Relocation Natal Effects

Thank you for your interesting story and to keep us updated.

I want to first make a statement of me not being any kind of expert. I have been studying astrology for a long time and I am very interested in what they call a mundoscope and have been looking into it. It is what siderealists call the real placement of the stars and they make a case of it. The most important planets will then be those that come very close to the angles.

Well I just tried making your relocation chart in a mundoscope and it shows that Saturn and Pluto come right to the angle, to your MC. This is not at all good, since Saturn is the great malefic and would make Pluto to behave difficult as well being just conjunct it.

Moon would come to your IC angle, so important as well.

This makes me think that relocation to San Francisco is not a good idea for you at all.

Looking at your mundoscope for NY it shows the opposite, Saturn and Pluto would still be on the angle, very close to your MC. It does not show good results for work.

How can a relocational astrologer come to the conclusion that it is good for a person to live where the great malefic is conjunct his MC???

I also see a lot of issues with the relocation chart...

Saturn is in the 11th house there, and that's a fairly prominent position. That house can relate to the quality of acquaintances you'll meet, or the kind of luck you'll have in general.

I also see Chiron on the Descendant, which also probably isn't good for relations with people.

Finally, I question the wisdom of putting Neptune and Uranus in the first house.

It seems like literally all he did was try to get Mercury closer to the 10th house cusp, and Jupiter closer to the 1st house cusp.

He basically ignored the impact of the location on your overall luck and friendships. It wouldn't have improved anything except for your career potential (although in his defense, it should have been great for career).

Ironically, even Las Vegas where the plane stopped might have been a more comfortable location. There, your Jupiter, Uranus, and Neptune are the 6th house, and Mercury is in the 3rd near your 4th cusp (good communication). Also, your Sun would be in the 4th house making that more comfortable. Your moon would have been in the 11th house, which might have made for meeting better acquaintances and better luck.

In other words, I get the impression that in Vegas, you might not have found a good career path, but you would have found a job of some kind along with an interesting social life.

Then again, I'm not that skilled with this reading this stuff. I don't even know how valid relocation astrology is. I've heard a lot of astrologers say that the birth chart can't be changed, and that the impact of moving to a different location is minimal.

PD187540 said:

Oh, and I forgot to mention that anyone I pursue for any type of personal or romantic relationship out there fails. It's like people come into my life quickly, and then they exit just as quickly. The only way I can maintain any type of long-term friendship is in a school- or work-related setting. I made only 1 good friend that I talk with regularly out there, and he's in my program. Every one else is either useless to me or a waste of time and energy.

I think that provided I get a job, I might have a better chance of making friends through work. This is also why finding employment is critical for me, not just to support myself.

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"everyone else is just useless to me or a waste of time and energy."
Hmmm! Every single person that stumbles upon our paths give us an opportunity to see something within ourselves; be it positive or negative. From past experience I would have to say that the negative is more positive for growth concerning self awareness; and when we are more aware of our own patterns, then we are more apt to gain positive reflections from the outside world. Carl Jung was adamant in idea concerning the macro universe is just a reflection of the micro. Many Yoganandas through out time have stated the same.
It is not what we can get from others but what we can give that pays more dividend. Change your perception and everything in your life will change~
Someone said above that is important to look at how the mind will react in the new environment. I agree 100%.
Our environment can only emphasize that energy within us.

PD187540 said:

Well, here we go! It's back to New York, ladies and gentlemen! Never again will I ever rely on an astrologer's "expert" opinion.

The San Francisco Bay Area has failed me completely. My living situation has been horrible and uncertain ever since I moved here a year ago, and I can't find a job anywhere. Either I'm being ignored or rejected with the BS "we found someone with better qualifications" excuse.

ON TOP of that, I got arrested last week for making "criminal threats" via text message, and I have a court hearing to go to here in San Francisco on Tuesday. The case has a strong chance of being dismissed, and it should, given the extreme emotional duress I've been under with trying to establish an independent livelihood here.

How ironic that I'm a paralegal student set to graduate this week, and I'm on the other side of the law.....


Therefore, the most practical thing for me to do would be to move back home to NY for good. Free rent, free food, and no aggravation. Best decision I'll ever make. I'll also have my paralegal certificate in hand, so I can apply to jobs in the NYC metro area while living at home.

There it is. My cross-country drive (for the third and final time) is scheduled for later this month, and that relocational astrologer is set to issue me a full refund. He claims that I'm the first one he has ever refunded, but I highly doubt that.

Next time you give a relocation opinion to someone for career or jobs help, please consider the LIVING situation of that city FIRST. The 4th House of Home and 10th House of Career are diametrically opposite one another. If one is debilitated but the other is great, that's no good. Here in SF, my career house appears to be excellent, but the living situation is awful. For me, I need a secure and stable living environment FIRST before I can even worry about trying to establish a career. As such, SF has failed me.

Thank you.

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Very interesting. Thank you for letting us know.

I agree with you completely that everything boils down to home situation. We all need a good living situation before e can do anything else. I think the most important angles to look at first are the IC and then the AC because this too would show if you like the place.

I must say that I think you have a pull to NYC because the Moon is conjunct the IC there. This is not always a good thing but it does make the place attractive because of the nurturing element there.

The other thing about SF is that having Uranus angular there makes it unstable no matter what. It's very hard to root yourself on Uranus angles.

Hello again

You say in your last post:

I'm now fully convinced that relocational astrology is a bunch of hogwash

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Overall though, I don't put any faith in relocational astrology at all.

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I just want to say that in my opinion you just ran into a bad astrologer - I do not think you can judge all relocational astrologers by this one... almost everyone in here, be it me the amateur or the most experienced people in here - have all told you that the relocational chart did not look good at all.

Having Saturn AND Pluto on your MC angle is not going to be good news for career or how you appear to the outside world - not at all.

Jupiter is usually associated with the law.

Jupiter
Good fortune/ good luck, abundance, optimism, hope, wisdom, genius, royalty, God, spirituality and spiritual Grace, ability to receive higher Guidance, success via synchronicity/ Universal assistance, having needs met and prayers answered, philosophy, benevolence, benefit, overcoming of obstacles, honor, integrity, peace, faith, truth, justice, success, reliability, selflessness, protection, truth, leadership, true genius, knowledge and learning, opportunity, open-mindedness, good judgment, banks, lenders, the law, higher education. Co-rules venture capital and investment banking with Pluto.

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Saturn
Control, dominance, criticism, imbalance- too much or not enough, bad luck, severance from God, atheism, inability to receive higher Guidance, bad judgment, selfishness, problems and mistakes- especially problems coming to a head, negative consequences, failure, pessimism, unhappiness, depression, desire to harm, revenge, hatred, bad public image, prejudice, bigotry, narrow-mindedness, being judgmental, fear, loss, disruption, deception, temptation, deceit, rigidity, stagnation, limitation, blocks, obstructions, isolation, loneliness, poor health, low energy, negativity of all kinds, divorce, and break-ups of all kinds. Co-rules deception with Juno. Saturn rules misfortune

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Pluto
Power of all kinds and preservation of power, love of power, hunger for power, powerful people, entrepreneurs, big business, the establishment, corporations, politics, advertising, great wealth, investments, banking, stocks, bonds, the stock market, loaning money, the ability to repay loans, acquisitions and the urge to acquire, capitalism, gambling and betting, never being satisfied, professional sports, lust, raw sexuality, intensity, extremism, dictatorships, ego, arrogance, oppression, secrets, mysteries, possessiveness, jealousy, greed, research, metamorphosis, destruction and rebirth, inevitable change, sex organs, detectives, nuclear power and weaponry. Co-rules competition with Mars. Co-rules venture capital and investment banking with Jupiter.

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PD187540 said:

The more I think about it, the more I'm losing faith in astrology. It's full of contradictions, inaccuracies, and people who just have no idea what they're talking about. Bottom line is to just do what you enjoy doing and press on, carrying out your goals with fierce determination. As long as I do that, nothing will stop me. And if anything does get in my way, I will steamroll over him/her/it to the Nth degree. Therein lies the power of a Saturn-Pluto-MC conjunction.

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That's not a bad attitude to take, really. It's important to listen to your gut, not put your personal power in the hands of someone else.

I personally have found professional Astrologers that I've paid to be useless most of the time. Many know just enough to be dangerous. When money is involved, a lot of people will try to oversell their skill/competence. Especially when it's something like Astrology, where it's hard to prove that there's anything wrong with their methods.

Think of the computer repair field. A lot of people barely know anything about computers, and thus these so-called techs can charge people $100 to run a $10 diagnostic program or install Windows (which nowadays is probably easier than signing up for this forum). They'll even keep the computer in the shop for a whole day so people feel like they're getting their money's worth, for a 5-minute operation. Well, that happens in Astrology too.

Don't get me wrong... not all astrologers are like that, but a lot of them certainly are. Plus, there's no such thing as required training or certification. Anyone can call themselves an Astrologer. Even me, and I've never had a single class on the subject. I could probably setup a site and charge someone $50 to fire up Astrolog, and impress the heck out of them with a little intuition, a lot of complex-sounding terminology, and generous use of automatically generated reports. I wouldn't, of course... but I could. And sad thing is, even doing that, I'd probably still be giving them more for their money than some of these guys are.

The only way to use Astrology, for me, has been to hit the books and search engines, and look at a ton of charts. There just isn't any substitute for understanding it yourself.

Once you've learned a lot about Astrology, you'll find it hard to go to a professional because you'll find yourself disagreeing with their methodology. It seems to me like you already understand enough about it that you'll have to just go ahead and either give up on it, or learn how to interpret your own charts in a way that works for you.

athenian200 said:

Saturn is in the 11th house there, and that's a fairly prominent position. That house can relate to the quality of acquaintances you'll meet, or the kind of luck you'll have in general.

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what 'is' a good position for Saturn do you think?

I've enjoyed reading your whole thread...
as I'm looking at relocating, for work and home environment reasons, plus I've just booked with my astrologer for advice on all of this --- your thread is a good reminder to trust in yourself rather than putting all your faith into someone else's interpretation.

PD187540 said:

What source did you pull all those meanings from?

Thankfully I have Jupiter in Sagittarius, its best placement (with Sun sextiling it). That alone has overcome my Saturn-Pluto conjunction on many occasions, and for that, I'm grateful. I've never had any major public "disasters," so to speak, mostly because I keep to myself a lot.

The more I think about it, the more I'm losing faith in astrology. It's full of contradictions, inaccuracies, and people who just have no idea what they're talking about. Bottom line is to just do what you enjoy doing and press on, carrying out your goals with fierce determination. As long as I do that, nothing will stop me. And if anything does get in my way, I will steamroll over him/her/it to the Nth degree. Therein lies the power of a Saturn-Pluto-MC conjunction.

I'm just glad to know that New York is the best place in the country for me to be. Why I left it in the first place (on THREE occasions) is beyond me.

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I'm so sorry I forgot to give you the source.
I am myself learning a lot from Magi society, Western Sidereal astrology and this forum as well. The text above was from Magi source:
http://www.magihelena.com/magi_lessonsyms.htm