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  #26  
Unread 02-25-2017, 11:08 PM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

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Originally Posted by StillOne View Post
There lies dapper dressed AppLeo in the middle of the Grand Ball choking on the dessert of the evening... that sumptuous chocolate banana split with extra whipped cream. There's only gasps from AppLeo's suffocating throat as that banana has become stuck. Guests all stand around watching the young man as he lay slowly dying on the floor.

AppLeo, is astonished as no one comes to his assistance! After all, his selfish nature has gotten him to the top of the company. He is important! However, his inconsiderate, thoughtless, unthinking, uncaring, uncharitable; mean, miserly, grasping, greedy, mercenary, acquisitive, and opportunistic ways don't sit well with the people around him. So they return to focusing on themselves, and let AppLeo die in the middle of the dance floor.

Assuredly, at least his lover should come to his rescue, no?! He knew his lover wasn't shy about a little mouth-to-mouth once in awhile and probably wouldn't mind a lil extra chocolate banana split either! Come help me!! Unfortunately AppLeo's recent lover is in the corner hooking up with the receptionist. So predictable, since AppLeo always said to focus on oneself before anyone else.
LOL

Okay I guess you got me

------------------------

But seriously, I won't choke on dessert. Plus, it would not be my lover's selfish interest to let me die. I would argue that letting me die is selfless. To love and care for someone is selfish by nature.

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  #27  
Unread 02-25-2017, 11:30 PM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

"No, you see, I am in love with him selfishly. It is through my own interest to help him if he ever needed it. I would not call that a sacrifice because I take selfish pleasure in it."

"It is immoral if it a love placed above oneself. It is more than immoral; it is impossible. Because when you are asked to love everybody indiscriminately, that is to love them without any standard, to love them regardless whether if they have any value or virtue, then you are asked to love nobody."

"What would it mean to have love above self-interest? It would mean for instance that the husband would tell his wife that he were moral according to conventional morality that, 'I marrying you just for your own sake. I have no personal interest in it, but I am so unselfish that I am marrying you only for your own good.' Would any women like that?"

"In love, the currency is virtue. You love people not for what you do for them or what they do for you. You them for their values and virtues. You don't love cousins; you don't love everyone indiscriminately. You only love those who deserve it. Man has free-will; if a man wants love, he should correct his flaws and he may deserve it, but he cannot expect the unearned."

Quotes by Ayn Rand.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQVr...&feature=share
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  #28  
Unread 02-25-2017, 11:52 PM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

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Yes, but if you care about others there is a possibility that they will be using you;
Indeed, and hence, we all suffer.
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  #29  
Unread 02-25-2017, 11:56 PM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

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Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post
See, that's stupid. Why even live if other people are above your own life? Selfless people are enablers for selfish people to be extremely selfish.
Who said above? How about on par.

I suppose it's evident, then, that there are quite a few extremely selfish people out and about.

Last edited by StillOne; 02-26-2017 at 01:23 AM.
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  #30  
Unread 02-26-2017, 12:11 AM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

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Originally Posted by StillOne View Post
Indeed, and hence, we all suffer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by StillOne View Post
Who said above? How about on par.

I suppose it's evident, then, that there are quite a few extremely selfish people out and about.
Indeed.

........
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  #31  
Unread 02-26-2017, 01:25 AM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

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Indeed.

........
There you have it folks. There's quite a few people out there who dgaf about others.
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  #32  
Unread 02-26-2017, 01:47 AM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

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There you have it folks. There's quite a few people out there who dgaf about others.
Who me?!

I care about my friends and family.
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  #33  
Unread 02-26-2017, 02:08 AM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

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Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post
Who me?!

I care about my friends and family.
Obviously there's a range involved. There are very few that occupy the very end of each spectrum. You can be somewhere in between, which may be explained a bit by your "D&D alignment" thread. I recall you being Chaotic Neutral while I tested Neutral Good. Lol, something to think about!
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  #34  
Unread 02-26-2017, 02:43 AM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

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Originally Posted by StillOne View Post
Obviously there's a range involved. There are very few that occupy the very end of each spectrum. You can be somewhere in between, which may be explained a bit by your "D&D alignment" thread. I recall you being Chaotic Neutral while I tested Neutral Good. Lol, something to think about!
Yes, I got Chaotic Neutral.

Hmm...

Well, I'm not chaotic evil so whatever.
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  #35  
Unread 02-26-2017, 06:09 AM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

Perhaps Self-Centered is a better concept than Selfish?

To be centered in oneself is to have inner harmony and strength so that the behaviour of others does not throw us off balance and effect our ability to love. By maintaining our equilibrium, we are in a better position to be of service to others. By being of service we are growing and evolving (Self-centered) and also allowing and inspiring others to grow and evolve (Selfless).

We stay centered by knowing our needs and knowing exactly how to get them fulfilled and doing it. It also means taking the time to focus inwards so that you may discern between what you need vs what you want.

It's ok to have desires and fulfill them, yet at the same time, the more desires we have, the higher the risk of us getting bogged down in fulfilling "selfish" desires and actually ending up neglecting our true needs. Thus we lose control over ourselves and become a liability to others and ourselves.

That is why we will always need people/souls who Love...Otherwise entropy would be the result. Love renews and expands.

If one looks at it from the perspective of Soul Evolution (If you entertain such thoughts)

Perhaps one could say that there is no great growth in only loving those whom we deem to be lovable...

Great growth comes from loving those whom we deem to be unlovable, by our own feelings and standards, someone who is unlovable to you might be very lovable to another.

Love manifests in infinite ways depending on the situation and the people/energies involved.

To love someone does not have to manifest as you regularily associating with that person. It might manifest as cutting that person loose so that they can grow too, that is loving, even if it doesn't seem so on the surface.

So if you cut that person loose and it hurts you, or you stand to lose something, then in that situation you are being primarily Selfless, whilst at the same time gaining Self-centered growth and maintaining your equlilibrium.

The other person will naturally (most often) see you as being Selfish.

Last edited by AtomsInPlace; 02-26-2017 at 06:12 AM.
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  #36  
Unread 02-26-2017, 12:01 PM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

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He sounds like quite the Scorpio Ascendant.
He certainly is
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  #37  
Unread 02-26-2017, 07:03 PM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

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Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post

Yes, but if you care about others there is a possibility that they will be using you;
and when you really do need there help they will abandon you.
At least if you're selfish,
you don't have to worry about you abandoning yourself.

If you're selfishly involved, you'll require the resources
(people, objects, whatever)
to help you get through life.
The best support is the support of yourself.
Other people are wishy-washy and unpredictable.
Trust is something is broken quite easily.

Intimate relationships are not necessary.

"It is the egocentric life that is suffering, the Buddha realized
the life conditioned by conceit

that needs a self to be built up and protected

and separated out
in its own version of dissociation
from the rest of the universe."
- Mark Epstein
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82p-D...eature=related Hippocrates Let food be your medicine: let medicine be your food. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvz9uSK3zXo Rosencrantz & Guildenstern are Dead Tom Stoppard http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KchhSIVwMdY Every exit is an entrance to somewhere else. VETTIUS VALENS FREE http://www.csus.edu/indiv/r/rileymt/...s%20entire.pdf
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  #38  
Unread 02-26-2017, 07:04 PM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

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Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post

Selfless people give themselves away to others
because they fear their own responsibility and independence.
Selfless are the most responsible people of all
because they take responsibility for the well being of others
not solely themselves
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  #39  
Unread 02-26-2017, 07:06 PM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

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Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post

Absolutely nothing wrong with that.
Selfish people can serve each other selfishly.
Better than serving selfless people who serve you selflessly.
Siriusly .... selfish people serve only themselves
Selfless people request no one to serve them
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82p-D...eature=related Hippocrates Let food be your medicine: let medicine be your food. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvz9uSK3zXo Rosencrantz & Guildenstern are Dead Tom Stoppard http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KchhSIVwMdY Every exit is an entrance to somewhere else. VETTIUS VALENS FREE http://www.csus.edu/indiv/r/rileymt/...s%20entire.pdf
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  #40  
Unread 02-26-2017, 07:57 PM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

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Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post

"No, you see, I am in love with him selfishly. It is through my own interest to help him if he ever needed it. I would not call that a sacrifice because I take selfish pleasure in it."

"It is immoral if it a love placed above oneself. It is more than immoral; it is impossible. Because when you are asked to love everybody indiscriminately, that is to love them without any standard, to love them regardless whether if they have any value or virtue, then you are asked to love nobody."

"What would it mean to have love above self-interest?
It would mean for instance that the husband would tell his wife that he were moral according to conventional morality that, 'I marrying you just for your own sake. I have no personal interest in it, but I am so unselfish that I am marrying you only for your own good.' Would any women like that?"
An alternative example of
what it would mean to have love above self interest

Instead of putting self interest above love
Bill Gates could raise his employees quality of life
by paying them reasonable wages
But Bill Gates would then no longer be 'the worlds richest man'
and that's why tens of hundred of millions of workers suffer debt slave wages
so one persons self interest may continue to flourish





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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82p-D...eature=related Hippocrates Let food be your medicine: let medicine be your food. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvz9uSK3zXo Rosencrantz & Guildenstern are Dead Tom Stoppard http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KchhSIVwMdY Every exit is an entrance to somewhere else. VETTIUS VALENS FREE http://www.csus.edu/indiv/r/rileymt/...s%20entire.pdf

Last edited by JUPITERASC; 02-26-2017 at 08:44 PM.
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  #41  
Unread 02-26-2017, 08:05 PM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post

"In love, the currency is virtue.
You love people not for what you do for them or what they do for you.
You them for their values and virtues. Y
ou don't love cousins; you don't love everyone indiscriminately.
You only love those who deserve it.
Man has free-will; if a man wants love, he should correct his flaws and he may deserve it,
but he cannot expect the unearned."

Quotes by Ayn Rand.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQVr...&feature=share






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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82p-D...eature=related Hippocrates Let food be your medicine: let medicine be your food. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvz9uSK3zXo Rosencrantz & Guildenstern are Dead Tom Stoppard http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KchhSIVwMdY Every exit is an entrance to somewhere else. VETTIUS VALENS FREE http://www.csus.edu/indiv/r/rileymt/...s%20entire.pdf
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  #42  
Unread 02-27-2017, 04:06 AM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

K thank you JupiterASC, but I'm not arguing with you anymore.

My beliefs are final.

And Buddha is an idiot. All he does is sit and meditate and never does anything productive.

"You can light 1000 candles with one candle so that means you can do with love too"

Yeah okay, whatever.
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  #43  
Unread 02-27-2017, 06:13 PM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

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Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post
My beliefs are final.

And Buddha is an idiot. All he does is sit and meditate and never does anything productive.

"You can light 1000 candles with one candle so that means you can do with love too"

Yeah okay, whatever.
I think you've made your position clear and so it's not surprising your opinion about Buddha as a result.

Best wishes to you AppLeo!
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  #44  
Unread 02-27-2017, 06:25 PM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

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Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post

K thank you JupiterASC, but I'm not arguing with you anymore.

My beliefs are final.

And Buddha is an idiot. All he does is sit and meditate and never does anything productive.

"You can light 1000 candles with one candle so that means you can do with love too"

Yeah okay, whatever.


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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82p-D...eature=related Hippocrates Let food be your medicine: let medicine be your food. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvz9uSK3zXo Rosencrantz & Guildenstern are Dead Tom Stoppard http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KchhSIVwMdY Every exit is an entrance to somewhere else. VETTIUS VALENS FREE http://www.csus.edu/indiv/r/rileymt/...s%20entire.pdf
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  #45  
Unread 02-27-2017, 07:16 PM
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Re: Virtue of being self-absorbed?

Leo, go read Adam Smith's The Wealth of Nations if you're wildly interested in economics, and you seem to be.

It will stand you in much better stead than all the Ayn Rand stuff.
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  #46  
Unread 02-27-2017, 07:26 PM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AtomsInPlace View Post
Perhaps Self-Centered is a better concept than Selfish?

To be centered in oneself is to have inner harmony and strength so that the behaviour of others does not throw us off balance and effect our ability to love. By maintaining our equilibrium, we are in a better position to be of service to others. By being of service we are growing and evolving (Self-centered) and also allowing and inspiring others to grow and evolve (Selfless).

We stay centered by knowing our needs and knowing exactly how to get them fulfilled and doing it. It also means taking the time to focus inwards so that you may discern between what you need vs what you want.

It's ok to have desires and fulfill them, yet at the same time, the more desires we have, the higher the risk of us getting bogged down in fulfilling "selfish" desires and actually ending up neglecting our true needs. Thus we lose control over ourselves and become a liability to others and ourselves.

That is why we will always need people/souls who Love...Otherwise entropy would be the result. Love renews and expands.

If one looks at it from the perspective of Soul Evolution (If you entertain such thoughts)

Perhaps one could say that there is no great growth in only loving those whom we deem to be lovable...

Great growth comes from loving those whom we deem to be unlovable, by our own feelings and standards, someone who is unlovable to you might be very lovable to another.

Love manifests in infinite ways depending on the situation and the people/energies involved.

To love someone does not have to manifest as you regularily associating with that person. It might manifest as cutting that person loose so that they can grow too, that is loving, even if it doesn't seem so on the surface.

So if you cut that person loose and it hurts you, or you stand to lose something, then in that situation you are being primarily Selfless, whilst at the same time gaining Self-centered growth and maintaining your equlilibrium.

The other person will naturally (most often) see you as being Selfish.

__________________
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82p-D...eature=related Hippocrates Let food be your medicine: let medicine be your food. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvz9uSK3zXo Rosencrantz & Guildenstern are Dead Tom Stoppard http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KchhSIVwMdY Every exit is an entrance to somewhere else. VETTIUS VALENS FREE http://www.csus.edu/indiv/r/rileymt/...s%20entire.pdf
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  #47  
Unread 02-27-2017, 07:29 PM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

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Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post

Who me?!

I care about my friends and family.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82p-D...eature=related Hippocrates Let food be your medicine: let medicine be your food. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvz9uSK3zXo Rosencrantz & Guildenstern are Dead Tom Stoppard http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KchhSIVwMdY Every exit is an entrance to somewhere else. VETTIUS VALENS FREE http://www.csus.edu/indiv/r/rileymt/...s%20entire.pdf
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  #48  
Unread 02-27-2017, 07:31 PM
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Re: Feeling guilty about my natal chart.

Quote:
Originally Posted by StillOne View Post

Who said above? How about on par.

I suppose it's evident, then, that there are quite a few extremely selfish people out and about.

Indeed

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82p-D...eature=related Hippocrates Let food be your medicine: let medicine be your food. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvz9uSK3zXo Rosencrantz & Guildenstern are Dead Tom Stoppard http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KchhSIVwMdY Every exit is an entrance to somewhere else. VETTIUS VALENS FREE http://www.csus.edu/indiv/r/rileymt/...s%20entire.pdf
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  #49  
Unread 02-27-2017, 08:35 PM
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Re: Virtue of being self-absorbed?





Let's add a bit of comic relief here,

A man at a Satsang sitting, begins laughing hysterically when he realizes that the "self" he thought he was, doesn't exist. Mooji joins in with a few hysterical comments:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfvgvDkdG2M
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  #50  
Unread 02-27-2017, 09:13 PM
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Re: Virtue of being self-absorbed?

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Originally Posted by StillOne View Post
I think you've made your position clear and so it's not surprising your opinion about Buddha as a result.

Best wishes to you AppLeo!
Well JupiterASC keeps making me defend my views.

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Originally Posted by JUPITERASC View Post


BAHA and you know who plato was? He's the philosopher of whimsical and abstract ideas, not logic or reason. Aristotle > Plato

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Originally Posted by Oddity View Post
Leo, go read Adam Smith's The Wealth of Nations if you're wildly interested in economics, and you seem to be.

It will stand you in much better stead than all the Ayn Rand stuff.
Thank you, Oddity. I will check him out. I think economics is fascinating. I just started reading about Ayn Rand and just fell in love, so I haven't really had time to branch out.

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Originally Posted by JUPITERASC View Post
Completely false.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JUPITERASC View Post
Indeed

Economic wealth has nothing to do with one's spiritual wealth.

There are rich people who are also rich spiritually.

And just because you're poor doesn't mean you're rich spiritually either.

There are plenty of poor people who are evil.
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