Mars square Pluto - most difficult sign placements

Viviene

Well-known member
I come from a family of Mars Pluto squares and oppositions. They are a tough aspect, but all of those in my family have Mars in Aries, Capricorn and Scorpio. One has Mars in Taurus opp Pluto in Scorp. So very strong Mars and/or Pluto placements for the most part.

I myself have missed out on this particularly family signature and do not have a Mars Pluto aspect. However I have recently had two very disturbing altercations with two separate individuals who both have Mars in Cancer square Pluto in Libra. I have Mars in Cancer, but it is only in a weak trine to Neptune.

I am of the opinion that a retentive sign such as Cancer is potentially more dangerous for Mars when placed in such a difficult square. Interested in the opinions of others. Cheers all
 

Lin

Well-known member
For a person to be literally 'violent' there has to be MORE than one negative ....no matter how negative. (so check other aspects in that person's chart.

I have Uranus square Mars angular and I've never been violent....in fact, just the opposite.
I tend to 'internalize' the negativity.
But I also use that energy to do things I REALLY love - it's inactivity that is my enemy.
LIN
 
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carpediem

Active member
I myself have missed out on this particularly family signature and do not have a Mars Pluto aspect. However I have recently had two very disturbing altercations with two separate individuals who both have Mars in Cancer square Pluto in Libra. I have Mars in Cancer, but it is only in a weak trine to Neptune.

I am of the opinion that a retentive sign such as Cancer is potentially more dangerous for Mars when placed in such a difficult square. Interested in the opinions of others. Cheers all

I agree with you, Viviene. Mars in Cancer is in its fall -- the worst possible sign Mars could be in. Its dispositor is the Moon, which makes Mars in Cancer people moody and emotionally unpredictable. This is especially true if the Moon is afflicted in the chart. Mars in Libra and Mars in Taurus people are usually nicer since their dispositor is Venus, a benefic (provided Venus is not heavily afflicted).

My former boss had Mars in Cancer square Pluto in Libra at 4 degrees applying. I would watch him explode emotionally at people within the office and at clients. He had a very bad mouth, as well. In my opinion, Mars square Pluto tempers are 100 times worse if the aspect is applying, rather than separating. My former boss's Mars square Pluto combination was further worsened by having Jupiter (exalted in Cancer) conjunct his Mars-in-Fall, and again worsened by having Pluto conjunct North Node. The Pluto-North Node conjunction was extremely tight at one degree applying -- the closest applying aspect within his chart. His moon was also conjunct Pluto (afflicted moon). He was emotionally volatile with a very hot temper and a strong drive for money, power, and success. Being a business sign, Cancer can get evil when it comes to fame and fortune, and it retains memory of past hurts.

I found two quotes online that I think really nail the Mars-square-Pluto aspect, if it is close and applying...
"These are emotionally violent types. They can't control or contain their emotional spite, and are physically damaging individuals. They have the capacity to ruin lives. They victimize themselves for personal gain, and lie regardless of consequence. They have tumultuous relationships/marriages, and are difficult people to get along with in everyday life."

"A note on Mars/Pluto, which dominates this personality and life from deep within: It shows a willingness (need) to fight to the death, a constant struggle for survival (whether physical or emotional), a compulsive need to win at any cost, the assertion of power, and deeply buried rage. It tends to bring utter ruthlessness (often hidden or disguised), and a flair for covert manipulation. The rage is buried, but then erupts with the most extreme force and is uncontrollable."
 

Ambitious

Well-known member
I also have Mars in Cancer square Pluto in Libra. I am not sure why some people automatically assume that Mars in Cancer is weak; never have I been such a person and I think the way Mars plays out in any individual depends on their chart and actual aspects to the planets involved. I am direct, focused, and decisive- none of which are attributed to Mars Cancer.

My Chart
 

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Loda41

Well-known member
You have to look at how the Mars in Cancer relates to the rest if your chart. Having air signs can make you intellectualize before you rush to confrontation.
 

Ambitious

Well-known member
You have to look at how the Mars in Cancer relates to the rest if your chart. Having air signs can make you intellectualize before you rush to confrontation.

I tend to sound intellectual when in confrontation, even when screaming. I also know how to fight, despite not being taught to do so. My Capricorn Mars sister never fought and is very emotional/feeling about everything; she is more likely to be defended by others than to defend herself.
 
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ashriia

Well-known member
When the mars in question, is in cancer, and in square aspect to pluto- then no - Mars is extremely strong in the personality, and forceful. For example, feeling vunerable might trigger volatility, as an example. Anything that is associated to moon - such an insecurity - vunerability - is likely to set off the aspect oftentimes, from what I've witnessed. A short temper is a given with it. But on the positive side it gives obsessive drive.. hopefully what is being focused on is in the best interest of all involved. Otherwise, look out.


I also have Mars in Cancer square Pluto in Libra. I am not sure why some people automatically assume that Mars in Cancer is weak; never have I been such a person and I think the way Mars plays out in any individual depends on their chart and actual aspects to the planets involved. I am direct, focused, and decisive- none of which are attributed to Mars Cancer.

My Chart
 

IfIKnewBetter

Well-known member
I have this aspect (Mars in Leo square Pluto in Scorpio) in a 2 degree orb.

Even when I was little it was complete blood lust. The way I would fight was totally different from other kids. I remember pinning a girl to the wall by the throat and working my fingers around her trachea when I was 6. Scared the **** out of my teacher. I unhinged a guy's jaw at 8 because he and his friend were making fun of my friend. Just reached in there, grabbed around his molars and yanked. The crossing guard couldn't believe it. It was always right to the finishing move. Even in emotional/psychological fights. Sometimes it felt like I would let things slide until I couldn't take it any more and explode.

I've had temper issues, or rather a difficult time communicating my anger in a way that defused situations before they'd become an issue. As I've gotten older and worked on it, things have gotten a lot better. I think the hard part about this aspect is that it's a quick reaction and you have to keep aware of yourself at all times. Self control isn't what you're good at when you're young. Managing anger or tension when your first instinct is to fight is harder when you're a kid. I think if I had a child with this aspect I'd teach them to give warning shots and get them into a sport to let out their frustration. That's what helped me when I was a pup. :joyful:

It's not all bad. I'm more tenacious than most which pays off with my goals. I'm assertive. Sex can be so much fun, very intense. I read this aspect is great for manifestation and honestly that's the biggest perk I've gotten from it.
 
Well, I have Mars conjunct Moon in Cancer both square Pluto and yeah, it's challenging, but the idea of the square in my understanding is to push you to improve and to transmute the destructive into constructive - especially with Pluto.
Now of course, one has to go through the lover octave of this aspect, which is not fun and can be indeed very destructive. I think the way this manifests is really dependent on the signs, elements and modality.

So as it was mentioned here, Leo/Scorpio square will play out in a much more overt and assertive way than Cancer/Libra. That is not to say that one or the other is "weaker". I think both of the vulcanos boil on the same intensity, but maybe the Leo/Scorpio one tends to erupt externally in a more open way, as for the Cancer/Libra the eruptions don't happen in such an obviously visible way. It can either happen mostly internally, or when the Mars energy is repressed (which happens a lot of times with Cancer Mars imo), it can erupt unexpectedly and then yeah, people get hurt.

My own experience with this aspect is that, in my case it manifested itself mostly in a self-destructive way, but I started to become aware of the fact that I am able to hurt others as well when the explosion comes to the surface. And that is again painful, because I can feel then the pain I caused to others.

For me Mars-Pluto square in Cancer/Libra is about experiencing the inability to act, like there is an invisible force which ties you down and you don't know where it's coming from. It took me a very long time to start tapping into the huge amount of repressed anger that was silently boiling inside me (silently from an outsider's point of view).

It's also accompanied with this strong sense of needing to protect myself from some impending danger. Whatever that would be... Which can be exhausting, and yeah, I'm pretty exhausted :)

I read somewhere that people with this aspect work constantly hard to "keep underwater" this huge block of energy inside them. Which is certainly my experience. And it can be really liberating to be able to finally let this go by directing this energy constructively.
What I'm working on now is to shed light to these survival-type fears of mine, own up to my Mars and get in touch with my assertiveness. And it's not easy...
 

Lin

Well-known member
Ambitious: you failed to mention that you have Mars MOON conjunct on the MC (in Cancer...so Moon in its own sign helps) and SATURN conj that Pluto in the 1st.
this modifies the Mars square. Saturn directs the Pluto energy a bit....and its dynamic is different from that which it would be were the Pluto alone there.
LIN
 

MiaMiaMia

Well-known member
I have this aspect (Mars in Leo square Pluto in Scorpio) in a 2 degree orb.

Even when I was little it was complete blood lust. The way I would fight was totally different from other kids. I remember pinning a girl to the wall by the throat and working my fingers around her trachea when I was 6. Scared the **** out of my teacher. I unhinged a guy's jaw at 8 because he and his friend were making fun of my friend. Just reached in there, grabbed around his molars and yanked. The crossing guard couldn't believe it. It was always right to the finishing move. Even in emotional/psychological fights. Sometimes it felt like I would let things slide until I couldn't take it any more and explode.

I've had temper issues, or rather a difficult time communicating my anger in a way that defused situations before they'd become an issue. As I've gotten older and worked on it, things have gotten a lot better. I think the hard part about this aspect is that it's a quick reaction and you have to keep aware of yourself at all times. Self control isn't what you're good at when you're young. Managing anger or tension when your first instinct is to fight is harder when you're a kid. I think if I had a child with this aspect I'd teach them to give warning shots and get them into a sport to let out their frustration. That's what helped me when I was a pup. :joyful:

It's not all bad. I'm more tenacious than most which pays off with my goals. I'm assertive. Sex can be so much fun, very intense. I read this aspect is great for manifestation and honestly that's the biggest perk I've gotten from it.

I have Mars in Leo square Pluto in Scorpio also and your description made me lol so hard, and know that I´d have loved to be your parent, you´d have won me every martial arts trophy and then some:lol:

I had anger issues as a kid too, and it came over as overwhelming even to adults, just as you described it, they couldn´t believe it and didn´t always handle it maturely. What helped me was pretty much the opposite though, instead of spending that energy (sports/competition) we adopted a very shy and previously abused cat. The obvious vulnerability made me rethink my behaviour, which felt very profound for a 7 year old:innocent:

I still get boiling angry when I feel too vulnerable, but it´s not personal, just general heat that I try to keep from people, since I hate to feel like an abuser.

I like the insightful quotes on this tread, thanks so much for that because it´s not an aspect that´s a s simple as it seems. Oprah has this, and having climbed from poverty to the top of the US entertainment industry, forgive me if this is sacrilege, but she must be RUTHLESS and SELFISH, and I bet many people paid the price for her success. This would be more of the manipulative and driven angle of the square.
Bruce Lee has this too, which was great for martial arts, a more direct expression, and I believe it bled over into his charisma, since he always seemed to have an edge to him, no matter how philosophical and hollisitc he got.
 

Imperial1922

Well-known member
Interesting forum. And yes I agree it is difficult, but very powerful. Unlike everyone who has mars in cancer here, i have Mars in pisces square pluto in sagittarius (exact). When I was a kid I always attracted violence from people including from my family.i was very kind but later I learned it isnt the way to go. My parents always thought I was some psychopathic killer just ready to go mad lol.in highschool ive gotten myself into fights and gave the worst temper ever. All because of the ego i have.

I was in a relationship that unfortunately I ended up being too controlling towards her. I think this aspect modified my mars in pisces alot, because I have a really high drive and am very agressive. In a few months im joining the marine corps soon also, so can't wait for that.

If i were to describe this aspect combined with my mars sign, this aspect would make really good fighters/strategists.litterally the aspect of a soldier. Also it gives a really high sex drive and stanima 😅

Forgot to mention, I have been called a psychopath because of the way i think, and the things I've done in general. Usually this stems from a sense of wanting to be the strongest out of everyone, since you can't let your guard down. If i feel humiliated, i usually hold on grudges and cut people off from my life.my friends hold me back and try to calm me down because of how easily mad I get.
 
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Imperial1922

Well-known member
I also have Mars in Cancer square Pluto in Libra. I am not sure why some people automatically assume that Mars in Cancer is weak; never have I been such a person and I think the way Mars plays out in any individual depends on their chart and actual aspects to the planets involved. I am direct, focused, and decisive- none of which are attributed to Mars Cancer.

My Chart

I agree with you, they say the same **** about mars in pisces and im not even close to being indecisive and indirect. I actually am very agressive,Ambitious, and determined with my goals (sun capricorn, moon cancer cardinal helps too)
 

Claire19

Well-known member
I agree with you, they say the same **** about mars in pisces and im not even close to being indecisive and indirect. I actually am very agressive,Ambitious, and determined with my goals (sun capricorn, moon cancer cardinal helps too)

Sun in Capricorn will give you direction and urge for status and authority.
Mars in Pisces can mean aggression because of taking alcohol or other substances but we always always need to look at an individual chart.
 

Claire19

Well-known member
I have mars in cancer. Square pluto in Libra

I've always read it is more of a victim aspect.

Victim issues are connected with Pisces and Neptune. Mars Cancer square Pluto Libra I would say relationship issues with wanting to please and saying yes when meaning no and also with family relationships. However without the chart, again, we cant say. Citing one or two aspects out of context is just not going to give you the valid answers.
 

aquarius7000

Well-known member
For a person to be literally 'violent' there has to be MORE than one negative ....no matter how negative. (so check other aspects in that person's chart.

I have Uranus square Mars angular and I've never been violent....in fact, just the opposite.
I tend to 'internalize' the negativity.
But I also use that energy to do things I REALLY love - it's inactivity that is my enemy.
LIN
I agree with Lin, one aspect by itself cannot make a person violent.

Lin, can I ask, what sign and house your Mars is in?
 

Imperial1922

Well-known member
Sun in Capricorn will give you direction and urge for status and authority.
Mars in Pisces can mean aggression because of taking alcohol or other substances but we always always need to look at an individual chart.

My mars is in a cardinal house (7th) and is in a mutual reception with jupiter in aries, would that help boost the mars sign in general? I dont think im anywhere near close to an alcoholic/drug addict
 

Arden

Member
I have Mars square Pluto.

I'm not violent, but I have been the victim of crimes. I've always internalized the pain, and for awhile blamed myself for being victimized.
 

ikigai_444

Member
I agree with you, Viviene. Mars in Cancer is in its fall -- the worst possible sign Mars could be in. Its dispositor is the Moon, which makes Mars in Cancer people moody and emotionally unpredictable. This is especially true if the Moon is afflicted in the chart. Mars in Libra and Mars in Taurus people are usually nicer since their dispositor is Venus, a benefic (provided Venus is not heavily afflicted).

My former boss had Mars in Cancer square Pluto in Libra at 4 degrees applying. I would watch him explode emotionally at people within the office and at clients. He had a very bad mouth, as well. In my opinion, Mars square Pluto tempers are 100 times worse if the aspect is applying, rather than separating. My former boss's Mars square Pluto combination was further worsened by having Jupiter (exalted in Cancer) conjunct his Mars-in-Fall, and again worsened by having Pluto conjunct North Node. The Pluto-North Node conjunction was extremely tight at one degree applying -- the closest applying aspect within his chart. His moon was also conjunct Pluto (afflicted moon). He was emotionally volatile with a very hot temper and a strong drive for money, power, and success. Being a business sign, Cancer can get evil when it comes to fame and fortune, and it retains memory of past hurts.

I found two quotes online that I think really nail the Mars-square-Pluto aspect, if it is close and applying...
Your analysis is very much along my line of enquiry regarding someone who has been interfering in my romantic connection - a female ex. I have no exact birth time, but have studied her chart extensively and it's riddled with squares: Sun/Nepune, Sun/Jupiter, Moon/Saturn, Mars in Cancer/Pluto in Libra and Nessus in cardinal t-square with the nodes/venus/Mercury. Also the Moon is at 28 degrees which is malefic: indicative of self-indulgence and being stuck in the past. I would very much appreciate any input.
 

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