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  #1  
Unread 02-01-2014, 11:07 PM
multiple multiple is offline
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alpha male capacity/dominance characteristics? or too much pluto?

so i've been doing a bit of thinking recently as I was spotting a pattern, it seems to me that people who show inclinations towards being dominant or alpha male assertiveness can quite often be uncomfortable around me, this isn't always the case but it is more so with people that seem to give me the impression that they are a little insecure towards these issues. maybe they have difficulty showing their capacity? but I have noticed that just when I am around them doing anything normal they appear bothered or they feel the need to assert their dominance, part of me thinks its a little silly, but I often wonder to myself what is it about me that rouses them into this state where they are getting themselves worked up? I don't actively challenge people, or force them to assert themselves but it seems as though they find my very presence enough that they feel the need to try and prove they are more dominant or alpha male. I don't really think of myself as an alpha male or a "leader" or a person who is dominant. so is it something in my chart being expressed? maybe the first house sun trine to pluto? but also after reading the thread about pluto and venus/mars connections maybe its my pluto trine venus? and i'm being a bit controlling? or at least, i'm not yielding to any control another is trying to assert over me.


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  #2  
Unread 02-02-2014, 02:23 AM
brookeashley brookeashley is offline
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Re: alpha male capacity/dominance characteristics? or too much pluto?

I'm new to this so don't take everything I say too seriously.
With your Venus conjunct your Asc, I would think that would make you seem comfortable or harmonious. People would be drawn to you. Is it just a couple people you have in mind or many? Maybe it would be worth looking at a synastry chart if its a particular person.
I have sun square Pluto and I appear deep. Somewhat secretive. I've heard from people of whom I'm an open book with, that there seems to be more to me if that makes sense. I don't think your sun trine Pluto has much to do with it.
Your Asc trine Pluto is a tight orb, less than 1 degree. Pluto is power and transformation, maybe Pluto (power) gives your Asc (appearance) a dominating output.
Has this been a recent thing? Could be a transit.

I could be wrong, hopefully an experienced astrologer will give there 2 cents.
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  #3  
Unread 02-02-2014, 03:10 AM
mutableflame mutableflame is offline
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Re: alpha male capacity/dominance characteristics? or too much pluto?

I would say that you likely have a very strong social presence. Lots of energy, extremely flirtatious, sharp, and charismatic when you care to be. A friend of mine has a very similar chart, and experiences similar issues with the way others perceive her.. The Leo moon should thrive in the Gemini ability to convey itself so effortlessly. That Leo moon may be what other pick up on. Perhaps a subtle (Virgo) social dominance you emote. You should also be quite dexterous and tactful even for a Gemini. Hard to say though.
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Unread 02-02-2014, 03:43 AM
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Re: alpha male capacity/dominance characteristics? or too much pluto?

this is a non astrological comment. But i thought most men experienced this with other males,no? I have/had a lot of males friend and this is always something that they deal with. I hear comments on how annoying it is all the time.
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Unread 02-02-2014, 04:30 AM
Krewster Krewster is offline
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Re: alpha male capacity/dominance characteristics? or too much pluto?

that Merc-Jup-Pluto (45-90-45) triangle must get you into trouble socially from time to time....?
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  #6  
Unread 02-02-2014, 05:06 AM
Chalk Chalk is offline
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Re: alpha male capacity/dominance characteristics? or too much pluto?

mars square sun and asc, sun in the first house in conjunction to the ascendant
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so is it something in my chart being expressed?
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  #7  
Unread 02-02-2014, 06:48 AM
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Re: alpha male capacity/dominance characteristics? or too much pluto?

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mars square sun and asc, sun in the first house in conjunction to the ascendant
That's what I'm seeing first, too. Also the Mars conj. Saturn. I associate Saturn with authority more than Pluto, and Mars/Saturn combo might make you seem naturally authoritative, even if you aren't trying to be.

I know someone who has this issue, and they have 1st house Mars conj. Asc in Capricorn.

For some contrast, another person whose chart I've looked at exaggerates their own authority/competence and it's hard to tell if they actually know what they're talking about or not, and they have Sun/Neptune conj. Asc in Capricorn, squared to Jupiter.
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Unread 02-02-2014, 08:05 AM
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Re: alpha male capacity/dominance characteristics? or too much pluto?

Hello,
please do not judge my english, to my glance it looks like your Asc, Sun, Venus ruler Mercury in Cancer in partile square to Pluto wants emotional, verbal assurance that you are needed, useful and in control of things. But trine from Gemini bodies gives great results ant outcome that you already are all that, just you Mercury is not so sure or needs aproval
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  #9  
Unread 02-02-2014, 02:27 PM
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Re: alpha male capacity/dominance characteristics? or too much pluto?

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Originally Posted by mutableflame View Post
I would say that you likely have a very strong social presence. Lots of energy, extremely flirtatious, sharp, and charismatic when you care to be. A friend of mine has a very similar chart, and experiences similar issues with the way others perceive her.. The Leo moon should thrive in the Gemini ability to convey itself so effortlessly. That Leo moon may be what other pick up on. Perhaps a subtle (Virgo) social dominance you emote. You should also be quite dexterous and tactful even for a Gemini. Hard to say though.
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Originally Posted by Flapjacks View Post
That's what I'm seeing first, too. Also the Mars conj. Saturn. I associate Saturn with authority more than Pluto, and Mars/Saturn combo might make you seem naturally authoritative, even if you aren't trying to be.

I know someone who has this issue, and they have 1st house Mars conj. Asc in Capricorn.

For some contrast, another person whose chart I've looked at exaggerates their own authority/competence and it's hard to tell if they actually know what they're talking about or not, and they have Sun/Neptune conj. Asc in Capricorn, squared to Jupiter.
that's interesting that you mention similar charts and similar issues, I haven't really looked too deeply into this before but i'd be interested to see the charts of people which experience this too. mars in cap is a strong place for it, i'd agree that mars in virgo isn't really the strongest place for mars.

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this is a non astrological comment. But i thought most men experienced this with other males,no? I have/had a lot of males friend and this is always something that they deal with. I hear comments on how annoying it is all the time.
yea, I think it is something that men have to deal with in general. its all part of the male psyche within certain dynamics. for example, if I was in a group of other people and there were any weaker males within the group I might be unknowingly elected leader or have that responsibility put on me. although when there is a situation when there are more dominant types then it becomes more complicated and these difficulties arise where other males begin to become competitive.
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Unread 02-05-2014, 07:01 PM
Zarathu Zarathu is offline
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Re: alpha male capacity/dominance characteristics? or too much pluto?

Has this always been an issue or is it something that you've just recently noticed?
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  #11  
Unread 02-06-2014, 02:01 AM
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Re: alpha male capacity/dominance characteristics? or too much pluto?

Hi,

What jumped out at me from your question and the chart was the T-Square, with a very tight orb, between you Asc - Neptune on the Descendant and Saturn. I think the answer to your question is here. With Neptune on the Desc, you have a strong tendency to fantasize about the other, and their perception of you, add to that Saturn conjunct Mars, square both of them, with the orb tightest to Saturn, and Saturn being the more malefic of the two due to you having a night chart, I think what is going on is you are coming to terms with this T-Square. Think of it as a tension in you between who you are, how you are seen, and authority and power. It is interesting how you describe this as the alpha male thing, (Mars) and bosses (Saturn).

One of the beauties of astrology is the mysterious ways that the chart can help us understand ourselves, but only when we are ready, and the fact that you asked this question I think indicates you are ready.

Mars and Saturn together in Virgo, imo, gives you a strong capacity to work hard, incredible attention to detail, perseverance, feet on the ground type of strength. Incorporating that into a Gemini Asc can be a challenge, hence the square, and combine that with a less the clear vision of the other, the opposition to Neptune, and a less than clear vision of power and authority, the Neptune square to Saturn/Mars, and you have a cocktail very close, imo, to what you are describing.

The Mind (Gemini) YOU - Mystery/Illusion/Spirit (Neptune) THE OTHER Power and Authority (Mars/Saturn) ORIGINS - My guess, this issue with authority maybe comes from home? How did your parents, family in general, treat you when you tried to assert yourself? My guess is your answer is there somewhere.

According to the house system you used, (I use another), the resolution is in the 10th house, in Pisces, where Neptune is comfortable. He's there now. I think if you delve into this, you will find the resolution, you are asking the right question, and I think astrology can help you find the answer.

Good Luck
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  #12  
Unread 02-06-2014, 09:01 PM
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Re: alpha male capacity/dominance characteristics? or too much pluto?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zarathu View Post
Has this always been an issue or is it something that you've just recently noticed?
only recently am I trying to put together a theory on how or why this is happening (within the last month). someone mentioned alpha males and psychology on another board I read a few years ago and the subject peaked my interest. my interest has been reignited after a person who is a self confessed alpha male has been a little bit passive aggressive with me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CactusLand View Post
The Mind (Gemini) YOU - Mystery/Illusion/Spirit (Neptune) THE OTHER Power and Authority (Mars/Saturn) ORIGINS - My guess, this issue with authority maybe comes from home? How did your parents, family in general, treat you when you tried to assert yourself? My guess is your answer is there somewhere.

According to the house system you used, (I use another), the resolution is in the 10th house, in Pisces, where Neptune is comfortable. He's there now. I think if you delve into this, you will find the resolution, you are asking the right question, and I think astrology can help you find the answer.

Good Luck
yes, you're right about family. I had a pretty tough time with my father, in short, things were quite complicated between him, my mother and us children. I later found out that he had various issues with my mother with her frequently complaining about his lack of effort. I had the feeling he saw me as a threat during childhood. not a physical threat but by me being assertive and confident/capable it made him look bad. I didn't understand all this as a child and simply took it personally.
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