Jupiter-Time, 400 day calendar, approaching the Scorpioyear!

You guys are amazing. Thank you for these posts.

Ceres as a counterpart to Mars, and Persephone to Pluto? Beautiful.

blacksun? said:

Ive done some acting courses and I can tell you acting will disrupt your morals. You have to get out of your own standards. Actors are not in general moral beings, not in the least. They are quite fun, not as clever as lawyers, who are amoral in a funner and smarter way. But actors will betray you behind your back without the least of scrupules, Ive got some in my family too, not the brightest moral lights, to say the least.

So back to Pluto - Venus.
My Venus rules my Pluto, so perhaps I have a skewed image, I have a Pluto that is quite... light. Weirdly, it sometimes seems like my Pluto is the most nurturing part of me. Then, it is conjunct Ceres. In any case my Pluto can destroy the petrified fearful walls of souldead humans, as a way to open the doors politely for my Venus to step into wherever life needs her.

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Lol. You're right. Some plutos are very polite, haha. Thank you for that endearing definition. It brought a smile to my face.

Although I personally know only a few actors, none of them are morally corrupt. Annoying, yes, definitely. Totally hilarious at times too. But I wouldn't call them morally corrupt, at least not the ones I know. In terms of the larger profession of acting and how it may shape an individual's life choices, a concept worthy of consideration may be how sometimes the larger system forces someone into a position that doesn't allow for his or her true values to flourish. Hollywood is such a system, as is our political system. One example may be a young boy who is starving, and out of desperation he steals a loaf of bread from a bakery. That young boy could be labeled a “thief” by the system, but that doesn’t tell the true story. The boy was driven by starvation, not a desire to be a corrupt person. Politics and Hollywood will do the same thing to people. One of the most moving writers I’ve ever read was Weisel, who spoke of his time in Auschwitz with his father. When they first got there, he took great care of his father, giving him his only slice of bread each day, whatever he could do in his power to keep his father strong. But eventually, like an animal, the fundamental needs of his human body took over and the only thing he could think of each day was his own hunger. It finally reached a point when he wished his father was dead so that he wouldn’t have to care about him anymore. This is an example of how a system can turn the most thoughtful and caring person into a complete beast. I don’t doubt you when you say that some of the actors in your life lack moral character. But in the case of Hollywood, it seems inevitable that an industry like that would produce monsters. We all know that some men clearly can’t handle having power. Just read some of the current events.

I know one local actor who is very talented. The subtle ways that he is able to bring life to a script has been fascinating for me to observe. But he’s not a big name, Hollywood actor, and he doesn’t have the desire to become one. It’s the perfection of his craft that drives him. So while Hollywood may project a version of the theatrical arts in the most superficial and commercialized way, there really is a craft behind acting and I’ve observed some very gifted artists in this field.

But I’m a little biased though. One of my most favorite things to do is observe someone enter that zone of mastery over his craft. There are very few people who are incredibly skilled at what they do, and they are rarely the most visible people. Mastery is a lifelong process, and I love that kind of devotion. The chosen craft doesn’t matter, whether it’s an actor, a painter, a mathematician, a poet….. there is something incredibly sexy about watching someone merge into his work like a master craftsman. These are the people who serve as a vessel to the cosmos in what they bring to life, how they build meaning out of senselessness. It’s similar to our previous discussions about the highest potential of Virgo….. this sign embodies a subtle power that goes unseen by others who are more enamored by the glossiness of flashy Hollywood lights. The sign of Virgo has moved on from that--- it doesn’t need the glory to feel good, instead it is focused on the quality of what is produced. This is the madman working tirelessly in his lab, refining the song, the piece of writing, the cure that will heal. They aren't aiming for perfection, they are aiming for divinity; and they continually refine their work in pursuit of hitting that mark. The good ones are striving to bring heaven to earth in whatever way it can be delivered through a single human being.

blacksun? said:

Jupiter in Scorpio is one bad ************.

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Yup. .

There was a suggestion by c.t. that Dionysus be considered as a counterpart of Venus. I'm going to switch to "component", in place of counterpart. So anyway, it felt right, but I wanted to research whether any such connection has been made by others. A psychological website urges men to get in touch with their "inner Dionysus", while for women, it's about their "inner Aphrodite". Aphrodite actually did have a brief fling with Dionysus in the Ancient Greek literature. In both cases it's about erotic love. And, there's the son of the Roman goddess Venus, Eros, as well. But the influence of the PLANET Venus has that dual nature, morning-star and evening-star, which brings in the component of the Logos, and is extremely concerned with Truth and Justice. The Goddess of Justice holds the Libran balance scale, and the sword (connected in Tarot as I learned about it to Air-signs). So, it would appear that the Planet Venus is a rather complex ruler, as is the Planet Mars. They've been oversimplified [IMO].

The Justice card, #XI of the Major Arcana, is associated with Libra. The original Goddess of Justice (in recorded history) was Inanna, Queen of Heaven as morningstar Venus. Ancient Egypt had it as Maat, with Osiris weighing souls in the balance according to Maat. That was in the first Decant of the Tropical Age of Scorpio, with Libra as the overlapping Background Age. The Pharaohs were expected to rule in accordance with Maat as well.

david starling said:

There was a suggestion by c.t. that Dionysus be considered as a counterpart of Venus. I'm going to switch to "component", in place of counterpart. So anyway, it felt right, but I wanted to research whether any such connection has been made by others. A psychological website urges men to get in touch with their "inner Dionysus", while for women, it's about their "inner Aphrodite". Aphrodite actually did have a brief fling with Dionysus in the Ancient Greek literature. In both cases it's about erotic love. And, there's the son of the Roman goddess Venus, Eros, as well. But the influence of the PLANET Venus has that dual nature, morning-star and evening-star, which brings in the component of the Logos, and is extremely concerned with Truth and Justice. The Goddess of Justice holds the Libran balance scale, and the sword (connected in Tarot as I learned about it to Air-signs). So, it would appear that the Planet Venus is a rather complex ruler, as is the Planet Mars. They've been oversimplified [IMO].

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This has enormous impact. Very direct... "psychic" responses of happiness at this connection.
Your next comment is also a lightning bolt.
I always figured Inanna for Taurean, but she didn't seem all to happy with that.
Maat has been a powerful influence for som time but I had to let her go as I didn't not understand her ground. So now I do.

That card represents the path that connects Tipharet (Beauty): the Sun/King/Child/Christ center, to Geburah (Fortitude): the Mars center.

Happy New Year!

Ive been frustrated about not finding true connection to the symbolic world of Aquarius, my Sun sign. It is one of the poorest in attributions, always super-annoying, meaningless trifle, "eccentric", "fashionable" "independent" "intellectual" - is about the gist of it. Terrible trifling nonsense. There has to be more substance to my own sign, for me to relate to it.

I had a breakthrough now though. I realized that Aquarius is of course the Eagle.

In the myth of Aquarius, Zeus turns into an Eagle to abduct Ganymede. So people have coupled Ganymede with Aquarius, which is again utter nonsense. There is zero meaning to that. AQUARIUS is indicated by ZEUS the EAGLE, you fools.

All Air signs are poor in what they've been given as symbols. A Scales?? Really?? But Libra is thus Inanna, Maat, the majestic Queen - Aquarius is Zeus the Skygod as the Eagle.

Now Im going to think about beautiful Gemini.
Its loathsome what is being said about Gemini. So feeble. Its clear that we are coming from an age that absolutely abhors the Air element.

In general it is bizarre that no Air sign is being associated with Air-animals, birds. Very stupid. Now that I realize how absurd this all is everything comes together, by utter inability to relate to the Air signs in the terms we've been given, whereas I can relate to each and every other sign perfectly well, even Virgo where I have neither planets nor house cusps. Virgo is very rich in symbolism. Perhaps the richest.

Gemini Libra and Aquarius are all unintelligible through their attributions. I can tel you, because I have a grand trine Sun Moon Pluto in Aquarius-Gemini-Libra, so I should be able to relate, and throughout my career I havent for the life of me been able to see any substantial meaning in the symbolic attributions to any of the air signs. Not have I ever read of a person with an Air sign Sun that they understood themselves in these terms. Never, not once.

So this is done for. Jupiter-Scorpio is first of all so utterly generous as to bring up the Eagle, traditionally a secondary symbol of Scorpio, as the primary symbol of my own sign. And of course this is honours the Eagle -- what is that animal doing as a secondary symbol? The ancients were simply wrong here. There is little Eagle-like to Scorpio. Scorpio does not hover above things. Yes, it does have a doubtless and unwavering eye on the prey. But so do all Fixed Signs when they discern what they want.

In any case, all signs deserve animal symbolism. Having specific humans rather than whole animal species, as a symbol is just extraordinarily poorly.
How can one single human symbolize half a billion people living under each sign now?
Humans are not as a rule higher than other animals. In many ways they are lower. In many of the best of ways, they are equal, and very happy as such.

In these times, humanity will spend some centuries getting on par with animals. Thats all that can be accomplished now.
The vey lowest, worst, scummy humans on the planet are those that seek to colonize other planets after we've destroyed the Earth. Obviously all of us must go down with the Earth, it is not about us, it is about the Earth and all the animals and plans on it that we are given to enjoy and live among. We derive our joy from her. All those other-world-lings like that poor Stephen Hawkings are absolute moral degenerates.

Back to Aquarius.
If we look at US presidents; Lincoln, FDR and Reagan, we see Aquarius is the most broad- and far-sighted sign, and possibly the most cold-blooded in war. Thats no water-bearer, no cup-bearer slave-boy, you ancient fools.

The Age of Aquarius arrives under the EAGLE.

Ride my Wings
As I let you
Before I dive
Close your eyes now little one
this is Aquarius
I will pour you forth and drink you up
but I don't care.

HA!

Gemini is CROW and RAVEN.



Birds of Odin
Trickster-God
Associated by the Romans with Mercury
God of Bad Weather
Temperament
Dangerous Games
Home in the Borderland, No Mans Land.
Law unto themselves -- or each-other -- no one knows.



"All weathers are wild, do you know what this means?"
Wind God, Crow God
GEMINI

Crows are delightfully arrogant. Especially vs humans. They are all too aware that we lack wings and telepathic normalcy, they know the ties that bind us, the ropes and chains that define us. So they grin their crooked grins and lure us into the woods, that we may smell freedom and begin to dream of it. It is beyond the crows knowledge or care what we will arrive at. They just like to spur us on into the unknown, away from our... "cup-bearers"... our pathetic cultures, our tables with food that goes to waste.....

The Eagle knows no arrogance. He wouldn't see anyone to look down on. Too far below to discern as entity.

Eagle has equals (friends, offspring) and then he has all that.... stuff below.

Next bird to discern: LIBRA.

World-Libra-Leaders:
Putin
Khomeini
Berlusconi
Thatcher
Netanyahu....

And Nietzsche was a Libra.

Evidently, Libra has Eagle-like qualities as well.
But perhaps.... the Owl?
Given that justice is blind and for this the Judge must be able to discern in the dark.... Putin and Khomeini both are leaders that came up in the deep of night of their country, the precipice of destruction. Netanyahu is very much a night-bird as well, a hunter in the dark. Berlusconi similarly. He was eaten by the Coyote hrc...

Thatcher brought on the Night for England.
Libras often herald the night, how fitting for the Guardian of the Fall Equinox.

The Owl for Libra is tentative. The Crow/Raven for Gemini is a happy match. The Eagle for Aquarius is definitive, Fixed.

The Eagle, hanging seemingly motionless in the sky - this is the symbol of Fixed Air.

Now then there is consecrated a bond between Aquarius and Scorpio, through the mighty Eagle.
Possibly, the human race was not ready for such a bold association.
But now that Ive tasted it, I am never going back to that barren world of the "cup-bearer".

Aquarians: you can drop your cup from the very heights where you live, far too high to even hear it smash to pieces. Yours is not the duty to carry a vessel. The OPEN SKY is the vessel which carries you, who are its will.

Sagittarius now can be seen to radiate into Capricorn and Aquarius -
David I totally agree with the trident approach. Capricorn is in a sense the center of what happens through Sagittarius, and Aquarius its frontier. The unboundedness of Pisces is the center of the Aquarian will-span and the total freedom of action of Aries its own frontier. And the complexities of Gemini form the frontier to Aries' single mind as for Pisces the bountiful truth of Taurus is the end to its imaginings, where the forward-will of Aries is its actual substance. Pisces' that I know are tough, and very prone to rumble. They have to be to go with the flow.... as any sailor will tell you.

I'm more attuned to Neptune than most Astrologers appear to be. Very easy to track Neptunian eras. When Neptune neared the end of its Transit through Scorpio, we got the "Soaring Sixties" epithet, referring to "The Eagle has landed" from the Apollo(!) Mission, at the same time THE song was playing, and the Age of Aquarius had become a cornerstone of the counterculture.

In the rulership groupings, Aquarius and Scorpio are "Companion-signs". The Water Bearer image does apply in one instance, [IMO]: Aquarius is "In Service", voluntarily, to the Moon and the Sign for which the Moon is Native-ruler cancer.

david starling said:

I'm more attuned to Neptune than most Astrologers appear to be. Very easy to track Neptunian eras. When Neptune neared the end of its Transit through Scorpio, we got the "Soaring Sixties" epithet, referring to "The Eagle has landed" from the Apollo(!) Mission, at the same time THE song was playing, and the Age of Aquarius had become a cornerstone of the counterculture.

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Yes, within two days of Neptune moving into Aquarius, my cousin committed suicide. Very clearly related, he couldn't take that hard air diamond all-truth that has no water or Earth-safety but only madness. Madness struck the planet with N in A.
I now see it moved into Pisces April 2011 - that immediately led to an enormous surge in my artistic and philosophic power, and within two months I had developed my philosophy of value, but right that very moment I booked a flight to LA, to heal myself through... dreaming.

This is a video I edited with the footage I came back with.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQvjzY2fhnk
Im pretty sure a Neptune lover will enjoy this.

david starling said:

In the rulership groupings, Aquarius and Scorpio are "Companion-signs". The Water Bearer image does apply in one instance, [IMO]: Aquarius is "In Service", voluntarily, to the Moon and the Sign for which the Moon is Native-ruler cancer.

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Yes. Aquarius serves as Water-Bearer, to to speak in philosophic terms, overflowing spirit, in pouring forth a the accumulated riches of the Zodiac. Pisces and Cancer would be natural recipients, as they are such pleasure and happiness loving signs, and are very good at receiving.

Pisces is the descent back into egoism, it takes the fruits of all the labor of the signs and seeks to enjoy it both privately and selflessly - but as wel know the Piscean selflessness is simply a completely exhaustive self-enjoyment. It imagines itself the blessing of everyones life. Pisces can be the most annoyingly irresponsible and profiteering people, when they have some hard aspects to that sign. Cancers can be the most overly sensitive hypocrites. But also these signs can provide the very sweetest and radiant gratitude. Aquarius is a both stoic and exuberant masculine soul before these that not always ungrudgingly pours forth what it has - sometimes it does begrudge Pisces ease in enjoyment of the honey in the human swamp, its talent for drawing out the good from the dank, ...

But back - Aquarius as Wolf, as calculating yet instinctive (moon) winter-group animal very much indicates an Aquarian allegiance to Cancer.

Aquarius - Wolf
Cancer - Moon
this is a nice pair.

blacksun? said:

HA!

Gemini is CROW and RAVEN.

Birds of Odin
Trickster-God
Associated by the Romans with Mercury
God of Bad Weather
Temperament
Dangerous Games
Home in the Borderland, No Mans Land.
Law unto themselves -- or each-other -- no one knows.

"All weathers are wild, do you know what this means?"
Wind God, Crow God
GEMINI

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From my point of view the raven gravitates more towards scorpio because of its alchemical and magical attributes.

Y

david starling said:

There was a suggestion by c.t. that Dionysus be considered as a counterpart of Venus. I'm going to switch to "component", in place of counterpart. So anyway, it felt right, but I wanted to research whether any such connection has been made by others. A psychological website urges men to get in touch with their "inner Dionysus", while for women, it's about their "inner Aphrodite". Aphrodite actually did have a brief fling with Dionysus in the Ancient Greek literature. In both cases it's about erotic love. And, there's the son of the Roman goddess Venus, Eros, as well. But the influence of the PLANET Venus has that dual nature, morning-star and evening-star, which brings in the component of the Logos, and is extremely concerned with Truth and Justice. The Goddess of Justice holds the Libran balance scale, and the sword (connected in Tarot as I learned about it to Air-signs). So, it would appear that the Planet Venus is a rather complex ruler, as is the Planet Mars. They've been oversimplified [IMO].

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This is only my opinion, but based on my experiences, I prefer Psyche and Eros as counterparts to Venus and Mars. I’ve found the symbolism of the myth behind Psyche and Eros to be very true when those two energies meet one another in real life as they represent a very finite point in the whole spectrum of desire. Psyche represents the human soul. It was through Psyche that Eros realized a higher potential for his erotic energy. Venus and mars can have quite a bit of fun down at the tavern, but when Psyche and Eros meet, a completely different storyline unfolds because that’s when a finite point in the human soul meets the point of absolute erotic desire on a divine level. This concept seems like a component of venus and mars.

In our previous discussion on how the gods come out in aspects, not in planets, your description of Persephone as the goddess for moon/pluto was a great example. I loved this because it symbolized the depth that is traveled in a feminine, lunar, transformative way. Dionysus, on the other hand, symbolizes more than venus to me. He symbolized more than mars and eros too. But perhaps this is because I've read different versions of his myth. When I think of Dionysus, I think of Neptune. Dionysus understood pleasure and desire, just like Venus and Mars, but he took it to another level, one that inspired the people around him to want more than the seduction of Venus or the desire of Mars. He caused people to want more out of their philosophy, more out of their art, and more out of their lives. That takes us into Neptune’s territory, the area in our cosmos that we can’t see every day but we all know is out there. In the back of his mind, Dionysus was always trying to get there.

Venus definitely embodies love and pleasure. It always stays close to the sun, so it’s the next brightest light in our sky, after the sun and the moon. But that also makes it one of three planets that can cast our shadows on earth. People can’t see their own shadows when they are busy looking right at these sources of light. Some stories say that Dionysus even confronted Eros, poking at his innately narcissistic views on life. Dionysus already knew that he was beautiful and he didn’t seek such adoration from any of the camps, mortal or immortal. Among the wells of sensation and inspiration where he would dive, he was looking for something else. Dionysus was trying to find home. Dionysus was inspirational across many different civilizations, religions, and cultures because everyone is trying to find "home," in some way, in some area of their lives. Where one finds it isn’t so much the point but the fact that everyone knows this home exists, somewhere, and they spend a good part of their lives looking for it. That’s why I see Dionysus as representing way more than a function of venus. Dionysus was aiming for the stuff that rests beyond the gates of Saturn.
.

ynnest said:

From my point of view the raven gravitates more towards scorpio because of its alchemical and magical attributes.

Y

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Certainly the 8th house is relevant to Raven. But I would note that Gemini is a magical sign too - the first of mind, the playful aspect of it, and it has communications as its central theme where the Raven in lore is always given the messenger-task. And in real life too. Just now a raven flew across the sky to sit on the tall dead Ash in the forest I see from my window, and as soon as he lands, two others fly out mechanically as special forces to some crucial hub of communications elsewhere.

It doesn't seem like Raven ever needs much at all. This is Gemini-like, the aloofness.
Scorpio and Gemini related in a strange way, of causing unpredictable results.

sadge said:

What do you guys think in terms of Uranus having rulership over Aquarius? Your honest opinion. I see it, as long as saturn is attached. Especially if you think about it as a secondary level (or higher purpose) of the sun (polarity point of Leo).

Same with the exaltation point in Scorpio. I can see how Uranus would have the exact opposite purpose of the moon, where it's exaltation point is in Taurus.

But it's all open for debate, and will probably be increasingly so as we move toward incorporating new findings into the field. Another point of debate right now is where to place Chiron. Astrologers who specialize in Chiron believe it should be with Virgo, Sagittarius, or both.

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In the patterns I keep saying I'm going to explain, Saturn isn't a member of the Aquarian rulership group. But Aquarius is definitely a target for Saturn's wrath, because it just naturally breaks Saturn's rules. Can't help it.