Synastry Luminary Orbs

I was just wondering what you all thought about luminary orbs for synastry.

Do you think it's too much to give a 14 degree orb for (same sign) conjunctions between the luminaries and chart angles?

For example, let's say your sun conjuncts the other person's midheaven. Or their moon conjuncts your descendant.

I mean, I SWEAR to you that I have distinctly felt an orb that wide. Have you?

Thoughts?

Edit: Astrotheme sort of backs up my theory by recommending a bracket of up to 14 degrees for searching conjunctions on their site. And they mention that they give up to 12 degrees for aspects between the luminaries...
http://www.astrotheme.com/synastry_advice.php

Generally speaking I dont allow orbs that wide (14) in synastry at all, nor even in natal, even between luminaries. But there are no set "rules" and I keep certain guidelines which are flexible. You just have to use your intuition and look at the overall pattern of things happening between the two charts and decide what is likely significant and impacting in relation to other aspects. When deciding what the most important or strongest energetic aspects will be, the ones ruling the picture so to speak, all those at 3° or less are most significant. Add a couple more if a luminary is involved and a couple more beyond that if two luminariues are in aspect, like a Sun-Moon conjunction at 7-8°,will likely be felt IMHO, but weaker than if the orbs were smaller.

I agree with Horus. I myself usually only use a 3-5 degree orb for personal planets, and 5-7 for luminaries. A 14 degree orb? That's almost half an entire sign.

Once again, I also agree with Horus. I stick to about 7.5 degrees for two luminaries and 5-7 degrees for personal planets up to and including Saturn. After that I use about 1.5 - 2 degrees for the outer planets.

thanks guys!

so, do you think that what i could potentially be feeling is that the two planets or angles are in the same sign?

does point a from my chart being in the same sign as point b from someone else's chart have a similiar feel to a conjunction?

What's the difference?

There's such a thing as conjunct by sign, square by sign, etc. When there isn't an actual energetic dynamic, a "beam of energy" if you will, linking the two planets by a valid interapect orb, they may still cooperate or differ. I'm mainly talking luminaries or personal planets only.

For example my Mars at 7° Libra is not conjunct my gf's Venus at 21° by aspect, but my yang sex/desire/assertion nature is in a matching frequency (Libra) to my gf's yin love and attraction nature so they are conjunct by sign and that shows fundemental compatibility in that department; we both love romance, harmony, words, poetry, etc.

If I was with a woman with an Aquarius Moon in the third decan, and it was not squaring my Scorpio Sun in the first decan, we'd still be running into problems because they are square by sign, the frequencies don't match, and the Aqua Moon's antipathy for intimacy, need for space, independence etc. would still conflict with my Scorpio Sun's intention to get close and establish an emotionally deep connection and bond.

It's always possible that any strong bonds or links you are feeling can be explained by something else, or by a combination of influences like having Venus or the Sun activating a lunar node with a conjunction, or planets activating an angle or sitting in the 4th-8th houses.

I also agree with tight orbs; however, in Hellenistic astrology and also in Vedic astrology today, aspects were taken by signs, not by degrees between points/planets; so, for the Greco/Romans (and for jyotishi) if 2 (or more) planets are in the same sign, they are considered conjunct regardless of how many degrees might be between them in that sign. I myself only consider aspect by sign only IF there are no aspect by degree involving the given planet; however, in synastry, PERHAPS if 2 planets are in the same sign, they might possibly be considered in conjunction even if seperated by a wide distance within that sign; something to think about...

if Sun is in the other's 10H and moon is in the other's 7H, even if not in orb, the two persons can prolly still feel something similar to Sun conj MC and Moon conj 7H. That I see as luminaries lighting up the relevent houses, rather than an aspect interpretation

molly91 said:

I was just wondering what you all thought about luminary orbs for synastry.

Do you think it's too much to give a 14 degree orb for (same sign) conjunctions between the luminaries and chart angles?

For example, let's say your sun conjuncts the other person's midheaven. Or their moon conjuncts your descendant.

I mean, I SWEAR to you that I have distinctly felt an orb that wide. Have you?

Thoughts?

Edit: Astrotheme sort of backs up my theory by recommending a bracket of up to 14 degrees for searching conjunctions on their site. And they mention that they give up to 12 degrees for aspects between the luminaries...
http://www.astrotheme.com/synastry_advice.php

Click to expand...

Hello.

As per my astrology system, I take all the planets in the whole sign for having an effect as per their placement.

Like for example jupiter in first house in the 3rd degree and suppose mars in the 28th degree in the fifth house. In my eyes it is a trine. But for some person who have a specific problem and to pinpoint the time I then take some very tight orbs / degrees of various planets and also look at the moon for starting of its effects.

My system is the whole sign system and you should try it too sometimes. It is easier to understand.

And once again for a strong effect the difference between the two planets (one natal and one the transiting one ) should be tight. Whether it is 2-3 degrees or 4-6 degrees is a matter of contention, and different things work for different astrologers.

But the effect (general ) should be felt during its stay in that whole sign.
But expecting a strong effect is difficult when the difference b/w them is very wide say 18-25 degrees.

Hope I have explained what I have actually wanted to explain.

The problem I have with aspects by sign is that the planets in that particular sign often get modified by aspects to other planets. My Cancer Sun, for example, doesn't behave like a typical Cancer Sun at all. It may trine my Scorpio Moon and Pisces Ascendant, but there's this 'pesky' (though I love it) square to Uranus that makes all the difference to me.

Somebody with a 'typical' Cancer Moon would probably feel familiar at first, then most likely really start to bother me.

So how do you take that into consideration?

molly91 said:

I was just wondering what you all thought about luminary orbs for synastry.

Do you think it's too much to give a 14 degree orb for (same sign) conjunctions between the luminaries and chart angles?

For example, let's say your sun conjuncts the other person's midheaven. Or their moon conjuncts your descendant.

I mean, I SWEAR to you that I have distinctly felt an orb that wide. Have you?

Thoughts?

Edit: Astrotheme sort of backs up my theory by recommending a bracket of up to 14 degrees for searching conjunctions on their site. And they mention that they give up to 12 degrees for aspects between the luminaries...
http://www.astrotheme.com/synastry_advice.php

Click to expand...

No way is 14 degrees valid even with birth charts. In Synastry no more than 3 degrees between aspects...even with luminaries such as Sun and Moon....Maybe 4 degrees at most. If you say you feel it it may be something else..Conjunctions are by nature close and upon each other..

bittermoon said:

The problem I have with aspects by sign is that the planets in that particular sign often get modified by aspects to other planets. My Cancer Sun, for example, doesn't behave like a typical Cancer Sun at all. It may trine my Scorpio Moon and Pisces Ascendant, but there's this 'pesky' (though I love it) square to Uranus that makes all the difference to me.

Somebody with a 'typical' Cancer Moon would probably feel familiar at first, then most likely really start to bother me.

So how do you take that into consideration?

Click to expand...

You are considering the chart as a whole and the aspects elsewhere and that is the essence of good astrology...THe outer planets are very powerful when connected to the personal ones and give great change and effect.

bittermoon said:

The problem I have with aspects by sign is that the planets in that particular sign often get modified by aspects to other planets. My Cancer Sun, for example, doesn't behave like a typical Cancer Sun at all. It may trine my Scorpio Moon and Pisces Ascendant, but there's this 'pesky' (though I love it) square to Uranus that makes all the difference to me.

Somebody with a 'typical' Cancer Moon would probably feel familiar at first, then most likely really start to bother me.

So how do you take that into consideration?

Click to expand...

Like I said, I primarily consider aspect-by-sign secondary to aspect-by-degree; however, just briefly looking at an aspect-by-sign-only system (like the Hellenists had and the Vedics still have), in those systems other factors come into play which modify the sign-aspects: eg, the Hellenist principle of dodekatemorion (the "shadow" place or ramification of a planet or other horoscopic point): the "dodek place" of the given planet was also delineated as if the planet were actually there, and then these indications were blended with the delineation of the planet's primary placement: so for example an aspect-by-sign of, say, Moon to Venus, would be modified by any other aspect-by-sign to the dodek of Venus: thus Moon might be square Venus (by sign) but also trine (by sign) to Venus dodek!

Now I am not advocating adoption of aspect-by-sign, nor of following the Hellenist approach to dodekatemorion: I am just passing along this information as a possible item of interest to some of our AW members!