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  #8101  
Unread 11-19-2019, 03:20 PM
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Originally Posted by david starling View Post
I haven't read much of it yet. What about her take on Saturn?

I hold the view that the Signs "own" the Houses, and the rulers "own" the Signs. But not rulers owning Houses. For example, H1 is the House most suitable for transferring the qualities of Aries. And, Mars is strongest in Aries. But Mars isn't necessarily at its strongest in H1 unless Aries is in the House along with it. Otherwise, I'd be conflating Signs and Houses. So, I don't see H11, for example, as imparting Uranian characteristics, unless the planet is actually in the House. Otherwise, I would be conflating rulers with Signs. She does seem to be conflating rulers with Houses.
Great mood-setting. Kind of spooky, when she was describing Pluto.
Glad to hear your explanation. Can you describe how you separate rulers from signs in that way? Particularly with the example you use of the 11th house - the way it seems to operate to me it has some kind of Uranian ground rules. I wouldn’t know how to call them “Aquarian rules” without the Uranian influence. (Does your autocorrect force you to say Iranian, by the way??)
I haven’t seen yet a Modern way of delineating similarities and differences between houses and signs that makes sense to me in that “clicking” way. Vedic astrologers seem to refer to planets having natural domicile in houses rather than rulership.

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  #8102  
Unread 11-19-2019, 05:09 PM
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Here’s something else she wrote with a Little blurb about Saturn within. I like what she has to say about the 6/12 and other axis.

http://mysticmarguerite.com/WebDocs/Texts/MagicWorkers.html

You can copy-paste the link if the underlining isn’t there.
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  #8103  
Unread 11-19-2019, 05:14 PM
AJ Astrology AJ Astrology is offline
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Re: Random Thoughts, strictly Text

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Well, now I've done it. I inadvertently got J.A. off and running on serial killers with Aquarian Suns, worldwide!
And here we thought all Sun Aquarians were angels, sent from heaven. So disillusioning!
Hi david starling,

That's all he's got. He can't actually refute your premise so all he can do is provide a grocery list of serial killers and he can't even show Sun as a causal factor.
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  #8104  
Unread 11-20-2019, 01:17 PM
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Re: Random Thoughts, strictly Text

@Passi you seem to be rather interested in Saturn. What do you think is the reason why you are drawn to it?
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  #8105  
Unread 11-20-2019, 01:22 PM
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Well, now I've done it. I inadvertently got J.A. off and running on serial killers with Aquarian Suns, worldwide!
And here we thought all Sun Aquarians were angels, sent from heaven. So disillusioning!
Care to fill me in the details? Love myself some good drama 👍

And also don't you think the "angel" title fit Pisces instead? Aqua are more like aliens or time-travelers coming to kick some sense into weak human
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  #8106  
Unread 11-20-2019, 02:09 PM
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@Passi you seem to be rather interested in Saturn. What do you think is the reason why you are drawn to it?
Maybe cause I never liked it but even what we reject catches up with us eventually.
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  #8107  
Unread 11-20-2019, 08:45 PM
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Re: Random Thoughts, strictly Text

David, on the 12/12 there will be a full moon in Gemini, your NN! Officially Xmas for 12/12!
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  #8108  
Unread 11-21-2019, 01:12 AM
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Re: Random Thoughts, strictly Text

Wtf with this mercury stationary day. Sounded so well aspected. One minor idiocy after another.

Last edited by passiflora; 11-21-2019 at 08:48 PM.
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  #8109  
Unread 11-21-2019, 03:32 AM
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Wtf with this mercury stationary day. Sounded so well aspected. One minor idiocy after another. Please let destroying my favorite pan just now be the end of it.
Mars just ingressed Scorpio. It seems to be somehow interfering with the mental acuity of Mercury in Scorpio. Both good placements, but somewhat out of synch.
Not sure what you meant about auto-correct and Iranian instead of Uranian. Is your phone doing that? I've found that a phone needs you to verify words it's unfamiliar with, so it can recognize them the next time.

Last edited by david starling; 11-21-2019 at 03:37 AM.
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  #8110  
Unread 11-21-2019, 04:55 AM
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Originally Posted by david starling View Post
Mars just ingressed Scorpio. It seems to be somehow interfering with the mental acuity of Mercury in Scorpio. Both good placements, but somewhat out of synch.
Not sure what you meant about auto-correct and Iranian instead of Uranian. Is your phone doing that? I've found that a phone needs you to verify words it's unfamiliar with, so it can recognize them the next time.
Oh dear. Is that disconnect between planets who are independently well placed in the same sign, something you can derive from 12/12? Or just the shakeup conducted by a domiciled planet returning home...
And groan - if you’re saying it could last til Mercury is in Sagittarius - that’s 3 weeks from now.

At least the evening went better than the morning and day! Thinking it was the station, so the retrograde was missed.
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  #8111  
Unread 11-21-2019, 05:28 AM
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Oh dear. Is that disconnect between planets who are independently well placed in the same sign, something you can derive from 12/12? Or just the shakeup conducted by a domiciled planet returning home...
And groan - if you’re saying it could last til Mercury is in Sagittarius - that’s 3 weeks from now.

At least the evening went better than the morning and day! Thinking it was the station, so the retrograde was missed.
In 12/12, Mars is Exalted in Scorpio, whereas Mercury is in-Service, and therefore a Benefactor.
Mars is Domicled in Aries, as is Mercury in Gemini, and Pluto in Scorpio.
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  #8112  
Unread 11-21-2019, 06:13 AM
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Originally Posted by david starling View Post
In 12/12, Mars is Exalted in Scorpio, whereas Mercury is in-Service, and therefore a Benefactor.
Mars is Domicled in Aries, as is Mercury in Gemini, and Pluto in Scorpio.
How do Benefactors and Exalteds get along?
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  #8113  
Unread 11-21-2019, 06:40 AM
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How do Benefactors and Exalteds get along?
Exalteds feel privileged. Mars in Scorpio is very physical, thinks Merc is an egghead.
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  #8114  
Unread 11-21-2019, 07:48 PM
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Exalteds feel privileged. Mars in Scorpio is very physical, thinks Merc is an egghead.
Merc is a bit of an egghead. Will thank Mars later for getting them out for a tough little hike.
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  #8115  
Unread 11-21-2019, 08:20 PM
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Merc is a bit of an egghead. Will thank Mars later for getting them out for a tough little hike.
Exalted Mars can get careless though. Might do well to listen to Merc's advice, at least once in awhile. "If you go that way, you'll be heading straight into a patch of poison oak."
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  #8116  
Unread 11-21-2019, 08:27 PM
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Exalted Mars can get careless though. Might do well to listen to Merc's advice, at least once in awhile. "If you go that way, you'll be heading straight into a patch of poison oak."
Wonder how that works when Merc will soon be so far ahead, almost out of the sign. (Are they within orb of aspect this time through Scorp?) Am sure the messages are faint, even if Mars wasn’t such a macho DIY type. Maybe a few mishaps before guidance is accepted?

Last edited by passiflora; 11-21-2019 at 08:29 PM.
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  #8117  
Unread 11-21-2019, 08:47 PM
david starling david starling is offline
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Wonder how that works when Merc will soon be so far ahead, almost out of the sign. (Are they within orb of aspect this time through Scorp?) Am sure the messages are faint, even if Mars wasn’t such a macho DIY type. Maybe a few mishaps before guidance is accepted?
Still over 2 weeks before Mr. Winged Sandals flies off into Sagittarius to visit the Centaurs. But, Jupiter will have already crossed over into forbidden territory on his own.

Last edited by david starling; 11-21-2019 at 08:54 PM.
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  #8118  
Unread 11-21-2019, 10:44 PM
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Glad to hear your explanation. Can you describe how you separate rulers from signs in that way? Particularly with the example you use of the 11th house - the way it seems to operate to me it has some kind of Uranian ground rules. I wouldn’t know how to call them “Aquarian rules” without the Uranian influence. (Does your autocorrect force you to say Iranian, by the way??)
I haven’t seen yet a Modern way of delineating similarities and differences between houses and signs that makes sense to me in that “clicking” way. Vedic astrologers seem to refer to planets having natural domicile in houses rather than rulership.
in 12/12, the Native-ruler (aka Domicle-ruler) of a Sign is like its parental influence. The Houses are customized for the Signs, and the Native-ruler of a Sign is always welcome in the House that matches up with that Sign, with the exception of Saturn, because Saturn's an abusive parent.
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  #8119  
Unread 11-21-2019, 11:02 PM
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Originally Posted by david starling View Post
in 12/12, the Native-ruler (aka Domicle-ruler) of a Sign is like its parental influence. The Houses are customized for the Signs, and the Native-ruler of a Sign is always welcome in the House that matches up with that Sign, with the exception of Saturn, because Saturn's an abusive parent.
When Saturn is so mean in a natal, how come he can be positive in synastry? It can’t be purely due to the helpfulness of the other planets in the relationship, with Saturn acting just the binder?
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  #8120  
Unread 11-21-2019, 11:16 PM
david starling david starling is offline
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When Saturn is so mean in a natal, how come he can be positive in synastry? It can’t be purely due to the helpfulness of the other planets in the relationship, with Saturn acting just the binder?
Since we live in a Saturnian version of reality, a good or bad Saturn matchup will make or break a relationship.
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  #8121  
Unread 11-21-2019, 11:28 PM
david starling david starling is offline
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The real question is whether Saturn's psychotic nature can be healed. I believe this will be accomplished once the tropical Age of Aquarius finally gets underway, and that will be where Mercury really comes through for us.
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  #8122  
Unread 11-22-2019, 03:40 AM
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Re: Random Thoughts, strictly Text

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The real question is whether Saturn's psychotic nature can be healed. I believe this will be accomplished once the tropical Age of Aquarius finally gets underway, and that will be where Mercury really comes through for us.
I certainly would like to hear more about this, David. It sounds like you’re saying that the parts of Aquarius that feel negative-Saturnine today are due to the effects of this tropical age of Capricorn. Uranus being an Outer, I have my doubts about our capacity to perceive it as an unmitigated good. Mercury being heroic makes a little more sense. Will be nice to hear the story.

Last edited by passiflora; 11-22-2019 at 03:53 AM.
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  #8123  
Unread 11-22-2019, 04:23 AM
david starling david starling is offline
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Originally Posted by passiflora View Post
I certainly would like to hear more about this, David. It sounds like you’re saying that the parts of Aquarius that feel negative-Saturnine today are due to the effects of this tropical age of Capricorn. Uranus being an Outer, I have my doubts about our capacity to perceive it as an unmitigated good. Mercury being heroic makes a little more sense. Will be nice to hear the story.
The alchemical connection is Mercury as god of Alchemy, and the claim that alchemy can enable the transformation of the element lead, currently known as Saturn's metal, into the Sun's metal, gold. The Romans connected Saturn to a Golden Age, before he went mad. But, what if that Golden Age is really in the future, rather than in the past?
Also, in 12/12, Mercury is Exalted in Capricorn, and Saturn is in-Service to Mercury and a Benefactor in Gemini.

Last edited by david starling; 11-22-2019 at 04:25 AM.
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  #8124  
Unread 11-22-2019, 07:57 PM
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Sun is in Sagittarius! Catalytic, in the 12/12 system.
c.t. coined the expression "dynamic uncertainty", which is paired with a can-do attitude.

Last edited by david starling; 11-22-2019 at 08:03 PM.
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  #8125  
Unread 11-23-2019, 12:00 AM
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Originally Posted by david starling View Post
Sun is in Sagittarius! Catalytic, in the 12/12 system.
c.t. coined the expression "dynamic uncertainty", which is paired with a can-do attitude.
Wish Gem was here, she could share insight on Sagittarius season in a nominally atheist country.

Last edited by passiflora; 11-23-2019 at 12:04 AM.
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