part of death

[terrcolomba]

http://alabe.com/cgi-bin/chart/pics/2456031435954.gif
my horary am i going to die?

part of death is 13 aries in the 8th

mercury in aries and flows to part of death
moon and 8th ruler quincunx it
8th ruler mars is in fall

8th ruler conjunct moon
does it mean that i will die?

thanks

[bubuza_dulce]

I'm just a beginner and I could not interpret the chart astrologically.

But I couldn't help notice something. Was that your question - "Am I going to die"? Because in this case the answer can be only yes! And as I suppose you meant something else (or not) the chart does not give you a correct answer if the question is not clear.

And equal houses are not meant to be used in horary as I read in some articles.
Usually only major aspects are used.
"8th ruler conjunct moon" as you said is a positive answer so you verified a known truth!

[bubuza_dulce]

Now I've read some of your other posts. I'm so sorry for your troubles...
But as I see you've cast charts for the same question many times I feel they're irrelevant. I get the same when playing with my Tarot cards. I ask the same question until I get the answer I want. Only the first time when the question came into your head means something. The rest reflect desires and fears but not the truth.

[terrcolomba]

Originally Posted by bubuza_dulce

I'm just a beginner and I could not interpret the chart astrologically.

But I couldn't help notice something. Was that your question - "Am I going to die"? Because in this case the answer can be only yes! And as I suppose you meant something else (or not) the chart does not give you a correct answer if the question is not clear.

And equal houses are not meant to be used in horary as I read in some articles.
Usually only major aspects are used.
"8th ruler conjunct moon" as you said is a positive answer so you verified a known truth!

i asked the question only once,this chart is the same as on my thread and i am asking about these aspects now is because i have been told by some(not on my thread) that i am going to die in the next two years and a half.

when i asked the question i asked am i going to die in the next 2 years and a half?

[bubuza_dulce]

I don't know if you did this but if you're interested in the next two and a half years period of time you should study transits, progressions, solar return charts and other charts from predictive astrology.

Maybe you'll be even surprised to find something good in them.

[terrcolomba]

does it mean that i will die in the next two years and a half? anyone?

[SagiCap]

I'm sorry but I don't think asking this is ethical or will do you any good. And for your own good, I won't answer. Why don't you ask "how am I going to live a good life? What is the best way?"

I don't know of any good astrologer who is in their right mind and would answer this question.

[terrcolomba]

Originally Posted by SagiCap

I'm sorry but I don't think asking this is ethical or will do you any good. And for your own good, I won't answer. Why don't you ask "how am I going to live a good life? What is the best way?"

I don't know of any good astrologer who is in their right mind and would answer this question.

i'm sick and i want to know if i am going to die so i can say goodbye before and take measures to prevent it if i can(dr. farr opinion)

[R.J.]

Originally Posted by terrcolomba

i'm sick and i want to know if i am going to die so i can say goodbye before and take measures to prevent it if i can(dr. farr opinion)

You CANNOT ask ANY question in horary astrology...that deals with your own personal demise or death...

That question is strictly out of bounds...since DEATH solves everything...Death is the final arbiter of things.

There are also legal and ethical questions to consider... If you do a consultation for another person predicting their own death and that person happens to die, don't be surprised if the police come knocking on your door... !

If you are really that fixated on your own demise, study your own natal chart's progressions, transits and directions...

If anyone tells you (on this site?) that death can be forecast through the horary chart, you have my permission to laugh at them...

Meanwhile, if you have EVER entertained thoughts of suicide, you should seriously consider getting some counselling in your local community...of New York City...

This site also has very clear rules about those asking questions of death or thoughts of death...

You NEED help...you might have mental health issues...

take care of yourself,



R.J. Smith

[SagiCap]

Originally Posted by terrcolomba

i'm sick and i want to know if i am going to die so i can say goodbye before and take measures to prevent it if i can(dr. farr opinion)

My heart truly goes out to you. There is nothing more on this earth that I can be more genuine about, but if you are asking me (by PM) and on this site, I must reply truthfully in my own best conscience. I would not even venture to look into a chart for that information because I believe in God and that even if we "think" we know from a chart, its liable to change at God's will. Also, it would depend on the astrologer's knowledge - and I would never leave my destiny in the hands of another human being, even if it's only the thought. You will not have control over this. We should all tell our family we love them and take measure to be healthy if possible every single day.

[terrcolomba]

i don't have mental illness R.J and one can take measures to prevent it if they know that before(dr. farr opinion)

thanks sagicap.

does anyone know what these aspects mean in this horary?

[Kaiousei no Senshi]

part of death is 13 aries in the 8th

mercury asc me in aries and flows to part of death
moon and 8th ruler quincunx it
8th ruler mars is in fall

8th ruler conjunct moon
does it mean that i will die?

thanks

No, that doesn't mean that. I wouldn't really use the Part of Death, I honestly don't use any of the Lots except for Fortune, and even then only if the question itself calls for it. It starts to get weird otherwise. The Part of Death doesn't even really do anything in this chart. I guess you could make the argument that the Lord of the Ascendant applies to it, but I think 8° is probably too far for Mercury to aspect a Lot, and I wouldn't count quincunxes for anything.

[SagiCap]

Originally Posted by Kaiousei no Senshi

No, that doesn't mean that. I wouldn't really use the Part of Death, I honestly don't use any of the Lots except for Fortune, and even then only if the question itself calls for it. It starts to get weird otherwise. The Part of Death doesn't even really do anything in this chart. I guess you could make the argument that the Lord of the Ascendant applies to it, but I think 8° is probably too far for Mercury to aspect a Lot, and I wouldn't count quincunxes for anything.

What I don't understand is that, if the Part can be calculated for anything, Part of Death, Part of Fortune, Part of Cucumbers, all Parts will be a systematic mathematic equation in every chart, garnering them all in existence, but if there is no active energy towards it, as Kaiousei says; POD "doesn't even really do anything in this chart" then what is activating that Part? How is it expressed. I have Part of Murderer in my chart like we all do, yet I am not a murderer. It's not activated.

[R.J.]

Originally Posted by 375692

i don't have mental illness R.J and one can take measures to prevent it if they know that before(dr. farr opinion)

thanks sagicap.

does anyone know what these aspects mean in this horary?

Terrcolomba;

Sorry for the misunderstanding...Assessing mental health is going way beyond the purvue of this site...so I'm not going there, deliberately...

What I was suggesting was that maybe... you might need some sympathetic ear to talk to... about your current situation.

In any event, horary astrology is a very special sub branch of astrology that has literally helped thousands of people over the years...

But, even the horary chart, as magnificent as it is, has its limitations...

Some very well known horary astrologers (like John Frawley and Radu, the former owner of AW) advocate or claim that that EVERY horary chart..is a readable chart....

I strongly disagree... Not ALL horary charts are readable...

They claim that horary charts are also event charts, so why not interpret the event, as well as the question...

So...according to Mr. Frawley's reasoning...? If you can't enter the house from the front door, simply go to the back door or to another room and break into the house...like a burglar...? LOL

Break and enter, at your will ? And, as long as you get your way..."all is good" according to Mr. Frawley...

This is just incredibly misguided advice...How about... if the front door (or a house?) cannot be opened, for some reason, then maybe it's because you were NEVER meant to live in that house....

Fate versus free-will, perhaps ?

So, maybe you, the beginner, have been sucked in... to believe Frawley, as well ?

Horary astrology is actually the highest, purest form of astrology that there is... The honest answer that you often get from a horary chart must supercede all other answers and auguries...

This is why the Lillys and Bonanos have taught us you only have ONE chance to ask the question...You cannot repeatedly ask the question in horary astrology...

Therefore, if you consult a horary chart, then later go to see a tarot card reader and psychic to ask the very same question, you are essentially telling the universe.... that you do not really trust or have faith in the horary chart process...

It's that very notion of non-confidence in the astrologer, that is the key issue, here...

Unfortunately. many newcomers to horary try to get sneaky by re-asking the question until they (finally) hear what they want to hear ?!

Consulting a horary astrologer is much like getting a verdict from the Supreme Court...

If you do not 'like' the verdict given by the Supreme Court judge, you'll have to live with it...in other words, 'tough titties' for you, the querent !

You cannot appeal or re-ask the question, over and over, as Frawley or Radu suggest...That would make a complete mockery of the strictures against judgement...

In real life, you cannot sleep or reside at the local court house or judge's chambers in your community. A courthouse is a place of judgement and court business, BUT, it is NOT meant to be a dwelling place....

How ironic, then, that some people live on this horary bulletin board ask repeated questions about their personal lives on an almost daily basis...

Should the horary section be like a hotel for tourists, or should it be a place for only the most critical of judgements (like a court house ?)

This is my main beef with this horary site, that people are coming here mostly out of curiosity and boredom, but not for any real intents and/or purposes...

We must remember that consulting a horary chart is never your personal ' right, nor is it a game or toy ? it's a priviledge..

In Lee Lehman's book, The Martial Art of Horary Astrology, she claims that horary astrologers must seize the moment, (like martial artists) by somehow concentrating or focusing on the question asked...

I honestly think that Lee Lehman wants to propogate her martial arts phiiosophy onto astrologers...

That's unfair of her...

As a long-time horary specialist myself, I personally do not make such demands on my own clients...

I also do not feel that its necessary that horary astrology should be turned into a martial art, nor should horary practicioners practice martial arts...

What should we expect, then, of the horary querent ?

In my view, the only expectation that we should have (of the querent) is that the querent have a sense of honesty, open-mindedness, and/or humility and that they will accept the higher wisdom of the astrologer interpreting the chart...

The reason? If you, the querent of horary astrology, cannot defer to the wisdom of a higher authority, then why bother asking the question in the first place ?


yours in horary astrology,



R.J. Smith

[Kaiousei no Senshi]

Originally Posted by SagiCap

What I don't understand is that, if the Part can be calculated for anything, Part of Death, Part of Fortune, Part of Cucumbers, all Parts will be a systematic mathematic equation in every chart, garnering them all in existence, but if there is no active energy towards it, as Kaiousei says; POD "doesn't even really do anything in this chart" then what is activating that Part? How is it expressed. I have Part of Murderer in my chart like we all do, yet I am not a murderer. It's not activated.

Well, in his course on natal medieval astrology, Zoller explains that typically parts had to be activated by being in an aspect with one of their rulers (domicile, exaltation, triplicity, face, or term) to be activated. If not they were pretty much useless. There are some exceptions for this rule, namely the Hermetic Lots, but there are only 7 of them. I'm not sure this rule really applies to horary, but I'd just rather not use any but Fortune regardless.

[Sanaqua]

Hi Terrcolomba,


From my personal experience, aspects with 8th ruler or planets being into 8th dont necessarily mean death. 8th house is generally associated with fear and loss also. And sometimes it represent extreme fear or depression also. It may mean tangled into problems also or sometimes financial loss or a person coming under huge loans. You have not attached chart with your question, so i cannot make guesses what type of loss it may be, neither can anyone here.


When we're surrounded with problems or are suffering from health issues, it is sometimes very natural to feel disappointed and dejected and having feelings of death. Pluto being attributed with 8th house has the similar meanings.


We all have to die one day and death is a transformation, from material into immaterial form. Soul is immortal. Please, think about the good things. I know this is way too difficult thing to practice but we cant really do anything about it. Please do consider what i said about 8th house and its rulers.


Peace,
Sanaqua.

Originally Posted by terrcolomba

i don't have mental illness R.J and one can take measures to prevent it if they know that before(dr. farr opinion)

thanks sagicap.

does anyone know what these aspects mean in this horary?

[Munch]

Originally Posted by R.J.

Terrcolomba;

Sorry for the misunderstanding...Assessing mental health is going way beyond the purvue of this site...so I'm not going there, deliberately...

What I was suggesting was that maybe... you might need some sympathetic ear to talk to... about your current situation.

In any event, horary astrology is a very special sub branch of astrology that has literally helped thousands of people over the years...

But, even the horary chart, as magnificent as it is, has its limitations...

Some very well known horary astrologers (like John Frawley and Radu, the former owner of AW) advocate or claim that that EVERY horary chart..is a readable chart....

I strongly disagree... Not ALL horary charts are readable...

They claim that horary charts are also event charts, so why not interpret the event, as well as the question...

So...according to Mr. Frawley's reasoning...? If you can't enter the house from the front door, simply go to the back door or to another room and break into the house...like a burglar...? LOL

Break and enter, at your will ? And, as long as you get your way..."all is good" according to Mr. Frawley...

This is just incredibly misguided advice...How about... if the front door (or a house?) cannot be opened, for some reason, then maybe it's because you were NEVER meant to live in that house....

Fate versus free-will, perhaps ?

So, maybe you, the beginner, have been sucked in... to believe Frawley, as well ?

Horary astrology is actually the highest, purest form of astrology that there is... The honest answer that you often get from a horary chart must supercede all other answers and auguries...

This is why the Lillys and Bonanos have taught us you only have ONE chance to ask the question...You cannot repeatedly ask the question in horary astrology...

Therefore, if you consult a horary chart, then later go to see a tarot card reader and psychic to ask the very same question, you are essentially telling the universe.... that you do not really trust or have faith in the horary chart process...

It's that very notion of non-confidence in the astrologer, that is the key issue, here...

Unfortunately. many newcomers to horary try to get sneaky by re-asking the question until they (finally) hear what they want to hear ?!

Consulting a horary astrologer is much like getting a verdict from the Supreme Court...

If you do not 'like' the verdict given by the Supreme Court judge, you'll have to live with it...in other words, 'tough titties' for you, the querent !

You cannot appeal or re-ask the question, over and over, as Frawley or Radu suggest...That would make a complete mockery of the strictures against judgement...

In real life, you cannot sleep or reside at the local court house or judge's chambers in your community. A courthouse is a place of judgement and court business, BUT, it is NOT meant to be a dwelling place....

How ironic, then, that some people live on this horary bulletin board ask repeated questions about their personal lives on an almost daily basis...

Should the horary section be like a hotel for tourists, or should it be a place for only the most critical of judgements (like a court house ?)

This is my main beef with this horary site, that people are coming here mostly out of curiosity and boredom, but not for any real intents and/or purposes...

We must remember that consulting a horary chart is never your personal ' right, nor is it a game or toy ? it's a priviledge..

In Lee Lehman's book, The Martial Art of Horary Astrology, she claims that horary astrologers must seize the moment, (like martial artists) by somehow concentrating or focusing on the question asked...

I honestly think that Lee Lehman wants to propogate her martial arts phiiosophy onto astrologers...

That's unfair of her...

As a long-time horary specialist myself, I personally do not make such demands on my own clients...

I also do not feel that its necessary that horary astrology should be turned into a martial art, nor should horary practicioners practice martial arts...

What should we expect, then, of the horary querent ?

In my view, the only expectation that we should have (of the querent) is that the querent have a sense of honesty, open-mindedness, and/or humility and that they will accept the higher wisdom of the astrologer interpreting the chart...

The reason? If you, the querent of horary astrology, cannot defer to the wisdom of a higher authority, then why bother asking the question in the first place ?


yours in horary astrology,



R.J. Smith

Well said and a good reminder for many of us. I have a tendency to read and then reread tarot questions. Mostly because I don't have faith that I am reading them right. I suppose why that's why I don't put too much faith in them so much as kinda glancing out my periphery to make sure I am not about to get totally smacked. That's the level that I want my horary readings at if I get one. My reasoning is I just want to know if I am wasting my time or not. If there is a chance it will work out, that's all I want or need. I can fill in the rest. If there is no chance, the same applies.

[terrcolomba]

in my horary part of death is activated, part of death in aries quincunx mars and sextile sun(dignity) and part of death and 8th is mars opposition sun(dignity)

lot of fortune is in pisces and libra is the 8th from that. Jupiter and Venus are together in the sign of Taurus. is this death indication?

the lot the killing planet is in aries, making mars the abscissor and mars as abscissor on the ASC


thanks for your replies

Kaiousei no Senshi,you use lot of fortune, what about the lot of fortune indication i mentioned?

well said R.J, do you agree this chart is readable?

i have posted a chart, sanaqua

[Kaiousei no Senshi]

in my horary part of death is activated, part of death in aries quincunx mars and sextile sun(dignity) and part of death and 8th is mars opposition sun(dignity)

Quincunxes and semi-sextiles don't count, so it's not activated.

Kaiousei no Senshi,you use lot of fortune, what about the lot of fortune indication i mentioned?

The Part of Fortune really isn't relevant in an inquiry on death. You could be justified in using it in that it relates to the body and health issues, but I'm not so sure it works like this in horary where it's generally a symbol of material value. For further reading on this matter, I would suggest looking into Zodiacal Releasing which will really give you some more utility for the Hermetic Lots.

Really the only thing in this chart to be worried about is the generosity between the First and Eighth house lords, but since there is no aspect between them you'll be okay.

[waybread]

terrcolumba, I admire your persistence, but surely you realize by now, after multiple attempts, that you are not going to get the answers you seek. Suppose somebody told you that you were going to die in 5 years? Or 6 months? How would the timing make a difference to you?

Obviously if you have an illness that is potentially life-threatening, you should get your affairs in order right now. But shouldn't all of us keep our affairs in order, as best we can, at all times?

Obviously if you want to say good-bye to loved ones, you should think right away of making and keeping loving contact with them now.

So just imagine that this 2.5-year death-clock prediction is correct. How would you live your life differently? Be kinder to your loved ones? Make sure your will is up-to-date? Write a living will? Do a few things you've always longed to do but kept putting off? You can do these things immediately, and if you live to be 103, the rest of your life will be kinder, more fulfilling, and more orderly.

Sounds like a plan.

[Kaiousei no Senshi]

To be fair, death is a part of life that everyone will have to confront on some level sooner or later. Wondering and asking about it is not a sin or a sign of mental illness. It's a perfectly normal part of human life. Many of us would rather not think about when our time will come and shun the idea of being able to find out when that time will be, and that's fine. Others would prefer to know, and that should be fine too.

We're astrologers. We judge charts, not people.

[Culpeper]

As you asked me by PM, I have looked at your horary chart. Your significator, Mercury, does not aspect either Mars which rules the 8th house or Jupiter which rules the fourth house. In addition I calculated several dangerous Hellenistic lots/parts including several death lots and anareta and none are active. You are not in imminent danger.

[anoop.indirapuramghazibad]

Here Moon with 8th lord indicates depressed/dejected mood. But there is possibility of change in Dr. or change in line of treatment, 2. Patient must keep faith in recovery. Certainly recovery chances are there (But positive attitude is most important).

[Sanaqua]

Hi Terrcolomba,


The AC is at 13* Virgo, making your rulling planet Mercury which is placed at 5* Aries. Look at Venus at 2 degree Taurus (in its domicile). Terrcolomba, for a death prediction or a serious situation like a death, there should be extremely bad aspects and no good placement. Venus is strong and Mercury is in mutual reception by Face. It means that mercury is recieving some good energy from a fortunate planet.


Your co-significator is Moon. Moon is conjuncting Mars retro but both Moon and Mars are in the triplicity of Venus (which is ofcourse a fortunate planet). Venus is master of both Moon and Mars and is in domicile, so it's a positive sign rather than negative.

If you say that Mars is the ruler of your 8th house, Notice one thing that Mars is retro also. And retro means something "going back". Secondly, Mars rules your 3rd house of communication/news/messages (Scorpio) also. And since, Mars is very weak in Virgo as well as in retrograde, it may some news which is not true or which has not so strong grouds (Virgo). It may be a reference to the prediction you got from someone about your death (Since scorpio is there also). 8th house's other ruler which is Pluto is in 4th house in Capri. I can be anything but i dont consider it a signification of death by any means.


About your long illness, Look at the Neptune (long illness) in 6th house (house of health), it indicates an illness which requires possibly a long hospitalization or simply a long illness but look Neptune too is in Pisces, in its own sign.


Mercury your significator is already in 8th house in Aries but it shows extreme depression and blood rush towards head. You should be very careful about your Blood Pressure. Get it checked up by doctors regularly and start home remedies like avoiding salt and eating garlic cloves to prevent it before it becomes dangerous. Mercury will be making a square with Pluto in 4 degrees. This period is especially tensed. There is something strong and powerful from your family side.


I dont see any sign of death from the chart (as far as i know about astrology and have read it). When a person is experiencing such a situation, there're no good things in the chart. Please, be positive.



Take care,
Sanaqua.

[terrcolomba]

Originally Posted by Sanaqua

Hi Terrcolomba,


The AC is at 13* Virgo, making your rulling planet Mercury which is placed at 5* Aries. Look at Venus at 2 degree Taurus (in its domicile). Terrcolomba, for a death prediction or a serious situation like a death, there should be extremely bad aspects and no good placement. Venus is strong and Mercury is in mutual reception by Face. It means that mercury is recieving some good energy from a fortunate planet.


Your co-significator is Moon. Moon is conjuncting Mars retro but both Moon and Mars are in the triplicity of Venus (which is ofcourse a fortunate planet). Venus is master of both Moon and Mars and is in domicile, so it's a positive sign rather than negative.

If you say that Mars is the ruler of your 8th house, Notice one thing that Mars is retro also. And retro means something "going back". Secondly, Mars rules your 3rd house of communication/news/messages (Scorpio) also. And since, Mars is very weak in Virgo as well as in retrograde, it may some news which is not true or which has not so strong grouds (Virgo). It may be a reference to the prediction you got from someone about your death (Since scorpio is there also). 8th house's other ruler which is Pluto is in 4th house in Capri. I can be anything but i dont consider it a signification of death by any means.


About your long illness, Look at the Neptune (long illness) in 6th house (house of health), it indicates an illness which requires possibly a long hospitalization or simply a long illness but look Neptune too is in Pisces, in its own sign.


Mercury your significator is already in 8th house in Aries but it shows extreme depression and blood rush towards head. You should be very careful about your Blood Pressure. Get it checked up by doctors regularly and start home remedies like avoiding salt and eating garlic cloves to prevent it before it becomes dangerous. Mercury will be making a square with Pluto in 4 degrees. This period is especially tensed. There is something strong and powerful from your family side.


I dont see any sign of death from the chart (as far as i know about astrology and have read it). When a person is experiencing such a situation, there're no good things in the chart. Please, be positive.



Take care,
Sanaqua.

what does venus signify in the horary? mercury and venus in mutual reception, moon and mars in the triplicity of venus?

you said that 8th house ruler mars in retro and means something "going back", will my health get better?

you said that mercury my significator is already in 8th house in Aries but it shows extreme depression and blood rush towards head. You should be very careful about your Blood Pressure, how long will it last and i should be careful?

Mercury will be making a square with Pluto in 4 degrees. This period is especially tensed. There is something strong and powerful from your family side.

what is that something? strong and powerful from my family side? does it have to do with my health or death?

do you consider the lot of killing, lot of death and lot of fortune i mentioned?

thanks for your help


thanks Kaiousei no Senshi, anachiel said that it means death will assist my recovery http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...ad.php?t=48203
and ruler of lot of death is mars in opposition to sun(dignity), is it not activiated?

thanks waybread, i agree.

thanks Culpeper, did you consider the lot of killing, lot of death and lot of fortune i mentioned? lot of killing and fortune are activiated

thanks anoop.indirapuramghazibad.