Transits for opportunities/beginnings

Okay, you wrote:

Osamenor said:

spock said:

But in what sense was your winding up in that interview out of the blue?

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I hadn't been actively job seeking, and while the job was in a field I had worked in previously, I thought I didn't want to go back. A family member of mine had worked for that organization, retired recently, but stayed in the loop and knew they were desperately seeking people and put the director in touch with me. She initiated the contact, not I. I felt I had to at least go through with the interview, and when I was offered the job, I didn't have enough else going on to be able to turn it down. So I accepted... and found that I liked it quite well after all.

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And:

Osamenor said:

spock said:

With regards to the beginning of your long-term relationship, for instance, you say in one of your posts that a friend had been trying to set you up. So that meeting wasn't quite out of the blue.

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True. I think I'm the only person involved who felt there was something out of the blue. After the relationship got underway, my boyfriend told me that he'd started noticing me several months before we actually met, and had a crush on me, and tried to talk to me, but I never really responded beyond a brief "hi." I don't remember that at all.

Then, after a few months of that, he went out with some of his friends, who also knew my friend, and they ran into her. She told me that she talked to him for half an hour and had a strong feeling that he was right for me. The interesting thing is, she and I had a rather difficult friendship: we were roommates initially (found each other through our college's roommate request board) and we were in constant conflict living together. When I moved out, we became better friends. Even then, though, it's not like we were together all the time and super close, we just got together now and then.

She called me after she met the guy and told me she'd met someone she thought I should meet, and who he was. After a month of us not getting together, she threw a party and invited both of us. That's when it started.

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And:

Osamenor said:

spock said:

You said you got an email. From whom? Why did they send you that email? Was there a reason they (whoever sent the email) thought you might be interested?

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It came from one of the herbalism school teachers, and I was on her mailing list, but that's the only emailing list email I ever got from her. Obviously, she doesn't send them out that often! I got on her mailing list because I was interested in herbalism, and she was a friend of a friend (I found her through a link on the mutual friend's website, but didn't get on her list until I'd met her in person, at an unrelated event). I signed up for the list thinking I'd contact her sooner or later and ask some questions about getting into herbalism, but I never did it.

So the email was not specifically for me personally, but it was an answer to the question I'd never asked.

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And:

Osamenor said:

spock said:

That venture, by the way, strikes me as the kind of life-changing development characteristic of what Daniel Levinson, in Seasons of a Man's life, called the Mid-Life Transition. That transition runs from 38 to 43 or 44. It coincides with Uranus opposite Uranus and Neptune square Neptune. I've assumed, since the Uranus transit is the opposition and the Neptune transit the square, that they're probably about the same length. At the very least the former begins no later than age 40. You indicate in one of your posts that your Uranus opposition will be starting pretty soon — “I understand the average age for the Uranus opposition is 42-43.” In fact you're already in it, and your pursuing not just a new career but one that's a complete break with your previous job history is attributable to it. Saturn was squaring your Sun when you began this endeavor, which accounts for the career change per se.

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Saturn was not squaring my sun when I started herbalism school. I have sun at 22 Leo; Saturn was at 14 Sag the day herbalism school began. When I got the email, Saturn was earlier in Sag, but well out of square with my sun. What Saturn was doing when I started this course was transiting my natal moon (15 Sag).

However, there's a detail I didn't include in this thread: I took a different herbalism course two years ago, a basic introductory course, with different teachers, and it just so happens that the teachers in my current herbalism school all studied with those teachers. I got into that one in a similar way: I'd been on a mailing list that had been pretty well dead, then there was suddenly an email sent out about this course being offered again (they'd offered it before, but not for several years)... and that happened when Saturn was squaring my sun.

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And:

Osamenor said:

spock said:

(Different cycles stand out in different people's lives. Saturn-Sun might stand out in yours.) Did you find out about this opportunity when Mars was transiting opposite natal Jupiter?

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Mars wasn't quite there yet. Natal Jupiter is in late Aries (on my IC), and Mars didn't reach my MC until right around Christmas. I got the email at the end of November, but I tend to think of it as December because I was so busy when it came in that I was unable to read my emails for a while. It was early December when I got around to it, mid December when I got the application in. During that time, Mars was transiting Libra, but not quite to my MC and opposition with Jupiter yet.

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And:

Osamenor said:

spock said:

One last thing. I like to check my theories against people's experiences whenever the opportunity arises. You mention on 7/31/16 that "I'm just going on two years of study," whereas if asked I would have guessed July 2014 with Jupiter square and Mars opposite natal Jupiter (although the Mars opposition in September following the Jupiter transit might also make sense). If you don't mind my asking, when did you begin your astrological studies? (Confirmations are nice, but counterexamples are often more informative.)

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It was September. Your second guess is right. I don't remember precise dates, but I do remember that I started reading about astrology again and trying to actually apply it to my chart shortly after I had a solar return reading. My birthday is in mid August (about to happen again)! and I got the reading a few days to a week afterward, and picked up The Inner Sky, which I had read before without really being drawn into it, a week or two after that. This time, I was hooked.

The date that I have a record of is the date I joined this forum--October 4th, 2014--and I joined after maybe two or three weeks of reading astrology books and trying to puzzle out my chart on my own.

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All very interesting and helpful. There's an interesting pattern in your events. In February 2001 you met this guy at a party and then or shortly afterward began a long term relationship. Your friend set you up with him by inviting you both to the same party. Mars was opposing its natal place. In September 2014, not long after a solar return reading — clearly, you had been at least casually interested in astrology for some time — you started reading about astrology "again" and pursuing it seriously, trying to "actually apply it" to your chart and joining this forum shortly afterward, "after maybe two or three weeks of reading astrology books and trying to puzzle out my chart on my own." Mars was opposing its natal place. Last year a family member set you up for an interview that led to a job offer that you accepted. Mars was squaring its natal place. Do you see the pattern? More on this below.

Now consider the herbalism class. When you applied for it in mid-December Mars was applying to the square to natal Saturn. Saturn was opposing natal Mars. The Saturn-Mars transit is probably relevant to the fact that taking this class isn't just a matter of exploring an interest but is a career move: "I'm in a career shift right now, attending herbalism school while working a rotation of part time and temporary jobs." — post dated 7/26/16. But this career move has larger implications. The Mid-Life Transition, as I've noted, runs from 38 to 43-44. The beginning of your serious pursuit of astrology, your introductory herbalism class, and the current one are all, in my opinion, episodes in that transition. At its close, with Saturn opposing its natal place, you might well make career decisions involving herbalism, astrology, or both, that will determine the path your life takes for years to come.

I asked above, "Was there a reason they (whoever sent the email) thought you might be interested?" and you answered, "I was on her mailing list." So she knew you were interested and therefore a prospect when she was setting up the class. Likewise, the earlier introductory course you took was ultimately the result of a mailing list you joined, thereby marking you as a prospect when that person set up her class. As I think I mentioned in one of my posts there is often a time lag between the impetus, timed by astrology, that leads to an external event, and the event itself, which is not necessarily timed by astrology. When a couple decides to get married, for instance, and sets a date six or nine months ahead, it's the date when they decided to set the date, and not the date of the ceremony itself, that coincides with the relevant astrological transits. It's not the "official" event but the internal needs, urges, etc., that drive us to set in motion developments that lead to it that are timed by transits, except when the event itself, such as an elopement, is an immediate response to those urges. It might be interesting to determine, if you can, when you joined those lists. The Mars transits in particular, but not necessarily only the Mars transits, might be interesting.

Return now to the events referenced in the first paragraph above. I've just suggested that both herbalism classes came about because of developments you set in motion. That's obvious with regards to your pursuit of astrology, not so obvious with regards to the relationship and the job offer. I've also mentioned that during transits, as a result of the urges, needs, etc. that accompany them, we sometimes cause events or elicit behavior from others. Their reactions to the way we're coming across sometimes constitute events or lead to them. I should add that we're not necessarily consciously aware of these inner psychological states, in fact we probably usually aren't. Your personal dynamics are interesting in that you don't always overtly pursue your objectives if they involve personal interactions. Rather, you move people to intervene on your behalf, something neither you nor they would be aware of. As these inner urges build up during the transit you express them in subtle ways, including body language, that neither you nor anybody else is consciously aware of but which others, particularly those who know you well, do respond to. And because you're probably pretty likeable (I'm guessing) they (including the one with whom you had a "difficult friendship") do so in ways that are beneficial to you, that help get you what you "want" (even if you're not aware of wanting it).

And by the way, happy 41st birthday. Hope you enjoy it.

muchacho said:

...
Astrology can help you identifying trends in terms of motivation or desires, your natural rhythm or unfolding of your path. Some people never thought of getting married but suddenly that's the only thing that's on their minds and they have no idea why. That's the influence of Dashas and transits. If you then follow that urge, that's a different story again and fully up to you. So as clever and awe-inspiring those astrological calculations may sound, it's always just about probabilities, never certainties.

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I would single out this part as very important
Often overlooked or not given sufficient attention to the motivation.

So transits indicate among other things, our motives. In particular, this applies to transits 'social' planets Saturn and Jupiter, and those "bring" motivation and event.

As already mentioned events can be realized at several levels. Therefore, it is often said that transits do not work. but that's not true. They are either placed on a different level or our motives are different now so it will pass unnoticed or there are some other transits which "hinder" previous transits to accomplish ... etc ...

Transits actually show our feelings and our motivation. they do not really show the type of event. Therefore, it is much easier to determine how someone will feel in an exactly specified period of time than to say which a specific event caused our specific reaction.

For example: Jupiter transit on the Moon ... Correct "translation" (because these are symbols) of the transit would be: Broadening emotional needs of persons

Someone would say, you'll get a relationship ...

Are you sure? Depends. Maybe yes, maybe no.

First and foremost is to know the current circumstances persons. Is the relationship or are married or not...
What are its inner motives...
Are there any circumstances that may prevent the spread of emotional need ...
What position in the natal chart takes Mo and Ju ... etc. etc.

...and what often happens ... (provided that it is a free person, and Mo in the natal chart is not under heavy aspects) or a person enters a relationship, or fall in love with a person but does not enter into a relationship. both is result of transit, because it's it makes no difference for horoscope

But this Mo can be the ruler of some "business houses" for example second house, and instead all of the above get an increase in salary. nothing from falling in love, but is emotional satisfaction is here
Why me transits do not work

Or

the same example of a person is in a romantic relationship ...

At the same transit Ju on Mo.

Depending on the current context of the relationship, a person can be happy but also unsatisfied ...

If previously a person dissatisfied with the the relationship this transit can increase its dissatisfaction.

This can result in a crisis of relations, or may lead until then to meet a new person to fulfill her increased emotional need ...

If a person is satisfied with the current the relationship and partner fulfills the increased emotionally capacity, then the person is happy and satisfied with their the relationship that at that moment can become deeper..

or
this person Mo is ruler of the 9 house, so she decided to take a course or informatics or any other course with the aim of deepening their own knowledge ... and again nothing of relationship


Therefore, you must know the current motivation person but the current circumstances in which person live ...

Without it, you do not have almost nothing

sorry for my English

sasa62 said:

Therefore, you must know the current motivation person but the current circumstances in which person live ...

Without it, you do not have almost nothing

sorry for my English

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Exactly right. You have to know the entire story in order to make correct predictions. A specific context is necessary. In vedic astrology they usually look at a whole bunch of indicators. An event has to be indicated in the birth chart, in progressions (Dashas) and in transits - only when all three point to the same event, the event will have a chance to actually manifest.

spock said:

ting and helpful. There's an interesting pattern in your events. In February 2001 you met this guy at a party and then or shortly afterward began a long term relationship. Your friend set you up with him by inviting you both to the same party. Mars was opposing its natal place. In September 2014, not long after a solar return reading — clearly, you had been at least casually interested in astrology for some time — you started reading about astrology "again" and pursuing it seriously, trying to "actually apply it" to your chart and joining this forum shortly afterward, "after maybe two or three weeks of reading astrology books and trying to puzzle out my chart on my own." Mars was opposing its natal place. Last year a family member set you up for an interview that led to a job offer that you accepted. Mars was squaring its natal place. Do you see the pattern? More on this below.

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Whoa... Mars transits do it?

Is that true for me specifically? Or do Mars squares and oppositions trigger those new beginnings for everyone?

Does it have anything to do with which houses Mars rules, or how Mars is placed in the natal chart (sign, house, aspects)? I would not have thought Mars was such a key player for me.

spock said:

Now consider the herbalism class. When you applied for it in mid-December Mars was applying to the square to natal Saturn. Saturn was opposing natal Mars. The Saturn-Mars transit is probably relevant to the fact that taking this class isn't just a matter of exploring an interest but is a career move: "I'm in a career shift right now, attending herbalism school while working a rotation of part time and temporary jobs." — post dated 7/26/16. But this career move has larger implications. The Mid-Life Transition, as I've noted, runs from 38 to 43-44. The beginning of your serious pursuit of astrology, your introductory herbalism class, and the current one are all, in my opinion, episodes in that transition. At its close, with Saturn opposing its natal place, you might well make career decisions involving herbalism, astrology, or both, that will determine the path your life takes for years to come.

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It sounds like Saturn involvement spells longterm things. Makes sense, given that Saturn is about long range planning and commitments.

In my case, Saturn is the AC ruler. Would it be equally involved in new opportunities for someone who does not have a Saturn ruled AC?

spock said:

It might be interesting to determine, if you can, when you joined those lists. The Mars transits in particular, but not necessarily only the Mars transits, might be interesting.

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I have no idea when I joined the first mailing list. It was so long ago that, while I have a rough sense of which year it may have been, I have no idea what time of year, let alone the date.

I don't remember exactly when I joined the second mailing list, either, but I know it was not long after I met the herbalist at an event, and I do remember the dates of the event (it happened over Presidents Day weekend). During that time, Mars was applying trine to my natal Saturn and sextile to my natal Mars. Mars and Saturn are sextile each other (out of sign but in close orb) in my natal chart. Saturn, meanwhile, was still within a few degrees' orb (separating, although it would return that way retrograde before long) of opposition with my natal Mars.

Jupiter was perhaps involved, too; it was within my natal fire grand trine at the time: pretty exact trine to my natal moon, also trine transiting Uranus, and applying conjunction to my natal sun and trine to natal Jupiter.

I didn't join the mailing list on that date, but I did probably within a week or two after.

spock said:

I've also mentioned that during transits, as a result of the urges, needs, etc. that accompany them, we sometimes cause events or elicit behavior from others. Their reactions to the way we're coming across sometimes constitute events or lead to them. I should add that we're not necessarily consciously aware of these inner psychological states, in fact we probably usually aren't. Your personal dynamics are interesting in that you don't always overtly pursue your objectives if they involve personal interactions. Rather, you move people to intervene on your behalf, something neither you nor they would be aware of. As these inner urges build up during the transit you express them in subtle ways, including body language, that neither you nor anybody else is consciously aware of but which others, particularly those who know you well, do respond to... they (including the one with whom you had a "difficult friendship") do so in ways that are beneficial to you, that help get you what you "want" (even if you're not aware of wanting it).

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I think it's also noteworthy that these things also fulfill other people's desires. A new relationship involves two people (at least) who both want something the other person can give them. A new job involves an employer who wants someone to do the job. The herbalism school is a really striking example: the co-founders had it as their dream for some time, and for everyone else there, it's also a dream fulfillment, it's not just mine. Multiple people's desires come together in all these cases. Astrological transits involved for them, too?

spock said:

And because you're probably pretty likeable (I'm guessing)

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What makes you guess that? Is it my birth chart? Or something else?

spock said:

And by the way, happy 41st birthday. Hope you enjoy it.

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Thanks!

Osamenor said:

spock said:

There's an interesting pattern in your events. In February 2001 you met this guy at a party and then or shortly afterward began a long term relationship. Your friend set you up with him by inviting you both to the same party. Mars was opposing its natal place. In September 2014, not long after a solar return reading — clearly, you had been at least casually interested in astrology for some time — you started reading about astrology "again" and pursuing it seriously, trying to "actually apply it" to your chart and joining this forum shortly afterward, "after maybe two or three weeks of reading astrology books and trying to puzzle out my chart on my own." Mars was opposing its natal place. Last year a family member set you up for an interview that led to a job offer that you accepted. Mars was squaring its natal place. Do you see the pattern?

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Whoa... Mars transits do it?

Is that true for me specifically? Or do Mars squares and oppositions trigger those new beginnings for everyone?

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True for everyone. It's not that new beginnings coincide with Mars transits for some people, and with some other transit(s) for others. Mars transits coincide with a particular type or level of change for everyone. As I wrote earlier, "Mars transiting conjunct, square, or opposite its natal place . . . tends to coincide with decisions or commitments that result in a change in your daily routine — where you go, how you get there, what you do, who you encounter and interact with, and how, how you move around in space and time. Some characteristic events: looking for a new job, or a job change at your current place of employment, rearranging or buying new furniture, changing the grocery store, department store, hardware store or bank we normally do business with, buying a car, starting an exercise regimen or diet plan, a new activity or a revision of an existing one, beginning or ending a relationship (or both). [Also] love affairs appear to begin and end with one of these Mars transits."

Often Mars transit decisions or commitments are part of a larger event. I also wrote, “A colleague turned professional as an astrologer as Saturn transited opening square his NG [i.e., conjunct his ASC]. That is, his sense of identity changed. He came to see himself as a professional astrologer. Within the longer period of the Saturn transit Mars squared its natal place. At that time he contacted the telephone company and arranged for an ad in the yellow pages as a consulting astrologer. That decision both reflected his changing self-image and manifested it at a more immediate level. Now he was taking calls, setting up appointments to meet with clients, doing charts in preparation for such meetings, and meeting with clients. Now he was doing the things a consulting astrologer does."

A person might become enthusiastic about radio controlled airplanes, or model cars, or herbalism, or astrology during a Jupiter transit, and during a Mars transit within or shortly after the period of the Jupiter transit decide to buy an RC plane or model, or to take a class, in order to pursue this new interest. A person might decide to pursue a career during a Saturn transit, and during a Mars transit within that period decide to go to college and study, say, physics in order to effect that change in identity. A couple might decide to get married, again, during a Saturn transit, and again a form of identity change, but the overt commitment to get married, setting the date, will coincide with a Mars transit within the period of the Saturn transit.

Does it have anything to do with which houses Mars rules, or how Mars is placed in the natal chart (sign, house, aspects)? I would not have thought Mars was such a key player for me.

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Rulerships, dignities, debilities, etc. have no more reality than the crystal spheres, epicycles, and deferent circles of ancient astronomy, in my opinion. Likewise for houses and even signs. Aspects to Mars are relevant, not in determining whether we make decisions or commitments during Mars transits, but in affecting the nature of those decisions. I have, for instance, Mars conjunct Saturn. That means every time Mars conjoins, squares, or opposes its natal place it simultaneously conjoins, squares, or opposes natal Saturn. Since Mars transiting Saturn is an inhibiting factor, during which we are especially “aware” of social expectations and rules, the decisions and commitments I make during Mars-Mars transits are shaped and channeled by that fact. These patterns of simultaneity play an important role in how a person's personality develops, by the way. I go into more detail about that in my article After Symbolism.

Now consider the herbalism class. When you applied for it in mid-December Mars was applying to the square to natal Saturn. Saturn was opposing natal Mars. The Saturn-Mars transit is probably relevant to the fact that taking this class isn't just a matter of exploring an interest but is a career move: "I'm in a career shift right now, attending herbalism school while working a rotation of part time and temporary jobs." — post dated 7/26/16. But this career move has larger implications. The Mid-Life Transition, as I've noted, runs from 38 to 43-44. The beginning of your serious pursuit of astrology, your introductory herbalism class, and the current one are all, in my opinion, episodes in that transition. At its close, with Saturn opposing its natal place, you might well make career decisions involving herbalism, astrology, or both, that will determine the path your life takes for years to come.

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It sounds like Saturn involvement spells longterm things. Makes sense, given that Saturn is about long range planning and commitments.

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Saturn is actually about identity — the ego — or more accurately the psychological force, or drive, underlying identity change. (Esteem needs in Abraham Maslow's hierarchy of needs theory is a good starting point for defining the precise nature of the drive.) It's simply a slower rhythm, with longer 'pulses' and longer intervals between 'pulses', than the activity or sensorimotor rhythm that corresponds to Mars periods.

In my case, Saturn is the AC ruler. Would it be equally involved in new opportunities for someone who does not have a Saturn ruled AC?

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Rulership is (in my opinion) an invalid concept and has no bearing. Also, Saturn isn't just about new opportunities per se, except in the sense that any planet's transits could be said to be about opportunities with regards to what that planet's transits are about. Saturn's transits are about identity, or more accurately the psychological force or drive that underlies identity and identity change. And I'd say this is true for everybody. It's simply the nature of the Saturn rhythm.

It might be interesting to determine, if you can, when you joined those lists. The Mars transits in particular, but not necessarily only the Mars transits, might be interesting.

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I have no idea when I joined the first mailing list. It was so long ago that, while I have a rough sense of which year it may have been, I have no idea what time of year, let alone the date.

I don't remember exactly when I joined the second mailing list, either, but I know it was not long after I met the herbalist at an event, and I do remember the dates of the event (it happened over Presidents Day weekend). During that time, Mars was applying trine to my natal Saturn and sextile to my natal Mars. Mars and Saturn are sextile each other (out of sign but in close orb) in my natal chart. Saturn, meanwhile, was still within a few degrees' orb (separating, although it would return that way retrograde before long) of opposition with my natal Mars.

Jupiter was perhaps involved, too; it was within my natal fire grand trine at the time: pretty exact trine to my natal moon, also trine transiting Uranus, and applying conjunction to my natal sun and trine to natal Jupiter.

I didn't join the mailing list on that date, but I did probably within a week or two after.

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I suspect you became strongly interested in herbalism during a Jupiter transit, and I suspect you joined that first mailing list during a Mars transit, but we're not in a position to know if either of these is true. But it does appear that you joined the second list as Mars was opposing your Nonagesimal (which again is simply where in the zodiac you were at the moment of birth). Transits by a planet to its own place and transits by it to your personal self, more commonly but also misleadingly known as transits "over the angles," are the two most important kinds of transits. The career changes that coincide with Saturn-Saturn transits also coincide with Saturn-NG transits, only more overtly, and likewise the changes I've associated with Mars-Mars transits similarly coincide with Mars-NG transits, again more overtly. There is a difference, but it's subtle and difficult to characterize. Essentially, during Mars-Mars transits there's a welling up of an urge to make a change in your daily routine. Something, a need or a lack, that's been bothering you comes to a head. During Mars-NG transits you're more of a self-starter, more likely to do things you might otherwise have put off or not gotten around to. Sometimes we can look back and see that some small thing we just happened to do turns out to have been the beginning of an ongoing involvement with an activity or organization. And that initiative will often be in the service of a larger change, such as a new enthusiasm (during a Jupiter transit) or a career interest (during a Saturn transit).

Please note that all transits I've referred to in posts in this thread are hard-angle transits — conjunctions, squares, and oppositions. That's not to say that trines don't have an effect, but it's not one that leads to events. Quite the contrary. We're less likely to change during soft-angle transits because we're more satisfied with the way things are. (A complete transit analysis for a point or period of time would include both hard-angle transits, indicating areas of stress and possible change, and soft-angle transits, indicating areas of stability and resistance to change. But that's well beyond the current state of the art.)

I've also mentioned that during transits, as a result of the urges, needs, etc. that accompany them, we sometimes cause events or elicit behavior from others. Their reactions to the way we're coming across sometimes constitute events or lead to them. I should add that we're not necessarily consciously aware of these inner psychological states, in fact we probably usually aren't. Your personal dynamics are interesting in that you don't always overtly pursue your objectives if they involve personal interactions. Rather, you move people to intervene on your behalf, something neither you nor they would be aware of. As these inner urges build up during the transit you express them in subtle ways, including body language, that neither you nor anybody else is consciously aware of but which others, particularly those who know you well, do respond to . . . they (including the one with whom you had a "difficult friendship") do so in ways that are beneficial to you, that help get you what you "want" (even if you're not aware of wanting it).

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I think it's also noteworthy that these things also fulfill other people's desires. A new relationship involves two people (at least) who both want something the other person can give them. A new job involves an employer who wants someone to do the job. The herbalism school is a really striking example: the co-founders had it as their dream for some time, and for everyone else there, it's also a dream fulfillment, it's not just mine. Multiple people's desires come together in all these cases. Astrological transits involved for them, too?

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Yes, but more specifically when it's a relationship. Filling a position is, for an employer, a routine occurrence. It's not an event, development, or new direction for him or her. Likewise for the person offering a class. It's likely to be a routine sort of thing, something s/he does on a regular basis. Specific transits would have been involved only when that person became a teacher, or to a lesser extent when s/he began offering that class for the first time. She will not necessarily, if fact not usually, have begun pursuing her dream of teaching herbalism at the same time that you began pursuing your dream of learning it. Now if s/he teaches that class infrequently and decides, every once in awhile, to organize a new one, then yes, that might involve a Mars transit that might or might not be simultaneous with your own. It might be, for instance, that once you took the initiative to put yourself on a mailing list, or were otherwise "on the lookout" for an opportunity to study herbalism, you would when the opportunity presented itself jump on it as a matter of course. You might say you were pre-committed, during an earlier Mars transit, to doing so. It's also possible, of course, that a course offering, whether a spontaneous or routine action on the teacher's part, might just happen to find you experiencing a Mars transit yourself, and therefore especially likely to recognize and take advantage of the opportunity.

With relationships there's no such ambiguity. In that instance both parties will be almost always be experiencing transits at the same time, albeit not necessarily the same ones. Saturn might for instance be transiting its natal place for one person, and natal Venus for the other. In that case the latter's Venus is conjunct, square, or opposite the other's Saturn. Similar considerations will apply with regards to Mars transits, which will time the actual decision to get married or move in together. One person might have Mars transiting its natal place or the NG, the other Mars transiting Venus or Mercury. This doesn't exhaust the possibilities, of course. These are just for instances. What is important is that simultaneous transits imply the existence of aspects between charts. Otherwise, they might pass like ships in the night, having no impact on each other. That's why interaspects are important. Since getting together is an event for both of them, the planets in their charts have to be situated such that they're both primed to experience change at the same time.

And because you're pretty likeable (I'm guessing)

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What makes you guess that? Is it my birth chart? Or something else?

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It's the pattern I think I see with regards to the way change often comes into your life. Transits not only impel us to cause changes but also our way of being during them sometimes elicits reactions from others. People seem to react to you in ways that benefit you, that get you what you want or need, which implies that they're well disposed towards you, which implies that you're likeable.

How do you know when a planet or transit is activated?

NShane said:

How do you know when a planet or transit is activated?

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Activated is a misleading term. It implies that you're asking, when does a transit cause or predict an event? The answer is, transits don't cause or predict events. Ever. There is an effect every time a transit occurs. However, that effect is not what astrologers have traditionally assumed. Transit rhythms — they're rhythms because the effect recurs regularly — are psychological drives. Since drives are motivations — we call them drives because they're innate rather than due to circumstances — we often do something in response to them, but transits don't predict events per se. They predict motivations. They indicate where we're coming from. Even when we don't create a noticeable external event, we change in subtle ways during these recurrent motivational states. In a post earlier this year you noted that "nothing significant occurred" during your Saturn Return. I think that's because you're expecting astrology to tell you what will happen to you, in terms of explicit external events. That's what astrologers have long expected astrology to do, but it doesn't in my opinion. During your Saturn Return you're likely to focus on where you want to go with your life, to set priorities, to get clear on what's important and what isn't in terms of social and career roles and related activities. It won't always coincide with an obvious external event, and the internal changes are unobvious and difficult to spell out. You might find it illuminating to read Erika Jong's Fear of Flying. Although not seen by her as such, it's a detailed account of the issues she wrestled with during her Saturn Return, which were apparently resolved at the end of her story (although, again, you'll find it difficult to specify exactly what was resolved).

In another post, in the horary forum, you wondered "which house would signify moving to a new home to RENT?" Answer: none of them. There is no configuration that will magically deposit you in another apartment or house. It will happen when and if you want it badly enough to make it happen, which most commonly coincides with Mars conjoining, squaring, or opposing its natal place. When you made that post, in fact, on July 6, 2015, stating, "I am desperate to move," Mars was applying to the opposition to its natal place. I don't know if you did move or make a commitment to move during that transit — that depends on circumstances, and whether you wanted it badly enough to overcome them — but it appears you certainly wanted to. That's what astrology is about.

spock said:

Activated is a misleading term. It implies that you're asking, when does a transit cause or predict an event? The answer is, transits don't cause or predict events. Ever. There is an effect every time a transit occurs. However, that effect is not what astrologers have traditionally assumed. Transit rhythms — they're rhythms because the effect recurs regularly — are psychological drives. Since drives are motivations — we call them drives because they're innate rather than due to circumstances — we often do something in response to them, but transits don't predict events per se. They predict motivations. They indicate where we're coming from. Even when we don't create a noticeable external event, we change in subtle ways during these recurrent motivational states. In a post earlier this year you noted that "nothing significant occurred" during your Saturn Return. I think that's because you're expecting astrology to tell you what will happen to you, in terms of explicit external events. That's what astrologers have long expected astrology to do, but it doesn't in my opinion. During your Saturn Return you're likely to focus on where you want to go with your life, to set priorities, to get clear on what's important and what isn't in terms of social and career roles and related activities. It won't always coincide with an obvious external event, and the internal changes are unobvious and difficult to spell out. You might find it illuminating to read Erika Jong's Fear of Flying. Although not seen by her as such, it's a detailed account of the issues she wrestled with during her Saturn Return, which were apparently resolved at the end of her story (although, again, you'll find it difficult to specify exactly what was resolved).

In another post, in the horary forum, you wondered "which house would signify moving to a new home to RENT?" Answer: none of them. There is no configuration that will magically deposit you in another apartment or house. It will happen when and if you want it badly enough to make it happen, which most commonly coincides with Mars conjoining, squaring, or opposing its natal place. When you made that post, in fact, on July 6, 2015, stating, "I am desperate to move," Mars was applying to the opposition to its natal place. I don't know if you did move or make a commitment to move during that transit — that depends on circumstances, and whether you wanted it badly enough to overcome them — but it appears you certainly wanted to. That's what astrology is about.

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Yes, I moved. Right around the same time Jupiter moved into my 4th house. (The whole process flowed almost perfectly). Its Ironic because I moved into an actual house which is 10 times bigger than what I was in previously.

I only feel impacted when planets move into a new sign. Never when they make a transit to a natal planet. I always feel impacted by Jupiter. Got a new job making way more money when it hit my 2nd house, was promoted to a communications type of position when it moved to my 3rd, moved when it hit my 4th, now its going to be moving to my 5th and I'm quite excited for it.



I treat the transits like the weather forecast, its only preparing me to grab an umbrella or not.

spock said:

I have, for instance, Mars conjunct Saturn. That means every time Mars conjoins, squares, or opposes its natal place it simultaneously conjoins, squares, or opposes natal Saturn. Since Mars transiting Saturn is an inhibiting factor, during which we are especially “aware” of social expectations and rules, the decisions and commitments I make during Mars-Mars transits are shaped and channeled by that fact. These patterns of simultaneity play an important role in how a person's personality develops, by the way. I go into more detail about that in my article After Symbolism.

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Great example!

spock said:

I suspect you became strongly interested in herbalism during a Jupiter transit, and I suspect you joined that first mailing list during a Mars transit, but we're not in a position to know if either of these is true. But it does appear that you joined the second list as Mars was opposing your Nonagesimal (which again is simply where in the zodiac you were at the moment of birth). Transits by a planet to its own place and transits by it to your personal self, more commonly but also misleadingly known as transits "over the angles," are the two most important kinds of transits. The career changes that coincide with Saturn-Saturn transits also coincide with Saturn-NG transits, only more overtly, and likewise the changes I've associated with Mars-Mars transits similarly coincide with Mars-NG transits, again more overtly. There is a difference, but it's subtle and difficult to characterize. Essentially, during Mars-Mars transits there's a welling up of an urge to make a change in your daily routine. Something, a need or a lack, that's been bothering you comes to a head. During Mars-NG transits you're more of a self-starter, more likely to do things you might otherwise have put off or not gotten around to. Sometimes we can look back and see that some small thing we just happened to do turns out to have been the beginning of an ongoing involvement with an activity or organization. And that initiative will often be in the service of a larger change, such as a new enthusiasm (during a Jupiter transit) or a career interest (during a Saturn transit).

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Wow... I didn't even know about the NG until this thread, but....

spock said:

Did you find out about this opportunity when Mars was transiting opposite natal Jupiter? You might experience further career developments, which similarly make sense in terms of your Uranus (and Neptune)-timed changes, when Saturn squares your birthplace (i.e., transits over the Asc) and later opposes its natal place.

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Osamenor said:

Mars wasn't quite there yet. Natal Jupiter is in late Aries (on my IC), and Mars didn't reach my MC until right around Christmas. I got the email at the end of November, but I tend to think of it as December because I was so busy when it came in that I was unable to read my emails for a while. It was early December when I got around to it, mid December when I got the application in. During that time, Mars was transiting Libra, but not quite to my MC and opposition with Jupiter yet.

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...I have the NG in early Libra, about 21 degrees early than my MC. Mars transited it a week or so before the email arrived. So while that notification did not coincide with a Mars/Jupiter opposition, exactly, it came right on the heels of a Mars/NG transit.

spock said:

Specific transits would have been involved only when that person became a teacher, or to a lesser extent when s/he began offering that class for the first time. She will not necessarily, if fact not usually, have begun pursuing her dream of teaching herbalism at the same time that you began pursuing your dream of learning it. Now if s/he teaches that class infrequently and decides, every once in awhile, to organize a new one, then yes, that might involve a Mars transit that might or might not be simultaneous with your own.

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That is the situation with this program. All the teachers involved have taught herbalism before, but this year is the first time they've put together anything this ambitious. And then there are the other students in the class, who are all in a similar situation to me regarding interest in herbalism. Comparing notes with others, I've heard a lot of, "I wasn't interested in herbalism at all until recently, then suddenly I was," or, "I've wanted to study herbalism for a while and then this opportunity came along." Sounds like a lot of important Jupiter, Mars, and/or Saturn transits happening, for all of us, within a close time frame.

spock said:

Jupiter transits coincide with new interests, hobbies, enthusiasms and friendships, things you enjoy doing and people you like to be with because you share common interests.

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I have Jupiter coming into conjunction with my NG now. Watching to see if anything new happens!

Osamenor said:

spock said:

Specific transits would have been involved only when that person became a teacher, or to a lesser extent when s/he began offering that class for the first time. She will not necessarily, if fact not usually, have begun pursuing her dream of teaching herbalism at the same time that you began pursuing your dream of learning it. Now if s/he teaches that class infrequently and decides, every once in awhile, to organize a new one, then yes, that might involve a Mars transit that might or might not be simultaneous with your own.

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That is the situation with this program. All the teachers involved have taught herbalism before, but this year is the first time they've put together anything this ambitious. And then there are the other students in the class, who are all in a similar situation to me regarding interest in herbalism. Comparing notes with others, I've heard a lot of, "I wasn't interested in herbalism at all until recently, then suddenly I was," or, "I've wanted to study herbalism for a while and then this opportunity came along." Sounds like a lot of important Jupiter, Mars, and/or Saturn transits happening, for all of us, within a close time frame.

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If this was a new departure for the teachers involved, then I'd expect to see appropriate transits for the time period when this new departure was being set in motion (i.e., sometime before the beginning of the relevant class(es). Likewise for the students. For those who weren't "interested in herbalism at all until recently" I'd expect a Jupiter transit to have coincided with the emergence of that interest. For those who said, "I've wanted to study herbalism for awhile and then this opportunity came along," the Jupiter transit that presumably coincided with the beginning had already come and gone, but the opportunity might have coincided with a Mars transit. I think it's even more likely that whatever they did (putting themselves on mailing lists, or in some other way signalling interest) that facilitated the eventual occurrence of that opportunity (by being on a teacher's list of possible prospects) coincided with a Mars transit.

Osamenor said:

spock said:

Jupiter transits coincide with new interests, hobbies, enthusiasms and friendships, things you enjoy doing and people you like to be with because you share common interests.

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I have Jupiter coming into conjunction with my NG now. Watching to see if anything new happens!

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If you're watching to see if an event happens it might not happen because you're waiting for it rather than doing it. Conversely, I think sometimes watching for the event is the event. When I was studying the Gauquelin Mars Effect research and juxtaposing it to my biographical research in an attempt to figure our the effects of Mars-NG transits I at one point begin keeping a journal so I could more easily include my own experiences in the analysis. Later, reading my journal entries for the period of a Mars-NG transit, I couldn't see anything of note that had coincided with the transit. But at some point it suddenly hit me — doh! — that it was during the transit that I had started keeping that journal! Sometimes the hardest thing to see is what's right in front of you.

In that vein we might ask, what's the significance of the fact that you're "Watching to see if anything new happens"? Recall that I describe Jupiter transits as coinciding with new interests, hobbies, enthusiasms and friendships. (I should add that it also coincides with shifts in pre-existing interests, etc.) If your watching for something new during this Jupiter-NG transit indicates a heightened interest in transit interpretation, that heightened interest likely is the Jupiter-Ng effect. (As an example of how easy it is to not see "events" I just realized, while writing this, that my upcoming vacation trip to Seattle, which is more than "just a vacation" because I'm considering relocating to the west coast, coincides with my current Jupiter Return.)

spock said:

If you're watching to see if an event happens it might not happen because you're waiting for it rather than doing it. Conversely, I think sometimes watching for the event is the event. When I was studying the Gauquelin Mars Effect research and juxtaposing it to my biographical research in an attempt to figure our the effects of Mars-NG transits I at one point begin keeping a journal so I could more easily include my own experiences in the analysis. Later, reading my journal entries for the period of a Mars-NG transit, I couldn't see anything of note that had coincided with the transit. But at some point it suddenly hit me — doh! — that it was during the transit that I had started keeping that journal! Sometimes the hardest thing to see is what's right in front of you.

In that vein we might ask, what's the significance of the fact that you're "Watching to see if anything new happens"? Recall that I describe Jupiter transits as coinciding with new interests, hobbies, enthusiasms and friendships. (I should add that it also coincides with shifts in pre-existing interests, etc.) If your watching for something new during this Jupiter-NG transit indicates a heightened interest in transit interpretation, that heightened interest likely is the Jupiter-Ng effect. (As an example of how easy it is to not see "events" I just realized, while writing this, that my upcoming vacation trip to Seattle, which is more than "just a vacation" because I'm considering relocating to the west coast, coincides with my current Jupiter Return.)

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Good point. Probably, whatever happens for me now (I not only had Jupiter cross my NG in the last few weeks, Mars just crossed my AC, too) will be much easier to see in a year or two or more.

I'm also seeing some other heightened interests, outside astrology. Those heightened interests are going along with accepting more responsibility... maybe associated with Mars crossing my Capricorn ascendant? Saturn is also approaching my moon again... I've felt more focused as I've had this last year's Saturn/moon transits.