Astrologers' Community  

Go Back   Astrologers' Community > Anything Else... > Chat

Chat For posts that don't have to do with astrological chart interpretation, but they're still important to you. Gossip, show off, hot topic, spiritual thoughts, Sun sign astrological discussions, chit chat: come in and share!


Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #51  
Unread 01-12-2020, 12:22 PM
petosiris's Avatar
petosiris petosiris is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 3,338
Re: What is an astrological planet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by david starling View Post
The absolute physicality is modern-day. And, they were polytheistic.
Ibn Ezra (a renowned Rabbinic authority to this day) Al-Biruni, Cardano and Morinus were polytheists? Modern-day scientists came up with idea of the four elements? What???

Reply With Quote
  #52  
Unread 01-12-2020, 12:24 PM
david starling david starling is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Yes
Posts: 20,697
Smile Re: What is an astrological planet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by petosiris View Post
Ibn Ezra (a renowned Rabbinic authority to this day) Al-Biruni, Cardano and Morinus were polytheists?
That's why I asked, "how ancient?"
Reply With Quote
  #53  
Unread 01-12-2020, 12:25 PM
david starling david starling is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Yes
Posts: 20,697
Smile Re: What is an astrological planet?

They were men of this Age, not the Hellenistic, Sagittarian Age.
Reply With Quote
  #54  
Unread 01-12-2020, 12:26 PM
petosiris's Avatar
petosiris petosiris is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 3,338
Re: What is an astrological planet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by david starling View Post
They were men of this Age, not the Hellenistic, Sagittarian Age.
Ptolemy and Valens worked with physical astrology. The Greeks called their methods ''physical'', not in the sense that they are ''materialistic'', but in the sense of ''natural'' or ''scientific'' - Robbins usually favours the first translation (though he uses physical and scientific at times), Riley usually favours the second translation as ''scientific'' (though he uses physical and natural a few times). The terms are used by Ptolemy and Valens to separate their astrology from mythology, divination, numerology and magic, and to base them firmly on astronomy.

You clearly have a problem with that world-view, and you have denigrated it many times now.
Reply With Quote
  #55  
Unread 01-12-2020, 12:32 PM
david starling david starling is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Yes
Posts: 20,697
Smile Re: What is an astrological planet?

Hey Peto, how will we know when H*ll has frozen over?

[Ans.] When J.A. decides that Pluto is a major influence in an astrology Chart!
Reply With Quote
  #56  
Unread 01-12-2020, 12:35 PM
david starling david starling is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Yes
Posts: 20,697
Smile Re: What is an astrological planet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by petosiris View Post
Ptolemy and Valens worked with physical astrology. The Greeks called their methods ''physical'', not in the sense that they are ''materialistic'', but in the sense of ''natural'' or ''scientific'' - Robbins usually favours the first translation (though he uses physical and scientific at times), Riley usually favours the second translation as ''scientific'' (though he uses physical and natural a few times). The terms are used by Ptolemy and Valens to separate their astrology from mythology, divination, numerology and magic, and to base them firmly on astronomy.

You clearly have a problem with that world-view, and you have denigrated it many times now.
You seek out those from the past with views similar to yours. The Ages aren't lock-step.
Reply With Quote
  #57  
Unread 01-12-2020, 12:38 PM
petosiris's Avatar
petosiris petosiris is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 3,338
Re: What is an astrological planet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by david starling View Post
You seek out those from the past with views similar to yours. The Ages aren't lock-step.
Said the guy with his new pet-theory no one cares about.
Reply With Quote
  #58  
Unread 01-12-2020, 12:38 PM
david starling david starling is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Yes
Posts: 20,697
Smile Re: What is an astrological planet?

Ptolemy and Valens--are their religious beliefs known?
Reply With Quote
  #59  
Unread 01-12-2020, 12:39 PM
petosiris's Avatar
petosiris petosiris is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 3,338
Re: What is an astrological planet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by david starling View Post
Ptolemy and Valens--are their religious beliefs known?
Greco-Roman polytheism, they mention Zeus and the gods a few times, but not related to astrology. Check who causes thunder for example - http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/...los/2B*.html#8
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to petosiris For This Useful Post:
david starling (01-12-2020)
  #60  
Unread 01-12-2020, 12:49 PM
david starling david starling is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Yes
Posts: 20,697
Smile Re: What is an astrological planet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by petosiris View Post
Greco-Roman polytheism, they mention Zeus and the gods a few times, but not related to astrology. Check who causes thunder for example - http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/...los/2B*.html#8
With Mercury as the god of thunder and lightning, a clear difference from the standard, Greco-Roman pantheon.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to david starling For This Useful Post:
petosiris (01-12-2020)
  #61  
Unread 01-12-2020, 12:51 PM
david starling david starling is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Yes
Posts: 20,697
Smile Re: What is an astrological planet?

Also a difference in the sweetness and light of the fierce, dangerous King of the gods in standard Greco-Roman.
Reply With Quote
  #62  
Unread 01-12-2020, 12:52 PM
petosiris's Avatar
petosiris petosiris is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 3,338
Re: What is an astrological planet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by david starling View Post
With Mercury as the god of thunder and lightning, a clear difference from the standard, Greco-Roman pantheon.
You mean that the two drying planets are associated with lightning instead of the false god who was associated with the star Phaethon?
Reply With Quote
  #63  
Unread 01-12-2020, 12:53 PM
david starling david starling is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Yes
Posts: 20,697
Smile Re: What is an astrological planet?

I read that, although he never claimed to actually be a Stoic, Valens held a lot of stoic convictions.
Reply With Quote
  #64  
Unread 01-12-2020, 12:55 PM
petosiris's Avatar
petosiris petosiris is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 3,338
Re: What is an astrological planet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by david starling View Post
I read that, although he never claimed to actually be a Stoic, Valens held a lot of stoic convictions.
He was a full determinist unlike Ptolemy, but he shared a physicalist (in the ancient sense) view of astrology. I've shared some of his quotes that blatantly show that - https://www.astrologyweekly.com/foru...postcount=8798
Reply With Quote
  #65  
Unread 01-12-2020, 01:09 PM
david starling david starling is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Yes
Posts: 20,697
Smile Re: What is an astrological planet?

I attribute the differences in our astrological models to differences in our Natal-charts.
Reply With Quote
  #66  
Unread 01-12-2020, 01:13 PM
petosiris's Avatar
petosiris petosiris is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 3,338
Re: What is an astrological planet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by david starling View Post
I attribute the differences in our astrological models to differences in our Natal-charts.
I and Ptolemy probably share Moon and Mercury placements that preclude superstition.
Reply With Quote
  #67  
Unread 01-12-2020, 01:17 PM
petosiris's Avatar
petosiris petosiris is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 3,338
Re: What is an astrological planet?

Do you deny that Ptolemy and Valens had physicalist (in the ancient sense specified above - excluding mythology, divination, numerology and magic) astrology?
Reply With Quote
  #68  
Unread 01-12-2020, 01:20 PM
david starling david starling is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Yes
Posts: 20,697
Smile Re: What is an astrological planet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by petosiris View Post
Do you deny that Ptolemy and Valens had physicalist (in the ancient sense specified above - excluding mythology, divination, numerology and magic) astrology?
No, looks like it to me. If they did have mystical musings, they didn't publicize them.
Reply With Quote
  #69  
Unread 01-12-2020, 01:22 PM
david starling david starling is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Yes
Posts: 20,697
Smile Re: What is an astrological planet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by petosiris View Post
I and Ptolemy probably share Moon and Mercury placements that preclude superstition.
Modern materialistic scientists consider astrology a superstitious practice.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to david starling For This Useful Post:
petosiris (01-12-2020)
  #70  
Unread 01-12-2020, 01:22 PM
petosiris's Avatar
petosiris petosiris is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 3,338
Re: What is an astrological planet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by david starling View Post
No, looks like it to me. If they did have mystical musings, they didn't publicize them.
Ooooh, probably afraid of the backlash from the scientific community.
Reply With Quote
  #71  
Unread 01-12-2020, 01:27 PM
david starling david starling is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Yes
Posts: 20,697
Smile Re: What is an astrological planet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by petosiris View Post
Ooooh, probably afraid of the backlash from the scientific community.
Highly doubtful. For their time they REPRESENTED the "scientific community". But, a Christian working as a scientist today isn't going to claim that God supersedes the scientific method, while at the same time believing that God can work supernatural miracles.
Reply With Quote
  #72  
Unread 01-12-2020, 01:53 PM
petosiris's Avatar
petosiris petosiris is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 3,338
Re: What is an astrological planet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by david starling View Post
But, a Christian working as a scientist today isn't going to claim that God supersedes the scientific method, while at the same time believing that God can work supernatural miracles.
??????????
Reply With Quote
  #73  
Unread 01-12-2020, 01:55 PM
petosiris's Avatar
petosiris petosiris is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 3,338
Re: What is an astrological planet?

You mean Christians can be hypocrites like Ptolemy and Valens (who were esoteric mystics)?
Reply With Quote
  #74  
Unread 01-12-2020, 02:02 PM
david starling david starling is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Yes
Posts: 20,697
Smile Re: What is an astrological planet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by petosiris View Post
??????????
Scientists who think everything is of the physical world, yet go to church on Sunday and pray to a non-physical Being.
Reply With Quote
  #75  
Unread 01-12-2020, 02:09 PM
petosiris's Avatar
petosiris petosiris is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 3,338
Re: What is an astrological planet?

Quote:
Originally Posted by david starling View Post
Scientists who think everything is of the physical world, yet go to church on Sunday and pray to a non-physical Being.
Do these scientists suffer from cognitive dissonance? You can't believe both.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT. The time now is 03:07 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2005-2018, AstrologyWeekly.com. Boards' structure and all posts are property of AstrologyWeekly.com and their respective creators. No part of the messages sent on these boards may be copied without their owners' explicit consent.