Does she now want to get back?

The Background
I asked this question a few weeks back, hence the date/time are correct, when I had a strong intuition that she wanted to be back with me.

She is an ex who broke up with me five years ago out of nowhere - one week she was absolutely desperate to be with me, next week she was gone and never contacted me again. I did try for about a year to maintain a friendship but she only replied out of courtesy and eventually I stopped contacting her.

The question
"Does she now want to get back with me?"

I'm not very experienced in horary but here's how I read it ...
- As I'm the querant, my significator is saturn (1st house); hers is the moon (7th house).
- The moon is in a tight applying conjunction to saturn, so that suggests to me that - yes - she is very desperate to get back close together with me.

As the moon is in the 10th that makes it weak hence she isn't contacting me?
And the presence of mars in that conjunction (ruler of the 3rd - communication) indicates that there would be arguments / conflict if we were together?


What's your view?

Is my interpretation right? If not, what is your reading of the chart? Does the chart show anything more about the situation?

Removed Answer - it was determined that the Question is invalid/should not be judged .

Thank-you very much for your reply VeryVenus. All the things you say in your explanation apply ... feelings of hurt, inability of her to communicate etc, etc.

I should clarify my intentions ... I have no interest now in getting back together with her. I loved her very deeply but having opened my heart to her and had her then trample it, I know I will never trust her again. The time has passed since I would consider reconciling.

The reason I posted this question is because I wanted to confirm whether feeling I was getting was intuition or just some kind of hidden wistfulness or desire on my own part. While I thought the chart confirmed it as intuition, I am grateful that you have now provided backup that my interpretation was essentially correct. My personal challenge this year is to trust and follow my intuition more.

Removed Answer - it was determined that the Question is invalid/should not be judged .

Your question is about her motivation, her willingness to get back together. It is not if the two of you will in fact get back together. It is only if she wants to get back together. So the answer will lie in her significator's strength and reception.

To me, the aspect between your significators does not address what she wants. Rather the aspect would address the question of "will the two of you get back together?", which it is not.

So enough caveats and on to delineation.

You are both pretty weak in this matter. You/Saturn are peregrine and she/Moon is in her fall. So you are not focused on the matter, and she is just a weakened actor. And the angularity of your significators seems not to overcome the inherent debility of both of your significators. Additionally, she has mixed and negative reception with you. Reception is the indicator we are looking for in this question as it points to willingness of the significators in the question.

As regards willingness, she/Moon is ambivalent: Moon is mixed/3rd triplicity ruler of Saturn in Scorpio on one hand, while conversely, Moon also does not receive you/Saturn well, with you being in the sign of her fall. So certainly mixed feelings about willingness on her part, part still rejecting and part not. There is no reception from you to her, so I really wonder about your willingness, too, which is understandable, given how you described the breakup:

So, I think there may be a part of her that may want to get back, but her negative reception toward you is a red flag. She is ambivalent about getting back together.

That's my take.

When we look to the question's unfolding, Moon's next aspect is a conjunction with malefic Saturn. I say it is a no-starter.

At this point it very well could be, that the question is considered "frivolous", or asked out of curiosity. (You were simply curious to see if your intuition was right).
Since Horary Astrology works best with highly emotionally charged questions of immediate and practical need, then the validity of the answers is indeed in question...

Ilene - thanks for your reply. It's a good distinction you make about the question being about motivation to get together rather than whether it will actually happen. I now see that when the question is about motivation, we should look at the reception of the significators.

I can imagine she is ambivalent or mixed feelings about getting back - she has natal libra moon. The day she broke up with me I didn't feel that she really wanted to do it, her mouth said one thing, her eyes said another. A real battle of head vs heart.

VeryVenus - thank-you for your further replies. I can see that my question was indirect and therefore could invalidate the chart, it would have been more specific to ask "Is my intuition about her wanting to get back together correct?" - which could of course change all the significators.

That said I don't think I asked it frivolously, I really was very intrigued at the moment I asked it. I was out on a run and it was important enough for me to change the settings on my stopwatch to find out the time I asked the question. I remember the thought hitting me like a train!!

In terms of compatibility charts, I always thought we had a strong positive synastry (not perfect but lots of good stuff) and that played out in us getting along well day-to-day. But our composite chart was full of t-squares which is probably why it fell apart in the end. Both of us have difficult natal charts - I've worked through mine over the years, but she was still stuck back where I was 20 years ago. She has this decade of pluto and uranus to help her unlock all that the issues with her aries and libra planets (7 in total). I'd dig it all out but actually I realise I don't care about her any more.

Alas. It has been discussed in multiple threads over and over again, about what Horary can and cannot do.

Unfortunately, The Universe in all of its vastness, will not entertain every single thought that just happens to pop into your head. But instead, Horary Astrology is suited best for straight forward, practical questions at hand. (Of immediate nature, especially those that have a strong emotional involvement). It is not going to delve into the deep psychological or spiritual issues underlying all your life experiences.
It does not entertain frivolous questions, especially ones just to test astrology and how it corresponds to your intuition. "Is my intuition right?" Is, unfortunately, considered a probing, frivolous question asked out of curiosity. You probably wouldn't pay $95 for a telephone consultation to find out if your intuition was right or wrong this time or simply because you had an " Aha" moment about a long past event in your life. Asking this question doesn't help you in any way, and so you have no business asking "just because" especially since the answers derived from Horary Astrologer are designed to give practical guidance - not to prove a point.
Bonatti: The First [Consideration] is to observe what it is that moves a person to propose or ask a question of an Astrologer; where we must take notice of three motions: the First, of the mind, when a man is stirred up in his thoughts and hath an intent to enquire; a Second, of the superior and celestial bodies; so that they at that time imprint on the thing inquired after, what shall become of it; the Third, of the free will which disposes him to the very act of enquiring; for although the mind be moved to inquire, ‘tis not enough, unless the superior bodies sympathize therewith; nor is such motion of the stars enough, unless by the election of his will the person does actually enquire."
This instruction helps to explain the nature of horary astrology: there should be an "intent to enquire". The querent must have perfect accord between the thought and the deed; intention and action.
A Horary Astrology is a sacred art designed to seek the truth in the success of any lawful matter and the querent then should have a serious intent. "Except where events demand immediate action, the matter should have disturbed his [the querent’s] mind for the space of a day or night or longer;". Bonatti also offers various methods to scrutinize a question for radicality. So after talking with the querent for some time to understand the underlying question, and seeing that presented their question as one in which they have control, choice or influence, he examined significators and how they confirmed/denied what was said. For example with Cancer on the Descendant, he knew that the matter had entirely depended on the other party (the Quiesited) -- this indicated that the Querent must wait for the other party to approach him on the matter (the heavens are not sympathizing with you on the matter). This would also be shown by the Moon in the 7th House. There's another method employing planetary hours to test for charts "radicality" - "As above so below", but we already need not concern ourselves with checking those, since we've established that 2 rules or strictures on proceeding of judging this matter are already broken.

I will just step back in to say that I appreciate the time and effort put into the readings by both VeryVenus and IleneK. I'm sorry to VV if she feels I wasted her time.

While I accept that there is some doubt over my initial question, I don't think it is beyond what horary can offer.

1) Certainly I was not trying to test horary astrology. That would be me hiding something in my garden and then asking "Where is my shoe?".

2) From the reading I did before posting the question, it said that a question should be verifiable. If we could ask her and get her to tell the truth we could verify the answer. To me, an unverifiable question is "Did Scotland vote against becoming independent because god willed it?"

3) In terms of emotional importance the whole matter of her has caused me huge heartache. From time to time that still flares up and I find myself ruminating on what happened. So the question that came to me was the eventual outcome of those ruminations and certainly not just a flippant question plucked from the air - I had subconsciously stewed on it for a long time.

Even now after reconsidering this matter for a few days I don't think I would ask a different question to the one I did. The question I asked is the one that burns inside of me as needing to be answered.

The matter of posting it was to very whether my reading of the horary was correct. Ilene subsequently pointed out it is not the aspects of the significators that matters for this question, it is their strength and reception.


Finally if any of that looks contadictory to what I wrote earlier don't be surprised. I currently have transitting neptune opposing my natal virgo mercury - so confusion definitely abounds. It also explains why I'm working on developing my intuition.

While I don't disagree that you were indeed emotionally disturbed over what seems like a traumatic event in your life, Horary Astrology is a 'sacred art' reflecting 'what above, so below' on urgent matters at hand. The heavens won't always reflect on every feeling and every thought you have at any given time. While I know you were not testing astrology with any malice, and instead testing your own intuition with the HELP of astrology (i.e. to prove a point), do you really think that it would be ethically correct for you to 'verify the matter' as you claim - call your partner for example, when you have no intentions of getting back together, for the sake of knowing? Wouldn't it be cruel? Would you say then: "jenny, I am calling to test my intuition - would you like to now get together?" What would 'Jenny' say?

For the Horary to answer: "will something come to pass" and the Querent earnestly praying to find the truth, in any lawful, practical and serious matter 'at hand', where thought is connected to action, for it to be justifiable. What action is connected to this thought? Is there any real life decision that will be based on the answer?

I also asked you, would you have paid $95 for the consult on the phone, to find out something for the sake of knowing? If you wouldn't, then you know that it's not a valid Horary. And let's face it, that which is easily accomplished, is hardly appreciated, therefore, there's a question of value - you believe, that a mere thought which will make no difference in your life, is suddenly SO important that it will be answered by God and by the divine. I assure you, that it's not. The Universe wouldn't want you to know - and if you really wanted to know, you would have called 'jenny' long time ago. If we could measure your thought in wavelengths on a scale of importance of major events at this given time, it would probably measure as the tiniest of waves - an undercurrent, perhaps.

...Furthermore, as mentioned earlier, I don't believe that it would be ethically correct to enable dwelling on the past. The past is like you thinking about having eaten a tomato. You have already eaten the tomato. It was beautiful, big, and ripe - yes. But it's now gone! You've already eaten it! Do you feel like eating a tomato once in a while - sure; jenny too maybe ruminating on the same tomato 'sometimes', BUT! its no longer relevant, in the present time. Look to the future, take away the lessons from the past, but focus on the PRESENT: this very moment is what matters. Don't let the past take away from your present, or take away from the appreciation of the grand, wonderful future that lies ahead.

Good luck.
VeryVenus.