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Fixed stars, asteroids and other cosmic objects For astrology talks on fixed stars, Chiron, Sedna, Eris or any other newly discovered or little known cosmic object.


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  #1  
Unread 03-17-2006, 07:48 PM
Pa Chandelier Pa Chandelier is offline
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Chiron in my ascenmdant conjunct south node; help!

Hi,
I have Chiron in my ascendant in Aries - and it conjuncts exactly with the moons south node. I can't escape it's influence, obviously - but what is it's influence?
Lately I've been digging myself into the subject of Shamanism - and I find that it greatly empowers me to deal with the oppsite sex - women, I mean. I've always been very insecure about my sexuality and now this Shaman-identy sems to be able to rid me of it.
I've read here that Chiron is equatable to the Shaman. I've also read that Chiron conjunc with south node is a guarantee for difficult lessons. I think all of this is very accurate - I'm now twentynine and FIALLY am having the opportunity to some kind of 'life' - the past ten years were ridiculously hard, I'm allready turning grey.
What I would like to ask any of the readers who have any knowlegde of Chiron and Shamanism is the following; how do I use this curse/gift to the greateat potential?
I have a quite powerful set of trines in m chart - for one thing I have a moon-sun-pluto trine exactly opposed to a ascendant - neptune - saturn trine, which makes a perfect sextile or star of david. (it also gives me a moon-neptune opposition and sun-saturn opposition which are both extremely tough on me, whereas the trines empower me to feel divine when I'm not feeling utterly helpless)
Since Chiron is in my ascendant and conjunct the south node (the north node conjuncts Iuno) I feelt hat my calling is some kind of mass-healing. Sicne I am a fillmaker (saturn-ascendant-neptune) and musician ths mightindeed be reality. Shamanism will hopefully play a role in this.
Any comments would be greaty appreciated...
Thanks,
Jakob

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Unread 03-17-2006, 08:27 PM
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Jakob,
You sound beautiful.
Can you post your chart or your data so we can look? I'm not so great at the technicalities of chart reading, but if I can see your chart and hear your concerns, inspiration sometimes comes. There are many here on this forum who are gifted and experienced and offer their wisdom and time generously. At the very least, you have kin here who care and understand.

Welcome,
Sita
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  #3  
Unread 03-18-2006, 03:17 PM
Pa Chandelier Pa Chandelier is offline
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Hi Sita,
That is really nice of you - thanks.
My birthdate is 30-jan 1977, 10:32 AM in Amsterdam. Netherlands.
(the url below is my chart on astro-software.com)
http://www.astro-software.com/cgi-bi...4.53&lat=52.23

Any help you can give me would be warmly received
Jakob
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Unread 03-18-2006, 05:13 PM
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Hi Jakob. I have South Node conjunct the malific star Algol. Here's my theory on these Sout Node conjunctions. I think they point to previous life issues which tend to recycle themselves in this life until recognized and dealt with. I also don't believe it is a form a punishment to have these aspects - I believe they are chosen to bring certain aspects of conciousness into our awareness.

In your case, you could have very well been a Shaman and created a set of issues that would put you into contact with this aspect of yourself so you could integrate it into this lifetime.

The issues you bring up about difficulty being yourself with women, could deal with a previous life where the Matriarchal society ruled and your masculinity was wounded (aspects in Aries). Wtih pluto opposing, this might reinforce the theory here.

Thoughts for consideration.
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Unread 03-19-2006, 12:12 AM
Pa Chandelier Pa Chandelier is offline
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Hi Kite,
I don't believe in punishments as such either - all consequences are just that, consequences. But the consequence of jumping off a building would be harsh, whether or not you'd call it a punishment.
I experience those aspects of my personality which are completely off the map to most people I know sometimes as a curse and somethimes as a great blessing - but the thing which is continuous is my wondering what the purpose of all this is. All my life I have lived with a sense of purpose - at the age of 7 I decided I'd have to invent a cure for death, and my ambitions have only lessened to the extent that I now understand death is not what I was taught it is - that it is not something to be feared.
The sene of purpose remains, though - and there is nothing I'd love to be more that a Shaman. I want to learn....
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Unread 03-19-2006, 12:20 AM
Pa Chandelier Pa Chandelier is offline
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Kite: I looked at your chart and see that you have a big Venus/Moon - Uranus - Saturn trine. It looks powerful - Does it manifest noticably in your life or consciousness?
J
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Unread 03-19-2006, 12:32 AM
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Jakob - I think you confused Venus with Mars as I have a Mars/Moon conjunction in a Grand Trine with Saturn and Uranus. I have lot of tension within the Trine as Jupiter opposes the Mars/Moon, Pluto and Neptune inconjunct to form a boomerang Yod and Mercury squares for a t-square.

So I would say it has effected me a great deal in that I've had a lot of energy to work with. When I've worked with it well - good things happen. When I don't work with it well, it works me :cry:

Kite
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Unread 03-19-2006, 01:19 AM
Pa Chandelier Pa Chandelier is offline
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Sorry - yes I did confuse Mars and Venus. How ironic, considering what you suggested about my wounded masculinity...

What is a boomerang Yod?
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  #9  
Unread 03-19-2006, 01:42 AM
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Quote:
What is a boomerang Yod?
It's a Yod with an opposition to the Apex. A Yod is to inconjuncts to an apex planet.
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Unread 03-20-2006, 12:34 AM
Pa Chandelier Pa Chandelier is offline
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Hi Sita,
Thanks for appreciating. Frankly I'm glad you say you can't wrap your mind around it - a shrink would tell me (many shrinks have told me) that I just need to not be so hard on myself and atop looking for answers where there are none. Har har. What do they know of answers - or even of real questions? Anyway I think you're right - we are part of a crucial generation (2012 coming up) and I feel I have a leadership responsibility.
A wondrous thing happened the night of my last post - I went to a birthday party of a cousin, and met a young actor with whom I have made plans for a tv programme to 'go out there' in name of our generation, to those places in the world where fundamental problems lie, dig them up and present their fully human forms to the young mechanically indoctrinated public. I had a sense of Eureka, so did he (he was cmpletely hystericval and he said goodbye exclaiming 'Viva La Revolucion!'
A set of clear signs of Fate guided this night. There is no doubt in my mind about whether or not I must or will do this - I just need to ajust my thinking and especially my feeling to this new modus. Right now I feel very melancholic - it seems I've arrived at the moment where what I do or don't do is seriously going to matter - which means the time for play is gone. I think another kind of play is how I should see this future work - I strongly believe that all innocent things are the result of a playful spirit. In fact - the time for play might finally have come instead of gone.
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Unread 03-20-2006, 12:49 AM
Pa Chandelier Pa Chandelier is offline
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There are some similarities in our charts - you also have the grand neptune-saturn trine with a moon neptune opposition - as well as saturn in Leo. Your moon is empowered by Jupiter though - that must be comfortable. Is it?
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  #12  
Unread 03-20-2006, 04:30 PM
Pa Chandelier Pa Chandelier is offline
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Hi Sita
No you're not wrong - but I've never heard of that project. What is it?
I laughed about your description of your emotions - you sound interesting to be with.
As for Cheiron - My body got mangled pretty bad as well - also due to my fanatical shaolin kung fu practice combined with yoga and chigong. It got too heavy for my nervous system and my whole left side has been victimized as a consequence. Currently I'm rebuilding it with help from Kaballah. I find the angels connected to each sephirah especially helpful - much more so than what I, with my originally sceptical nature / nurture, had thought possible.

I find that offering enery to Gods and Angels is very powerful and has direct influence on my intuitive decision making.
I would really like to get that moon-sun-pluto trine activated - I reckon I'll have to balance my moon and sun energies.
what do you know of Pluto? As far as planets go - he is the only one I really don't understand... I get the idea that that is what he is - that which you probably don't even want :evil: to understand.
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Unread 03-22-2006, 07:31 PM
Pa Chandelier Pa Chandelier is offline
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I looked up Earth Charter project - it's very good to see people are getting organized in this way.
It's interesting - about a decade ago I predicted that movie and popstars would be the first soldiers of the 'army' of the Earth - people who have made a fortune with art are almost by definition not evil, not careless.
Also I am very much impressed by what Bill Gates is doing. Have you ever looked at his chart?
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Unread 03-29-2006, 12:24 AM
dianelasater dianelasater is offline
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Jakob:
I read through your email researching Chiron and noticed our Chirons are at opposite poles, mine at 27 Libra. (would indicate our age difference) Mine is a little closer to the Ascendant than yours but not conjunct the South Node.. What your chart would indicate is that you have an innate talent that you will be teaching to others. I looked at your chart and found it to be very interesting, challenging and wondered how your new project is progressing. Would love to hear more
Diane
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Unread 03-29-2006, 01:55 PM
Pa Chandelier Pa Chandelier is offline
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Hmmm. I wonder if I should make another post on this forum - or leave it at this. It seems no one is likely to be able to bve me this clarity about Chiron I seek. I've allready talked to some astrologers in Holland who say Chiron in the ascendant represents an upfront way of dealing with old karma - I hardly had the eureka effect, I can tell you.
If anyone is still reading this who knows things - are there famous people with Cheiron in their ascendant? I read that Saddam Hussain had it tied to the south node like me. I hope there are some other examples - I don't much feel like tredding in his footsteps.
As for Pluto - isn't he the planet of the unavoidable?
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  #16  
Unread 03-29-2006, 02:47 PM
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South Node
The South Node, sometimes called the "Dragon's Tail," is the intersection point where the moon's orbit crosses the sun's path from North to South. The South Node is exactly 180 degrees away from the North Node. It expresses your karma, or the lessons you need to learn from your past life. If you do not believe in past lives, you can consider this point to be lessons that you need to learn, or challenges to overcome, from childhood. The South Node also gives you hints as to talents that you brought into this life. The South Node is a bit of a “double-edged” sword. On one hand, you have talents in the sign of the South Node. On the other, you need to use those talents to move to the sign of your north node. If your South Node is in Sagittarius, you may have spent many past lives developing wisdom while meditating in a mountain cave. In this life, you may not want to come in to the world from your peaceful mountain. However, you must step into the opposite sign Gemini North Node to do your work in this life. A Gemini North Node person would need to communicate all of that past life Sagittarius wisdom to the world during this lifetime.

Chiron
Chiron, an asteroid orbiting between Saturn and Uranus, represents the wounding we sustain in life. As a centaur (half human, half animal), it represents overcoming our lower, animal nature in order to serve the highest forms of human service. The idea is that we create our own suffering in life because we hold on to ideas, behaviors, and possessions that are transitory. In mythology, Chiron gave up not only his life, but also his god-like immortality in order to release his suffering. His reward was to be placed up in the sky for eternity. Chiron in your chart represents ways and areas where you suffer, as well as areas where you can release your suffering. Chiron teaches you to go beyond your sense of limitation and powerlessness. It teaches you to see the Truth of the Universe. Because Chiron was only discovered in the 1970’s, you will find a variety of opinions on the meaning of Chiron in the chart.

Perhaps your placement of Chiron on the South Node is a pointer to a cyclical wounding you need to break out of.

Kite
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Unread 03-29-2006, 05:22 PM
dianelasater dianelasater is offline
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Jakob:
Chiron is something that we are all exploring now, we bring in the understanding from 1977, when it was discovered, so it doesn't have the history that the inner planets have. (Pluto is young too as far as our understanding, not discovered until 1930) I am specifically looking for definition of the South Node conjunct Chiron, I have three examples, and all of them are in healing/helping professions, indiciative of the fact that they do have a solid innate comprehension of Chiron. There is a tendency to go either with the traditional medicines or herbal/healing therapies.

What I know is that Chironic energy has a twisting affect, it isn't addressed head on, it is something that comes through the action of living our lives. I find that Pluto wounding is confused with Chironic healing. They aren't the same.

Chiron was rejected, hence the power of your South Node position. The nodes are placements that have a very karmic feeling to them. The South Node shows us where and how we feel the most exposed, where we are unable to protect ourselves; either from the prying eyes of others or showing the worst part of our nature. The placement of Chiron on the South Node has a very natural feeing to it. Chiron was not able to defend himself from the negative judgment he received from others. The example of his life is our path to healing. He didn't deal with those who had wounded him, instead he addressed what he knew, what the gods had taught him, and took his amazing talents elsewhere, found a cave and took in abandoned children. From there he trained them to become the heros of Greek myth, the savors of the society that rejected him. He was not the hero, but the one who taught the heros how to use the talents they were given. Chironic healing grows from finding a place to do the work we know how to do. The native responds to their own plight by using their god given skills to help others find and hone their own skills. The virtue of this humble expression raises Chiron with the South Node from outcast to acclaim.

I am still interested in knowing more about the manifestation of this conjunction in your own life, if you would, my email address is diane@dianelasater.com
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Unread 03-29-2006, 05:25 PM
Pa Chandelier Pa Chandelier is offline
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Kite! Thanks os much, that was what I needed to hear.
So I need to cross over to Libra with the help of my Aries powers. Yes, cyclical wounding is a pattern I very much recognize as is that self-image of powerlessness. It's all there.

Diane - you have the south node in Libra you say - can you tell me anything about that? what is it that you know you know, what noone has to teach you?
I know Libra is ruled by Venus and is the 'nicest' sign of all and indeed two friends of whom I know to be Libras are wonderfully sensitive and capable of handling this sensitivity with flair and grace. Seems my learning path is right there... I asked that oracle on this site for one of them and the answer was; a Venetian gondlier bringing a serenade. Whereas when I asked it about a girl I just met it said 'an old peacock parading in a courtyard of an old castle. I also asked 'Libra' and then it said: deep within the depths of the Earth, new elements are formed.

Sita - I think you should write a book on your life, or at least some short stories... You're inspired, witty and it seems you've got a lot of crazy stories. I disagree with you on Gates - He's allready spent gigantic amounts of money on healthcare in the third world - and he even visits these places, goes into the most crumby hospitals all over the globe in oder to find out what it is exactly that must be fixed - I think the man has allready done so much more than the vast majority of the Earths population will ever amout to in terms of humanitarianism. Not that he shouldn't do even more, of course.

I looked up my birthtime in the oralce - look ahwt it said on the nodes:
Sabian Symbol for the North Node:
A MAN IN DEEP GLOOM. UNNOTICED, ANGELS COME TO HIS HELP. (28º Libra)

Sabian Symbol for the South Node:
A LARGE DISAPPOINTED AUDIENCE. (28º Aries)

This means, I assume, theat in a past life I was some kind of performing person who suffered a great faillure. My present life started out in gloom over that experience. Am I right to conclude this you guys think? It would cover for my fear of exposure and my craving for recognition.
I hope it doesn't mean that that disappointed audience is yet to come - but as it's my south node, I assume it's something I allready went through.

As a matter of fact (I ahdn't mentioned that I think) I am currently in the proces of wrapping up the recording my first record - it's rap and in dutch so not very interesting to you, and even though everyone tells me it's among the best they've ever heard, I am scrared sh**less to release it. I talk about a lot of very sensitive subjects, not sparing myself, so if this would be a success, It would change me for good.

I asked the oracle about it and it said: 'a girls face breaking into a smile.'
that made me very happy for an instant.
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Unread 03-29-2006, 06:41 PM
dianelasater dianelasater is offline
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Jakob, you are also going through your first Saturn return now... its a hard time no matter what else is going on in your chart. Its a time to rethink everything, very important. So know that no matter how much success you gain, you will be influenced by the need for assessment that Saturn is bringing to your life. It's a time when we rethink all we have done and decide which way we want our lives to go, what it is that is success for us, how we will fit our patterns into the world's patterns and make the mark that we intend, rather than just what happens. It passes over your Saturn in July.
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Unread 03-29-2006, 07:19 PM
dianelasater dianelasater is offline
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You ask interesting questions, the reversal is in the position of Chiron, yours at 27 Aries, (my 7th house) mine at 23 Libra, 12th house close to my ascendant, your North Node is close to or on my Ascendant.

What I have found is that the North Node is where things come to us, nice, orderly, timely, convenient, assistive. The South Node is almost the opposite in that action, hense the exposure, the feeling of being vulnerable, unprepared, etc. The world comes to us through our North Node, we come to the world through our South Node. Its the difficulty we all face in meeting our karmic debt so to speak, handling all that inconvieniet stuff and doing the best we can to contruibue to the world, giving back something, while the North Node is where things come to us. I know that isn't the common interpretation, but its what I have found to be true.

So, is the question then what am I here to give? The answer is Chiron, the wounded healer, you are here to teach others how to heal, and in doing that your healing will happen.
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Unread 03-30-2006, 01:32 AM
Pa Chandelier Pa Chandelier is offline
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Diane - you seem to think of the south and north node in the exact opposit emanner as I was used to intrpret them - I thought south node is that which we came into he world knowing.
Regadless - south node - Chiron speaks to me directly in that I've had to heal others in order to heal myself. For example - in my country there was a religious murder - the grand-grandson of Vincent van Gogh was murdered for his ati-Islamic talk - the countryreacted neurotically and iI knew I had to find a muslim youth to bring on national television, to relieve the high pressure kettle that was muslim / muslim fearing Holland.
To find the kid, to make the film and to get it on tv took a year. During this year I've transformed and gotten a lot more comfortable with my life and myself.

Regarding energetic healing; I can sense energies, can call on angels and Gods, can influence peoples aura's directly by just thinking of it, but I would like a tutor. There are lots of healers around here but none of them - no one that I know of - is willing to go in there with me - to the core of the Earth, to the paradigm that is about the crack, to the legions of forces that are so anxious to jump into battle with us that I feel them breathing in my neck. A warrior-shaman is what I needed all along but I haven't met anyone - which leads me to believe I'm here to discover it myself - through trial and error - to rediscover ancient laws and phrase them for our times.

I had a great night by the way - with Libra in mind I went to a wrap-part of the show I was working for - and it worked - I don't think I rubbed anyone the wrong way the etire night1
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Unread 03-30-2006, 02:07 AM
Pa Chandelier Pa Chandelier is offline
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So - the healing I'm able to do lies, I think, in mass entertainment - not so much in the one on one sphere - when I'm with someone who tells me of a problem I'm always inclined ot seek an answer and usually come up with one evry quickly - I'm not always very effective at communicating these answers - I'm too straightfoward in my presentation for that - I've gravely insulted good friends just meanig to give them loving advice - not realizing that not everyone is so aware of his weaknesses as I am.
Film is my great passion. Our time asks for new myths.
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Unread 03-30-2006, 02:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pa Chandelier
A warrior-shaman is what I needed all along but I haven't met anyone - which leads me to believe I'm here to discover it myself - through trial and error - to rediscover ancient laws and phrase them for our times.
Pa Chandelier,

You said your Chiron (the Shaman) is in Aries (the Warrior) conjunct Asc and South Node? It sounds to me like YOU are the "warrior-shaman" that you've been looking for!

And, with a conjunction to your South Node, this I'd think would indicate that (through past lives) you've already mastered and integrated the Warrior Shamanic nature of Chiron. Now you just need to recognize "Him" as your deep inner self (it conjunct your Asc) and not necessarily outside of yourself (that whole Aries/Libra identity business) and/or in another 'teacher'.

Here's a bit from Barbara Hand Clow's book Chiron- Rainbow Bridge Between the Inner and Outer Planets 1994.

"CHIRON IN ARIES

When Chiron is in Aries, the search for identity predominates. Who am I? Why am I here? What do they all want of me? That level of questioning becomes Chirotic, or a life and death issue, and until there is a satisfactory answer, the native is restless. But an answer will come with time, because Chiron's natural form as a warrior initiate is very attuned to Mars......

"......This position causes quick action to breakthrough Saturn barriers and act idealistically with Uranus. But unless there are other factors in the chart which foster mysticism, these natives may not activate the subtlety of Chiron. The warrior energy is the most powerful manifestation for these natives. They need to be encouraged to systematically develope a discipline which will enable them to empower Chiron and get in touch with the potential power of the etheric plane. Good examples of such discipline are Carlos Castenada, Carl Jung, Jack Anderson, and Aleister Crowley. All four of these men have created great power in their disciplines and made great impact on their times. A deliberate development of initiate warrior power by these natives will cause Chiron to become a very great tool for bringing their greatest essence into being. Generally these natives are frustrated unless they are extrememly active, and an analysis of the house position of Chiron in Aries will reveal the area of life where they can initiate progress. Limitation will drive them crazy......."
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Unread 04-01-2006, 02:10 PM
Pa Chandelier Pa Chandelier is offline
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Lapis -
the past few days I've been going through a rather violent physical change - too complex t go into right here but what you say is extremely interesting to me - that Libra buisines does work, but when you give the examples of Crowley, Castaneda and Jung (I don't know the other guy) you menion names of people whpo have been of profound influence to my experience of the world. Castaneda was the first one who brought me in contact with unseen, in many ways realer worlds. Jung has taught me the anima, in combination with Nietzsche and Crowley ahs literally transformed me with his book Little Essays Towards Truth. I still think this is the most ambitious and courageous piece of writin on any metaphysical subect. It deals with the Tree of Lifew, which has been my dicipline for a long time.
The quote you give suggests a dicipline to contact the powers that I have access to. I have long been testing and practicing varios diciplines - so far the tree of life has been the widest ranging, most powerful one.

Both Crowley and Castaneda used all kinds of 'substances' in their work - I have had transfrming experiences with mushrooms and I've only recently put an end to my marihuana use - which for me was a very powerful tool to contact the astral plane - with all the negative consequences attached to it as well. Now that I no longer have that I'm kind of floating in the real world - I've lost my compass so to speak - or not s much my compass as my anchor. I'm not as aware of the forces and in me - I need to iinvest more time to mobilize the energies. Maybe that's what needs to de done. When under iinfluence even from a couple of days back - it was easy for me to get the whole energy circuitry running in the directions I chose - now physical stuff is putting it's weight on the table. I'm finally recovering from an injury I suffered six years ago whcih twisted my Ischias nerve - as a result I'm now feeling the pain I should have si years ago. This is strange, but - well - I think it's opening up a new life path of activity on planes I've been dormant at. I hope.
But back to the dicipline - if I want to find my swing in life, I have to get deeper in... the trouble is I'm doing so many things at the same time that to get in deeper I'd have to drop some things - or raise my level of activity

By the way - since ten days I've been wearing a silver necklace with a Lapis stone. It's a very stong influence and I usually don't wear stones for more than two days - but intuitively I knew I wanted this lunar influence - as my solar side has bee tyrannisizing my passive me. First I balenced it with a golden necklace with a golten topaz which softened it, but now I'm, only wearing the silver. I think the physical changes are a result of this.
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Unread 04-01-2006, 02:16 PM
Pa Chandelier Pa Chandelier is offline
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"At a railroad crossing, an automobile is wrecked by a train."

this is what the Sabian Oracle had to say about my back.
Hmmm.
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