No such thing as a bad chart?
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wan
Well-known member
I think you are conflating "chart" with "life". You meant that it's possible for the native to have a bad life despite having a good chart. But this does not change the fact that it is still possible to designate a chart as being either good or bad. It's subjective and different people will have different ideas for what makes good and bad charts. However, my point is that it's still possible to judge.
PlutoLibScoAsc
Well-known member
I don't believe it. People getting killed, raped, suicides, life health issue like paralyzed 'till dead on the dead bed etc. I think 'no bad chart' is created to comfort.
wan
Well-known member
I don't know why you have such a big problem with people judging other people's charts, charts that the latter voluntarily put up on an open forum. People in real life comment on other people all the time, on pretty much everything imaginable. It seems like human nature. Therefore, it is to be expected that people here will comment on others' charts.
Commenting on someone's chart is one thing. Completely different telling someone they are condemned to a bad life due to a bad chart.
So, what is a good life?
Sometimes a chart has all easy aspects, how lovely. And that person slip slides through life on a silver lined cloud. No challenges, no conflicts, no stress. Is that a good life? For some, yes, for others no.
Then you have someone like Steve Jobs, would he have preferred to have an easy chart and a "good life"? Would you have told him he would have so many challenges to overcome and then die early from a tumor? How would that have effected him? Would he have gathered his strength to go forward, or just collapsed and given up? (Don't want to start a discussion about this particular person, there are thousands of examples we could cite. )
Why do they say "Every cloud has a silver lining?".
And the quote about the glass half full or half empty.
It's also a question of choices, psychological ones that we make during our life's path.
And, a choice of the astrologer to try to help someone understand the possibilities if they follow one path or the other according to their free will, or to give them dire predictions and black pictures of their future? Which is more helpful?
david starling
Well-known member
wan
Well-known member
But as far as I know, nobody is telling anybody that he is doomed to a bad life. People are just commenting on other people's charts.
Yes. And just like how people can comment on others being ugly or pretty, they too can comment on other people's charts being good or bad. That's my point all along.
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wan
Well-known member
Not quite sure what you are trying to say. Anyway, what is your issue with people designating others' charts as being bad? You think that people should not judge other people's charts?
wan
Well-known member
Because it's human nature to pass judgments. On everything, but especially on other people. You yourself have probably considered someone or the things they do "bad".
Now it's my turn to ask you a question. Why do you react so strongly to people branding a chart as bad?
Also, I don't understand what you meant by "chisel in stone". If I say, "the weather is lousy today", am I also "chiseling in stone" that the weather is bad?
Of course. My sense of self is not tied to my horoscope chart. If someone wants to consider my chart bad, it's no skin off my nose. Not a big deal at all.
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david starling
Well-known member
I just look for the functionality of the Natal-chart, starting with its strengths and intrinsic abilities. Then, I look for the obstacles that might interfere with them, and a way around those obstacles. The more obstacles, the more "difficult" and "challenging" the Chart, and the greater the rewards in dealing with those difficulties and challenges.
The word "bad" doesn't even enter into it.
The word "bad" doesn't even enter into it.
"you react so strongly"
Am I? Sorry, I was just trying to express my point of view.
Re-reading the comments perhaps I should clarify. I don't see anything positive in telling someone their chart is "bad". I agree very much with David Starling's explanation, "I just look for the functionality of the Natal-chart, starting with its strengths and intrinsic abilities. Then, I look for the obstacles that might interfere with them, and a way around those obstacles."
My comments relate to what you should say to someone, not what my personal judgement of a chart might be, which is irrelevant to the person.
An interpretation should be helpful, not hopelessly negative.
Am I? Sorry, I was just trying to express my point of view.
Re-reading the comments perhaps I should clarify. I don't see anything positive in telling someone their chart is "bad". I agree very much with David Starling's explanation, "I just look for the functionality of the Natal-chart, starting with its strengths and intrinsic abilities. Then, I look for the obstacles that might interfere with them, and a way around those obstacles."
My comments relate to what you should say to someone, not what my personal judgement of a chart might be, which is irrelevant to the person.
An interpretation should be helpful, not hopelessly negative.
david starling
Well-known member
A very Saturn-oriented Chart might seem "bad" to someone with a very Neptune-oriented one, and vice versa. I always like to know an openly judgemental astrologer's Natal-chart so I know what what's behind the judgements.
Kite
Well-known member
Very wise of you. Better to judge one's character than one's chart.
AJ Astrology
Well-known member
Hi passiflora,
You would tell them because of values such as honesty and integrity. Of course, that assumes you have those values
Hi ElenaJ,
The chart will tell you that, too. A chart will tell you if someone is lazy, a slacker or a dullard.
Hi ardentika,
You don't have free will.
Astrology aside, from the moment of birth, you're shaped by your environment and learn to respond to stimuli in certain ways.
Those learned responses to stimuli control you for the rest of your life, because every time certain stimuli arise, you will respond exactly as you have learned and it is beyond your control.
Why do you think women refuse to leave abusive relationships? Because they don't have free will.
Ever see people in a "serious" relationship and then a month later break-up, and then 2 days later they're in a "serious" relationship and 2 weeks later they break up and then the next day they're in a "serious" relationship and 6 weeks later they break-up and then 3 days later they're in a "serious" relationship and that ends a month or two later?
That's because they don't have free will.
They simply cannot go more than 3 days without being in a "serious" relationship.
They learned from a very early age, and then reinforced by the media and social media and their friends that if they don't have someone attached to their hip 24/7 then then have no redeeming value whatsoever on this earth.
It doesn't mean they can't change, because they can, but it will take years of therapy and very hard work, assuming they even want to change in the first place (and most do not want to change).
AJ Astrology
Well-known member
Hi psycles3,
Do you realize the Greeks did not know what a cell was?
No one knew of the existence of cells until the year 1665 CE.
So, the Greeks did not know that the brain had cells and that electro-chemical reactions among those brain cells is what produced consciousness.
In order to explain something the Greeks could not possibly understand, they came up with the concept of a "soul."
If those Greeks were alive today, and they were aware that the human brain was highly specialized cells conducting electro-chemical reactions that produced consciousness, they would flat out reject the whole idea of a soul.
I guess the question is why do you cling to an ancient false concept predicated on ignorance?
This is a very positive approach that you outline.
When referring to a person what you see in their chart, there is a big difference between pointing out strengths (however few they may be), and ways of approaching solutions to obstacles, as opposed to telling them "This is a really bad chart, and unfortunately you don't have free will, so there you go".
Confronted with the latter, I'm not sure how many people would take courage in their hands and try to overcome.