Venus Virgo / sag Mars man

sibylline said:

His being fire and earth dominant (because he really only has one planet in air, discounting Pluto because it stays in the same sign for over a decade) is so far from the point. I didn't even realize the elements of his charts until this was mentioned. You're also creating a false dichotomy here -- fire/air vs earth/water -- as if those are the only two elemental dominants a person can have, or there even needs to be an element which is predominant.

I don't think anyone here even mentioned the elements his planets were in. I re-read the posts to make sure, and nope. Of course fire/air men are capable of commitment. My bf's brother is Gemini Sun and Mercury with Leo stellium and he's attached at the hip to his gf. Even more attached than my bf is, and he's got the three water signs in Sun, Moon, Ascendant, with Capricorn Mars traditionally ruling the Asc. I think we all know men with fire and air dominant who are happily committed.

Back to the point -- his mindset and behavior is the problem. The chart gives us the basis and specifics of his issues, but the man has said he doesn't want to be in a relationship not just to Bluebell but to other women he has been involved with and clearly shows commitment aversion. No astrological knowledge is necessary to see that. I'm glad she is going to move on...hopefully she will move on.

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Forget the whole element thing. I was referring to Katydid's post(s) about Gemini Moon/Uranus/Sagittarius Mars/mutable squares). I think it's best for her to move on, but I don't think it's because of those placements, they may be difficult but I don't think those placements make someone undateable, which seems to be implied. We all have demons but what's the quote? we all need someone whose demons play well with ours. I think it's best in general not to stay too attached to one individual because even if he does turn around and decides he wants commitment, it will be on his terms...you can't expect anything or you'll get hurt...I think it's best to keep your options open, date other guys, if anything happpens (with any of them), it will develop naturally

sibylline said:

Oh, he forgave you did he? Lololol. You don't need to be forgiven because you didn't do anything wrong, unless there is something you're not sharing.
What is "exciting" to you?
From your posts it seems like he enjoys the closeness and companionship that comes with a relationship (when he wants it) without actually having to commit.

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Well, it's funny because the first few times I saw him and he spoke to me I hardly looked twice at him because he looked like the exact opposite of what I was striving for - someone looking to be a responsible adult. But when I did speak to him, one of the first things he said to me was my job probably wouldn't agree with his weed smoking, and rather than it put me off, I was impressed by his honesty. And it resonated with this rebellious side I have suppressed. Then he said he was only after something casual, but since I had just broken up with someone, I was persuaded by a friend to see him again. And so I did but I wasn't taking him seriously at all and had had a couple of drinks when he came round, and this is when the 'incident' occurred - I went to cook a pizza and thought I heard him textin on his phone like my ex used to, so I threw the pizza box at him and said 'I'm not cooking a pizza if you're on your fone,' but it turned out to be remote. I just laughed it off and we had a good night, including play wrestling which left a couple bruises (he does martial arts.) Anyway, he left later that evening and never messaged me again. And after a week I felt used and sent him a message saying I was going to phone police and say the bruises were from an assault.

Well, fast forward a year to now, and we've been talking for a few weeks. He said he wanted to meet up and I said no, I don't do casual, last time wasn't for me. I didn't realise he took my threat seriously as well, as it was clearly just intended to wind him up but he says that behaviour from me made him not trust I have good intentions. So he says he wants to just talk to me and let stuff happen 'organically.' But it's been a few weeks now, and he won't meet up with me. And it's making me insecure. Then I rant, he sticks to his guns, and I apologize and try to be nice again.

What do I find exciting? His fire energy, and his mind. It's weird because i could be living with him underneath a bridge and I would feel safer with him than I would with say a successful businessman who is a coward underneath his suit. His mind keeps me warm plus he's a challenge.

craft94 said:

Forget the whole element thing. I was referring to Katydid's post(s) about Gemini Moon/Uranus/Sagittarius Mars/mutable squares). I think it's best for her to move on, but I don't think it's because of those placements, they may be difficult but I don't think those placements make someone undateable, which seems to be implied. We all have demons but what's the quote? we all need someone whose demons play well with ours. I think it's best in general not to stay too attached to one individual because even if he does turn around and decides he wants commitment, it will be on his terms...you can't expect anything or you'll get hurt...I think it's best to keep your options open, date other guys, if anything happpens (with any of them), it will develop naturally

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Good point, even if he does decide he wants a relationship in the future, it will probably all be under his terms, as that's the way he's living his life atm.

craft94 said:

Forget the whole element thing. I was referring to Katydid's post(s) about Gemini Moon/Uranus/Sagittarius Mars/mutable squares). I think it's best for her to move on, but I don't think it's because of those placements, they may be difficult but I don't think those placements make someone undateable, which seems to be implied. We all have demons but what's the quote? we all need someone whose demons play well with ours. I think it's best in general not to stay too attached to one individual because even if he does turn around and decides he wants commitment, it will be on his terms...you can't expect anything or you'll get hurt...I think it's best to keep your options open, date other guys, if anything happpens (with any of them), it will develop naturally

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Here is what I originally said, and I stand by my OP:


Sorry Belle, but I am not feeling too good about this guy for you. Put on your seatbelt and crash helmet, at the very least.

He has the Moon in Gemini opposed Mars conjunct Uranus. So he probably does what he wants, when he wants. And with out a lot of concern about other’s needs/wants., as that opposition squares Mercury retro and Venus in Virgo.

I think he relies upon others for his needs/wants and is not always responsible and/or reliable when others need him. He wants total freedom from other people ’needs’—yet expects them to be there for his wants/desires.

Please do not think you will tame him or domesticate him. I think he knows how to lure people in by pretending to want to ‘be tamed’—but I don’t think he really intends for it to happen.

His Moon opposes Mars/Uranus and squares Mercury/Venus. His Moon in Gemini is severely challenged by Mars/Uranus in Sag. That is the ultimate in rule breaking, rebelliousness. And that energy is challenged by retro-Mercury/Venus in Virgo. I think he looks to others for a life line when he is adrift and lost, but eventually finds fault with them so he can leave, and feel justified walking out.

Maybe I am wrong. But please keep your eyes wide open.

Are you in a relationship with him?
=============================================


Those aspects, by themselves, do not make anyone 'undateable. ' But combined with his current words and actions, they do.

He admits to and behaves much like I described above. He likes to be 'connected' in a distant, arms length way. He gets just enough to satisfy himself, but will not go out of his way to satisfy her needs/wants. And that is detrimental to her emotional/mental well being as it makes her feel flawed and insecure.

craft94 said:

Forget the whole element thing. I was referring to Katydid's post(s) about Gemini Moon/Uranus/Sagittarius Mars/mutable squares). I think it's best for her to move on, but I don't think it's because of those placements, they may be difficult but I don't think those placements make someone undateable, which seems to be implied.

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I think she was more talking about the aspects, and the aspects are what I see as problematic also, although mutable squares have their own particular tendencies. It's just calling it what it is.

I would always advocate looking at the chart but not favoring or disfavoring someone based on that. If the difficult aspects of their chart begin manifesting in ways that make them more trouble than they're worth, then you already know precisely what is going wrong and why, and you don't have to spend too much time figuring things out.

craft94 said:

I think it's best in general not to stay too attached to one individual because even if he does turn around and decides he wants commitment, it will be on his terms...you can't expect anything or you'll get hurt...I think it's best to keep your options open, date other guys, if anything happpens (with any of them), it will develop naturally

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I agree with not getting too attached to someone who hasn't made a solid commitment to you, but I'm not a multi-dater because it's simply not in my nature. I just don't waste time waiting on a guy who isn't fully into things from the start.

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@Bluebell

Well, you sound...fiery. I'll admit I would be giving you an evil look if you threw a pizza box at me for texting and threatened to call the police on me. Clearly the latter is inflammatory and he didn't know you well so didn't know you were playing/being dramatic. And I tend to be on my phone a lot during free moments. My bf sometimes gets annoyed by that and he will kindly ask me to put it away while we're eating, watching a movie, etc. and I do so. No pizza boxes need fly.

None of this changes what I think of him, however, but now I'm even more convinced you need to find someone like you.

sibylline said:

@Bluebell

Well, you sound...fiery. I'll admit I would be giving you an evil look if you threw a pizza box at me for texting and threatened to call the police on me. Clearly the latter is inflammatory and he didn't know you well so didn't know you were playing/being dramatic. And I tend to be on my phone a lot during free moments. My bf sometimes gets annoyed by that and he will kindly ask me to put it away while we're eating, watching a movie, etc. and I do so. No pizza boxes need fly.

None of this changes what I think of him, however, but now I'm even more convinced you need to find someone like you.

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Yes, the pizza box moment was a bit embarrassing. When we stared talking again, I explained that my ex has messaged other girls whilst saying it was in my head. As for the threatening thing, well it was only after a week off him not speaking to me and not telling me the pizza thing had put him off me. I mean, I said to him, well if I was good enough to sleep with after that, then you owed me the truth about losing interest. But HE says that my performance means I deserved no respect back. And so, for a few weeks now, I've been letting him get to know me. But it's like, don't talk to me if you're not interested, but he does have valid reasons to keep me on 'probation.' So that's where I lose the argument :/ and it doesn't matter if I tell him I was going through a tremendous hard time, he says he knows how far my mind can go now. He's smart but also kinda spiteful :/

Bluebell87 said:

Yes, the pizza box moment was a bit embarrassing. When we stared talking again, I explained that my ex has messaged other girls whilst saying it was in my head. As for the threatening thing, well it was only after a week off him not speaking to me and not telling me the pizza thing had put him off me. I mean, I said to him, well if I was good enough to sleep with after that, then you owed me the truth about losing interest. But HE says that my performance means I deserved no respect back. And so, for a few weeks now, I've been letting him get to know me. But it's like, don't talk to me if you're not interested, but he does have valid reasons to keep me on 'probation.' So that's where I lose the argument :/ and it doesn't matter if I tell him I was going through a tremendous hard time, he says he knows how far my mind can go now. He's smart but also kinda spiteful :/

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Well, with my guy friends that sort of stuff gets you on the "do not contact -- crazy" list. I don't like it, but they will just ignore women who bring "drama" and the ones who are married b!tch about their wives who do. There are cultural differences though, even here, some sub-groups are more accepting of off the cuff behavior like this than others.

I finally watched the video you posted all the way through. I liked him, especially at 10:00-10:50, then he started talking about America and I thought he sounded like a nut.

sibylline said:

Well, with my guy friends that sort of stuff gets you on the "do not contact -- crazy" list. I don't like it, but they will just ignore women who bring "drama" and the ones who are married b!tch about their wives who do. There are cultural differences though, even here, some sub-groups are more accepting of off the cuff behavior like this than others.

I finally watched the video you posted all the way through. I liked him, especially at 10:00-10:50, then he started talking about America and I thought he sounded like a nut.

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Haha yes I know what you mean. He did say it was his 'favourite crazy party story' and I said that was a bit judgemental as you don't know where someone has been for them to get to where they are. And all it took for that to happen was an ex constantly lying to me.

Maybe I just need to face facts that his opinion has stuck and it doesn't matter if I know it was just down to the stress and alcohol. And his opinion has changed and we get on great, which is why I thought we should meet. But he wants it to happen 'organically, but that made me feel insecure and like that little girl so I just ranted at him for a few days there, then I asked the horary.

He's funny isn't he!! Do you not think what he said about America was true? It certainly put the other guy in his place! We have a great laugh together. I knew we would even after last year, call it an intuition thing. But he's needing time and proof I guess.

I'm going to try get his birth-time in the next couple of weeks.

Bluebell87 said:

Haha yes I know what you mean. He did say it was his 'favourite crazy party story' and I said that was a bit judgemental as you don't know where someone has been for them to get to where they are. And all it took for that to happen was an ex constantly lying to me.

Maybe I just need to face facts that his opinion has stuck and it doesn't matter if I know it was just down to the stress and alcohol.

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Let me clarify that I do not think your behavior is the cause of his. I expect he would have been the same regardless of what you did or didn't do. It's just now, like you said, a convenient excuse.

Bluebell87 said:

He's funny isn't he!! Do you not think what he said about America was true? It certainly put the other guy in his place!

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He says all of that with a "NY" cap on...

Can you tell me what he said at 11:46-11:50? I find his accent a little difficult to understand, despite being pretty good with various accents.

He's funny though. I rewinded 11:57-12:06 several times (though part of that was because like I said, I couldn't understand a couple of words). The U.S. has an interesting history and not above critique, not that he told the whole story, but we won't get into the history of the UK and compare and contrast. Barack is also okay -- he shares Sun and Moon signs with "Respek".

Oh, do please get the birth time. It shall be interesting to see.

Ah, I just thought of your chart and realized why you're so enthralled by this guy and his antics. You've got Mercury in 7th like me and that honestly would be enough because Mercury in 7th needs a true meeting of the minds -- connecting mentally and getting that back and forth stimulation comes first. I used to be more attracted by the verbally amazing, highly intelligent men, mostly scientists, engineers, and the like, but it's toned down a bit since I realized I can bring that side out of someone who isn't naturally that way. After all, it is your Mercury.

But then the Mercury is conjunct Jupiter, and is in mutual reception with Mars in Gemini in the 9th house which rules the 7th. Gotttt it. There are committed, reasonable, spontaneous, verbally gifted men out there though, trust me.

Oh ok so I checked back on the times and he said 'you won't see me like mr magoo, and you're mother fu**ing inner child is bigger than you.' Hahah....he's so funny. And it wouldn't surprise me if he didn't notice he was even wearing an NY cap, he doesn't seem to care, which gives him more integrity I think. I would want to look after him and give him a bowl of soup and a cuddle hahaa...

Yes all that about what you said about Mercury in the 7th, I put it down to the Mars in Gemini only...I've been in a bubbled confusion the last week, so I think it should settle down now and il see him for the friend he has the potential to be. Such a shame he needs to be on his own tho! I'm thankful he was as honest as me and didn't say he wanted more just because I said that's what it would take.

Certainly, I would want him in my life as a friend. He's such an interesting character and I'm at glad at least then I'm not in he category of the girls he does just have casual with. Rather a friend than that

I'll need to find my spontaneous fun-loving guy, it'll be hard to beat his intellect though, let's hope this crush passes soon *_*

Bluebell87 said:

Oh ok so I checked back on the times and he said 'you won't see me like mr magoo, and you're mother fu**ing inner child is bigger than you.' Hahah....he's so funny.

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Ohhhh, "inner child"... Lol! I was all, "What, 'inner tail?', 'inner chair?'"

Bluebell87 said:

And it wouldn't surprise me if he didn't notice he was even wearing an NY cap, he doesn't seem to care, which gives him more integrity I think. I would want to look after him and give him a bowl of soup and a cuddle hahaa...

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Awww, ViP in the 6th house. I'm similar except it's more like, "I know you've had a hard time. Let me hear all about it. I will heal all of your emotional wounds". 8th house.

Bluebell87 said:

I'll need to find my spontaneous fun-loving guy, it'll be hard to beat his intellect though, let's hope this crush passes soon *_*

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I thought the same about my first love who was Gemini Sun/Sagittarius Moon and Ascendant because our mental connection was stronger than anything else I had ever experienced. I found others though. Actually this guy looks a bit like him (of course he doesn't have massive under eye circles), so maybe he is Sag Rising also. I actually thought Aqua at first but I could see him as many Ascendants, even Cap.

I think he can string words together well and has the trademark Leonine dramatic flair but I certainly know men who are bright enough to keep you intrigued.

I'm going to go hang out with my bf but I'll be back tomorrow.

You have Venus in the 8th house? I can definetely get that sense from you that you like to heal and understand people. It's easy to come across intellectual people, but those that have the intelligence to use their intelligence to understand and not judge, are surely wise, which is a far better achievement than mere intelligence. Have you posted your chart on here?

My first love had Mars Gemini in opposition to Uranus, sun in opposition to Uranus too and was a Gemini sun, Scorpio moon and rising, Venus Aries. He was extremely loyal but ultimately all that Scorpio was too stifling for me. Although he's been the only one that was truly there for me. My other ex was a long distance relationship, he lived and worked all the way down in London as a guard for the queen. But his cheating *** broke my heart. He's an Aries sun, moon Capricorn, Venus Gemini trine Mars Aquarius...he's married now and recently emailed me saying he missed me (what an ahole).

Oh yes I love his leonine flair. What a pity but oh well, you win some, you lose some. Although I did use a bit of reverse psychology on him last night and it def worked, now just to back off and only see him as a friend. (And date someone new asap).

sibylline said:

I think she was more talking about the aspects, and the aspects are what I see as problematic also, although mutable squares have their own particular tendencies. It's just calling it what it is.

I would always advocate looking at the chart but not favoring or disfavoring someone based on that. If the difficult aspects of their chart begin manifesting in ways that make them more trouble than they're worth, then you already know precisely what is going wrong and why, and you don't have to spend too much time figuring things out.

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Those are difficult aspects, but I have difficult aspects in my chart too. So does Bluebell (Venus-Uranus). Most people do. It shouldn't make us unloveable or undateable or whatever. I've seen posts online, saying why you should never date people with certain aspects and I think it's ridiculous. A person with all 'easy' aspects would be boring imo. My main thing is, people have different visions of what's difficult for them. Going by Bluebell's chart, I feel like she'd probably have less difficulty with a Moon-Uranus guy than she would with Moon-Pluto. But if this guy's being an ******* and making her feel insecure, none of that really matters. You don't need that.

Also, Katydid made that post before Bluebell elaborated on her relationship with this guy. The elaboration understandably reinforced her opinion, but she originally drew her conclusions on aspects alone... which isn't necessarily a bad thing, that's why people read synastry charts after all... I just...personally don't see how moon-uranus or moon in gemini is bad for her... like I said, I think some hard aspects are easier for some people to handle than others. Some people would find it easier to deal with Moon-Pluto

Bluebell87 said:

You have Venus in the 8th house? I can definetely get that sense from you that you like to heal and understand people. It's easy to come across intellectual people, but those that have the intelligence to use their intelligence to understand and not judge, are surely wise, which is a far better achievement than mere intelligence. Have you posted your chart on here?

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I do have Venus in Pisces in the 8th house. It's awesome, as you can imagine.

No, I haven't posted my chart on here because I'm pretty private about myself and I've had bad experiences doing that in the past. I will tell you any details you want to know, however.

You're right, these people can be hard to find but they do exist.

Bluebell87 said:

Oh yes I love his leonine flair. What a pity but oh well, you win some, you lose some. Although I did use a bit of reverse psychology on him last night and it def worked, now just to back off and only see him as a friend. (And date someone new asap).

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Yes, date someone new. He seems like he'd make a good friend but not so good of a boyfriend.

craft94 said:

Those are difficult aspects, but I have difficult aspects in my chart too. So does Bluebell (Venus-Uranus). Most people do. It shouldn't make us unloveable or undateable or whatever. I've seen posts online, saying why you should never date people with certain aspects and I think it's ridiculous. A person with all 'easy' aspects would be boring imo.

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You're repeating yourself here. No aspect makes a person unlovable, and no one said there was. I do think you're reading a bit too much into this, based on your own experiences and feelings.