Using astrology not to be subject to astrology

What are your thoughts on using astrology to transcend the natal chart and self-imposed limitations?

Do you think that we could use our natal charts not only to get to know ourselves better, but to use it as a tool and combine it with psychology and counseling to become better versions of ourselves and connect with our unlimited selves?

Furthermore, do you think that we could stop responding to transits the way we used to once we become more conscious and aware of our greater self?

Thanks for sharing your thoughts on the topic!

Sasha88 said:

What are your thoughts on using astrology to transcend the natal chart and self-imposed limitations?

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What happens when you go to school? Do you stay in the same class every year or, by what you have learnt that overcomes the limitations of your kowledge, proceed into the next class.

Do you think that we could use our natal charts not only to get to know ourselves better, but to use it as a tool and combine it with psychology and counseling to become better versions of ourselves and connect with our unlimited selves?

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Yes.

Furthermore, do you think that we could stop responding to transits the way we used to once we become more conscious and aware of our greater self?

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Yes.
But I would change 'greater' to improved or developing Self. One can learn from, or choose to dismiss the effect of situations upon one's life (transits ).
From learning, the individual treats the same transit to the chart in another fashion, whereby the further effect will be different. This in turn changes how the next transit from the same planet will be approached; etc.etc.

An individual can still learn from dismissing a transit or doing nothing about it. Life is in constant motion, and one can learn from the effect that occurs by doing nothing..

You could compare transits to the effect of a stone hitting the water. The rings it leaves expands the further possibilities of its effect.

What/who do you consider 'the greater self' to be? The full potential that lies within natal Sun, or 'something' that is not registered in the chart ? The latter would seem to be like driving a car without knowing the destinationof where it's heading.

Practical, and probably not the type of answer you are seeking.

You must be a very powerful wizard, or sorceress, to think that you can transform yourself into the Ubermensch on nothing more than strength of will.

greybeard said:

You must be a very powerful wizard, or sorceress, to think
that you can transform yourself into the Ubermensch

on nothing more than strength of will.

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Quite - also "using astrology not to be subject to astrology"
IS "being subject to astrology"

" or choose to dismiss the effect of situations upon one's life (transits )."

Well, you can try. But I have never seen this done. You may be able to work on not allowing- one or several transits which may be afflicting your chart (you)- the events or situations get out of hand and undo you....but....you will feel the effect....you can't "dismiss" something until you are aware of it. Once you are aware of something your "reactions" happen automatically. Only then can you work on "learning" something from it....via your own reactions and feelings.

This works better if something happens which has happened before; but for issues and events which have never happened and for which you are totally unprepared, I don't see how it is possible to "dismiss" however you tend to react to the unpredictable.

But you can try. I mean - see how long you can go without succumbing to your usual response to something really hard or unpleasant. Or tragic. Or challenging.

However: you CAN learn. But once "whatever it is" becomes an emotional issue, all your previous knowledge, all that you have learned can go out the window.
I think we learn from our experiences and mistakes if we have the potential to do so.

I know plenty of people who never really learn. Unfortunately.

Now: "self imposed limitations" is something else. Again, some people do this automatically- if it's a potential in their psyche. They have found that curbing an instinct or desire in a constructive way is helpful as a rule.
Of course under certain situations (transits) this impulse can get out of hand. One can totally 'throw away' all their personal "rules" - and ....they can over compensate for previous attempts at self limitation. OR they can overdo the self restriction thing and shut down in some way.

Which is why when people feel the need to make big changes in their lives they often seek professional help.
LIN

" or choose to dismiss the effect of situations upon one's life (transits )."

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Well, you can try. But I have never seen this done.

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This surprises me if you have never noticed this in people.
Never seen anyone shrug their shoulders 'in acceptance' without questioning the reasons of why for situations?
Never seen anyone turn away and dismiss what they see happening before their eyes as if it wasn't happening?
Never seen anyone 'ignore' a physical pain that is really a signal of something occuring within the body?
etc.etc.

You may be able to work on not allowing- one or several transits which may be afflicting your chart (you)- the events or situations get out of hand and undo you....but....you will feel the effect....you can't "dismiss" something until you are aware of it

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Exactly. It's the conscious awareness (Sun) that enables a person to take notice of issues and do something about them. Moon effects aren't always so positively inclined.

I think we learn from our experiences and mistakes if we have the potential to do so.

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Isn't this what I said in my reply to OP ? Even if it IS through the result of doing nothing; the 'could'a, would'a, should'a's of the retrospect 'if only'.

Yet does such action mean that one has 'transcended the natal chart and self-imposed limitations', as per OP's enquiry? The latter can be attained through experience, but transcendence off the chart?????

*edit* btw I don't know why there's a thumb down icon on my post, must have clicked that by mistake!

Sasha88 said:

Furthermore, do you think that we could stop responding to transits the way we used to once we become more conscious and aware of our greater self?

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Yes, to an extent. Some think we are just leaves blowing in the astrological wind, and I think that's actually true for the majority of people. But one of the fundamental reasons we are here and that this whole cosmic pantomime exists is so that we learn to exercise our consciousness and free-will amongst various external pressures.

In the Astrology Podcast episode entitled Reconciling Traditional and Modern Astrology, Robert Hand mentions he has noticed that clients who practice Buddhism tend to not really be negatively affected by difficult transits. I've heard other astrologers say the same thing.

Also, transits seem to have higher end manifestations and lower end manifestations. What you get is a selection from a range of probabilities, and it depends on your level of awareness and point of attraction.

I recommend having a read of this article by an astrologer I particularly respect, Julian Lee: How Astrology Really Works

Here's a quote from that article:

With astrology…phenomena…You can also list them from gross to subtle. "Your house burns down" would be a gross possibility of, say, Mars-Dodecile-4th-House-Ruler-for-3 weeks.

More subtle fruit from the same transit might be:."Your neighbor burns a lot of trash and you see red vehicles around your house, the cops show up for some reason."

An even more subtle version would be "You read a little bit about the Great Fire of Chicago" or "You hear about a friend having a fire" and "you finally mow the lawn."

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[edited quote over 100 words against Forum Rules - Moderator]

Sasha88 said:

What are your thoughts on using astrology to transcend the natal chart and self-imposed limitations?

Do you think that we could use our natal charts not only to get to know ourselves better, but to use it as a tool and combine it with psychology and counseling to become better versions of ourselves and connect with our unlimited selves?

Furthermore, do you think that we could stop responding to transits the way we used to once we become more conscious and aware of our greater self?

Thanks for sharing your thoughts on the topic!

Click to expand...

Maybe taking it all the way to "not to be subject to" is a bit far, but if we're not learning about our charts in order to grow ourselves and improve our lives, I don't know what the point of astrology is. We might as well just not look if it's all set in stone and we have no hope of doing anything about it.

The forum has been hopping with fate vs. free will topics lately. I wonder what astrological transit might be responsible for that!

A lot of people don't like the idea of being "programmed" by unseen forces.

''Never seen anyone shrug their shoulders 'in acceptance' without questioning the reasons of why for situations?
Never seen anyone turn away and dismiss what they see happening before their eyes as if it wasn't happening?
Never seen anyone 'ignore' a physical pain that is really a signal of something occuring within the body?''
etc.etc

SincereIy, NO! I have seen people try to ACT as tho something isn't getting to them.
But I think it would take a great soul who has detached from worldly experiences to be able to do this. And I have never met such a person.

I have heard of such people.....theoretically. And I say this because, again, I have never met anyone who can shrug off tragedy and adversity or major financial setbacks; sometimes the reaction comes later.

People who are used to putting their emotions on "hold" during REAL emotional experiences often respond at a later date. Sometimes it's the next day or sometimes it's the next year. OR sometimes it's the NEXT time they are faced with a stressful situation; they react to the past trauma instead of the present issues...great or small.

Ignore physical pain? no. LIVE with pain.... manage pain....but not ignore it.

Our bodies don't allow us to do this. Our nerves are connected to our brains so that we can be conscious that something is wrong. So that we can attempt healing ourselves or seeking medical help.

Also: you might have mistaken something I said or I was not clear: LEARNING from the past...working on our reactions...."reprogramming" our negative automatic thoughts... allowing ourselves to go beyond the moment....these are ideals. All people who study human nature and our own nature's strive to become "better" than our primitive selves. I'm certainly more conscious, more compassionate, more objective, a bit less selfish, more generous than I was when I was 25, let's say.

But....if I am not my own best friend, my own advocate; if I don't say what I feel, then what am I? yet must I say it the moment it comes into my head? LOL.....no. For some people this is a very difficult lesson. But...to NOT feel it at all? To be separate from one's physical being? If you can tell me how to do this, please....I'm all ears!

Look, your natal chart is no "separate" from you . It's a metaphorical representation of your psyche. Trying to separate your natal chart from your "self" is like trying to separate yourself from your genetics!
LIN

Thread title reminds me of the sci-fi concept of anti gravity.