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  #1  
Unread 01-25-2011, 01:12 AM
BONZO BONZO is offline
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septiles and noviles

What is the meaning of septiles and noviles and what orb do you use?
I have:
Mars binovile mercury / venus
Mercury / venus septile north node
Sun biseptile mars
Mars triseptile pluto

Can anyone shed some light on these placements
And also let me know of how your septiles and noviles have played out in your life?

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  #2  
Unread 01-25-2011, 09:19 PM
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Re: septiles and noviles

In a nutshell, forget them........they are at best minor and I dont ever use them........concentrate on your major aspects is my advice and okay semi squares and semi sextiles if they are really close in orb. Inconjuncts I also use...
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  #3  
Unread 01-27-2011, 05:04 AM
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Re: septiles and noviles

Thats a shame Claire as I have an exact mercury / venus binovile mars in a chart with the rest only multiple squares and inconjuncts to mars. I"ve heard the novile is a pleasant aspect though I haven"t been able to garner any info on it, I was hoping for something positive thing to come out of my mars

Last edited by BONZO; 01-27-2011 at 06:33 AM.
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Unread 10-15-2011, 10:36 PM
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Smile Re: septiles and noviles

My apologies if I offend any senior or seasoned astrologers; however, I completely disagree that harmonics are not important.

I consider major aspects -- common, and minor aspects -- uncommon and usage seems to be based on their popularity and astrologer's knowledge of what those aspects do. Harmonics are uncommon and unpopular (at this time) and there's little knowledge about them so they tend not to be used by astrologers; however, that doesn't mean they are not useful -- they are.

To suggest that something in the native is unimportant, does not make sense to me. Everything about YOU is important, even the tiniest of detail says my Virgo stellium in the 8th. :P

I have Mercury Septile Jupiter (I'm a metaphysical, philosophical, and spiritual author, teacher, communicator, etc), Uranus Septile Neptune (I'm a psychic tarot reader and astrologer), and Sun Septile Uranus (I'm really quirky and different, personality-wise). I also have Venus triseptile North Node (NN), and Mars tri-septile Ascendant (Asc).

Here's some websites to look at that focus or touch upon Septiles:
http://www.universalastrologer.com/septile.html
http://aliceportman.com/?p=326
http://members.wizzards.net/~magyan/Mercury_Aspects.html

What have you found?

And trust your gut about how your Mars bi-septile will open you up to a world of possibilities and enhanced confidence in the knowledge that there's something divinely special about you. :-) And best wishes with your quest for harmonic knowledge.

Abella "Jucy" Arthur

Last edited by Jucy; 10-15-2011 at 10:43 PM. Reason: Clarity & additional info.
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  #5  
Unread 10-16-2011, 12:52 AM
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Re: septiles and noviles

Minor aspects are important, but mostly I leave them out unless I see them as midpoints of other aspects or other aspects as midpointing them. If you have a square with 2 semisquares or a biquintile with 2 quintiles that becomes very important, but I don't know much about minor aspects otherwise because I don't have any.
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Unread 10-16-2011, 03:25 AM
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Re: septiles and noviles

Hi Rebel Uranian!!

Who began calling Harmonics minor?
To me, they are MAJOR.

And how are semi-squares or semi-anything minor?
To me, they are just not always present. Meaning, the *issue* is not always present. I have a lot of semi's. Semi-sextile, semi-squares, etc.. I feel them.

And if an astrologer didn't use them when giving me a consultation, they might miss out on some of the "finer points" about my character and life. Then again, I believe that whatever is given at any one time is useful to one's development so that's kind of a mute point!

Actually, instead of calling them "minor", how about calling them "fine aspects"?

I think harmonics are left out or diminished because those astrologers don't know what to do with them, what they mean, or how to use them. That's my thought, anyway.
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  #7  
Unread 10-16-2011, 07:25 AM
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Re: septiles and noviles

I'm convinced Septiles are something to be considered Major...but not exactly sure what.
The chart I have in the Degree Forum that I have proposed is that of Jesus/Yeshua has Septiles...quite a story there... if you're at all interested then, read it there as I try not to drag Sabian Symbology into the other sub-forums too often...it upsets a lot of people here that don't want to address their veracity.
Dane Rudhyar [and Layla Rael ...his wife] 's book "Astrological Aspects. A Process Oriented Approach", states; "Little is known about the Septile. Marc Jones calls it 'An aspect of Fatality' " [again; read the above thread of mine, that I suggested, for more on that.]
...you do know that the slope of the Great Pyramid is the same degree as the Septile...don't you...or not? If not, there's something ..a clue...you may want to explore.
Now, about noviles [this is really amazing as I wrote extensively on both septiles and noviles the last two nights and ...filed them...to do something with them someday...I was in a conversation via e-mail with sdh3 about Sabian Symbols in sequences... particularly the Pentagrams ...as per sdh3's thread on Movie Scripts found in Pentagram matrices.]. They are produced by dividing the 360 degrees by 40.
The Pentagram is produced by dividing the 360 degrees by 72. The numbers 40 and 72 are of the most profoundly symbolic numbers of the 'Divine' from 1 to 100.
72 names of God, 72 Angels of the Quinaries [Quintiles]...etc...etc.
40 days of fasting in the desert, 40 years of wandering the desert, 40 days and nights of rain, Abdul Baha's 40 years of imprisonment in the town of Akka [which means 'Womb'] which was in a cell 40 steps down...9 mos of pregnancy is 40 weeks in the womb. [I lived in the historic [1875] Folsom Hotel when I 'put it all together' with the aforementioned birth chart of Jesus/Yeshua in room 13 which was 40 steps 'UP' from the street. ...just saying...]
It symbolizes 'Birth'...or 'Rebirth'. [In Vedic/Hindu lore 40 has to do with the Yugas also...but in that sense it's about hundreds, thousands or tens of thousand of years.]
I'm going to quote a great deal of the text from the aforementioned book here at this point. I do not care to count the words as per the limit imposed here. It is too important a message, IMHO, to be concerned about that. The mods will, no doubt, edit it and I'll be reprimanded...sobeit. I hope you get a chance to read this before that happens. If you're too late...get a copy of the book by Dane and Layla.

[bear in mind...you're dealing with three trines in a nonagon...]

" ...raises the meaning of Three to a higher level. At the level of Three the human being discovers and envisions the meaning and purpose of what he or she experiences, and orients [themself] toward the fulfillment of this meaning and purpose. At the level of the Nine, the individualized person discovers and envisions the meaning and purpose of what he or she is. The trine leads to planning for action; the novile[when at all operative in an individuals life] leads to personal rebirth-or 'Initiation'-to a basic identification of the self with the purpose this self is seen to have within the harmony of the universal Whole.
The novile thus represents the level at which complete fulfillment of individual being is possible-either as an end in itself [negative approach] or as the condition for positive emergence into an altogether new and higher realm of being [beginning with number 10]. Thus number Nine is the number of a fulfilled period of gestation...the presence of noviles - or of one strongly emphasized novile - in a chart shows that the individual may come to realize, that the entire personality is a womb or matrix from which a 'higher' being - a spiritually conscious self - should emerge. Christian mystics speak of the birth of the Christ-child within the heart as the central experience of the spiritual life. In a less exalted sense, every aspect based on 40* increments brings the possibility [not the certainty] of some 'birth out of captivity', some emergence into a Promised Land, whatever it be within the personality that is held captive, wandering in the desert of unconsciousness and spiritual aridity. The two planets in novile aspect indicate the psychological functions which establish through their relationship the matrix-field from which the act of spiritual liberation or rebirth may occur.
For example, in the birth chart of the Persian prophet, Baha'u'llah, who claimed to be a manifestation of God, the Sun and the Moon are 42* apart. This, in a sense, a very wide novile, as in most cases no more than a degree and a half should be allowed for this aspect; but the Moon may be exactly 40* from the Ascendant, and such an aspect would be characteristic. If a man is actually to be considered a physical incorporation of divinty, then it would be logical to expect the Sun and the Moon -the two basic vital powers-to be novile at the time of his birth."

[...my Sun and Moon are an, almost, exact bi-novile ...i.e 80 degrees...I don't know what that means yet...but it can't be bad...I figure. ptv]

Mohandas Gandhi...12th house Sun to 1st house Mars = 39 1/2* [interesting as Mohandas was the numero uno promoter of non-violence in the 20th Century.]

Albert Schweitzer ...11th house Venus to 1st house Sun = 40*

Alice Bailey...Sun to Uranus = 40*

...ptv
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Last edited by piercethevale; 10-16-2011 at 08:09 AM.
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  #8  
Unread 10-19-2011, 07:16 AM
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Talking Re: septiles and noviles

Interesting stuff piercethevale. Just learned about the great pyramid connection tonight! Not sure what that means yet but very cool...

I also have noviles and deciles too.
Here's my noviles...

Sun Novile Moon

Sun QuadNovile (also known as quadrinovile) North Node
Moon QuadNovile North Node
Mars QuadNovile North Node
Saturn Bi-novile North Node

Mercury Bi-novile Neptune
Jupiter QuadNovile Chiron

The less popular harmonics answer my questions around destiny and what I'm meant to do when the so-called majors and minors do not. These aforementioned aspects are very good and useful but tend to answer the basic day-to-day life questions. The higher harmonics, however, answer questions around one's *life purpose*. At least that's my opinion. So if you are reading this (whoever you are) and you feel like you have a *destiny* but you don't know what it is or you want to engage in *extreme* self-development, you may want to know what to look to the higher harmonics to help you reach your answer.
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  #9  
Unread 10-19-2011, 07:33 AM
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Re: septiles and noviles

Hi Jucy...I never had time [or really...an inclination] to even really understand what is meant by 'Harmonics'...I do know that astrodienst's chart maker won't include Septiles...I wrote and asked the admin. if they might possibly consider it in the future and got a very rude reply that started out as: "Don't you dare preach to us...," and then went on to explain that I could determine septiles by generating a Harmonics chart which they do provide if requested...[I don't understand how that works ...I never got around to studying the 'Harmonics' thing...just so much I have time that's free....{well, I'm retired...so I have a lot...but, I've got plenty on my plate..}
You might be interested to know that I have a theory...['Theory'..in that it hasn't been recognized by anyone in the Astro-world...but, my clairvoyant...and she's top notch...says I've nailed it] on the application of musical tonality to the Zodiac...[of which there have been many attempts in the past ...even by the likes of Sir Issac Newton...but no one was able to figure it out]...it is based on semi-septiles...and again...IT WORKS ...it's buried in some thread or threads here at astrologyweekly...I've also got it at ACTastrology.com here: http://actastrology.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=177

...see what you think of it....
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Unread 10-19-2011, 08:04 AM
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Re: septiles and noviles

Hi Jucy

i have never viewed Semi-squares and sesisquadrates as minor aspects after all they are part of 8th harmonic family if you run all your major events through 8th harmonic aspect, each one of the crystal clear.

Each harmonic describes certain traits of a native it is sort of like sorting a pile of aspects into different categories

8th harmonic is most commonly used among astrologers who practice harmonics because 8th harmonic shows the action/events in predictive astrology

5th harmonic shows you your talents cretive and scientific
7th harmonic is related to music more than anything else.

http://www.astrology3d.com/harmonics.html

Novile is part of 9th harmonic family which is used in vedic
Sun/moon novile 40 deg aspect 1 deg orb - is a person who feels comfortable in his/her own skin but has a tough time understanding if the other person is not feeling that and tries to help to teach the other how to love self.

I personally use all harmonics and midpoints

cheers
T


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jucy View Post
Hi Rebel Uranian!!

Who began calling Harmonics minor?
To me, they are MAJOR.

And how are semi-squares or semi-anything minor?
To me, they are just not always present. Meaning, the *issue* is not always present. I have a lot of semi's. Semi-sextile, semi-squares, etc.. I feel them.

And if an astrologer didn't use them when giving me a consultation, they might miss out on some of the "finer points" about my character and life. Then again, I believe that whatever is given at any one time is useful to one's development so that's kind of a mute point!

Actually, instead of calling them "minor", how about calling them "fine aspects"?

I think harmonics are left out or diminished because those astrologers don't know what to do with them, what they mean, or how to use them. That's my thought, anyway.
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  #11  
Unread 10-19-2011, 08:53 AM
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Re: septiles and noviles

...well, I'm just thankful I don't have to consider bi-sextiles or homo-sextiles for that matter...I ain't in to Trine none of that...
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Unread 05-30-2012, 09:41 AM
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Re: septiles and noviles

I'm not a professional astrologer,but with all of the looking around that I've done I've developed the belief that septiles and noviles of all types
(as well as many other aspects that have been labeled as minor and uninfluential) must have a significant impact on an individual....

I have in my chart....

Moon BiNovile Mercury You are an effective communicator on subjects of personal concern. You have a knack for making others feel
welcome and accepted. You can use this gift as a counselor, teacher, parent, and in many other areas of life.

Sun Novile Pluto Rejoicing in self-punishment and self-belittlement; rejoicing in revealing oneself to the world &warts and all


Mercury Biseptile MCThe more clearly you express yourself, the more successful
your career becomes. Share your ideas with the world at large
and circulate your information, particularly with a bit of
humor.You could achieve a degree of public success in connection
with mental activities.

http://www.thefutureminders.com/astr...glish-m-bt.cfm


Moon Biseptile Jupiter
You live with a faith you can�t explain or understand, and yet you are unwavering. You know there is a higher force at work in your life; you feel it, and as you look back you recognize its guidance throughout your life. Your knowing can inspire others, and you may be regarded as a sage or wise one. Your attitude is typically quite positive.

http://members.wizzards.net/~magyan/Moon_Aspects.html


Pluto Biseptile AscRuthless, cruel, irresistible, awe-inspiring (but the ruthlessness may be turned on oneself as well as on others)

http://www.12sign.cn/bbs/archiver/?tid-5617.html


Uranus septile Desc.Thrilling, brilliant, wild, shocking, rebellious, a law unto oneself

Jupiter Binovile Saturn Rejoicing in the ability to combine freedom with acceptance of one's fate, and to achieve freedom within one's prescribed role.


Mercury Biseptile Saturn Inspired by the idea of controlling and disciplining the mind, and of thinking and communicating in a down-to-earth and practical way; inspired by the idea of scientific proof and experimentation, and of belief systems that limit one's freedom of thought; inspired to communicate one's limitations and obligations, and those of other people.


Saturn triseptile MCBowed down by burdens, faithful, loyal; bearing the sorrows of the world.

Sun novile Venus: The request here is to overcome your restrictions to manifest self-enhancement. So if you actually have a Sun Novile Venus, the request here is to be more self-loving and allow the Sun to shine on your Venus — perhaps over-the-top self-loving, and unabashed ego. This is your destiny, if you will.






The novile:
http://john-sandbach.blogspot.com/20...le-aspect.html
http://www.linda-goodman.com/ubb/For...ML/201926.html
http://www.matthewsastrology.com/sam...Highlights.pdf

Various aspects:
http://tribes.tribe.net/astrology_of...3-8c3c5bb9305b
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  #13  
Unread 12-26-2013, 06:42 AM
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Re: septiles and noviles

Hello!
About noviles:
1. They are not "nice" aspects, unfortunately.. Noviles and their derivatives belong to "Karmic group" of aspects. I will post about karmic aspects on my site soon, but in short, karmic group consists of Noviles (40, 80) and a Sentagon (100 degrees). They have to do with "life changing" events (usually very important ones ), and are used in predictive astrology, - they HAVE to be triggered! So right now you have "indication" of karmic event possibility, which when triggered, will only play out negatively if there's a trigger. Noviles in transits indicate a strong emotional response; it's a stressful aspect with intensity almost like in opposition. It's called Karmic because it doesn't give it's recipient a choice and forces acceptance of circumstances;if it involves melefics such as Mars or Saturn it makes it all the worse. Benefic planets in Noviles give philosophical life views, patience and ability to be content with very little.. Sun in Virgo Noviles Neptune in Cancer in Mother Theresa's chart. Moon in Cancer Noviles Mars in Libra in movie stars chart Marlene Ditrich. For the last years of her life due to agoraphobia she wasn't able to leave her house, her activity (Mars) was doomed to be confined at home (Moon) - please note there might be different manifestation of this aspect depending of your individual chart. There are no cookie cutters in astrology, one shoe won't fit all.
***Of note***
The orb for such aspects is 1,5 degrees between Luminaries, and 1 degree between planets.

2 Septiles are not used by me in primary directions, as they dont indicate events, however as 7 harmonic they indicate the "spiritual" -- in transits they mean a stage of Cleansing. During such transits (or when your natal Septiles are being triggered by another planet) we have a strong feelings of "it's not right", our consciousness speaking up; religious feelings and feelings of strong faith, responsibility and ethics; and the Septiles tell us very strongly, without any ado, what we should be doing and what we shouldn't (in no circumstances), so in this sense we receive spiritual guidance from our highest self. On the positive side it can manifest strongly (such as resistance to unethical behavior) , because there's strong feeling of direction in "knowing what to do" and the idealism of what is right. On the negative there's sharp feeling of duty; possible guilt; exaggerated feeling of righteousness.
Astrodetective.com

Last edited by VeryVenus; 12-26-2013 at 06:58 AM.
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Unread 12-26-2013, 11:15 PM
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Re: septiles and noviles

On the form side, “harmonics” and “minors” are the same thing, just the display is, respectively changed from a mathematical construct (not resembling the solar system’s physical space but helpful for research in the pre-computer age) to (roughly) the manner in which they are positioned in physical space.
I don’t feel much pull to study “harmonics” as a system for reasons such as that I want to see in one wheel graphic how the minors and majors connect (e.g., a 180 is statistically probably twice as likely to be affected by a planet lying 72 and 108 degrees from each end as it is to be affected by a planet apex/midpointing and just tweaking your aspect set to show minors mixed in with majors shows this readily while a harmonic chart will not.
On the substance side, my fuzzdar flares up at the ubiquitous net use of “mystic” and similar words for the septile family aspects for many reasons (e.g., their fuzziness is anti-conductive to research activities aiming at proof/disproof and they are useless for counseling a “standard native,” such as a businessperson not interested in spiritual help. More useful (though by no means fully satisfactory) adjectives have been proposed by many in this or other astro forums based on their own experiences (e.g., obsessive, over-reactive, etc).
As for novile family aspects (40, 80 and 160) and semi-novile family aspects (20, 100 and 140), my observations are not confirming a dark side (such as explained by VeryVenus) but, rather, something more along the lines of a super-trine (perhaps too refined for the native to always know its there but instead an ability/facility so easily surging as to send one into a dervish whirlwind of joyous energy). Sorry for the poorly-crafted imagery but, e.g., in the case of Bonzo’s Merc/Ven novile Mars (if isolated from other aspects) a non-negative oversupply of projective but soft mental energy could be experienced such as could make someone a favored speaker.
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Unread 12-27-2013, 02:12 AM
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Exclamation Re: septiles and noviles

Quote:
Originally Posted by Krewster View Post
As for novile family aspects (40, 80 and 160) and semi-novile family aspects (20, 100 and 140), my observations are not confirming a dark side (such as explained by VeryVenus) but, rather, something more along the lines of a super-trine (perhaps too refined for the native to always know its there but instead an ability/facility so easily surging as to send one into a dervish whirlwind of joyous energy). Sorry for the poorly-crafted imagery but, e.g., in the case of Bonzo’s Merc/Ven novile Mars (if isolated from other aspects) a non-negative oversupply of projective but soft mental energy could be experienced such as could make someone a favored speaker.
I wanted to ask you for examples of your "observations" - for example, I provided two specific examples (which can be all traced to astrotheme, however dual chart needs to be displayed to illustrate specific TRANSITS I was talking about.). Where are your examples of specific "observations"?.. You speak of Bonzo's Merc/Ven novile Mars is a novile - first of all are you referring to John Bonham's chart? I just looked it up and I only see a Novile from Mars to Uranus, there's no noviles to Mercury. (Please specify so I can look it up, thanks! Also what is the date a mentioned "speaker position" was offered to him? )


...as I stated, a Novile can manifest in other "karmic" events, all of which will seem fated "events" -- NEVER JUST "JOYOUS ENERGY". When we interpret natal horoscope, it's OK to go about interpreting traits but when it comes to Noviles and "novile family", they show actual events that seem "fated" - we are talking about triggered astrological events, such as transits or primary directions...if you have natal Novile, it's triggered the same way: through planets in transits or in symbolic directions. It does not surround you as "joyous energy" all your life, like a cocoon. No super-trine of this nature exists!.

***
To address number 40 this is a mystical number - there are 40 weeks in pregnancy, and in the folklore the soul wanders about the Earth for 40 days before transcending. The Bible mentions that the wordly Flood has lasted 40 days; there are 40 days til Christ's resurrection. (can anybody else remember more examples of number 40?) There's predominant theme of "creation of something bigger than YOU", which I simply cannot see as "super-trine" (a trine is a harmony in a relationship and "pure joy" as well as esthetics, luxury and beauty, but if we were to dissect it, Venus which symbolizes the aspect trine, gives passiveness and inactivity which is concomitant to female nature of Venus; as well as sensuality, love, and everything connected with sensory system such as music).

Novile is a Karmic aspect in connection of fatality , it gives a person a certain program showing NATURE-LIKE necessity and inability to avoid your "karmic lesson". Just like during influence of Pluto ( a highly transformational planet), we have to sum up whether benefics/malefics are present; and a third point in play inside this aspect. So let's go for formal operations:

135=90+45 (Mars+Neptune) SEMISQUARE
100=40+60 (Pluto+Saturn) SENTAGON
80 = 40+40 (Pluto+Pluto) Bi-Novile. Pluto as we know actualizes the themes of the 8th house, which can sometimes be very painful. But Pluto has other meanings as well which cannot be ignored (Death. Sex. Legacies and HUGE RICHE$ such as lottery. Resources of your Partner. Inheritance. ECT)

And with the addition of the third point (for example):
120-40=80 (Venus+Pluto).

And now for the semi-novile:
20=60-40 (Saturn-Pluto)
160=120+40 (Venus+Pluto) - This one is one of the "best" noviles, giving the most benefits. Perhaps if we can take a look at the "Bonzo" chart (which I don't have an access to right now) we can observe it, or there are other "guilty parties" at play?

The orb of inluence is 1 degree for planets, and 1.5 degrees for Luminaries.

So by utilizing the mathematical tools I just provided, it's possible to put on your scholar hat and calculate YOURSELF a whole deluge of astrological (COMBINED) aspects! (Without having to open one book, mind you!).

Lets for example take a whole new look at Quincux!!! In the book " Psychodynamics of quincux" we read the following: "quincux or inconjunction symbolizes a different relationship of a person to himself and the world around him, which inevitably gives birth to self-limitations"

Now let's break down quincux and see what we get:
Mars (90)+ Saturn (60) = 150
Mars as initiative and action, meets "self imposed" limitation, and nevertheless achieves results, with Hard Work (Saturn). Let's not forget that Saturn is not only an old father figure but he is also the Great General and a Disciplinarian. He wants to "set you straight"!

Now, you can try your own interpretation.
But we can try a different formula - such as square plus sextile:
90+60 = 150
And once more we can take another view,
180 (opposition) - semisextile.
What do we see? That's right, we see two planets that function within stressful conditions. Quincux has the dynamics of Mrs, Mercury and Pluto and qualities of Aries, Virgo and Scorpio.

Let's formulate the rules of "combined aspects":
Aspect of Venus (120) cannot be interpreted as a sum of two aspects of Saturn or a sum of 3 aspects of Pluto, or a sum of Mars(90) and Mercury(30) - because the aspect of Venus is a MAJOR ASPECT and thus it has its own autonomous Meaning. You cannot dissect an aspect of Mars because he is also considered "basic aspect". Opposition consists of Uranus (150) and Mercury(30) - largest of basic aspects has "absorbed" the smaller 120 aspect of Venus, thus the preference is to 150+30(uranus+mercury) to 120+60 (venus+saturn).

So to sum it up, the rule of "Combined Aspects" should be formed from 5 of the smallest aspects of "major group" in multiples of 30 (Aspect of Mercury) , by means of absorption of smaller aspects by larger aspects.

For example to calculate a semisextile, TRY TO FORMULATE YOUR OWN FORMULAE AND LET ME KNOW WHAT DO THEY ALL HAVE IN COMMON?
THEN BASED ON THIS, CAN YOU GIVE ME AN INTERPRETATION?

__________
So all in all, yes, the opinions regarding these "minor aspects" vary from astrologer to astrologer; and regarding their "negative" or "positive" meaning we observe purely conditional meaning.

A new "combined aspect", formed from Pluto (40)+ Jupiter (72) = 112.

I dare you to check it out it's very interesting!

(let me add that Uranian astrology ignores completely the "aspects" focusing instead of Midpoint pictures. By analyzing aspects and midpoints we operate with THREE symbolic representation of the planet, each of which consist of their own characteristics, qualities, and meanings - which brings variability in interpretations). But now you are your own astrologer, and possess all the tools necessary to write your own interpretations, in all their range - the good, the bad, and the ugly.

At present time, we don't have one concrete aspect or midpoint that gives out exuberance of its entirety. Every planet has negative and positive qualities.
For example lets look at the Trine (120=Venus) of Mercury and Mars:
"Too Much mental energy. Great ability to express oneself, aspiring to form public opinion." (Reference from Astrological program Zet)

And now let's look at the midpoint: Ve=ME/MA.
Joy (Venus) from writing (Mercury), harmonious conversations(Mercury) about work(Mars), creative work in comminications such as reporting. (Reference to Udo Rudolf "ABC's of planetary pictures")

I hope the reader feels inspired and empowered from "dissecting" planetary aspects and midpoints to their very essence during analysis. \\yes, we are all guilty in labeling aspects 'super-bad' and 'super-good' based on our own experiences, while we need to be more subjective rather than one-sided; otherwise the reader will get limited idea from your "interpretational text", wherever you get it.\\

I urge you to learn more about aspects - major AND minor - because there's more to the aspects, than meets the eye.
VeryVenus.
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Unread 12-27-2013, 03:21 AM
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Re: septiles and noviles

Quote:
Originally Posted by BONZO View Post
What is the meaning of septiles and noviles and what orb do you use?
I have:
Mars binovile mercury / venus
Mercury / venus septile north node
Sun biseptile mars
Mars triseptile pluto

Can anyone shed some light on these placements
And also let me know of how your septiles and noviles have played out in your life?
I find noviles and binoviles very important in synastry and composite charts - I see them as spiritual aspects, a place where people connect on a soul/telepathic level. Some of my most powerful karmic relationships I've experienced had important novile aspects in the composites - connections I've had where we can hear each others thoughts and feel each others feelings from far away. I keep the orbs low - less than 2 degrees. They are particularly important when involving the ASC, Vesta, the Vertex, Mercury, or the Moon.

I haven't explored septiles very much yet, so can't comment.
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Unread 12-27-2013, 06:10 AM
VeryVenus VeryVenus is offline
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Re: septiles and noviles

You can post your respective charts .Correct - the way they will PLAY OUT is when triggered In transit or in progression by a third planet And will depend on the nature of the third planet (Whether it's benefic or malefic planet) And what house does it represent in your natal chart.
This said, bi Novile has a nature of Pluto(Please read my previous post). The theory of planet equals aspect is not new And was even adopted by the church of light in Los Angeles in 1932. However it assigned the moon very minor minor position of semi sextile. I adopted the Aspect system of C Carter Who assigns both sun and the moon number one. Mercury as a dual sign of Gemini number two. Venus number three. Mars number four. Jupiter number five. Saturn number six. Uranus number seven. Neptune number eight Pluto number nine. In this system we Must concede that the moon becomes the coruler of the Leo in the night's chart and the sun becomes a coruler of cancer in the day chart. The system becomes unique - giving us the key To the mystery of zodiac through numeric order, which begins at zero Leo. Here we have elements of pairs or diads, opposing in their meaning. So...
Sun/Moon - 0 - Conjunction 0
Mercury(30)+Uranus(150) -2-Opposition 180
Aspect of Venus 3 Trine. 120
Aspect of Mars 4 Square 90
Aspect of Jupiter five quintile 72
Aspect of Saturn 6 Sextile 60
Aspect of Uranus 7 septile 51 (Nervous nature)
Aspect of Pluto 8 Novile (40)
Aspect of mercury - semiSextile (30)

I hope that by experimenting, a reader can arrive that midpoints and aspects are identical in meaning If you can concentrate on the symbol of the planet Leaving out positivity or negativity of the aspect.
For example midpoint, Ma= Sa/Mo and lets take an aspect Saturn square Moon. We can write it down as Ma= Sa/Mo!!! Now as soon as Western astrologer hears the word "Square", immediately the "Red Radar" goes off prompting a negative interpretation. Astrologers of Harmburgs school are much wiser, giving us only concise descriptions of planetary manifestation. Moon = feeling or woman . Saturn - separation, disease and limitation. Mars - Action, work, decisiveness. As a result we get "lack of decisiveness, separation with a woman, emotional conflict between wanting to act and feelings of duty; an action taken based on self-control, work related separation. " We now have sewn together a few objective meanings without labels bad or good , and can feel the aspect more of a conflict between want and need; we see a slowing and limiting action of Saturn to Mars's wanting to act quickly and passionately.

Aspect of Saturn nature (sextile) connects 30° cancer with 30° Taurus. We can theorize that the qualities of Saturn (working hard, self discipline) bring about Harmony and Life's Comforts. Saturn= career. Venus=Money.
Aspect of Mars brings together 30° of cancer With 30° of Aries. We can interpret it as violence gives birth to violence or action Promotes An opposite reaction. And an opposition connects 30° of cancer with 30° Capricorn. Sudden Communication leads to Separation. In quincux we can see 150=60+90=30+120. So we can interpret it as Finding Solutions (Merc) to Welfare (Venus) that requires Constant (Saturn) Work (Mars).

I will talk about Uranus and Septiles some other time.

All in all, now you can find your own interpretation. The truth is encoded in the Zodiac. Usually the aspects are analyzed on primitive premise on good/bad without taking into account their natural planetary nature. You needed an Aspectarian book or a click/point software to tell you, how can things "play out". Well no more "headache". All you need is an old good book of Ptolemy!

When looking at the chart and the aspects really break down and dissect (or investigate) what planet does this aspect really boils down to? Then there will be more answers than questions.

VeryVenus
Astrodetective.com

Last edited by VeryVenus; 12-27-2013 at 06:33 AM.
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Unread 12-27-2013, 06:14 AM
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Re: septiles and noviles

You should get a copy of Dane Rudhyar and Leyla Rael's [Danes 4th and final wife] "Astrological Aspects. A Process Oriented Approach."

They sing high praise for the novile and wrote of understanding all aspects as divisions of the entire 360 degrees. Where as a Grand Semi-Sextile [Star of Solomon or Magen David] is a perfect 6 pointed star it does also represent 3 sets of oppositions and that oppositions are either that which concede to integration or resist and remain separations and this is of "the world of Life". The novile, although, represents three Grand Trines and this is of the "world of mind"... it is a rather complex explanation that I'm not in the best frame of being at the present to try to re-write and to do the authors justice it should be read as it is printed and I'm not of a disposition to be founded guilty of plagiarism or accused of copyright violation, even though I have challenged the long standing rule here on the basis that I do so for instructional purposes for Danes published work on the Sabian Symbols...and as Dane is deceased, I feel it is more than just okay, as His work should be actively promoted...but Leyla is quite alive and well and, as I have recently discovered, is also a very wonderful person dedicated to the memory of Dane [although she seems to have remarried as she currently goes by the name of Leyla Rudhyar Hill {no relation to Lynda Hill, according to Lynda}] and as I know of no other works authored by Leyla I'm quite sure she would appreciate it if I didn't just give Her hard work away for free. ...meaning...buy the book.

Dane and Leyla do mention the "Bab", Baha'u'llah [of the Baha'i faith] in the aforementioned book as to His Sun and Moon being just a tad more than 42* apart [saying it is over the 1 1/2 deg. orb of allowance but that the Moon in turn may be a perfect 40* from the ascendant, and that is characteristic of what They believe that the novile represents, which is a birthing process...a Spiritual rebirth...and that people with novile aspects between their natal Sun and Moon are those that Christian Mystics speak of as the birth of the Christ child within the {spiritual} heart [the Hridayam, in Sanskrit] ...I have natal Sun and Moon at 81* 10' apart, btw, for what that is worth. In another book by Dane, that I can't presently recall which of the many that he wrote He wrote of the "Bab" as having been imprisoned for some factor of 40 [weeks-years-months...I can't remember] and that He was in a dungeon that had 40 steps down {I lived in the old and historic, Folsom Hotel, when I was able to ascertain the natal chart that i wrote a book about in "A Template for the Time. the Astrological Birth Chart of Jesus" in room 13, 40 steps up...go figure...{?}
As I already posted in this thread a couple of years ago, I have written on the Septile and what Dane and Marc Edmond Jones estimations pertaining to it are and my own findings.

Buy Dane and Leyla's book... you will be glad you did.
Word Up!~
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Unread 12-27-2013, 06:20 AM
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piercethevale piercethevale is offline
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Re: septiles and noviles

Well, now...on having checked back in this thread a bit further, it seems that i did copy and post a good deal of the authors text... my bad... I guess I just wasted an hour basically saying the same thing.
Maybe it was for me to realize that I should apologize to Leyla for having done so.

...my bad...
Buy their book... please.
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Unread 12-27-2013, 07:02 AM
VeryVenus VeryVenus is offline
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Re: septiles and noviles

No problem at all, we all repeat ourselves over and over it seems, the threads have so much info at a time that its like you have to read one large article after another! We will definitely check out the book, for sure! (If we haven't already) As I mentioned before, "my bad" for putting on a "bad face" to Novile - in my two following posts I go on explaining in detail my reasonings where I disprove the "LABELISM" in astrology (is that even a word?) when it comes to "good vs evil aspects" (in my second post) and go on to lay out more straightforward meanings of Planetary symbolisms at work - and there are just too many of them to list in their entirety; whilst in an individual horoscope, there are even more differences because they also carry out the meanings of natal houses being represented. You correctly describe this aspect and I am sure that The authors we ve mentioned today wouldn't mind us quoting their works because there's so much more in the books. The subject is simply eye opening and fascinating.
Quoted Literature:
W.Lilly Christian Astrology
C Carter Book of Aspects
A. Leo Practical Astrology
K. Zain Astrological Signatures
J Lewis Encyclopedia of Astrology
C. Show Predictive Astrology
Noel Tyl Articles How to use astrology for success in business
S. Arroyo Astrology Karma and Transformation
P. Globa Aspectarium
A. Leman History of Magic
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Unread 12-27-2013, 07:23 AM
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Re: septiles and noviles

...and I did some more checking and I messed up in that I identified Baha'u'llah as the "Bab" of the Baha'i ...that personn is Abdul Baha, as I wrote over two years ago.
...boy, I'm not firing on all cylinders tonight... too much to remember, presently, got too much personal stuff running through my mind lately.

I apologize.
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Unread 12-27-2013, 07:29 AM
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Re: septiles and noviles

Since I have written here over two years ago, someone in some other thread, that I'm the originator of, pointed out to me that I have a few semi-septiles and semi-noviles in my natal chart ... I can't recall the thread, or whom that the member is, but they are apparently very knowledgeable about this subject. [as to what those two 'semi' aspects infer, is not known to me presently, but it isn't a bad thing, as was my 'take' on their post.]
If I remember what thread that is, I'll post a link here in the next couple of days
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Unread 12-27-2013, 07:33 AM
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Re: septiles and noviles

Well, I'll be... it was Krewster in this thread of mine.
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...t=59528&page=2
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Unread 12-27-2013, 11:05 PM
Krewster Krewster is offline
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Re: septiles and noviles

(apologies format-wise; since 3 days ago my postings prove incapable of retaining paragraph spacing...(all fix-it suggestions welcome)...
VeryVenus,
I don’t know anything about John Bonham (generally avoiding study of famous charts) and have not reviewed (as have you in such depth) the effect of novile family aspect transits (or synastry) on which you seem to do ground-breaking work (from which I have shied-away due to concern they may be too refined/invisible to easily study).
Rather, my post was staying on topic with the natal config mentioned in Bonzo’s opening post and, in novile-related substance, sourced from natal charts of familiars from which my observations are fairly consistent (albeit limited by only about 9 months work), being that the only “dark side” (in a natal chart interpretation) is the seeming intentional ignoring of how society wants the native to behave (I propose because the pure surge of refined trine-like energy among the planets in question is its own mandate –from the native’s self-perception viewpoint; e.g., I have repeatedly “observed” Ven in a novile family aspect to a transpersonal resulting in libidinous behavior shocking to general societal norms but likely “acceptable” in a jungle).
Re your mentioned “combined aspect” approach, perhaps it is helpful in regards the 30 and 150 aspects which are the exception (for me) to being able to ascribe uniform traits to aspect families on a broad-brush-stroke basis (I am in the camp that the 30 is supportive while the 150 is of course not)…
..and I like your elaboration of how novile-based triangles can form (and yes, I’ve observed many 40-120-160 triangles as well as NovaYods and others)…
…but I would not go so far as to “create” a 112 aspect by adding the 40 to the 72, first off because what should one do (orb-wise) with the more important (so far in my view) 112.30 (i.e., from the semi-octile family aka the 16th harmonic)?
If there is more to discuss, consider a new thread or, perhaps better, discoursing via PM (though I fear I may not be much of an enthusiast for mutual review of abstractions unrelated to a real life example of a familiar of yours or mine).

Last edited by Krewster; 12-27-2013 at 11:09 PM.
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Unread 12-28-2013, 04:00 AM
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Re: septiles and noviles

The not so minor minor aspects are same showed in the harmonic charts well known to be the Western version of divisional charts of the Vedic astrology.

However, I do think we should start from the Major then cut through toward the more specific aspects.

My baseline, if in practice, the method/tool gives consistent accuracy, then I will try to learn and use.
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