Why does Jupiter rule Pisces?
- Thread starter AppLeo
- Start date
The reason's "why" planets were assigned as rulers (the better term is significators) of various signs, is discussed in Lwellyn's A-Z Horoscope Maker and Delineator (in pre 1970 editions) and also in Carter's Essays on the Foundations of Astrology and in his The Zodiac and the Soul; Hall also touches upon this issue in his Astrological Keywords...
david starling
Well-known member
Right! Pisces is TOO amorphous and expansive! Jupiter lays down some ground rules to keep Pisces in line. Very annoying, but necessary.
UraSatVen1029
Well-known member
Right! Pisces is TOO amorphous and expansive! Jupiter lays down some ground rules to keep Pisces in line. Very annoying, but necessary.
I have Jupiter in pisces 3rd house... but it's retrograde.
It also sextiles my ascendant.
Would this still be considered "lucky"? Even with retrograde and 3rd house?
JUPITERASC
Well-known member
This thread discussion is on the topic of why Jupiter rules Pisces
and so better to open a new thread in Read My Chart
to discuss your own natal chart
JUPITERASC
Well-known member
Siriusly
Modern Astrological Essential Dignity/Debility is strongly reliant
on the original Traditional Essential Dignity/Debility Tables
and few
if any
Modernist astrologers
assign rulership of any sign SOLELY to any outer planet
instead
CO-RULERSHIP is assigned by Modernists
FURTHERMORE
Jupiter is Exalted in Cancer
HOW TO READ THIS TABLE OF DIGNITIES AND DEBILITIES
http://www.skyscript.co.uk/dig2.html
Originally Posted by dr. farr
I believe that the long established (Western) dignity/detriment model
was developed upon the framework of 12 signs and 7 planets
and that this model works perfectly well
within the context of the Hellenist and Traditionalist whole system models.
I also question the practicality
of attempting to fit other cosmic factors (the outer planets)
into that specific model.
However, concepts such as dispositorship-like influences, elemental qualities, etc
can be applied to these other cosmic factors (the outer planets),
although upon an experimental basis
(until several hundred years of such uses,
and the collection of results from such uses, have been accumulated)...
Siriusly
Modern Astrological Essential Dignity/Debility is strongly reliant
on the original Traditional Essential Dignity/Debility Tables
and few
if any
Modernist astrologers
assign rulership of any sign SOLELY to any outer planet
instead
CO-RULERSHIP is assigned by Modernists
FURTHERMORE
Jupiter is Exalted in Cancer
HOW TO READ THIS TABLE OF DIGNITIES AND DEBILITIES
http://www.skyscript.co.uk/dig2.html
Originally Posted by dr. farr
I believe that the long established (Western) dignity/detriment model
was developed upon the framework of 12 signs and 7 planets
and that this model works perfectly well
within the context of the Hellenist and Traditionalist whole system models.
I also question the practicality
of attempting to fit other cosmic factors (the outer planets)
into that specific model.
However, concepts such as dispositorship-like influences, elemental qualities, etc
can be applied to these other cosmic factors (the outer planets),
although upon an experimental basis
(until several hundred years of such uses,
and the collection of results from such uses, have been accumulated)...
But Jupiter is much more like Sagittarius; more concerned with religion in the traditional sense, and occupied with morals, rules, laws, etc, whereas Pisces is more spiritual, a little more mumbo-jumbo so to speak. And the innate sensitivity, sacrifice, confusion and martyrdom that is so much associated with Pisces goes hand in hand with Neptune. Neptune is so obviously ruling Pisces, and Uranus Aquarius. It is so obvious to me I can even see it in their appearances.
david starling
Well-known member
Think of Astrology as a tree. J.A. is looking exclusively at the roots, you're looking exclusively at the branches. The tree requires both roots and branches.
JUPITERASC
Well-known member
Significations of Jupiter are as follows
Jupiter indicates childbearing, engendering, desire, loves
political ties, acquaintance
friendships with great men
prosperity, salaries, great gifts
an abundance of crops
justice, offices, officeholding, ranks, authority over temples
arbitrations , trusts , inheritance
brotherhood, fellowship , beneficence
the secure possession of goods, relief from troubles, release from bonds, freedom
deposits in trust, money, stewardships,
Of the external body parts it rules the thighs and the feet. (Consequently in the games Jupiter governs the race.)
Of the internal parts it rules the sperm, the uterus, the liver
the parts of the right side.
Of materials, it rules tin.
It is of the day sect.
In color it is grey verging on white and is sweet in taste.
THE ANTHOLOGY Vettius Valens http://www.csus.edu/indiv/r/rileymt/vettius valens entire.pdf
waybread
Well-known member
Actually, none of the above. Jupiter is the traditional ruler of Pisces. Neptune is the modern ruler. I would look at both in a nativity. In horary, I would use Jupiter as the ruler of of Pisces, but Neptune as a separate data point in situations where it seems relvant.
I don't think that Ptolemy invented the following system ca. 150 CE, but he popularized it.
Consider the planets' distance from the luminaries (sun and moon) both in terms of km (miles) and time from the summer solstice. The traditional rulerships work thusly:
moon=Cancer............sun=Leo
Mercury=Gemini..............=Virgo
Venus=Taurus.................=Libra
Mars=Aries.....................=Scorpio (modern ruler is Pluto)
Jupiter=Pisces.................=Sagittarius (modern ruler is Neptune)
Saturn=Aquarius.............=Capricorn
This system is probably about 2000 years old. Note that according to traditional Aristotelian "science," Saturn is the coldest and driest planet, and the farthest from the sun (heat) and moon (moisture.)
I don't think that Ptolemy invented the following system ca. 150 CE, but he popularized it.
Consider the planets' distance from the luminaries (sun and moon) both in terms of km (miles) and time from the summer solstice. The traditional rulerships work thusly:
moon=Cancer............sun=Leo
Mercury=Gemini..............=Virgo
Venus=Taurus.................=Libra
Mars=Aries.....................=Scorpio (modern ruler is Pluto)
Jupiter=Pisces.................=Sagittarius (modern ruler is Neptune)
Saturn=Aquarius.............=Capricorn
This system is probably about 2000 years old. Note that according to traditional Aristotelian "science," Saturn is the coldest and driest planet, and the farthest from the sun (heat) and moon (moisture.)
Jupiter rules Pisces as by nature Pisces relates with spirituality and our soul evolution. Pisces is the last sign of zodiac and most complete and most evolved one. It is a quintensence of all the other signs of zodiac. It means death and endings, the door to other world, after a full soul trip.
Jupiter controls spirituality and our aim for religion and beliefs and also our need for expansion. Pisces and isolation and self-undoing are close related to meditation, spirituality and religion.
Our final goal in our lives experiences is the soul & spirit expansion and its evolution.
Think about monks that live isolated and they dedicate their life for "serving" others and God in a very Piscean way.
Jupiter is very tight related to this business, in my opinion.
Jupiter controls spirituality and our aim for religion and beliefs and also our need for expansion. Pisces and isolation and self-undoing are close related to meditation, spirituality and religion.
Our final goal in our lives experiences is the soul & spirit expansion and its evolution.
Think about monks that live isolated and they dedicate their life for "serving" others and God in a very Piscean way.
Jupiter is very tight related to this business, in my opinion.
david starling
Well-known member
For Pisces, Jupiter's a critical, demanding ruler. Neptune's rulership is unconditional.
david starling
Well-known member
There are serious doubts concerning Ptolemy's rationale, and it's generally believed that the origins of rulership assignments predate his own explanation. So, it's a legitimate question, not only for Jupiter, but for ALL rulerships.
They predate his explanations by at least 150 years, but there is no doubt they are based on the seven-zone.
IleneK
Premium Member
It is based on an astrological geometry, so to speak, as per the two attachments. Jup rules Sag and Pi, well, just because it does. Not because of modern symbolism that you might be looking for. Jup's rulership of Pisces is way older than modern astrology, so cannot be explained or defended using modern astrology.
Check out the images and see that there is just a pairing of signs to each traditional planet, with the exception of Sun and Moon.
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david starling
Well-known member
Notice that the rulers that move in only one direction rule one Sign each whereas those that move in two directions (Dir.& Retro.) rule two each. Also, the Heliocentric model was well-known by 150 B.C.E., and COULD have been used as a cipher in assigning rulerships--what stands out immediately is the Heliocentric, stationary (& fiery) Sun given rulership of Fixed Fire. There's more, but the point is, the neat geometric mandalas you posted may have been only part of the reason for the Traditional, 7-pattern rulerships.
IleneK
Premium Member
Good and interesting points, David.
I was displaying the tables merely to help illustrate how the assignment of planets to signs works, not as part of any reasoning.
I don't know the reasoning, or that the reasoning is known. Perhaps others who do know may share that?