evolutionary astrology???

I'm not quite sure where to post this thread, as it relates to a few different systems, Mundane, Uranian...
anyway.....

it's a personal question. My natal Neptune is 0deg Capricorn, so 0-1degrees. That being on the Cardinal Axis or Cross. Solstice and Equinox. It connects the day and the year.
The four Cardinal points define our subjective connection to the world. It defines your connection to the whole, how you connect to the Universe. Capricorn being the winter solstice, having to do with social order.

and then I just read something by Jeffrey Wolf Green, Evolutionary astrologer. "Natural triad of consciousness symbolized by the moon your ego, Pluto your soul, and Neptune, your individualized consciousness relative to the collective consciousness of all humans.

So...my Neptune is exactly on the Cardinal Axis, it's conjunct Jupiter at 5deg Capricorn, and they are both in my first house. my asc 20sag.

Any insights would be most helpful.

this should go in the modern section.

.... to clarify my query some...

with Green's interpretation of the moon/pluto/neptune triad (Neptune specifically) taken into consideration with the meaning of the Cardinal Axis, that being blended with Jupiter in my first house. How would that manifest, from those perspectives of Neptune?

that either made it more confusing or didn't ..

thnx

conspiracy theorist said:

this should go in the modern section.

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mmmkay...how would one go about moving it??

Metaphysica said:

mmmkay...how would one go about moving it??

Click to expand...

A mod will get around to moving in when they see it. Most with an interest in evolutionary astrology don't usually crop up in the traditional board so you are unlikely to get the response that you want.

All, I have moved the topic to the correct forum.

There are several good lectures by Green and Marc Jones on YouTube that explore the meaning of the Moon/Neptune/Pluto triad in some depth. Marc is a protege of Green's and he once described them this way in one of the videos:

Moon (Cancer) is heart, Pluto (Scorpio) is spirit and Neptune (Pisces) is Soul.

I have some issues with this interpretation since it is a departure from the more traditional view where water signs are related to the emotional and feeling functions and thus to relationships and family, but fire signs are the element that is related to spirit. Although I do see that spiritual growth and awareness is precipitated and aided by emotional awareness and growth, they are not the same.

Can I ask where you heard/read that the Cardinal axis defines one's subjective connection to the world?

Barb at thelivingsky.wordpress.com

Fire: Spiritual energy; Air: Spiritual thought; and Water: Spiritual emotion.
Subjective portals: Asc., individualistic World-view; M.H., social World-view; and Desc., traditionalistic World-view. The Cardinal-sign axis is about new beginnings. [IMO]

[SIZE=-1]"For Uranian astrologers, the Cardinal Points rank up there in importance with the Ascendant and MC. Each of these three types of sensitive points is formed by the intersection of two primary astronomical planes. In the case of 0 degrees of Aries and Libra, the intersection is that of the plane of the Earth’s daily rotation (the equator) with the plane of the Earth’s yearly trip around the Sun (the ecliptic). Thus the Cardinal Axis connects the day and the year, the two primary cycles of the earth, and has to do with the seasons, which are fundamental to all life on earth. This is why it carries a world-wide connotation. As Witte’s successor Ludwig Rudolph put it, “The four turning points of the revolution [of the Earth around the Sun] are astrologically connected with mankind, the Cross of the general experience of the multitude of Men.”(3) Along with the Sun, Moon, Asc and MC, the Cardinal Axis (which for convenience Uranian astrologers often call the Aries Point or simply Aries) was considered by Witte to be one of the all-important personal points of the horoscope. Unlike the other personal points, however, the Cardinal Axis is at the same position in everyone’s chart. As such, it marks a person’s point of commonality with the rest of the world."[/SIZE]

taken from an article here:


https://alabe.com/AUG2.htm

Inasmuch as Urania is the Muse of all versions of Astrology, I prefer the designation "Symmetrical Astrology". It seems to have few adherents, but is impressively well-thought-out. Maybe should even have its own Forum.
http://capecodastrologer.com/articles-posts/articles/what-is-uranian-astrology

I was looking at a few charts using the cardinal axis. 0 Aries at the ascendant and I found it extremely accurate. Taking the cardinal axis as how we connect to the collective, reading the chart that way, it was very easy to see how one relates to the world.
I was just reading the house positions for the planets and points. Because using that house system, the asc and mc are placed into different houses.
So the house that the ascendant is in is the area of life that the person relates to people through.
The house that the mc is is in is the nature of the career.
Do the same for any of the planets and it's amazing how accurately it portrays the person for whose chart you are using.

I'm actually going to use this house system every time I read a chart.
I use multiple different systems for analyzing a chart, but this one is going to come in very handy, I think.

You gotta be careful. It sounds awfully sacredly geometrical to try and take a system derived from a really chaotic physical network and impose aesthetic order over it. The four horse men are actually symbolized by fixed stars belonging to neighboring constellations and the degrees they correspond to relative to earth are not all 15, none of them I don't think. Symmetrical order in this universe arises through patterns in chaos but the chaos itself is ... rarely perfect. No degree or sign is inherently significant, the universe is somewhat indifferent to Earth in its sprawl. :S

bansoda said:

You gotta be careful. It sounds awfully sacredly geometrical to try and take a system derived from a really chaotic physical network and impose aesthetic order over it. The four horse men are actually symbolized by fixed stars belonging to neighboring constellations and the degrees they correspond to relative to earth are not all 15, none of them I don't think. Symmetrical order in this universe arises through patterns in chaos but the chaos itself is ... rarely perfect. No degree or sign is inherently significant, the universe is somewhat indifferent to Earth in its sprawl. :S

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Isn't the entire discipline of Western Astrology based on the belief that there is indeed a symmetrical and geometric order to the birth chart and the relationships between planets and these are significant? Are they not significant because they are formations of order amidst the chaos? It is the geometric relationships that we call tines, squares, etc. all derived from the geometry of a circle divided into the arbitrary number of 360 degrees. These relationships are significant in astrology because of their relation to symmetry within the circle. The most significant relationship being the conjunction which corresponds to and is an expression of "unity" and then its opposite, the opposition, which is s symbolic expression of "duality." And so on.

I tend to believe that the constellations are totally irrelevant except as markers to help us locate things, as they are just landmarks, they are background along the ecliptic. It is the the segments of the ecliptic, each one 30 degrees beginning with the 0 Aries point that are what define the "signs". The zero Aries point is in fact not arbitrary at all. It has real significance in that it is the point where the Sun crosses the earths orbit in our field of vision from earth. One could argue that 0 Libra could just as easily be the starting point I guess.

I may experiment with this 0 Aries as the Ascendant method. It is an intriguing idea. And maybe a 0 Libra one too, which may be useful for questions regarding all things Libra ?

Barb at thelivingsky.wordpress.com

I would think that one who buys into astrology must somewhere believe that the universe is not chaotic at all, but that there is a very unified grand scheme operating here. I see astrology as a study of "sacred geometry."

Samantha Bean said:

This all speculation. Without birth data, there is no way to know. One size does not fit all.

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We agree with your point, But, You know that astrology does not only depend on birthdays. Its mathematics too.