not in mine, not in traditional western astrology. Often invoking "karma" is just an excuse for blaming one's unhappiness on an unproven notion with zero evidence to support it.

A good rule of pragmatic modern astrology is to focus on understanding this life first.

Saturn above all is the planet of material, concrete practicality. In Saturn's world, 2+2=4, no matter how much we might want 2+2 to equal 5.
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I thought we went along paths--but it seems there are no paths. The going itself is the path.
C.S. Lewis, Perelandra.

Life is not about finding yourself. Life is about creating yourself. Message on a refrigerator magnet.

Last edited by waybread; 11-23-2016 at 03:43 AM.
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Unread 11-23-2016, 10:10 PM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

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Hi,

Your natal 12th house contains only one personal planet, the Sun. This could mean that 12th-house issues (introspection, taking the time to think about yourself/ life/ your own weaknesses and failures) are your focus in life. Since the other two planets are not personal planets really, you might not be a recluse or want to work in a mental institution.

You might come across as a bit cool and aloof in the first instance, which is basically because of your Capricorn Asc. and Sun, and, yes, because the Asc. ruler, Saturn, is in the 12th house and your Sun, too. Therefore, you do need your retreat and just being by yourself, too. That said, the Moon and Venus (both are personal planets) want to actually be amongst people and out there in society. You actually might even love being amongst friends/ groups.

Could I ask what you do for a career wise?


im doing jobs that i dont like for living.

i ve studied sound engineer and stuff about music,im playing some guitar and bass
i ve also finished computer science
and i i ve watched some acting lessons-seminars

but i stopped doing everything of the above because...

that moment i was at my early 20's and i was about to start doing something hopefull in my life i was motivated....
Then suddenly economic crisis crashed my country and i had the obligation to move into another country...(that i dont like)

and here i am now. doing jobs that i dont like and have completely loss any motivation that i had, to do so something special in my life.

january 3 im about to turn 28 sometimes i wonder how the heck i will turn my life around....
i need a miracle.

sometimes i feel old, and go like" dude leave it you have grown now,what do you really expect to do?making a miracle in your 30's and then end up getting recognition at your 40's or even 50 "s?
Such a late bloomer....


Sometimes i feel like i have accomplished zero things in my life, while at the same i realize that im a young smart guy
who can really change things if he wants it,

but the main problem is that im hella unsure what career profession would be the best for me,i have serious problems choosing and define my path in life.

the only thing that helps is that im a quick learner.
my learning skills sometimes are above average.

Last edited by MadArchitect; 11-24-2016 at 06:43 AM.
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Unread 11-23-2016, 10:12 PM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

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The 12th house and Saturn have to do with karma only in certain astrological systems. Not in mine, not in traditional western astrology. Often invoking "karma" is just an excuse for blaming one's unhappiness on an unproven notion with zero evidence to support it.

A good rule of pragmatic modern astrology is to focus on understanding this life first.

Saturn above all is the planet of material, concrete practicality. In Saturn's world, 2+2=4, no matter how much we might want 2+2 to equal 5.
i dont blame saturn or karma for what i ve been through
i think i am responsible about my fate,but im also a bit unlucky
but anyways. life without troubles its like bread without butter...
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Unread 11-23-2016, 10:19 PM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

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Kind of what Aquarius7000 said, you only have one personal planet in the 12th house. Neptune and Saturn are generational planets so they don't really mean much personally. Saturn and Neptune kind of blend into your 12th house too. Neptune naturally fits in the 12th house and Saturn joys in the 12th house traditionally. If you had Mars or Mercury in there then maybe you would feel the 12th house more prominently.

Besides, You have planets all around your chart; they aren't set in a particular spot.

Being a Capricorn person, no matter where your planets are, is going to make you ambitious; especially, in aspect to Pluto. Pluto and the Moon are also conjunct the MC which also generates a lot of ambition and desire to be successful and to seek recognition.


hey thanks for being honest and straightforward,i like people who tell the truth
im just brainwashed about the whole 12th house propaganda....
neptune and saturn indeed can work good in 12th house

there are so many astrological sites and astrologers
who tend to make people believe neptune or saturn or sun in 12th as the total disaster=

prison,drugs,alcohol,suicide,loneliness or agoraphobia paranoia(lol)
such a pessimistic distorted point of view......

Last edited by MadArchitect; 11-24-2016 at 07:44 PM.
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Unread 11-24-2016, 12:43 PM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

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...i ve studied sound engineer and stuff about music,im playing some guitar and bass
i ve also finished computer science
and i i ve watched some acting lessons-seminars...
First and foremost, at 27/28, not having a set career is absolutely not being a "late bloomer" at all. All the fields you have dabbled into and actually studied suit your chart, so you are already on the right path career-wise.

Let me share what I think you chart says to me. Scorpio MC (career line) with Mars as its ruler and in Aries, you need a job that will a) give you a lot of freedom and not tie you up to your desk, so no, a 9-5 job is not really for you. Perhaps one of the reasons you are even (unintentionally) doing many different jobs. A career in music (Mars-Venus trine), or something where you can manage yourself what you are doing (Aries Mars and Sco MC) is what suits your nature. Venus in Sag, music could be spiritual or foreign/unconventional (in the 11th house) in nature. Pure music, like a singer is not what I mean, but producing music could be the answer. Something where science is involved. You said you attended some acting classes. I can actually even see you doing that - Moon is on your MC (it wants recognition amongst people) and Venus trines MC ruler.
You also studied computer science, which absolutely also suits your nature because of all the Saturn energy through your Sun and Asc. I could almost imagine you with your own (or working for a company) music-production studio, where production happens on the computer.

Also, do not get frustrated or think that you are unlucky. You have Saturn Sun and Asc., which means a slight delay often in settling in life. I have seen many, many times, so simply have patience and keep trying, but with a positive attitude.
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  #21  
Unread 11-24-2016, 07:39 PM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

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First and foremost, at 27/28, not having a set career is absolutely not being a "late bloomer" at all. All the fields you have dabbled into and actually studied suit your chart, so you are already on the right path career-wise.

Let me share what I think you chart says to me. Scorpio MC (career line) with Mars as its ruler and in Aries, you need a job that will a) give you a lot of freedom and not tie you up to your desk, so no, a 9-5 job is not really for you. Perhaps one of the reasons you are even (unintentionally) doing many different jobs. A career in music (Mars-Venus trine), or something where you can manage yourself what you are doing (Aries Mars and Sco MC) is what suits your nature. Venus in Sag, music could be spiritual or foreign/unconventional (in the 11th house) in nature. Pure music, like a singer is not what I mean, but producing music could be the answer. Something where science is involved. You said you attended some acting classes. I can actually even see you doing that - Moon is on your MC (it wants recognition amongst people) and Venus trines MC ruler.
You also studied computer science, which absolutely also suits your nature because of all the Saturn energy through your Sun and Asc. I could almost imagine you with your own (or working for a company) music-production studio, where production happens on the computer.

Also, do not get frustrated or think that you are unlucky. You have Saturn Sun and Asc., which means a slight delay often in settling in life. I have seen many, many times, so simply have patience and keep trying, but with a positive attitude.



i agree with all of the above and thank you for your answer

the midheaven ruler though its Pluto and NOT mars

Mars its co-ruler of scorpio not the main ruler ,the main ruler is Pluto

Mars represents his true nature by the sign of Aries not of scorpio


looking at my chart though i found these


Acting=jupiter of taurus opposite MC jupiter oppositing MC is a typicall actors aspect
12th house stellium also indicates actors

Music-12th house stellium,Venus in Saggitarius


Computer science-Mercury in aquarius on 1st

Music production-sound enginnering=Mercury in aquarius on 1st plus 12th house stellium


my midheaven is in scorpio degree though (20)

and moon of scorpio is in libra degree(17)

pluto of scorpio in taurus degree(14)


ruler of 5th house on 1st can also indicate creativity music arts or something like that ?

Last edited by MadArchitect; 11-24-2016 at 09:04 PM.
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Unread 11-24-2016, 10:26 PM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

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i agree with all of the above and thank you for your answer

the midheaven ruler though its Pluto and NOT mars

Mars its co-ruler of scorpio not the main ruler ,the main ruler is Pluto

Mars represents his true nature by the sign of Aries not of scorpio...
One cannot assert that Pluto is THE ruler of Scorpio and Mars the co-ruler. I follow traditional rulers and have almost ("almost" as I do not like to sound to certain) always had excellent results with them. In my opinion, Uranus, Neptune and Pluto are too impersonal in nature and generational to indicate and reflect the personal nature of the native through rulerships. However, if you go by modern rulers, that is your prerogative.
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looking at my chart though i found these

Acting=jupiter of taurus opposite MC jupiter oppositing MC is a typicall actors aspect
It all depends on what Jupiter rules in the chart, and what the career house indicates.

Quote:
12th house stellium also indicates actors

Music-12th house stellium,Venus in Saggitarius
Yes, correct to quite an extent. However, Venus in Sag has little to do with Music per se.

Quote:
Computer science-Mercury in aquarius on 1st
That and also the fact that Sun and Asc. are in Cap, which lends an aptitude for numbers. Aquarius Mercury in aspect to Aries Mars also promotes Science.
Quote:
ruler of 5th house on 1st can also indicate creativity music arts or something like that ?
Yes, and especially if the signs on the 5th house are Leo, Gemini, Pisces, but less if the signs are Capricorn or Virgo for instance.
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  #23  
Unread 11-25-2016, 05:17 AM
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Originally Posted by MadArchitect View Post
hello dear members,
im just wondering what the meaning of the stellium in my natal chart?

first of all let me get this cleared,

never had any psychological problems in my life ,never got hospitalized
no mental and physicall issues, and nothing self-destructive is going on with me.

i dont do drugs and im not drinking.

im not interested to work behind the scenes,
not working in institution, and have nothing 12th house related going on that indicates the typicall
12th house "serve or suffer" stereotype or the victim mentality.

(all of the above are the 12th house stereotypes.....)

on the contrary i always wanted to do a job that allows me to be in the spotlight and have contact with people.




so i wonder how comes and i have this stellium in 12th house and not in 1st?

i have to admit though that at first i may get mistaken as closed character because im not opening up myself directly into others
because of trust issues

but once i get the feeling that the people around me are fine to deal with and trust.
im opening myself without second thought,



Truth is, i ve been through a lot difficult times and troubles since the very beginning in my life .

i faced many obstacles since a little kid and had some issues with family-parents
and i was generally unlucky in the beggining of my life.

but nothing to worry to the point to feel that my life is doomed and needs to be end.
i ve seen people dealing with even worse situations than what i had dealt with.



im not looking for compliments

every opinion is accepted even if does not describe me

im just wondering what does this stellium indicate about me?
It would make sense if it was in 1st house instead of 12th..


because all i look for in this life, is success and recognition.
Why the asteroids? Keep the chart simple.
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  #24  
Unread 11-25-2016, 05:27 AM
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

Neptune is an outer planet but Neptune looks close to the sun, or is my eyes deceiving me?
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Unread 11-25-2016, 06:58 AM
MadArchitect MadArchitect is offline
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Re: Whats the meaning of my 12th house stellium in capricorn?

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Originally Posted by aquarius7000 View Post
One cannot assert that Pluto is THE ruler of Scorpio and Mars the co-ruler. I follow traditional rulers and have almost ("almost" as I do not like to sound to certain) always had excellent results with them. In my opinion, Uranus, Neptune and Pluto are too impersonal in nature and generational to indicate and reflect the personal nature of the native through rulerships. However, if you go by modern rulers, that is your prerogative.
It all depends on what Jupiter rules in the chart, and what the career house indicates.

Yes, correct to quite an extent. However, Venus in Sag has little to do with Music per se.


That and also the fact that Sun and Asc. are in Cap, which lends an aptitude for numbers. Aquarius Mercury in aspect to Aries Mars also promotes Science.

Yes, and especially if the signs on the 5th house are Leo, Gemini, Pisces, but less if the signs are Capricorn or Virgo for instance.


Yeah i find scorpios anything else except martian...

Scorpio people are very calculating,deep,analytic,observers,dark,mysteriou s, and somehow
they think and analyze too much before they take action,

They also have tendency to remember everything and seek revenge.

All these traits dont look martian more like pluto.
Only by looking at them they scream hell-underworld-hades...

for me true martians the warriors of the zodiac are Aries people.

they are the most fearless brave people i ve ever met,they are the heroes of tge zodiac
They are impatient ,assertive aggresive ,they have no time to plot revenge or analyze a situation
they go to action without second thought

Thats the true nature of mars. Raw warrior like fast,aggresive,assertive, not hidden and behind the scenes and curtains like scorpio..



Jupiter opposite MC is an aspect that has been found a lot in actors charts
its a typicall acting aspect


Venus in Saggitarius gives love for everything beautifull and artistic

But degrees i believe play a major role in all of these.

Aquarians always very stylish and popular and very good musicians too
they are also masterminds..

Last edited by MadArchitect; 11-25-2016 at 07:07 AM.
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