Astrologers' Community  

Go Back   Astrologers' Community > General Astrology > Natal Astrology > Relocation Astrology

Relocation Astrology For discussions on relocation astrology techniques: astro*carto*graphy, relocated charts, local space directions etc.


Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Unread 09-04-2014, 04:34 PM
heycutie heycutie is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 38
Astrocartography: Saturn/Pluto crossing?

I have relocated a few times across the planet to far away places and cities. Somehow in some places where I have, say, jupiter line or sun line, I still felt an omnipresent and creeping feeling of gloom and doom. I know that wherever I go, I bring my natal chart with me, since it's a huge part of my personality make-up. I didn't understand why in places where things are, theoretically, supposed to be awesome, somehow I still suffered issues related to saturn (restrictions, housing problems [my natal saturn is in the 4th]) and pluto (power struggles).

Just a few days ago, I started paying attention to the crossings, after learning the importance of them through others' experiences. Upon some investigation, I noticed how all the major cities I travelled to and stayed in have one crossing in common (I traveled horizontally across canada from west to east around the same latitude). And the crossing line is saturn/pluto.

Maybe the crossings' influence is more powerful than I thought. Now I re-examined my lines for different cities, and it seems that some cities in the states that share the similar major lines as the ones in canada are better for me, because some of them have no saturn crossing or lines whatsoever.

Considering that saturn only have two aspects in my chart, both are negative, one is a square to my sun, one is conjunction to my IC, I think it's wise for me to avoid saturn-influenced places at all costs.

My birth place have saturn/IC line running right through it, so I know all about the cold saturn business. I ain't about this life tbh! I don't want to spend my whole life stuck in such places and wallowing in pity and depression.

What do you think about the influence of crossings? Any experience?


Last edited by heycutie; 09-04-2014 at 04:38 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Unread 09-04-2014, 08:42 PM
miquar's Avatar
miquar miquar is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: North West England
Posts: 3,218
Re: Astrocartography: Saturn/Pluto crossing?

Hi. Do you mean that one of your Saturn lines crosses one of your Pluto lines at each city you stayed at? If so, I don't see how this is possible if you travelled east to west. I may not be getting what you're saying.
__________________
True freedom and the end of suffering is living in such a way as if you had completely chosen whatever you feel or experience at this moment.

Eckhart Tolle, Stillness Speaks, page 118
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Unread 09-04-2014, 10:18 PM
heycutie heycutie is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 38
Re: Astrocartography: Saturn/Pluto crossing?

^ oh no. The crossing of two lines occurs at a specific place in the world, but the thing with crossing is that, its influence affects all the places at the same latitude as the crossing, i. e. If the crossing is at 10'N 135'W, then everywhere else along 10'N latitude will be influenced by the same crossing energy. Hope that makes it clear for you.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Unread 09-04-2014, 10:28 PM
miquar's Avatar
miquar miquar is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: North West England
Posts: 3,218
Re: Astrocartography: Saturn/Pluto crossing?

I see. I haven't come across that idea before. Why the latitude line and not the longitude line? Why even the latitude line, in fact?
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Unread 09-04-2014, 10:29 PM
heycutie heycutie is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 38
Re: Astrocartography: Saturn/Pluto crossing?

^ interesting question.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Unread 09-04-2014, 10:46 PM
miquar's Avatar
miquar miquar is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: North West England
Posts: 3,218
Re: Astrocartography: Saturn/Pluto crossing?

Yes. It sounds very suspect to me.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Unread 11-30-2014, 11:56 PM
HoldOrFold's Avatar
HoldOrFold HoldOrFold is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 445
Re: Astrocartography: Saturn/Pluto crossing?

Heycutie, there may be other factors at play which you haven't looked into... perhaps in these places your ascendant is conjunct negative midpoints, or it could be your vertex etc.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Unread 12-01-2014, 02:10 AM
horarymaster horarymaster is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 346
Re: Astrocartography: Saturn/Pluto crossing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by heycutie View Post
I have relocated a few times across the planet to far away places and cities. Somehow in some places where I have, say, jupiter line or sun line, I still felt an omnipresent and creeping feeling of gloom and doom. I know that wherever I go, I bring my natal chart with me, since it's a huge part of my personality make-up. I didn't understand why in places where things are, theoretically, supposed to be awesome, somehow I still suffered issues related to saturn (restrictions, housing problems [my natal saturn is in the 4th]) and pluto (power struggles).

Just a few days ago, I started paying attention to the crossings, after learning the importance of them through others' experiences. Upon some investigation, I noticed how all the major cities I travelled to and stayed in have one crossing in common (I traveled horizontally across canada from west to east around the same latitude). And the crossing line is saturn/pluto.

Maybe the crossings' influence is more powerful than I thought. Now I re-examined my lines for different cities, and it seems that some cities in the states that share the similar major lines as the ones in canada are better for me, because some of them have no saturn crossing or lines whatsoever.

Considering that saturn only have two aspects in my chart, both are negative, one is a square to my sun, one is conjunction to my IC, I think it's wise for me to avoid saturn-influenced places at all costs.

My birth place have saturn/IC line running right through it, so I know all about the cold saturn business. I ain't about this life tbh! I don't want to spend my whole life stuck in such places and wallowing in pity and depression.

What do you think about the influence of crossings? Any experience?
Hello:

The crossing of Saturn and Pluto is one of the worst place to be, on Earth, and being on the same latitude as the crossing (in my experience) is NOT as bad, but is potentially a harmful place.

I also have an afflicted natal Sun in adverse aspect to Saturn.

To cite my own experience, I also happen to have a Saturn/Pluto crossing not far from Los Angeles and the Mexican border.

Dealings with Los Angeles/San Diego people have always been problematic and VERY difficult for me.

I once met an astrology client and her daughter from this area and they were bad news from the get-go. Really diffiicult and stressful to deal with !

They were living like "vultures" in abject poverty ! LOL

The mother had paid the daughter a visit and the daughter had no furniture in their house, as she was moving ?

As a result, my client slept on her daughter's floor ?

I then learned that the daughter was involved in a serious criminal matter involving dui and jail was imminent !

Whereever Pluto is angular, criminality or dealings with criminals is common and you have to always watch your back.

This Saturn Pluto crossing also extends into the State of Arizona. I once was a member of an astrology forum owned and operated by a world famous Arizona based astrologer for a period of several years !

In the beginning, this individual was nice to me, but as time went on, I just got the impression that he was controlling, manipulative and increasingly evil ? Then I discovered that he worked with a team of business partners, who also ******* people over ?

I had to leave the forum for good, never to come back.

One of the manifestations of a Saturn Pluto zone is being the victim of a powerplay, a slander or outright character assasination by some psycho with a thirst for power and control ?

You need to be very careful in those zones, as you could meet some very nasty people who will try to f*ck up your life ?


Regarding your natal Saturn = the IC, Saturn is not necessarily "bad," but in your case, it talks about your father and your relationship with your family, in general.

Saturn here can mean that you don't always have a great relationship with father and that there could have been little love expressed between you. Or maybe you felt that you were not loved enough when you were a child ?

Maybe that is why you are so bitter today, as an adult ? But as with all things Saturn, the situation can improve over time and, as you get older, you can get a grip on your life ?

Also, very important, when judging the relocation chart, please do not dwell on the crossing, but look at the WHOLE relocation chart for a blended answer.

Do not judge the whole area on just the angular planets, but also, the ruler of the 1st house, its conditions and placements, the midheaven, etc.


later,


HM
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to horarymaster For This Useful Post:
heretolearn (12-01-2014), miquar (12-01-2014), StillOne (03-10-2015)
  #9  
Unread 12-01-2014, 11:23 AM
miquar's Avatar
miquar miquar is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: North West England
Posts: 3,218
Re: Astrocartography: Saturn/Pluto crossing?

HM's example of the forum being run from the place where the Saturn and Pluto lines cross is very interesting. I have a friend who was born at the point where my Venus and Uranus lines cross (in Malaysia!). She is probably the most eccentric person I know in some ways, and once told a mutual friend of ours that she and I had entered into a relationship but that neither of is had spoken about it to one another! Once she go in touch (out of the blue after a few years) on a day when I'd been having strange ideas about a fictional culture where each person has two partners, and spends half a week with each one! This astrocartography thing is not to be underestimated. There may be potential for people to find their own special places of healing rather than all going to the same statue of Mary or whatever.
__________________
True freedom and the end of suffering is living in such a way as if you had completely chosen whatever you feel or experience at this moment.

Eckhart Tolle, Stillness Speaks, page 118
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to miquar For This Useful Post:
HoldOrFold (01-14-2016)
  #10  
Unread 02-28-2015, 05:01 AM
comdoc comdoc is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 337
Lightbulb Re: Astrocartography: Saturn/Pluto crossing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by heycutie View Post
I have relocated a few times across the planet to far away places and cities. Somehow in some places where I have, say, jupiter line or sun line, I still felt an omnipresent and creeping feeling of gloom and doom. I know that wherever I go, I bring my natal chart with me, since it's a huge part of my personality make-up. I didn't understand why in places where things are, theoretically, supposed to be awesome, somehow I still suffered issues related to saturn (restrictions, housing problems [my natal saturn is in the 4th]) and pluto (power struggles).

Just a few days ago, I started paying attention to the crossings, after learning the importance of them through others' experiences. Upon some investigation, I noticed how all the major cities I travelled to and stayed in have one crossing in common (I traveled horizontally across canada from west to east around the same latitude). And the crossing line is saturn/pluto.

Maybe the crossings' influence is more powerful than I thought. Now I re-examined my lines for different cities, and it seems that some cities in the states that share the similar major lines as the ones in canada are better for me, because some of them have no saturn crossing or lines whatsoever.

Considering that saturn only have two aspects in my chart, both are negative, one is a square to my sun, one is conjunction to my IC, I think it's wise for me to avoid saturn-influenced places at all costs.

My birth place have saturn/IC line running right through it, so I know all about the cold saturn business. I ain't about this life tbh! I don't want to spend my whole life stuck in such places and wallowing in pity and depression.

What do you think about the influence of crossings? Any experience?
Crossings occur where one planet is on the MC or Nadir, and other planet is on the Ascendant or Descendant. The 4 angles of the chart are the most powerful zodiacal points in the local space environment: where the Ecliptic (Sun's yearly circular path) intersects the Eastern and Western horizons, and those points where the local meridian (longitude) intersects the Ecliptic highest point in the sky (MC), and opposite lowest point (IC, beneath the Earth). Note the Zodiac (yearly) cycle intersects the Circle of Houses (diurnal 24 hours cycle) at the 4 Angles.

MC planet is at most outwardly (public) visible point, while IC planet is at most hidden (private) point. Ascendant planet is at point where it is first becomes visible (rises into view), and Descendant planet is at point where it first becomes hidden (sets out of view). Recall that we associate 1st House cusp with Self, 7th House cusp with Others, 10th House cusp with Objective Public, and 4th House cusp with Subjective Private sectors.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Unread 02-28-2015, 05:50 AM
comdoc comdoc is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 337
Re: Astrocartography: Saturn/Pluto crossing?

Planet crossings are places where two planets' influences are strongest at a particular location on the surface of the Earth: one in longitude(Ascendant or Descendant), and other in declination or latitude(MC or IC). Why does a planet crossing have an influence along a latitude parallel?

Because of our planet's rotation from West to East. Note that planet crossings in relocation astrology are related to our natal birthchart and body spacetime coordinates. Crossings are relatively easy to interpret in tropical Zodiac terms.

Yes, planet crossings also have influence along the respective local longitude meridian. These influences are related to declination: the distance North or South of the Ecliptic Plane. They are harder to interpret in Western Tropical astrology system. We have only distance North or South of Celestial Equator, and Parallel and Contraparallel interaspects for clues to meaning.

Intuitively we sense that a planet's height (declination) above or depth below the Ecliptic Plane has specific meaning. For example, Saturn on MC is most visible in the outer objective social world--while, on IC is most hidden, deep in the subjective inner world. We can understand the extremes easily by reading the planet's influence at Nadir (4th House cusp) or at MC (10th House cusp).

But what if a planet is in between these extremes? We can read the planet's influence by House location, to gain some insights into it's relative declination nature and effects. However, a planet's character in 8th House is quite different than the same planet's character in 11th House--even though both may be at same distance (declination) North of South of Celestial Equator.

Last edited by comdoc; 02-28-2015 at 04:54 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Unread 03-08-2015, 04:26 PM
Calvinsmom's Avatar
Calvinsmom Calvinsmom is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 64
Re: Astrocartography: Saturn/Pluto crossing?

I lived under Saturn Neptune crossings and Pluto Mercury crossings but fortunately not Saturn Pluto cross. I would personally stay away from that.

I believe strongly in astrocartography, in my case it proved correct. I moved to a Jupiter midhaven line thinking the crossings wouldn't matter and they absolutely did.

I was fortunate to have a Venus first house natal, so I moved to my Venus ascendant line without negative crossings and it changed my life for the better. I have lived here 8 happy years and cannot imagine living anywhere else. Everything about it came true. I am so grateful.

Just had to chime in.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Unread 03-09-2015, 08:23 PM
CapAquaPis's Avatar
CapAquaPis CapAquaPis is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: ...in the sidereal astrological system.
Posts: 2,084
Arrow Re: Astrocartography: Saturn/Pluto crossing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by horarymaster View Post
Hello:

The crossing of Saturn and Pluto is one of the worst place to be, on Earth, and being on the same latitude as the crossing (in my experience) is NOT as bad, but is potentially a harmful place.

I also have an afflicted natal Sun in adverse aspect to Saturn.

To cite my own experience, I also happen to have a Saturn/Pluto crossing not far from Los Angeles and the Mexican border.

Dealings with Los Angeles/San Diego people have always been problematic and VERY difficult for me.

I once met an astrology client and her daughter from this area and they were bad news from the get-go. Really diffiicult and stressful to deal with !

They were living like "vultures" in abject poverty ! LOL

The mother had paid the daughter a visit and the daughter had no furniture in their house, as she was moving ?

As a result, my client slept on her daughter's floor ?

I then learned that the daughter was involved in a serious criminal matter involving dui and jail was imminent !

Whereever Pluto is angular, criminality or dealings with criminals is common and you have to always watch your back.

This Saturn Pluto crossing also extends into the State of Arizona. I once was a member of an astrology forum owned and operated by a world famous Arizona based astrologer for a period of several years !

In the beginning, this individual was nice to me, but as time went on, I just got the impression that he was controlling, manipulative and increasingly evil ? Then I discovered that he worked with a team of business partners, who also ******* people over ?

I had to leave the forum for good, never to come back.

One of the manifestations of a Saturn Pluto zone is being the victim of a powerplay, a slander or outright character assasination by some psycho with a thirst for power and control ?

You need to be very careful in those zones, as you could meet some very nasty people who will try to f*ck up your life ?


Regarding your natal Saturn = the IC, Saturn is not necessarily "bad," but in your case, it talks about your father and your relationship with your family, in general.

Saturn here can mean that you don't always have a great relationship with father and that there could have been little love expressed between you. Or maybe you felt that you were not loved enough when you were a child ?

Maybe that is why you are so bitter today, as an adult ? But as with all things Saturn, the situation can improve over time and, as you get older, you can get a grip on your life ?

Also, very important, when judging the relocation chart, please do not dwell on the crossing, but look at the WHOLE relocation chart for a blended answer.

Do not judge the whole area on just the angular planets, but also, the ruler of the 1st house, its conditions and placements, the midheaven, etc.


later,


HM
It's recommended you shouldn't visit or stay in southern CA and everyone it seems wants to travel or live here (esp. the winter months in the Palm Springs area, ROFL). I'm a CA native, Palm Springs area local (year-round) and probably forever...always had an interest in relocation out of state, but when you think the "grass is greener" you're not prepared to deal with the new place you want to call home: different climate, elevation, culture, economic situations and becoming familiar with your surroundings. And my own observations of places I traveled to: Utah, OK, France and Mexico.

I find southern CA crowded, expensive, HOT (triple digit highs) in the summer, not as friendly, limited job opportunities and issues with county/state public social services I'm on. I'm concerned with drought (worst in 2 centuries), immigration (out-of-state and foreign) contributing to overpopulation (?), earthquake risk (a M8+ on the San Andreas fault someday) and political ideologies (are we really "free" or too much laws?) can affect the quality of life for me and other 38.5 million Californians. Note an Aquarius sun lives in an Aquarius rising CA, Aquarius moon USA.

Individually, we have a perfect place in our heart and soul, and not everyone will find CA (northern or southern) right for them. I find astro-cartography a practical guide of my life, what if I moved to a particular city or town and how it may affect me, and clues to my family history. Let's say if a meridian/longitude ruled by Venus MC is where I find love? Or the Sun/Moon AC where I marry or have a family? Mercury DC where I have business opportunity? or Pluto IC is where I may die? And most of all, why where I live can't provide or less likely these things based on my natal chart.
__________________
or , I have the same ruling planets: Uranus and Saturn. I see the Cancer rising. Aries in the MC and Venus was her name!
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Unread 03-10-2015, 10:26 AM
horarymaster horarymaster is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 346
Re: Astrocartography: Saturn/Pluto crossing?

You are right, the grass ain't always "greener" on the other side !

The most popular question asked by relocation clients is: Will my RLC chart change me as a person., will it take away from my natal chart.

The answer is: absolutely not ! You are, what you are, through the natal chart, but obviously, your progressed chart, transits, etc, shape you and your destiny.

Also, do not be deceived by study of ONE planet alone, such as a Jupiter line, Saturn line, Mars line, etc.

Look at the whole chart !


HM
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Unread 03-10-2015, 10:53 AM
horarymaster horarymaster is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 346
Re: Astrocartography: Saturn/Pluto crossing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by CapAquaPis View Post
It's recommended you shouldn't visit or stay in southern CA and everyone it seems wants to travel or live here (esp. the winter months in the Palm Springs area, ROFL). I'm a CA native, Palm Springs area local (year-round) and probably forever...always had an interest in relocation out of state, but when you think the "grass is greener" you're not prepared to deal with the new place you want to call home: different climate, elevation, culture, economic situations and becoming familiar with your surroundings. And my own observations of places I traveled to: Utah, OK, France and Mexico.

I find southern CA crowded, expensive, HOT (triple digit highs) in the summer, not as friendly, limited job opportunities and issues with county/state public social services I'm on. I'm concerned with drought (worst in 2 centuries), immigration (out-of-state and foreign) contributing to overpopulation (?), earthquake risk (a M8+ on the San Andreas fault someday) and political ideologies (are we really "free" or too much laws?) can affect the quality of life for me and other 38.5 million Californians. Note an Aquarius sun lives in an Aquarius rising CA, Aquarius moon USA.

Individually, we have a perfect place in our heart and soul, and not everyone will find CA (northern or southern) right for them. I find astro-cartography a practical guide of my life, what if I moved to a particular city or town and how it may affect me, and clues to my family history. Let's say if a meridian/longitude ruled by Venus MC is where I find love? Or the Sun/Moon AC where I marry or have a family? Mercury DC where I have business opportunity? or Pluto IC is where I may die? And most of all, why where I live can't provide or less likely these things based on my natal chart.
This is a very good point that you raised.

If you are very good in your field of endeavor, why can't you do well, anywhere on Earth.

You can ! It's called the "Wayne Gretzky effect."

To the uninitiated, Wayne Gretzky is the most prolific ice hockey player of all time, the owner of over 56 NHL scoring records.

Did Wayne Gretzky score goals only on Jupiter or Mars lines or crossings ?

No !

Gretzky scored goals in every NHL arena, where there were Neptune lines, Pluto lines and Saturn lines.

Therefore, if you are a prolific adulterer, you could pick up women in any bar in the United States, not just where Venus and Mars lines are located.

Why is it that some people have no difficulty finding lovers and relationships, yet others struggle with meeting people.

Obviously, everything stems from the natal chart.

The idea of going to a specific place on Earth where ONE planet is on an angle is similar to the idea of exalting a planet to its maximum capacity.

If the load exceeds its capacity, it would be like blowing a fuse, wouldn't it ?

The effect of a planet on the angle, artificially placed, is like a garden hose being covered by a few fingers, causing the water to flow faster ?

It's still the same planet and aspects but you are pushing the energy to its maximum potential.

?

HM
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Unread 01-20-2016, 07:19 PM
HoldOrFold's Avatar
HoldOrFold HoldOrFold is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 445
Re: Astrocartography: Saturn/Pluto crossing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by heycutie View Post
Just a few days ago, I started paying attention to the crossings, after learning the importance of them through others' experiences. Upon some investigation, I noticed how all the major cities I travelled to and stayed in have one crossing in common (I traveled horizontally across canada from west to east around the same latitude). And the crossing line is saturn/pluto.

Maybe the crossings' influence is more powerful than I thought.
Fascinating how you noticed this effect through direct personal obsvervation. It so happens that Martin Davis, author of Astrolocality Astrology and contributer to Skyscript.com, shares that observation. He's also considered an expert in astrocartography.

Here's a quote from him in regards to the effect of the crossing (aka Paran) having a residual effect on for that entire lattitude on the planet:

Quote:
The influence of a Paran is most prominent at the exact point were the A*C*G lines come together over the earth. As an important, though secondary effect, practitioners will note the earth latitude where the crossing occurs and considers the force of those planets active - at that latitude- around the entire globe.

Why around the entire globe? Well, in 24 hours the earth will rotate below the crossing of the two planetary lines, energising that entire latitude with the force of the planetary square in space. An orb of plus or minus one degree of latitude is often used when determining the range of potency, though sometimes practitioners enlarge the orb beyond this. As with all of the other A*C*G lines, the tighter the orb, the greater the effect we can expect.

- Martin Davis
__________________
Free detailed midpoint calculator with aspects and interpretations
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
astrocartography, crossing, saturn or pluto

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT. The time now is 01:43 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2005-2018, AstrologyWeekly.com. Boards' structure and all posts are property of AstrologyWeekly.com and their respective creators. No part of the messages sent on these boards may be copied without their owners' explicit consent.