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  #1  
Unread 12-28-2009, 09:34 AM
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The science behind planets and astrology

I understand that the moon affects the changing tides and I am also in agreement that astrology is very real... it is not just pseudo babble.

What I want to understand is the science behind how the planets are able to affect and influence our psyche. Is it a matter of sharing DNA with the planets and stars?

Would anyone like to comment?

Thanks

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Unread 12-28-2009, 09:55 AM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

astrology is not just a science it's an art -- a huge synthesis of knowledge, experience and above all practice. Maybe some research into the origins of astrology on google may help
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_astrology
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astrology
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Unread 12-28-2009, 10:16 AM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

For those like me who question, here is a good start to an answer:

http://www.halexandria.org/dward329.htm
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Unread 12-28-2009, 10:45 AM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

There's a lot of discoveries being made in quantum physics and the like that may one day explain astrology. I won't begin to say these are the answers but things like spin, tachyons, string theory may be a step towards them.

As an aside if anyone ever says or asks "Astrology isn't real. We don't know what causes it". The easy answer is to point out that scientists don't actually understand gravity yet that seems to be pretty effective at keeping us on the ground.
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Unread 12-28-2009, 11:09 AM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

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Originally Posted by Inside Out Orange View Post
There's a lot of discoveries being made in quantum physics and the like that may one day explain astrology. I won't begin to say these are the answers but things like spin, tachyons, string theory may be a step towards them.

As an aside if anyone ever says or asks "Astrology isn't real. We don't know what causes it". The easy answer is to point out that scientists don't actually understand gravity yet that seems to be pretty effective at keeping us on the ground.
Thanks IOO... this is the kind of answer I was searching for...
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Unread 12-28-2009, 11:45 AM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

One book that was a good read for me and fairly accessible to quantum physics for the first 3/4s of the book or so was Hyperspace by Michio Kaku. (Compare that to A Brief History of Time by Stephen Hawking which is a mess from about three pages in).

It seems Google books have scanned it over here.

The thing is not to expect to understand everything all at once, or to be put off when you don't. Just keep reading and rereading, finding similar books on the topic and slowly it builds to a more coherent picture.
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Unread 12-28-2009, 12:02 PM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

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Originally Posted by Inside Out Orange View Post
It seems Google books have scanned it over here.
Wow... I'm just coming up for air...

What a huge amount of information to process - thanks again IOO!
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  #8  
Unread 12-28-2009, 12:16 PM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

Good thread!

For me the question actually is that how astrologers paired up feelings/behaviours with the moving planets. How did they know which planet affects which area of life. I often think about this, when i read about asteroids especailly the (relatively) newly discovered ones.
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Last edited by ume; 12-28-2009 at 01:42 PM. Reason: Typos everywhere!
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Unread 12-28-2009, 12:26 PM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

Personally for me to fully comprehend and intergrate astrology in my life, I have a need to understand the basic principles and that is why I asked this question.

In a simplistic sense, I do a lot of baking (call me Nigella - sorry I digress). But I understand that when I put certain ingredients into a cake batter, certain scientific principles happen to allow the cake to rise.

I am no longer content to plod along in life without gathering the required information I need to make true sense of something ... I want to know HOW it works and in asking this question, I am not refuting that astrology is an art.

Glad you like the thread Ume!
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Unread 12-28-2009, 01:25 PM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

Okay so I havent read the links, but what a great topic!!!! I need a rationale for everything, but for some reason I never needed one for astrology, it just seemed to real for me.

However, I dont know if astrology can fit within a scientific method?
  • Hypothesis
  • Testing of the hypothesis (how would one test your question? Looking at charts of course, but then it is an art and so many would take personal accounts to testing the hypothesis. Since this is an art, it is hard to format without bias.
  • Analyze data
  • Interpret the data
I still think that it would be fun to conduct some study on the research out there to generalize, like mercury is for intelligence, speed, wit, ect.

What an interesting thread, I will read the links on my day off! I sort of responded too, so that I can keep up with the thread.
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Unread 12-28-2009, 08:35 PM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

hi
inside out orange touched on quantum physics which actually has a concept that gives the dynamic responsible th econnections in astrology.
this concept is called Non-Locality.it has been derived from empirical observations by multiple researchers.
essentially it has been observed that every atomic and suubatomic particle in the universe are connect. the theory postulates that there is a underlying quantum matrix to whic every particle in the universe is connected to.hence the concept of "distance" between two particles is illusionary.there is no distance between particles,they are all connected inherently.
then there is the concept of "entanglement" which is sililar to non-locality.it has been shown,again, by many researchers that every particle has the abiltiy to be insync or entangled with other particles.
scientist can induce entanglement with lasers . a classic experiment is to induce entanglement in two particles, and then separate them by several miles.when the spin on one particle is changed, the other particle,miles distanst,changes it's spin nearly simueltaneously.the actual speed of connection is about 5000 times the speed of lihgt.hence this phenomenoma is not relativistic because with the theory of relativity the absolute speed of the transmission of information is the speed of light.
karl pribram who was one of the genius' of quantum theory postulated tha even "meaning" can be a function of non locality.this gives the dynamic by which a planet can have an affect or meaning on an individual.this is possible because there is no prohibition in quantum theory that says big objects like us and the planets can't respond to these quantum dymanics
rahu

Last edited by rahu; 12-28-2009 at 09:38 PM.
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Unread 12-29-2009, 12:12 AM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

Quote:
Originally Posted by rahu View Post
hi
inside out orange touched on quantum physics which actually has a concept that gives the dynamic responsible th econnections in astrology.
this concept is called Non-Locality.it has been derived from empirical observations by multiple researchers.
essentially it has been observed that every atomic and suubatomic particle in the universe are connect. the theory postulates that there is a underlying quantum matrix to whic every particle in the universe is connected to.hence the concept of "distance" between two particles is illusionary.there is no distance between particles,they are all connected inherently.
then there is the concept of "entanglement" which is sililar to non-locality.it has been shown,again, by many researchers that every particle has the abiltiy to be insync or entangled with other particles.
scientist can induce entanglement with lasers . a classic experiment is to induce entanglement in two particles, and then separate them by several miles.when the spin on one particle is changed, the other particle,miles distanst,changes it's spin nearly simueltaneously.the actual speed of connection is about 5000 times the speed of lihgt.hence this phenomenoma is not relativistic because with the theory of relativity the absolute speed of the transmission of information is the speed of light.
karl pribram who was one of the genius' of quantum theory postulated tha even "meaning" can be a function of non locality.this gives the dynamic by which a planet can have an affect or meaning on an individual.this is possible because there is no prohibition in quantum theory that says big objects like us and the planets can't respond to these quantum dymanics
rahu
Thanks for this very informative posting Rahu ....

I have had to re-read the post a few times to understand it and now that I do, I find it fascinating that scientists can induce entanglement, separate and then spin the particles and watch how the spinning of one particle has an effect on the other which is miles away...

I wonder if we will ever in our lifetime or our childrens lifetime have conclusive (and agreed) evidence of planetary influence in our lives so that some form of agreement can be reached between astrologers, scientists and astronomers.
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Unread 12-29-2009, 01:16 PM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

Wow Rahu!!!
That was amazing!
I agree 07.

Horary as bad as it is for my eyes to read, I have found them to be very accurate!

My favorite was a total throw out there, it was: will I move to washington state this year. Had no inclinations I would move. It said yes, and sure enough within six months here I am, in Washington! Amazing.
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Unread 12-29-2009, 07:00 PM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

yea steph
but it also throws the doors wide open to asteriods, as meaning is inherent with one and any asteroid one considers.the mere act of inquiring if a named asteroid is of signifigance to one initiates the pre-existant quantum connection.

rahu
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Unread 12-29-2009, 07:05 PM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

and 07.Re
your question form acceptance from "scientific establishment is entrenched in cultural and person consciou/subconscious and unconscious baggage that has been added to the condension of the scientific ethic that they could never acknowledge that what they thought was garbagge, was in fact the "god" principle.

if scientifically ,if there is no such thing as proximity or distance between particles and the are all connected ,then basic mantra of the spiritual perspective:we are all one and all are part of god or the godhead if you will is verified by quantum mechanics.the deductionist prejudices of the scientific mind are blind sided by the truth in this instance.

but this wil not happen until the afor mentions mental dynamic are modified.

rahu

.

Last edited by rahu; 12-29-2009 at 07:30 PM. Reason: my mind got away from my hands
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  #16  
Unread 12-29-2009, 07:54 PM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

There is a very interesting paper by Victor Mansfield regarding synchronicity, quantum mechanics and astrology. I have a very old scanned copy of his paper, but i googled it and it’s here

http://www.lightlink.com/vic/astrol.html

I personally disagree with all of it, i do not thing the planets affect us at all (/hide)

No seriously, before you start chucking rocks at me, it is my opinion that our race is not THAT interesting, what i mean is: We tend to go round and round the same behaviors, it used to be chanting at the moon around a campfire, now it’s singing a pop song around the TV. Used to be spears now its tomahawks, etc. etc.

History is simply cyclical in nature, what the ancients did and did very well was find a way to determine these cycles, but instead of saying: "every 3 months its best to sit back and review what we have done because we have not talked about our plans for quite some time and we are bound to have a misunderstanding" they said: "when mercury goes retrograde communications shut down"

To me, the planets are like a very complex clock that keeps the beat of our human nature.

But i do agree with Victor Mansfield, the point here is not HOW it works, not even IF it works, the real point here is: Where is the comprehensive studies and serious science that point in any of both directions? The lack of large scale studies on astrology is something that to me proves hidden agendas in wanting it kept occult.

/disclaimer: That is my personal opinions and do not necesarily reflect those of moonmentum
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  #17  
Unread 12-29-2009, 08:00 PM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

There's some interesting 'basic' experiment in quantum physics you might want to go read about ... Schroedingers Cat ... Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle ... the double-slit experiment ... Bishop Berkeley's bucket ...

On a slightly different note, "The Field" by Lynne Taggart is an interesting read in terms of all the alternative science that has been done on things like homeopathy, ESP, chi energy. Basically it talks about the zero point energy field.
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Unread 12-29-2009, 09:25 PM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

hi almire
not trying to throw stones but your exemplify exactly what i said above.in face of the most up to date theories of nuclear physics,which show repeatedly that every particle and wave in the universe are connected, you choose not to believe."as is above as is below".of course i don't know if you are a "scientist", you could also have a religious priority over science. i won't argue then because i don't argue about beliefs.

rahu
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Unread 12-29-2009, 09:57 PM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

My point here is not in the science but in the actual human behavior.

I choose not believe in "as is above so below", but rather "as is below so is above", which is in agreement to what you wrote.

I would not want to be misunderstood in my statement: Astrology´s correlation to events and psychological profiles is truly astounding, BUT i do not believe that it is a non-local effect. My opinion here is that the explanation is much simpler, humanity is boring and every certain time we just do the same thing again and again and again... it’s a psychological phenomenon based on our collective unconscious, our very own herd pattern ingrained in RNA.

It’s more complex than cow grazing, but it’s just as periodic.

Again, these are my uninformed opinions based on what I’ve seen, i am a newcomer to astrology and come from a more psychological background, when you have a hammer in your hand, you tend to see all problems like nails
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Unread 12-29-2009, 11:20 PM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

did you know that we can't even explain the science behind gravity?

in physics there's something called fundamental forces, first, there's strong force, which glues quarks and gluons together to form neutrons and protons and those two also stay together because of strong force.

then there's weak force, which rules the nuclear decay domain. (up quark to down quark transformation resulting in beta decay, radioactivity)

then there's electromagnetism, it affects charged particles without changing them but makes two negatively or positively charged particles push each other.

THEN, there's gravitation, no one can explain why it is weakest of all four. earth with all his mass can't stand against this refrigirator magnet of mine holding this paper clip. and without this hypothetical and massless particle called "graviton" (never observed) it's just we don't know HOW gravitation works.

...

ever since quantum physics got popular all the mumbo jumbo people started to use it for their own foul reasons. (mostly creationists) like, "electron is both here and there so there's heaven and earth" it gives people a way to make things blurry, they say physics even fuzzy, why we should be completely tangible?

so i guess i mean, you don't know, i don't know, no one knows. every theory about how astrology works condemned to be gullible.

...

if you tell me this big object in our solar system has an affect on me in a quantum level that's fine... but how you can say that saturn and jupiter affects me in completely different ways? now, that, you can't possibly explain in a quantum level.

and if we start speculating about how distance doesn't matter and stuff, then you have to add rest of the universe's affects on us. black holes, supernovas, pulsars, all the meteors...

to be honest, i can't see astrology getting scientific. the only "reason" would be a god or goddess or something that blessed jupiter like this and cursed saturn like that so that's why they have these attributes.

unless we assume that saturn emits this hypothetical particle called saturnon and whatever.

Last edited by 2complicated; 12-29-2009 at 11:59 PM.
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Unread 12-30-2009, 01:08 AM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

2compliated
i don't try to define these effects but simply acknowledge their

rahu
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Unread 12-30-2009, 03:17 PM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

Almire,
I will not throw rocks
I appreciate your thoughts to human behaviors and their repetition.

They are repetitive for the basic needs of human survival (Maslow): breathing, food, water, sex, homeostatis, excretion. These things are all innately within so that we can survive.

If you come from a more psychological backround then you will also agree with me (?) that the human experience itself is not repetitive.

Sure we all do the basics of what it is to live, but the living (life) experience is unique to us all.

From above, we look to be of the same; from within the experience is detached from the rest and very personal.

"According to Dr Percy Seymour, a Theoretical Astrophysicist, resonance is what makes it possible for a radio telescope to tune into specific vibrations in the Andromeda Galaxy (14 million, million, million miles away) and accounts for the Solar System playing a symphony of vibrations on the magnetic field of the Earth."http://www.kathryncassidy.com/articles/how-astrology-works.cfm

I found this to be very interesting as most anti-astrologers theory's argue that the outer planets do not have any action towards the earth, nor do they interact with the magnetic field.

Dr. Seymour also stated that when working with NASA scientists noted that going away from the sun the solar winds became violent, while going towards (conjuncting) the winds were more calm.

I do belive that the planets in our solar system have an effect on us, because they affect the earth.

I just dont think that they can be statistically proved by the scientific method, but can be proved through the human experience of living.
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Unread 12-30-2009, 03:41 PM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

And the theory would be that the different magnetic fields affect our synapses and glandular flows thus affecting our emotions and thoughts, it is an interesting point of view.

The human experience is very unique, because of the infinite variations of day to day living. Yet on the core not only do we have the same needs (Maslow) but also we work along the same structures (Jung´s Archetypes) and interact in the same way (Berne´s Games) with the same primal needs (Freud), creating in a broader sense, a cyclical nature to life in the collective.

¿Maybe a convergence of theories might be more complete?
“The earth, nature and the human race live on a series of cyclic behaviors that have been observed for 4000 years and categorized with the stars as a calendar. These natural cycles are then reaffirmed and entrenched by the non-local quantum force we have given these planets through our observations and associated concepts. With micro-variations of the cycles caused by vibrations and local fields that exert changes on our regular patterns of thought"

What do you think?
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Unread 12-30-2009, 04:06 PM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

Almire,
I say yes, and yes.
I agree there.
But I think it is much more personal then these theories make life out to be.

I agree with what you are saying, based on the cyclic life patterns that move the biologic process of life along.

We are bogged down by the basics of living. However, there is also the emotional side to life that is lost within the theories here.
Last year I would have wholly agreed that life is life, and we are innately designed to live as structured as it is meant to be; breathe or die.

But after the personal experiences that I dealt with over the year, I have been touched by life on a different level. A level that brought this emotional and spritual side to life that has forced me in a way to change my view on things. I dont think it was due to alterations of the planetary movements on my glandular processes.

I needed to breathe air to live, but I add to that (on a higher spiritual level), the ability to breathe in life to live.

I do agree in your last paragraph. I actually love it!
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Unread 12-30-2009, 06:04 PM
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Re: The science behind planets and astrology

i want to make a quote to further confuse you people just for the heck of it;

Many scientists have documented that over 95% of Human DNA does not have a known purpose. This DNA has been colloquially referred to as “Junk DNA”.

Up to 97% of the human genetic information (DNA) is seemingly needless, repetitive “junk” – only about 3% is known to generate proteins, deserving the name “gene”. The rest used to be called “junk DNA”, lately renamed as “non-coding introns”, sometimes labelled by the mysterious, though not very explicit description that these self-similar strands “regulate gene expression”




However, other researchers have not been content to simply classify this predominant part of DNA as “one of life’s mysteries”. Scholarly groups at the forefront of investigative researchers are gathering details which suggest that DNA may not substantively exist as a “building block of life”. Rather, it appears that the substantive function of DNA is to act as a “parasitic inhibitor” and “regulator” of life on planet Earth.

Recent work by Russian biologist Piotr Garjajev and some Russian linguistic experts suggests the same thing, and, more specifically, this research may show that junk DNA, rather than being a discard, is “a computer hologram that works with laser-type radiations.” In short, DNA is an extraordinary generator of perceptions, an instrument of virtual reality.


By accepting the link between DNA and emotional and mental activities, we may begin to imagine DNA as a complex program that directs the life process (regulating our metabolism, for instance), but impedes our consciousness from complete manifestation.

Research testimony that includes ancient representations, suggest that DNA was implanted in humanity by Manipulative Extraterrestrials. The fact that over 95% of DNA does not support vital biological living processes suggest that it is conceivable for biological life to exist without any DNA.
More than 95 % of all DNA, had been first called “Junk DNA” by molecular biologists, because they were unable to ascribe any function to it. They assumed that it was just “molecular garbage”. But, if it were “junk”, the sequence of the “syllables”, i.e. the nucleotides in DNA should be completely random. However it has been found that the sequence of the syllables is not random at all and has a striking resemblance with the structure of language (ref. Flam, F. “Hints of a language in junk DNA”, Science 266:1320, 1994), that is alien to humanity. Scientists now generally believe that this DNA must contain some kind of coded information.

http://fractogene.com/full_genome/fractogene.html



NOW, go figure the relationship between junk dna and astrology.
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