Help reading Natal Chart: confirmed birth time

Hi-

I've finally had my birth time confirmed. It is quite different than I originally thought.

Born: June 26, 1973, 9:48 pm
Summit, NJ, USA
Cancer sun / moon in Taurus / Capricorn rising

If people would like to read my chart, I'd appreciate any insights you may offer. I am especially interested how some of the harsher or conflicting aspects may be tempered or overcome.

Many thanks,

Ziggurat

OK, so looking at harsher aspects first - there's a T-square between the Sun, Mars and Pluto, in cardinal signs (the Sun appears to be in a separating conjunction with Saturn, although the orb seems rather more generous than I would normally use so I'm going to set that aside). The school of astrology I'm training with describes a T-square as a "problem-solving machine" - the problem is that presented by the opposition, with the planet at the apex of the T-square indicating a possible solution. So, let's see what's here: -

Mars in Aries in the 2nd. Mars is very comfy in Aries, as it's a sign he rules. Here, he gives you enormous amounts of energy, drive and initiative, and the ability to take the lead. In fact, it suggests you like taking the lead rather a lot, and can be more than a little pushy in order to get to the head of the queue. But this is because you know what you want and you know how to get it, and you probably don't tend to have a lot of time for people who aren't as assertive as you. You would seem to value taking action and asking questions later, and you strive for tangible results and personal security.

This is in opposition to Pluto in the 8th. This is also a strong position for Pluto, as it's his natural house. It gives you a deep and intense perception of the motivations of others, a great deal of sexual energy and a very powerful personal charisma. In the context of the opposition, this placement, I think, brings with it power struggles with others over money, possessions and values - the very things you are striving for through your Mars placement. The conflict represented by this opposition could potentially lead to very heated confrontations, even violence in the right circumstances.

However, at the apex of this T-square sits your Sun in Cancer in the 6th. I think the lunar nature of Cancer softens the opposition to a large extent. Sun-Cancer makes you a naturally empathic individual who is open to the feelings and needs of others, generally rather nurturing and almost parental. This restrains, IMO, some of the more negative energy of the opposition. The Sun here also indicates that you have a strong practical edge, interested in workable solutions to problems.

Got to go, my dinner's ready! Hope that helps.

Lets take this piece by piece and examine some of the more prominent features for your chart.

With the Sun in Cancer in the 6th, you are an empathetic, homeloving individual who strives for security. Service to others is a major part of your life.

The Moon in Taurus in the 3rd, the changing flow of the moon is neutralized in Taurus, due to the sign's stable nature. The Moon is also exalted here, so it feels comfortable here. You probably love road trips and maintain an emotional connection to your brothers/sisters (if you have any)

Saturn grounds Gemini's flightiness and duality. You may feel as if fun and pleasure are restricted in your life. It may seem hard, but Saturn is the Great Teacher. He is known to teach you lessons through restriction and hardship. Bear with him, he is doing you a favor.

Mercury in the 7th (just like me) you are attracted to intelligent individuals, and you may do well in debates or law (law as a knowledge body is 9th house, but lawsuits and open enemies are a 7th house dealing)

I have to go soon, so I may find this post and write more. PM me if you want to know more.

Thank you both for the responses, they are quite informative.

Inconjunct: I am now doing some research on the T-Square. It does seem your approach is quite helpful, that I can look at the T square as a problem to solve. I think what I am trying to piece out is how the opposing, 12th house may also provide a solution, if any, rather than pose more difficulty. I do also wonder how a cancer in the 6th would energize or reconcile the intense opposition. I shy away from violence, etc., but there has undoubtedly been conflict in my life, power struggles, etc. Perhaps as you say, the search for workable, practical solutions. But when the issues get really heated . . .

The notion of a T square being a leader and dynamic does really seem to apply to me. I've been told in a good astro reading years ago that I was built to be a leader. This was not in connection to any configuration, but perhaps he was referring in part to this.

Chris: you have a very interesting perspective, also being a cancer sun, moon in taurus. Thank you. Yes, road trips. Travel has been a big part of my life; I have also lived in many cities, in five different countries. My family relations are not a strong point in my life, though they are still present.

Perhaps you can expound a bit on Saturn's favor in my life. Your read on that restricting influence is certainly accurate. Perhaps it is that these 'lessons' are designed to bring me greater success and stability later in life? The harsh karma may even be a catalyst for some fame later on. Not entirely sure . . .

I do potentially see some dealing with intellectual property law in my chosen career (film). Hopefully not too contentious. Yes, indeed, I am quite attracted to intelligent people as friends, and likely vice versa.

Many thanks again to you both; feel free to indulge more if you so choose-

Ziggurat

ziggurat said:

Thank you both for the responses, they are quite informative.

Inconjunct: I am now doing some research on the T-Square. It does seem your approach is quite helpful, that I can look at the T square as a problem to solve. I think what I am trying to piece out is how the opposing, 12th house may also provide a solution, if any, rather than pose more difficulty. I do also wonder how a cancer in the 6th would energize or reconcile the intense opposition. I shy away from violence, etc., but there has undoubtedly been conflict in my life, power struggles, etc. Perhaps as you say, the search for workable, practical solutions. But when the issues get really heated . . .

The notion of a T square being a leader and dynamic does really seem to apply to me. I've been told in a good astro reading years ago that I was built to be a leader. This was not in connection to any configuration, but perhaps he was referring in part to this.

Chris: you have a very interesting perspective, also being a cancer sun, moon in taurus. Thank you. Yes, road trips. Travel has been a big part of my life; I have also lived in many cities, in five different countries. My family relations are not a strong point in my life, though they are still present.

Perhaps you can expound a bit on Saturn's favor in my life. Your read on that restricting influence is certainly accurate. Perhaps it is that these 'lessons' are designed to bring me greater success and stability later in life? The harsh karma may even be a catalyst for some fame later on. Not entirely sure . . .

I do potentially see some dealing with intellectual property law in my chosen career (film). Hopefully not too contentious. Yes, indeed, I am quite attracted to intelligent people as friends, and likely vice versa.

Many thanks again to you both; feel free to indulge more if you so choose-

Ziggurat

Click to expand...

Saturn's role in your chart is to teach. It is known by some as The Great Teacher or the Lord of Karma. It's teaching methods are different than Mercury (which gives information and rationalizes,) Saturn's teaching method is experience and hardship. It wants you to not just learn, but feel and experience. It also represents order, and discipline.

I hope you don't mind that I take this from a Western Sidereal point of view instead of a Tropical point of view, but I use it, and I may be able to speak to things a bit differently than most.

Leo Rising 1°50"
Sun Gemini 10°26"
Moon Aries 15°49"
Venus Cancer 1°0"
Mars Pisces 9°20"

...

First, with Leo rising, the Sun is a prominent component of your chart. I share this configuration, and know that it means that we walk into a room and have no problem talking to anyone and everyone without realizing that we've actually done it. This may seem weird, because you also feel like all eyes are on you at first, and you have to maintain a positive image.

With Aquarius setting, this means that when you meet someone that you like (erotically), you immediately begin to absolve them of ALL wrongdoing, giving them excuses for their actions and permitting them to walk all over you. Then suddenly, like a flash of lightning, you realize that they have faults, and you can't decide whether to let them go, because the relationship isn't a real relationship, or hold onto them because you made the decision to do it, and you stick with that decision.

With the Sun in Gemini, in the 11th house, it is close to the Part of Fortune, but far enough from Saturn to not be terribly affected. You tend to ask many people's opinions on things that you want to know, probably talking fairly quickly as well. The topics of interest that you float to have to do with where society is going, and the different views on what to do about it. You are interested in politics and the people involved, but probably don't want to take part in it so much.

This placement tends to stiff necks, cold, and flu infections. Expect hoarseness more often than most.

With the Moon in Aries in the 9th close to the MC, you tend to be rather aggressive with the people that you hold close to you. You want to grab them and own them. You oscillate between doing exactly what you want to do, and realizing that you've been selfish; therefore overcompensating by trying to ask and do what your significant person wants to do. You don't understand why other people may not do something when they want to. You are attracted to people who are independent, but will kind of cater to you. You also tend to blame yourself for things that aren't really your fault, because you believe that anything that happens to you should be your fault anyway. Don't worry, you're extremely smart.

With Venus in Cancer, you enjoy fishing and having a beer with close friends and family. It is important because Mercury is combined here that you and those people have in depth conversations that may border on spirituality discussions. In fact, you'll find that you have a major interest in those items that may have been taboo (such as astrology, tarot, 2012 prophesies, etc) even if you don't believe them all. You can also easily pick out the types of things that other people like, and almost feel at times as if you can read their thoughts.

With Mars in Pisces, you like to spend all day in bed with someone. However, you also realize that "those" dreams are better than in reality. It doesn't stop you from trying to make those dreams a reality, and that definitely makes someone you are with lucky. You may find difficulty in doing things you want when it involves having to hurt someone else. I like to word it as a person that can scale any wall they are given, as long as the wall isn't made up of people.

With Jupiter in Capricorn, you aren't very lucky in a traditional sense. You have great knees and can run most of the day with more problems in your feet than knees. However, you can still be lucky in hard work. In the sense that you can get a degree, and work hard to build a firm foundation for yourself with a nice house, and other's will just look at you and say, "You're lucky," despite that you had to work for it all. The inconjunct between Jupiter and Saturn is weak, but it is still enhanced by the Capricorn placement.

With Saturn in Gemini though, the "drill sergeant" tells you that you aren't doing enough be informed of things. It also says that you aren't "good enough" at handling all of the information given to you. It'll never be "happy" though, so you have to accept that this is a side of you that will always ask you to grow, but mustn't be allowed to overwhelm you. The interaction with Saturn makes for a difficult relationship with the father, feeling like the father may be overbearing in demands and in what you are allowed to do. He may even feel manipulative.

With Chiron in Pisces, it is outside it's dignity. You want to help people better themselves, but think that everyone has to do so spiritually on their own accord, and that it's not your place to say anything.

Pluto and Mars are the major players in your chart. The are at opposition, and they are highly irritated. Squaring to the Sun, Pluto tells you that you have to be in complete control of yourself at all times and how you are. It also tells Mars that you need to be in complete control of your actions at all times, and will tend to hold your actions back, increasing your irritation on things and on people until you bottle up so much that it begins to release on other people (which can be good in bed, bad at work).

The way to deal with this is through fifth house/Sagittarius activities. It's important because this is also where your North Node is, and where you will feel like you are maturing and becoming more of a spiritual master. Do this by finding ways to have fun with people and keep things lighthearted. Find "spiritual rituals" that make you feel "complete."

I'd imagine that many people have considered you to be very childlike (not to be confused with "childish") in that you see the entire world and everything around you as a child would, new and wonderful. You intend to bring more into the world than you take from it (if by just a little), and can make material the things that you feel make the world a better place.

Watch your stomach acid and watch for stomach cancer. You'll be fine if you eat right (plenty of veggies with antioxidants and such). Do not smoke (too late, right?) and your throat will thank you later. Don't land on your feet too hard when you exercise (Dr. Scholls). Finally, keep aspirin around for the migraines, and take valerian root or chamomile before bedtime since you have such a hard time shutting your brain off before sleep (and no, I don't mean alcohol).

Dear Kainous,

Thanks very much for having a go at my chart. I am not familiar with sidereal, but from your reading, there are certainly some salient points.

I'd first mention that for a long time, I did not know my birth time, and so had with astrologers assumed myself as a Leo Rising (in a tropical chart). There is something to that characterization, but I'm also prone to some of the Capricorn rising tendencies it seems.

I'm somewhat shy / nervous, occasionally isolated, and deeply empathic and compassionate (so long as nobody rubs me the wrong way), which is indicative of Cancer sun. So it is a strange mix. I was also under the assumption that the Leo rising would tend to emerge later in life as other aspects were worked through or released / eased into, as well me crossing my midheaven.

Your Aquarius tendency in fact resonates with me, unfortunately (but kudos to your read!). As it reads so unfortunately, what would one do to rectify or work with that particular aspect? I do believe now that certain negative tendencies within a chart -- once one becomes aware -- are there to help one learn, release, improve, etc. In other words, if I am, or have displayed a propensity toward "doormat-ness," this is something to transform, no?

The Sun in Gemini, with its overactive, sometimes flighty, multi-faceted and insomniac mind may be incisive on your part (or simply on the sidereal's). I do also resonate with cancer too; it may in fact be something like a Gemini-Cancer cusp type of feel for me. My mother and only brother / sibling are Cancer suns in tropical; at least in the tropical chart, my Saturn (whom I read as my father) falls in Gemini.

I do take some issue with your read the location of the Saturn conjunct; if it is in any way similar to the sun's proximity on the tropical chart, I can tell you from experience -- not the chart -- that living this aspect, despite its broader conjunction, was brutal and psychologically / emotionally debilitating. We are talking life-long severity. Perhaps you can elaborate on the Part of Fortune? I am not familiar with this, or how close it may be affecting my sun. And if I am misreading your read on the conjunction, I apologize in advance.

I don't intend to read a permanent, fatalistic prescription into the chart itself re: Saturn; however, from my life experience, plus reading the way the Saturn aspects itself intensely to Mars and to Pluto, thereby creating the T-square, it casts one intense, long shadow. You do acknowledge the father difficulties further down, and yes, I'd suppose it would impact upon the circulation of information, but not only that.

I can possibly say that it may be the case -- one astrologer has pointed this out -- that the Saturn figure as it reads / sits in my chart specifically is, in essence, smaller than me. That is to say, either its placement, or formations, or whatever, do not overshadow the strengths or integrity of my being in the lifetime. I also have gifts and abilities, as well as handicaps and disadvantages. If I am clear enough in releasing old karmic baggage and transforming myself, I can emerge stronger. The mind is sharp, as you note, and I do appreciate that. Maybe this mind can work itself out from under some of the heaver things that can bog down. But the above task is a huge one, and decidedly not easy, nor very "fun."

Your read on the moon is quite interesting. There are some impulsive qualities. Though I get held up myself in life, I do, at least silently, get peeved with people who do not take action for themselves when it would benefit them to do so. I have identified with moon in Taurus for so long, it is hard to shift that perception immediately, but being Gemini in your read, I am able to hold the different views in my mind w/o judgement at this point. Anything that can shed light and aid progress I feel is ultimately a positive thing.

My biggest question for you re: the entire read is reconciling the very intensive energies you note between Pluto / Mars / Sun. This can be a herculean task. Sometimes, as I greatly appreciate your generous and insightful read, telling a majorly Saturn/Pluto-aspected individual to be more lighthearted is a hard pill to swallow. Ultimately the goal is to lighten one's being in the world, to experience more joy, less sorrow.

But . . . as to how one with these dominant aspects may go about this lightening: practical, effective steps could be a major, and majorly enlightening and valuable (not that you must be the one to provide this, but again, you have made incisive insights around this formation). Finding a spiritual practice that lightens, and instills joy, balance, peace etc. would certainly be a good start -- I agree there, and have had some success with this. If there are other, practical ways to move towards a 'Lightness of Being,' I'm all ears. And fun, but not as others may experience fun? Like my own way of 'funning?' (And what would this be? Writing long meanderings in online forums? Lol . . . suggestions appreciated)

Looking towards the Sag is likely a smart way to go . . . I wonder if the spiritual mastery direction to mollify the harsh Pluto / Mars aspects may also have something also to do with not feeding into the lower vibrational desires of difficulty, hostility, obsession represented by those aspects . . . maybe looking more towards grace, acceptance, absolution, etc. But the whole thing is a rather difficult proposition.

Chiron in Pisces vs. Chiron in Aries . . . well, I have to say that Chiron in Aries, as challenging as it may sound, does resonate with my overall life-picture. It is something akin to the self-worth issues indicated by the dominance of Saturn in the chart.

Something too there with the child-like-ness, I agree. Thank you. I think a more evolved reader may take it as a compliment. I don't, however, come off as very child-like, but the child-like way I perceive the world does not usually fall in traditional modes.

Also, yes on the stomach and insomniac tendencies. No smoking here, can't tolerate it, and never had any desire. Not much of a drinker either. Something to the throat thing, as in, when I do some heavier speaking, I have had a tendency towards losing my voice or going hoarse. Hmm . . .

One last thing I noticed in the switch from a tropical to a sidereal chart: the emphasis seems to change over somewhat from a more Saturn-dominated chart (tropical), w/ Capricorn rising, to a somewhat more Sun-oriented chart (sidereal), with Leo rising, perhaps moving away from the Chiron in Aries, etc. It's almost like Sun bumps out Saturn on the ascendant. This is very interesting shift indeed. Had you noticed this as well? And how would one make an informed decision as to the weight of a tropical over a sidereal perspective? It is hard to say which is 'right'; I'd prefer to be free of Saturn's grip, and be more 'sunny.' Easier said than done (lol)

Thanks again -- I look forward to any feedback you may have

Well, Sidereally, your Saturn also occurs in Gemini. Remember, Western Sidereal also has progressions, so you probably act more like a Cancer than you did as a child.

You may be right though that I'm downplaying the Saturn quality a bit. Saturn acts like that voice that tells you "you aren't enough." However, it builds you up into something that when you look back into the past, you realize that you are so much better than you were. I have Saturn rising (exactly), and I know this influence. Depression is a given. However, the only way to deal with it is to realize that it is only trying to make you grow, and when it gets to be too much, tell yourself that the only person that you are comparing yourself to is the person that you once were.

As for the things that upset you about your chart, I have found that you are exactly the great person you can be, and exactly the worst person that can be at the same time. However, you have to realize how that which you consider to be "horrible" placements can come in handy. You have yet to learn how to use them for your benefit. I can't teach you, for it will hit you upside the head like a ton of bricks one afternoon when you are ready to start shedding tears for something that isn't entirely your fault.

As far as Chiron. I've considered it to be two things. In sign, it tells you how you "tell other people where to improve" I consider Pisces to be its debility, and therefore it just doesn't. In houses, it indicates the area of one's life that one is OCD. That hasn't changed in the two charts.

Finally, steps for improvement.... That is what all Saturnine individuals are actually after when they read through their own chart. First, don't look at squares as "issues." They are only issues when the planetary influences are greatly exaggerated. Think of it as trine so strong that it goes out of control. In this sense, you have a lot of control of yourself anyway because your Pluto/Saturn control issues surface.

What this means in a nutshell is to learn to let go of control. Pluto/Scorpio/8th house lesson to overcome is to "let go." (hence death, and other people's things). With Saturn, I'm about to tell you something that will not make sense at first, but will end up being the most important thing you've heard once it's had a chance to mull over. "Sometimes your test is to BE OKAY with not knowing what your tests are going to be." Basically, you don't have to be prepared for EVERY test.