Sorry to pull this up again, but what are the degrees of fall for the various planets? Do you happen to have a link to a table or chart (it would be much appreciated); I can't seem to find any information about them just yet...
Which one is stronger: domicile or exaltation?
- Thread starter Fragoso
- Start date
Sorry to pull this up again, but what are the degrees of fall for the various planets? Do you happen to have a link to a table or chart (it would be much appreciated); I can't seem to find any information about them just yet...
JUPITERASC
Well-known member
That's OK sequestra. Saturn in 12th is in his element, Saturn enjoys being in the 12th just as a fish prefers and enjoys being in water.Thank you for answering so thoroughly- I will work my way through that weighty thread. But with respect to the above, I'm still confused. I mean, I take it from that description these malefic planets are rejoicing because they're making things crappier for the native.
Realistically speaking, life is not always wonderful, as we skip along sunlit safe pathways surrounded by leafy trees while bathed in light and political correctness.
Everyone's life includes some form of unhappiness at some stage or another - perhaps mild, perhaps horrendous: depending on past actions we reap the consequences.
Saturn experiences demonstrate starkly to us the consequences of our actions... those consequences are sometimes unpalatable... nevertheless Saturn non-judgementally presents us firmly with the consequences of our actions. Often those consequences are ones we are happy with.
Saturn in 12th directs his malefic acts away from the native - this is considered good for the native but not so good for others. Others generally dislike us if we harm them! Either way Saturn has fun in his element.
Saturn is helping us to do better by confronting us with the results of our actions which encourages us to initiate action that causes us less suffering.
Mars similarly enjoys the 6th
Frank
Well-known member
I'm going try to avoid the word stronger and put it this way:
All things being equal, Domicile is more comfortable and familiar for a planet to be in than is Exaltation.
But things are never really equal, are they?
To use my own chart as an example (in my profile), I have two planets in Domicile and one in Exaltation - Jupiter in Sagittarius, Saturn in Capricorn, and Mars in Capricorn (for the moment, let's leave out that Mars is also in his Term).
My chart is a Nocturnal chart - with the Sun well below the Horizon. Therefore, both Jupiter and Saturn are out of Sect, whilst Mars in Sect.
Jupiter is Cadent, in the 12th House and at the Bendings (square the Nodal axis). The only aspect he receives is an applying sextile from the Sun.
Saturn is angular, conjunct the Ascendant within a degree, and makes or recieves no applying aspects by Moiety of Orb. Venus is separating from him, also on Capricorn. By sign, he receives a trine from the Moon, the presumptive Sect Lord in Hayz (there may be some debate about the Moon's qualification as Sect Lord due to her house placement - 8th House in Regiomontanus and 9th in Whole Sign since I use a hybrid of both).
Mars is in Sect, Angular, and is applied to by Venus. Being in Term, he also picks up 2 extra points of Essential Dignity using Lilly's point system - pushing him one point ahead of Saturn.
But wait, Jupiter is not only in Domicile, but also Triplicity - in Fire in a Nocturnal chart. This gives him more Essential Dignity point than either Saturn or Mars.
Depending on the situation, I can be Jovial, Saturnine, or Martial - but which is stronger?
Strength is not really a consideration - it's a question of quality. According to purely Hellenistic (and likely most Medieval systems) Mars would be the planet that operates most freely and effectively.
Each planet takes its own place in each chart - supported by the relationships it has with Essential and Accidental dignities and debilities, dispositorships and aspects.
All things being equal, Domicile is more comfortable and familiar for a planet to be in than is Exaltation.
But things are never really equal, are they?
To use my own chart as an example (in my profile), I have two planets in Domicile and one in Exaltation - Jupiter in Sagittarius, Saturn in Capricorn, and Mars in Capricorn (for the moment, let's leave out that Mars is also in his Term).
My chart is a Nocturnal chart - with the Sun well below the Horizon. Therefore, both Jupiter and Saturn are out of Sect, whilst Mars in Sect.
Jupiter is Cadent, in the 12th House and at the Bendings (square the Nodal axis). The only aspect he receives is an applying sextile from the Sun.
Saturn is angular, conjunct the Ascendant within a degree, and makes or recieves no applying aspects by Moiety of Orb. Venus is separating from him, also on Capricorn. By sign, he receives a trine from the Moon, the presumptive Sect Lord in Hayz (there may be some debate about the Moon's qualification as Sect Lord due to her house placement - 8th House in Regiomontanus and 9th in Whole Sign since I use a hybrid of both).
Mars is in Sect, Angular, and is applied to by Venus. Being in Term, he also picks up 2 extra points of Essential Dignity using Lilly's point system - pushing him one point ahead of Saturn.
But wait, Jupiter is not only in Domicile, but also Triplicity - in Fire in a Nocturnal chart. This gives him more Essential Dignity point than either Saturn or Mars.
Depending on the situation, I can be Jovial, Saturnine, or Martial - but which is stronger?
Strength is not really a consideration - it's a question of quality. According to purely Hellenistic (and likely most Medieval systems) Mars would be the planet that operates most freely and effectively.
Each planet takes its own place in each chart - supported by the relationships it has with Essential and Accidental dignities and debilities, dispositorships and aspects.
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piscesascendant
Well-known member
Most concise explanation I've seen, quoted and cited:
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41081
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41081
piscesascendant
Well-known member
Hello everybody!
I came with this question... For me things are pretty obvious: in my opinion domicile is stronger than exaltation... It is almost intuitive. I am wondering why some people believe exaltation is stronger...
Tell me your opinion
Fragoso
I've felt intuitively that exaltation is "stronger," frag. Even before I read any numeric charts (Lilly) that treated astrology like a spreadsheet rather than the art it actually is. The explanation I linked before summarized the art form interpretation most thoroughly and succinctly in my opinion. I read the castle analogy, and--minus the use of the word "castle"--that was used in the explanation I quoted, but to explain detriment, not exaltation... having gifts but being in someone else's home with their "rules." Frankly, I found the explanation I read to make more sense (no offense to anyone). I also feel people cannot seem to disassociate the definition of the word from the astrological use (detriment, for example). But anyways...
I have planets both in exaltation and by rulership in my chart. A mutual reception by ruler, in fact. I don't sense my chart's rulers "overriding" my exaltations.
tokyo.lights
Well-known member
Voted for domicile purely because I have two of them in my chart
Plus I think so anyway
Plus I think so anywaypiscesascendant
Well-known member
Voted for domicile purely because I have two of them in my chart
I have both domiciles and exaltations. Someone brought up a good point: rather than look at domicile and exaltation as "stronger" (aka, which is "better," which is what I think people are really asking) look at what each is in itself. Domicile is known for its strength, exaltation for its purity. Neither is better than the other, as each contribute beneficially in their own way. It's more like, "how will the energies play out?"
tokyo.lights
Well-known member
Interesting way to look at it. I would imagine domicile energy flows more naturally/honestly? Exaltation...flows easily? I'm just guessing
piscesascendant
Well-known member
Interesting way to look at it. I would imagine domicile energy flows more naturally/honestly? Exaltation...flows easily? I'm just guessing
Domicile flows more naturally? Perhaps. More honestly? Exaltation wouldn't be dishonest by comparison. Is there a "dishonest" flow? And exaltation flowing more easily? Perhaps, but again, I'm not sure. Could be. Again, I think people are trying to ascribe "better" and "worse" descriptions to these things for some form of validation on their own charts.
tokyo.lights
Well-known member
wow no! not at all lol
Honestly as in true to itself. Like Libra in Venus. I would think Pisces in Venus expresses the planet's energy honestly as well. But since it's Venus, I guess it's Libra's territory. But yep...I'll just stop guessing 
tsmall
Premium Member
As this thread continues to gain life, I have to agree with you. Because the way we, and planets, behave when we are at home is completely different from the way we behave when we are "on display" in an exalted state. On the one hand we are free to be ourselves, and on the other we must put our best foot forward, mind our manners, and watch for those who wish to bring us down.