relationship mystery charts.... test yourself

A mystery partnership..... I typed this once already and POOF the internet ate it when I hit send. So if it shows up later this is why.

Included are the Composite and Davidson charts of a partnership. We get so many requests to help with relationship charts, so I thought I would post this one for practice.... as time and the thread goes on, I will include the natals and the synastry chart. For right now, lets focus on the relationship.

Composite charts are the half way (midpoint) of each others like planets to like planets.... like Sun to Sun or Moon to Moon. The thing to remember is that there are 2 midpoints, the one shown and the one directly opposite. The chart shows the shortest midpoint. In a composite it is possible to see things that can not be in real life, like the Sun opposed Mercury... it is just the nature of midpoints. Signs are not important as is the houses and the aspects.

The Davidson is a chart that averages out time and space, so you have the midpoints of the planets, the dates, and the coordinates. In this, you may find the coordinates are in an ocean somewhere. This chart you read by starting with the house lords (rulers) So lets say the 3rd house is Aries.... you look for Mars in the chart to tell you about how the house is viewed. If said Mars is in the 12th squaring the Sun, take that information back to the 3rd and you will see arguements that are ego bruising and below the belt, then add in what other planets may be in the house. This is an easier chart to use for progressions, and you can use it in synastry with one of the natals, to see how the individual fits in to the relationship chart.

Now, lets see what kind of relationship we are looking at, what were the private times like, the times in public, the occupations, was there respect, do we see outside influences? What ever you see, let us know.


TK

Woot!

I'll take a look at basic composite reading and will try my hand later. Just wanted to say thanks for putting this up, I feel it's a much needed exercise.

Will read an article about composites by Liz Greene, here's the link if anyone else needs some guidance:


http://www.astro.com/astrology/in_composit_e.htm

Thanks for the Liz Greene link, it is most helpful. Trying to get the ball rolling, notice in both the Composite and the Davidson, both have Neptune in Leo on the IC. The IC is the place where the roots take hold. This is the solar plex gut feeling of the union together. Leo is ruled by the Sun, so that will tell more of the entire purpose fulfilled by the relationship, and in both charts tell us that Neptune is part of the purpose. Oh, and both individual's birthtimes have a Roden AA.

TK

Alright, here come my first attempts at the composite, oh God....

Now, lets see what kind of relationship we are looking at, what were the private times like, the times in public, the occupations, was there respect, do we see outside influences? What ever you see, let us know.

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Okay, I have no idea what kind of relationship, but by looking at the Moon-Uranus conjunction on the cusp of the 11th, Uranus being Co-ruler of the MH; all the action in the 11th house, and the 12th house; I'm under the impression that this relationship has a focus on humanitarian, social work, perhaps with a focus on issues with children, since Saturn is there in the 5th and so markedly opposed to Mars. This is the area in which they find the greatest problems amongst themselves as well, children and/or creation, perhaps there is one who controls too much of the actions of the pair and another always frustrated and thwarted.

The core nature of the partnership is Sun in the 12th, conjunct Mercury, so it is an intellectual relationship, and possibly dedicated more to the collective than to the inner need of the "couple".

It is that tricky 12th house Sun, that turns one's real self into a hidden thing, and makes someone mostly known for a public persona. The public persona is shown by Aquarius in Midheaven, ruled by Uranus and Saturn. Uranus in Pisces conjunct Moon, pisces is the sign of those people who love some sacrifice, again, I'm thinking they are humanitarian activists, pro-mothers and children, Saturn in the 5th in Virgo also points to something related to health and children, maybe abused children, considering the opposition to Mars...

Okay, I won't go any further cos this may be SO OFF that it'll be embarrasing. I'll read a bit about Davidson and will try that one too. God help me.

RockFish said:

Okay, I have no idea what kind of relationship, but by looking at the Moon-Uranus conjunction on the cusp of the 11th, Uranus being Co-ruler of the MH; all the action in the 11th house, and the 12th house; I'm under the impression that this relationship has a focus on humanitarian, social work, perhaps with a focus on issues with children, since Saturn is there in the 5th and so markedly opposed to Mars.

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The social work..... that is something that can be explained later when all is revealed. There is a focus on children, especially in later years by one of the two. I will give a hint, they do not have children together, yet met when a birth was about due, and bonded closer after the death of one of the pair's children.

This is the area in which they find the greatest problems amongst themselves as well, children and/or creation, perhaps there is one who controls too much of the actions of the pair and another always frustrated and thwarted.

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Yes, there were problems with being frustrated and thwarted. Now this is important to remember it is the composite.... individually they did not treat each other in such fashion, but the energy created together did put the pressure on both.... one thwarted and the other frustrated caused by outside influences.

The core nature of the partnership is Sun in the 12th, conjunct Mercury, so it is an intellectual relationship, and possibly dedicated more to the collective than to the inner need of the "couple".

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The collective is the "social work" I will explain later. It was more of an intellectual relationship than others would have thought. As for the inner need of the couple it is both important to the collective, but as the nature of the Sun, extremely focused on themselves.

Saturn in the 5th in Virgo also points to something related to health and children, maybe abused children, considering the opposition to Mars...

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Very Spot on in later years with one of the individuals, but it took both to have given the one the platform to do so.

Rockfish, you did great, and you see it is easy when you take the approach of reading it like a natal birth chart. In the above example, it does point out that it was the nature of the relationship, not the individuals that caused problems. I hope we get more people trying their hand at this or I am changing the thread to "the Rockfish and Wintersprite Hour" and we can have the music from the Bullwinkle and Rocky show.... guess Rockfish is Rocky...

TK

Thanks Winter, although I feel like walking in a swamp with this compo thingy.


I want to take a look at the Davidson one, but when I tried to find a clear explanation of how to use it, I found a lot of different opinions.

One that drew my attention said that Midpoint Composites show how a relationship projects itself in the outter world, or, it is the chart of an "individual" formed by the combination of the two people and how this individual functions. So, you can see how the relationship works in the outter world, its purpose and main areas of activity, but you can't see a lot of their intimate relationship. On the other hand, Davidson shows how the two people function intimately.

Do you think this is correct? In which sense you feel a Midpoint Compo is different from a Davidson, in terms of interpretation?

Just so that I know what do with it here in our Rockfish and Wintersprite Hour with Guests (that don't show up, but we keep the faith anyway ).

Okay, now some more about the Midpoint Compo:

Since you mentioned Neptune in Leo as an important feature of the chart, very close to the IC, I'd say this relationship is based on Neptunian characteristics, since it's Leo, the basis of it possibly lies in the performing arts.
Since there is Neptune there I think music must be of big importance to them, maybe musicians and/or dancers.

I look at the IC also to have hints of the house of the pair, Neptune in the IC also points to a "rootless" living or shifting roots, perhaps they had problems in having a fixed place to live, or lived above water, LOL!

Despite that quite ugly Mars-Saturn opposition, I find this a harmonious chart with many trines and sextiles. That packed 12th house also points to some kind of secret, behind the scenes relationship, did they keep their relationship in secret for a while?

The composite chart.... I tend to think of it as two people coming together to create like one aura of the relationship. It seems it works best in close proximity, like physical presence creates a more vibrant picture. In my own life example. I knew a man that our composite charts gave us the Sun Conjunct Jupiter in Leo and in the tenth house. When we got together it was like Sunshine, we were like larger than life, and we would go places and others would comment, or we would hold a room captivated, with everyone watching how much joy we found in being near each other.... I talked louder and moved like royalty.... and then we would part, and I would realize what a big dumb jerk he really was, but being together was intoxicating and my 12th Sun loved the attention. When we were apart..nothing. and it was hard for us to get together, we really were from 2 different planets.... but we would keep trying.

So with this couples chart we are looking at.... Did anyone notice that Juno is right there on the MC? No one ever saw one without the other was what was said in an autobiography by one of the two.

Rockfish nailed the Neptune in Leo on the IC... yes there were no strong roots, they traveled much. Singing and dancing were a vital part of the partnership. I am going to include now acting also.

Note the second house of income and it is in Gemini and Mercury rules Gemini. Wit was a very large factor in their steady work.

I am going to look at the Davidson now, as I am giving too much away with the composite already.

The Davidson is a concrete representation of the partnership. I am going to read the first 4 houses.

1st, how you are viewed from the outside, your persona. Gemini is on the Ascendant. Gemini shows that they are a witty well read , and that communication is what the team is known for. Mercury is found in the 6th... it's natural home, and is in Scorpio and going RX and under the beams of the Sun. No matter how well known they were as a couple, it strongly went back to the individuals. Both felt they had not had their best abilities shown and respected (that is the merc rx to the Sun) It could be an ego bruiser to be known but not have felt your best was ever given a chance.

The 2nd house being income and how and what we value. Again the house ruler is Gemini. The made money off of the persona and the communications and the wittiness. Gemini is a fickle sign and there were payment issues, never a steady income. Mercury again is looked at and it is RX and headed for the Sun. Pluto resides in this house. Pluto is square Jupiter and Venus. There was a need to transform and eventually kill off the partnership for various monetary and talent reasons. Pluto is kind to the rest of the chart, the pressure being on the 2 benefics.

The 3rd house is in Cancer ruler Moon right on the cusp of the 5th house. The POF is in Cancer = nurturing, mimicry, reflection (films recordings) It is appropriate that the house of communications has that reflection quality from the moon.

When in later years speaking about each other, you hear how they speak of the other with tenderness and much reflection upon specifics... (Cancer memories).

The IC/4th house has Leo and ruler of the house the Sun. We see in the 6th that the Sun is conjunct the Vertex. From their first meeting, there was this fatefulness felt. When asked the reason for their success, it was said that it is because they ignored the audience and played to the other one like they were all that mattered in the world. Neptune in the 4th gives us the roots that wander. There is the square to Mercury, and it wasn't dishonesty, but the very nature of the business ignored the intelligence and agility of the two.

Going to stop here, you should have the idea of how it is read now... and I am not just talking to Rockfish... or am I?

TK

wintersprite1 said:

... and I am not just talking to Rockfish... or am I?

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***lurking***

Alright, so Davidson does not differ much from a midpoint compo reading, okay, I'll try to get the houses you didn't read:

5th house obviously crucial house of the chart.

Shows what they created together. And they created a whole lot of stuff together.

House cusp is Virgo, Mercury rules from the 6th in Scorpio, Moon is there perfectly sextiling Pluto, seems to me they were very incisive in their creation-work, perhaps comedians, since there's gotta be a joyful (5th) way to present their incisive ideas (Mercury Scorpio).

Moon is there so creation is like breathing and a strong desire to be parents.

Uranus opposed to Moon in the 10th, also points to a rather quirky duo-personality joyful, sometimes unpredictable.

There's Mars in Virgo quite isolated, I suppose even though it's obvious that this was a very creative partnership, there was a lot that didn't find a way of expression. Some say that an unaspected planet tends to imposed itself forcefully in a chart, but by looking at this chart I'd say there was a lot of energy that didn't get released and therefore there was stress.

Saturn exhaltation + Jupiter in LIbra provides the right amount of resilience and responsibility, but I think Jupiter suffers a bit in a conjunction to Saturn, while Saturn is ever joyous with Jupiter.

Jupiter in the 5th makes for real talent and lots of luck, but Saturn stifles that a bit, so perhaps Jupiter's gifts and joy in the 5th were a bit cancelled by Saturn suffocating ways.

So they had the discipline, the resilience, but perhaps Saturn made it a bit difficult to have fund with the whole process sometimes, perhaps two perfectionists in that.

Venus is on the most interesting positions here, she is conjunct Jupiter AND Saturn, she is in her sign and she is a great artist in the 5th, and also squares Pluto, which gives the artwork possibly a fascinating aspect. Venus also rules 6th so it's the work-driver here.

6th house is ruled by Venus, Sun and Mercury are there, shows work and daily activities as the core of the partnership.

Uffs, I have to go for a while, kinda busy, but will go on later!

There isn't much I would add to Rockfish's interpretation, it is all correct. Quirky duo... you will see....

On the Davidson, we are now on the 7th house. No planets in there, but it is ruled by Jupiter. Foreign (they were international successes), buffoonery, expansive...and yet, it is not just Jupiter, since Jupiter and Venus are so tight (and Saturn) they get drug around also. Partnerships and open enemies. The two of them were never ashamed to admit their admiration and love for each other, and that brought out the open enemies.... as jealousy often does. There was a constant outside force wanting to break up the set and regroup them with another agenda, and in the end it did happen that way.

The 8th house brings income form others. It is often an important house when looking at performers, as they get their monies literally from their fan appeal and purchases. Again we see that trio acting. Saturn there being all serious and restricting (and it started out that way) but from making a few hundred dollars a week for performing, by the end of that first year (1945) they were each making 17,000 per week and soon on there way to making millions upon millions, so it is safe to remember Jupiter and Venus (their popularity) conjunct with somber limiting Saturn, they invested wisely and the money grew and grew. On that it is the house of Death... Back to the humanitarian streak Rockfish pointed out. They spear headed a charity for children that had very short life spans and brought literally trillions to the organization (Jupiter huge, Venus love, and Saturn responsibility) In the end, one of the partners lost a child in an airplane crash, it reconciled the two after the break up and kept them together until the end. The 9th house had the same planets as the 8th and with Jupiter lord of the 7th, the 7th, 8th, and 9th are very similar. I am not sure if it played at all in religion, as the two were of different religions. I do know that a foreign element was often played upon with favoritism because one was from a European national and many in the music industry were of the same nationality... they were quiet blatant that the national blood was thicker than water. We do have the airplane death mentioned in the 8th and the 9th rules the airplane industry and the same sign on the cusp of both houses.

Uranus rules the MC and is found in the 10th but close to the 11th and should be read that way. Yes, the partnership was Unique, progressive, and unusual. Ad lib was the norm instead of rehearsals. Uranus on pushing on the 11th house cusp, points again to humanitarianism and also wonderful bodies of friends. They were well known amongst their peers but also known as being unpredictable and a bit of the odd couple. Uranus is the apex of a beautiful kite and in Pisces. The oddness is the attraction. The 11th in Pisces also shows their friends were from this magical illusion place (actors and such) Neptune is on the IC... these are the peers in the very vocation that their roots lie in. Note that Neptune is making a square to Mercury.... There would be confusion as the 2 became stereotyped unfairly. I will go into that once the individual charts are put up. As a point, the younger more juvenile one that you would expect to delight in drinking sodas, was instead often half drunk just to come on stage, and the other with a reputation of being a drunk, only drank apple juice on stage and pretended it was hard liquor, and the reputation of being a drunk followed the person through out their career.

The 12th house is usually one of sadness, secrets, loss, grief, confinement. The house is ruled by Aries, so the ruler is Mars. Mars is sitting there in the 5th with nothing really going on. This give Mars a bit more power he needs to leave somewhere in the chart. On the cusp of the 12th, it is the hidden aggressions, the forced confinement of a stereotype, and we see Taurus completely intercepted, and with that comes that Venus conjunct Jupiter... Much of the private lives are unknown, as should be, and I think in the 12th we see there was much good along with the bad.

Plenty more was revealed and some of you may know who this is, and if you would like, pm me and I will announce at the end it was figured out or googled well I would like to see the work off of cold charts, but seems that only Rockfish is taking the chance... and Yay is showing how easy it really is if you understand Astrology. I have to wonder if what I have written is because I know who it is, or would I have read it blindly as well?

If anybody sees what we have missed, please jump right in. I am going to prepare the last set of individual and synastry charts tonight.

TK

Possibilities I see in the composite chart....





With Moon conjunct Uranus, I'd say that this relationship is of a restless nature yet very exciting. I don't see a romantic relationship here but if the couple is trying to have one, I'd say it is very unstable. Moon conjunct Uranus could also indicate that the two people involved come from two different backgrounds and are thought of as two people who others would have never thought them to be together. There is something unusual about this couple, if not to outsiders to the two individuals themselves. Whatever it is that is unusual about these two, it is what binds them. I dunno, maybe one of them involved in this relationship is much older than the other, something unusual of atypical.


It is possible that with Venus (ruler of the 6th being in the 12th house, these two could have met in a hospital or some kind of institution where where people are in need of either medical, physical or spiritual help. It is also possible that one of the two involved is either employed at the institution, is or was a patient or client.



Astrologer4U

Heey, thanks for bringing this one to the top.