Not necessarily
Astrologers are not infallible
Astrologers are not infallible
But the Stars and Planets, we can't control.
Not necessarily
Astrologers are not infallible
You can.
The outcomes will stay the same...
Because the stars and planets don't change.
If an Astrologer said you will die on this day because a person will enter
your home and stab you. You can put an alarm system up, move out or whatever, but still you get stabbed by somebody. Because the stars and planets already had Astrologer warning you, and you die anyway.
You cannot answer this question with horary astrology. Think about it. People all over the US, and probably all over the world, are asking whether Trump will win-- as a horary question. They won't all have the same chart time or date, so the outcomes will differ.
People do try to predict outcomes of presidential elections through mundane and birth-chart astrology, however.
50 people running the same question should yield the same answer HOWEVER, the significator for D.Trump in this case should be different depending on who is asking.
Is he your employer?
is he your father?
your husband
are you gambling on him?
brother?
this chart
Trump loses
because Saturn is on MH
someone older
sun is busted literally!
Folks, I do have a clue as to how horary works. I wonder how many of you have explored mundane astrology, where a lot of work is done on predicting election outcomes.
So far as I know, the relationships of 99% of the astrologers asking the question about Donald Trump are the same. I don't think any of his relatives are on board here.
If different astrologers coming from different positions (like/dislike) about Donald Trump can yield different answers, that is a problem in predicting the outcome of an election. Are you more likely to get one answer if you approve of him, and a different answer if you don't?
This is a horary thread, not a thread on an old classmate's uncle's psychic's predictions of someone getting killed in a crash. Astrologers from Ptolemy to William Lilly have indicated that mitigation of a predicted negative outcome is possible.
Two skilled horary astrologers should come up with the same response to a question if they use the same technique and moment (as astrological software would convert your times to GMT.) But here we have amateur astrologers all over the map; and other astrologers at different places and times asking the same question of different charts. So the analogy does not apply.
Certainly horary can address important political questions. Court astrologers existed from Roman times into the 17th century. But I don't think a lot of other astrologers were asking the same questions that Lilly asked in rafaella's example. Frawley's comment on the universe answering the same way 500 times is purely speculative.
How about reception and placement? 10th ruler Mars rued by Sun, could the presidency be in the palm of Trump? Yet at this time not seen (Mars cadent in his 12th). Mars, in detriment of Saturn (the opponent). Sun has lot of dignity. Saturn dignity by term. I do hope Trump loses. But I'm not convinced. Sun is exceptionally strong and I think can take on Saturn because he is comfortable in his own sign.
BTW is Venus translating between Sun and Mars? Venus, combust (hidden and not seen). Venus, rules the 4th and the 9th signs.
Good luck to you all! If he wins, you are all welcome to Australia!
Rafaella
you still have a problem with no aspect.. reception dignity all dandy but
there is no aspect
Sun is sitting in its own 1st not bulging. fixed angles - nothing happening at all
venus cannot translate light from sun to mars since sun is faster
venus - sun - mars - YES . a true TOL but not sun - venus - mars
translation of light works when 2 primary significators are separating and 3rd must be faster and receive either 1st or 2nd significator rejoining them
T
There are different definitions of translation of light, I'm looking more to Al Biruni example here and Bonatti http://www.skyscript.co.uk/tobyn2.html
Mercury 15 Virgo Venus 16 Taurus Jupiter 21 Leo
Mercury and Jupiter are significators not in aspect. Mercury applies to Venus and gives his light to her. She then applies to Jupiter, and translates the light of Mercury to him, thus allowing perfection.
Here is another one:
Mercury 15 Virgo Jupiter 16 Leo Venus 17 Scorpio
Mercury and Jupiter are significators not in aspect. Venus is separating from Jupiter and carrying his light. Mercury catches up with Venus and the light of Jupiter is translated to Mercury.
Perhaps not Lilly's definition, but there is more to trad horary than what Lilly mentions.
Well this is different kind of translation of light, it comes from sky script own website showing examples by Bonatti and Al Biruni. Venus translates here, not Mercury, so it's combination of translation and collection I guess. In the trump example, Venus is in dignities of both Sun and Mars and brings the light of Sun to Mars without interference. But of course some may say Venus being rx is rejecting the light of Sun, because rx plant pushes back the light rather than taking it.
I'm undecided. I think I'm done with this chart lol...
Waybread
whatever ... future is fixed like it or not.
YES IT DOES matter where you stand on trump.. if you are in his party, Trump becomes 10th house or even 1 not 7th
when you are an opposition then he is 7th
if he is representing part of your group, it is 1st.
this is not about MUNDANE ASTROLOGY EITHER!
This is horary.. He aint winning deal with it.. you have a chart.. where is your interpretation?
there you go Waybreak *smirk* right call right chart right judgement
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=56236
there you go people
https://books.google.com/books?id=dCEAAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA269&dq=will+the+king+remain+horary&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjfjKCdxLXKAhVY3mMKHZQmD9oQ6AEILDAD#v=onepage&q=will%20the%20king%20remain%20horary&f=false
10th house issue the whole breakdown ...
then there is this https://tonylouis.wordpress.com/2012/08/18/who-will-win-the-us-presidential-election/
here is 7th house put into use http://www.astrologyweekly.com/more-horary/hillary-clinton-president.php therefore the judgement of 1st chart is correct - Trump is 7th house and none other and he is not getting in
I can keep going back and worth on presidential elections.
T
This thread might be of interest: see the horary moderator's and Deborah Houlding's take on the same type of question.
http://skyscript.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=8841
I note that the chart was constructed last August. I cast a chart for the moment. Of course, the sun is now leaving Capricorn, headed for Aquarius. Interestingly, the sun is also in the 7th, with Capricorn on the Dsc; but an old meaning of Saturn in or ruling the 7th is that the astrologer should discard the chart, because the querent is not going to like the answer. Hmmmmm.
But you see the problem.
Alternatively 'the sudden surprise'
may be that Trump fails to buy the Presidency