The "Great" Conjunction?

[Sugarsweet]

The last conjunction between Saturn and Jupiter took place on May 31st 2000 and will make a return again in late 2020.
Other than this conjunction occurring once every 19 years, having this planetary configuration in my natal chart, located in my 12th house, I do struggle to comprehend what is "great" about it.

I can also never find convincing or concrete interpretations on how this conjunction effects natives with the placement? Really frustrating.

Research suggests that this conjunction and the tangible influence Saturn and Jupiter have on each-other do not seem to manifest MY kind of greatness; just fluctuations in economical dynamics and assassinations of political leaders.
Something that I read online, which may be quite great, is this conjunction was said to be the Star of Bethlehem, as this would've occurred as of 7 BC.

From an astrological standpoint, what are your thoughts on this conjunction? Are there any patterns that are caused when Saturn and Jupiter conjoin?
Does this conjunction create the same lasting impacts generationally in the way it would effect a native?

My chart for reference:

Love from the UK

[Golden Yod]

I have the conjunction less than 6 degrees apart.

To me, Jupiter amplifies Saturn characteristics. My Saturn is very strong since it's also in Capricorn.

[Sugarsweet]

Thanks for your response Golden Yod.

Where do you have this conjunction if you don’t mind me asking?

A Capricorn Saturn can be actually quite a blessing depending on its location and relationship to the rest of the chart.

I read online somewhere that the planet with the lowest degree has the most influence on the conjunction.
Is this the case for you lol?

It is for me. My Saturn holds the lowest degree so my Jupiter doesn’t really get a look in, in regards to 12th house matters.
My Jupiter has otherwise harmonious aspects to my other planets. So it’s not all bad.

[Golden Yod]

TY Sugarsweet.

Mine are in the 9th house if my recent rectification is correct.

My Saturn has the lowest degree. It seems like my Saturn is much stronger than my Jupiter.

My Jupiter is at the apex of a Golden Yod, connecting Venus and Pluto both with 144 degree offsets.

Saturn can be a very good influence depending upon how it is looked at.

[greybeard]

First, as Yod just pointed out, we must assess relative strength and qualities. The conjunction is not the same, say, in Sagittarius or Cancer as in Capricorn or Libra. There are lots of measures of strength and quality. Does one of the pair seem likely to be predominant?

In your case, with the 12th house position, might there be a lot going on that is unavailable to consciousness?

I use the 12th as the house of "repressed contents" (the personal unconscious). It often opens doors to understanding... uncovers hidden things.

The 12th is said to be the joy of Saturn. He's happiest in the gloom, I guess. Among other possibilities, Saturn here can show some form of isolation (prison, hospital, monastery, etc) and alienation from the father. Jupiter is in his natural house. Here he often acts as a guardian angel, bringing unexpected and unsolicited help and protecting from unseen dangers. He enjoys solitude and selfless giving to others (whole chart, whole chart,...).

You might find going back in time illuminating. Check transits of either planet to the natal conjunction...what happened?

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by Sugarsweet

The last conjunction between Saturn and Jupiter took place on May 31st 2000 and will make a return again in late 2020.
Other than this conjunction occurring once every 19 years, having this planetary configuration in my natal chart ( at a tight 0 degree orb may I add), located in my 12th house, I do

struggle to comprehend what is "great" about it.

I can also never find convincing or concrete interpretations on how this conjunction effects natives with the placement? Really frustrating.

Research suggests that this conjunction and the tangible influence Saturn and Jupiter have on each-other do not seem to manifest MY kind of greatness; just fluctuations in economical dynamics and assassinations of political leaders.
Something that I read online, which may be quite great, is this conjunction was said to be the Star of Bethlehem, as this would've occurred as of 7 BC.

From an astrological standpoint, what are your thoughts on this conjunction? Are there any patterns that are caused when Saturn and Jupiter conjoin?
Does this conjunction create the same lasting impacts generationally in the way it would effect a native?
Love from the UK

in ancient times Jupiter and Saturn were
the outermost known planets
and were called by astrologers of old the "Great Chronocrators".
For millennia
the alignment of these two planets
has been regarded
as a significator of great social
economic
and
political watersheds - historic turning points, if you will.
hence
referred to as
"The Great Conjunction"

[greybeard]

Originally Posted by JUPITERASC

in ancient times Jupiter and Saturn were
the outermost known planets
and were called by astrologers of old the "Great Chronocrators".
For millennia
the alignment of these two planets
has been regarded
as a significator of great social
economic
and
political watersheds - historic turning points, if you will.
hence
referred to as
"The Great Conjunction"

Once again, Good Job.

[greybeard]

You will live your life with or without astrology. No need to panic.

What happened?...i.e., Did anything happen?

[passiflora]

Liz Greene and Stephen Arroyo lectured on this topic and published them in a book. The conjunction doesn't last long enough or occur infrequently enough to be quite a generational placement.

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by Sugarsweet

Thank you so much for your response.
This was also really insightful and much appreciated.
Do you agree that the alignment of these two planets
has significant effects on social, economical and political matters?
Or is it just us millennials being notoriously fatalistic again ??

in ancient times

Jupiter and Saturn were
the outermost known planets
and

were called by astrologers of old
the "Great Chronocrators".
For millennia

the alignment of these two planets
has been regarded
as a significator of great social
economic
and
political watersheds - historic turning points, if you will.
hence
referred to as
"The Great Conjunction"
clearly then
Juiter Saturn conjunctions have been charted for millenia
by MUNDANE ASTROLOGERS

by the way

Mundane astrology is very Hierarchical
thus
Starting with the Grand Conjunction
your Natal Chart would be 7th in the pecking order
and

Horary is below your Natal Chart
and is lowest on the Mundane Hierarchy


i.e.
MUNDANE ASTROLOGY HIERARCHY

Grand Conjunction 1702
21 May 1702
4:01:37 PM
+4:56:02
Federal Hall, New York
074°W00'37"
40°N42'26"


Great Mutation (Earth) 1802
17 Jul 1802
5:52:26 PM
+4:56:02
Federal Hall, New York


Great Conjunction 2000
28 May 2000
11:07:39 AM
+4:56:02
Federal Hall, New York


Great Malefic 2004
25 May 2004
1:20 AM
+4:56:02
Federal Hall, New York
....is currently the operating Malefic Chart
and then the following will become operative....
Great Malefic 2034
26 Jun 2034
5:33:42 PM
+4:56:02
Federal Hall, New York



2019 Aries Ingress
20 Mar 2019
Federal Hall, New York


INSERT YOUR NATAL CHART HERE
That is where your place is in the hierarchy of charts.
INSERT HORARY CHART HERE
That is where horary charts are in the hierarchy of charts

Note: Relocate the chart(s) to your country
and
for maximum accuracy, use the "foundation point"
eg: Romania = Alba Iulia, not Bucharesti
Japan = Kyoto, not Tokyo
Spain = Toledo, not Madrid
and so on

[Sugarsweet]

Originally Posted by greybeard

You will live your life with or without astrology. No need to panic.

What happened?...i.e., Did anything happen?

I like this approach. Although the fatalistic approach is entertaining I hate when it's used against people. Thank God that wasn't the case here greybeard.

I can't answer this question vaguely. A lot has happened in my time, good and bad. And to this day. Likewise to everybody.

I don't know if it's a Pluto aspect to my Moon thing but I'm rather private. Without exhibiting too much, I do have mental health issues. I have suffered with anxiety and depression since I can remember. I was clinically diagnosed at 12 of both. I still manage to be productive nonetheless. Maybe it's Saturn? I think it trines my mars.

Is this what you was even asking????????

[Sugarsweet]

Originally Posted by passiflora

Liz Greene and Stephen Arroyo lectured on this topic and published them in a book. The conjunction doesn't last long enough or occur infrequently enough to be quite a generational placement.

Sorry about the misguided introduction to this thread. My wording could've been all the way better LOL.

I enjoy Liz Greene's work, do you know if there is access to a PDF online?

By generationally I was referring to the depictions of economical and political rise and falls due to this conjunction. I agree 19 years isn't a generation lol

With love passiflora

[Sugarsweet]

Originally Posted by JUPITERASC

in ancient times

Jupiter and Saturn were
the outermost known planets
and

were called by astrologers of old
the "Great Chronocrators".
For millennia

the alignment of these two planets
has been regarded
as a significator of great social
economic
and
political watersheds - historic turning points, if you will.
hence
referred to as
"The Great Conjunction"
clearly then
Juiter Saturn conjunctions have been charted for millenia
by MUNDANE ASTROLOGERS

by the way

Mundane astrology is very Hierarchical
thus
Starting with the Grand Conjunction
your Natal Chart would be 7th in the pecking order
and

Horary is below your Natal Chart
and is lowest on the Mundane Hierarchy


i.e.
MUNDANE ASTROLOGY HIERARCHY

Grand Conjunction 1702
21 May 1702
4:01:37 PM
+4:56:02
Federal Hall, New York
074°W00'37"
40°N42'26"


Great Mutation (Earth) 1802
17 Jul 1802
5:52:26 PM
+4:56:02
Federal Hall, New York


Great Conjunction 2000
28 May 2000
11:07:39 AM
+4:56:02
Federal Hall, New York


Great Malefic 2004
25 May 2004
1:20 AM
+4:56:02
Federal Hall, New York
....is currently the operating Malefic Chart
and then the following will become operative....
Great Malefic 2034
26 Jun 2034
5:33:42 PM
+4:56:02
Federal Hall, New York



2019 Aries Ingress
20 Mar 2019
Federal Hall, New York


INSERT YOUR NATAL CHART HERE
That is where your place is in the hierarchy of charts.
INSERT HORARY CHART HERE
That is where horary charts are in the hierarchy of charts

Note: Relocate the chart(s) to your country
and
for maximum accuracy, use the "foundation point"
eg: Romania = Alba Iulia, not Bucharesti
Japan = Kyoto, not Tokyo
Spain = Toledo, not Madrid
and so on

You are truly amazing JUPITERASC !

I do not understand horary at all but you have inspired me to know what all of this means by the end of today. Thank you
With love

[passiflora]

I don't know if there is a .pdf! Astrology publishers could really get with the Kindle game, I cycle through books and that's not necessary with e-books.

Currently a used copy + shipping on Amazon is about the same price as a Kindle book might be. I find psychological perspectives on astrology able to work on the membrane between fatalism and free will - you might enjoy too.

[Sugarsweet]

Originally Posted by passiflora

I don't know if there is a .pdf! Astrology publishers could really get with the Kindle game, I cycle through books and that's not necessary with e-books.

Currently a used copy + shipping on Amazon is about the same price as a Kindle book might be. I find psychological perspectives on astrology able to work on the membrane between fatalism and free will - you might enjoy too.

Thank you for your response. That's lovely of you.
I definitely agree with you on that one. It drives me crazy scanning the internet for resources. They absolutely should get with the kindle programme

What was the name of the book please? I will have a search on amazon.

I love psychological approaches to astrology. I think it compliments the embodiment of astrology well. Cosmic Healing
However I do draw the line at some fatalism in astrology.
Thanks a lot!!!

[greybeard]

While this conjunction is technically effective (orb 9°+), it is well-past. Not nearly as strong as other things in the chart.

More important by far are the partile opposition Jupiter-Pluto (resolved in the Common T-square to Sun) and the angular opposition of Mars to Uranus.

[passiflora]

https://www.amazon.com/Jupiter-Satur.../dp/0916360164

hope you enjoy it!

[Sugarsweet]

Originally Posted by greybeard

While this conjunction is technically effective (orb 9°+), it is well-past. Not nearly as strong as other things in the chart.

More important by far are the partile opposition Jupiter-Pluto and the angular opposition of Mars to Uranus.

Wow I interpreted this conjunction very wrong
Where did I get the 0 degree orb from??

If possible, and if you wish too, could you elaborate on this Jupiter-Pluto, Mars-Uranus relationship to me? Hate to ask on the thread but I'm not sure if private messaging is allowed on here.

I have seen somewhere that Mars opposite Uranus calls for an extremely clumsy individual. Probably why I completely misread my own natal conjunction LOL

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by Sugarsweet

You are truly amazing JUPITERASC !
I do not understand horary at all
but you have inspired me to know what all of this means
by the end of today. Thank you
With love

AN INTRODUCTION TO MUNDANE ASTROLOGY
https://www.skyscript.co.uk/ingresses.html

[Chrysalis]

Originally Posted by Sugarsweet

I enjoy Liz Greene's work, do you know if there is access to a PDF online?

Here's a link to pdf Liz Greene books[and many many more].

http://gen.lib.rus.ec/search.php?req...e=1&column=def

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by Sugarsweet

By generationally

I was referring

to the depictions of economical and political rise and falls due to this conjunction.
I agree 19 years isn't a generation lol

With love passiflora

Since males and females are capable physically
to reproduce at age 19 years
then
19 years IS a generation!

Jupiter's alignment with Saturn
occurs at intervals of just under 20 years

The aspect is occasionally repeated due to a retrograde
of one or both planets.
Each successive conjunction
not counting retrograde repeats
occurs at a mean advance of
approximately 243 degrees relative to its predecessor
although from one alignment to the next
this arc can vary considerably.

Every third conjunction
i.e.
once every 60 years
brings the alignment back
to its starting place, plus around 9 degrees:
this 60 year cycle is termed
FIRST ORDER RECURRENCE of the conjunction.

Every 40th conjunction - roughly once every 800 years -
brings the alignment back to within about 1 degree of its starting place:
this approximate 800 year cycle is termed SECOND ORDER RECURRENCE
aka GREAT MUTATION CYCLE

[Sugarsweet]

Originally Posted by Chrysalis

Here's a link to pdf Liz Greene books[and many many more].

http://gen.lib.rus.ec/search.php?req...e=1&column=def

Thank you so much. You’re an Earth angel.

Have a lovely day.

[JUPITERASC]

Jupiter-Saturn conjunctions occur in signs of the same element
for a mean period of a bit less than 200 years at a stretch
typically with some overlap at the beginning and end of the cycle.

For example, the cycle of conjunctions in the earth signs
Taurus, Virgo and Capricorn
was initiated 26 January 1842
and concluded 28 May 2000.
This cycle was interrupted
by the 31 December 1980 - July 24, 1981 triple conjunction in Libra.

The previous Great Chronocrator cycle in the fire signs Aries, Leo, Sagittarius
began with the 1663 alignment
and ended in 1821
having been interrupted by the 1802 conjunction in Virgo.

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by Sugarsweet

Thank you for your response.
I’m not sure why you replied to my comment when it would’ve corresponded better with the original comment. It was Liz Greene who made the point of this conjunction not being long or frequent enough to be generational.
I also have to ask how on Earth is the possibility of reproduction at 19 years a credible factor to consider in regards to this being a generational conjunction or not? Attached is a list of the youngest parents. I know for certain 5-10 isn’t a generation lol. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List..._birth_mothers

I’m also struggling to understand why you constantly refuse to connect the dots up within context to your information overloads? Do you enjoy the patronising effect it has on people?
Love from the UK

ours is an online international astrological learning forum
the information posted is relevant to the thread title
i.e.
The "Great" Conjunction
beginners may not know that
The Great Conjunction is traditional MUNDANE ASTROLOGY

[Sugarsweet]

Originally Posted by JUPITERASC

ours is an online international astrological learning forum
the information posted is relevant to the thread title
i.e.
The "Great" Conjunction
beginners may not know that
The Great Conjunction is traditional MUNDANE ASTROLOGY

I think you hold great knowledge and insight however please remember I reference natal related questions/enquiries at the start of the thread also. It could’ve been under the mundane astrology forum but it was put here on the natal one.