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  #51  
Unread 10-12-2019, 01:30 PM
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Opal and Moonkat, you might be interested to learn about biblical criticism. This doesn't mean condemning the Bible, but rather "getting under the hood" to ferret out the different authors, when they lived, their social influences, and so on. This is typically based on expert knowledge of ancient languages and philology, but there are laypersons' discussions in English.



Hi Waybread,

Nowhere have I condemned The Bible. Nor do I condemn people that adhere to any religion. I had a mixed religious upbringing myself.

Paternal Grandmother - Protestant
Paternal Grandfather - Cree and followed their natural heritage
Maternal Grandmother - Catholic
Maternal Grandfather - Muslim

I use the Bible as a study tool. Much the same as my Grandmother’s. I have a Koran. I don’t have a concordance for it. My Cree Granfather used no book, he just taught the ways of the land. He also served in WWII.

I just have learned to study it in my own way. I do not care if people want to discuss their choice of religion. If that is the subject. The title of this thread is “Bible and Astrology”. I study The Bible, with my concordances, in which can found all of the numbers of Precession. I started looking at The Book as a Tool of Precession many years ago, because that is what I see.

I suppose that would be why I see it as what I see it as. I am looking at it with my eyes, not the eyes of someone who is telling me what it should mean to me.

The concordance is an amazing tool. It allows me to observe key words, and lets me decide what I believe. I have been to the churches and mosques and long houses. I do not find what I need for my chosen path of faith there. I find my faith from, deciphering The Bible and ancient mythologies.

Each to their own.

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  #52  
Unread 10-12-2019, 09:38 PM
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Re: Bible and Astrology

Opal, I know you have not condemned the Bible!!! So sorry for the misunderstanding. I was responding to Greybeard and AJ.

I agree that a concordance is a super study aid.
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  #53  
Unread 10-13-2019, 02:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waybread View Post
Opal, I know you have not condemned the Bible!!! So sorry for the misunderstanding. I was responding to Greybeard and AJ.

I agree that a concordance is a super study aid.
Alas, I am sorry for misunderstanding you Waybread, I should have known better. You are always fair to my mind. I had a bad day yesterday, ended up in the hospital, I am and will be fine, probably why I misunderstood you. And I am pretty drugged. 😄😄😄

Have a good night Waybread!

Hey, before I go, I was in Nakusp this summer, they had a book sale on. I bought a book called The Bible as History by Werner Keller, when I opened it up at the sale the first thing I saw was “there was a conjunction of Saturn and Jupiter” he was referencing Kepler’s studies.
You are probably the only person here that knows of Nakusp! Pretty small town to find a Biblical astrology book!

Talk to you later Waybread, goodnight!
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  #54  
Unread 10-15-2019, 12:05 AM
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Re: Bible and Astrology

Greybeard did not and does not condemn holy writings or the religions they spring from.

I do not "reduce" religion to a medium for social control. It is many things, performs many functions. I merely point out that one of its most important and primary functions is as a means of social control.

It runs throughout history.

The OP has run face-on into religion as a means of social control: "Thou shalt not study astrology."

Last edited by greybeard; 10-15-2019 at 12:09 AM.
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  #55  
Unread 10-15-2019, 12:29 AM
greybeard greybeard is offline
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Originally Posted by AJ Astrology View Post
Hi greybeard,

How do we know what John says is true?

John says Jesus was crucified on a Wednesday. The other three say differently.

They all can't be right. Either John erred or the other three erred.

It says something that Yahweh doesn't even know when his "only begotten son" (

) died.

I am not here to argue the veracity of the bible. I take the book as it is accepted by its adherents, and try to help the OP orient himself within his accepted belief system.

Whether or not I personally accept the bible is immaterial.

Whether Jesus was crucified on Tuesday or Friday, or not at all, is meaningless in this context. I must ignore such argument.

Last edited by greybeard; 10-15-2019 at 12:36 AM.
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  #56  
Unread 10-15-2019, 01:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greybeard View Post
Greybeard did not and does not condemn holy writings or the religions they spring from.

I do not "reduce" religion to a medium for social control. It is many things, performs many functions. I merely point out that one of its most important and primary functions is as a means of social control.

It runs throughout history.

The OP has run face-on into religion as a means of social control: "Thou shalt not study astrology."
I know you didn’t Greybeard, you are pretty straight up about what you say.

I find we all make errors in miscommunications here too easily. I put it down to no eye contact.

But you nailed it with what the OP is facing. Church rules, versus personal choices, they don’t always mix.
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  #57  
Unread 10-15-2019, 04:04 AM
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Re: Bible and Astrology

Quote:
Originally Posted by greybeard View Post
I am not here to argue the veracity of the bible. I take the book as it is accepted by its adherents, and try to help the OP orient himself within his accepted belief system.

Whether or not I personally accept the bible is immaterial.

Whether Jesus was crucified on Tuesday or Friday, or not at all, is meaningless in this context. I must ignore such argument.
We are pointing out that the Bible's adherents do not all "accept" it in the same way. Compare the teaching of the Southern Baptists, with the Unitarians, just for one example. Jews do not accept the New Testament, and the Catholic church includes some books that other Christian faiths do not.

Have you studied the Bible extensively?

Reductio ad absurdum, what with not eating frogs and the day of the crucifixion?
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My friends, love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair. So let us be loving, hopeful and optimistic. And we’ll change the world. Jack Layton, "Letter to Canadians"

I thought we went along paths--but it seems there are no paths. The going itself is the path.
C.S. Lewis, Perelandra.

Life is not about finding yourself. Life is about creating yourself. Message on a refrigerator magnet.
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  #58  
Unread 10-15-2019, 04:25 AM
greybeard greybeard is offline
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Re: Bible and Astrology

Sorry. No argument here. You win.
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  #59  
Unread 11-28-2019, 03:35 AM
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Re: Bible and Astrology

So, I am looking in this book. Sefer Yetzirah. The Book of Creation. By Aryeh Kaplan.

My husband bought it. I opened it to a page. 236 to be exact. And it is talking about the nodes. Genesis 1: 21

Note that Kaplan is Jewish. Would be using the Torah. I will type you an excerpt, from the book.

"The "dragon" whose head and tail form the two nodes, is then identified as the Teli. Most early Hebrew writers refer to it by its Arabic name Al Jaz'har. Juz'har is a Persian word, meaning "knot" or "node."

Rabbi Abraham Abulafia also identifies the Teli with the celestial "knots" (Kesharim). He writes that the head of the Teli denoes merit, while its tail signifies liability.

Especially important are the lunar nodes, since it is only at these points that an eclipse, either of the sun or the moon, can occur. The Teli can then be seen as the imaginary dragon swallowing the sun or moon.

Although the obliquity is often referred to as the Teli, it is questionable if this is the Teli mentioned her by the Sefer Yetzirah.

Ther is also a tradition that there are two Telis or dragons, one male and the other female. These are identified as the two Leviathans, and are mentioned in the account of creation, "God created the great dragons" (Genesis 1:21) According to the Talmud, the Pole Serpent mentioned by Isaiah is the male dragon, while the Coiled Serpent (Nachash Akalkalon) is the female. Some Kabbalists state that the constellation of Draco is the male Pole Serpent, while the inclination of the ecliptic is the female Coiled Serpent. The female therefore encompasses the male, this being the mystery of, "a female shall surround a male" (Jeremish 31:22)"



It continues with a debate of others identifying the Teli with the Milky Way. Saying the Teli would be the axis of the glaxy. but, the Book of Raziel calls the Milky Way the River Dinur, mentioned in Daniel.

Guess I am going to have to go back to page 1.

My husband picks good books.
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