Inevitable and damaging solar return

I just noticed something else: comparing your SR chart with your natal, SR Saturn is in your natal ninth house, as is Mars--and Mars is stationary, about to go retrograde. The Mars station doesn't show in the Astrodienst chart, I just know that because I'm following the current transits--but that both of these placements are in your ninth house indicates that this is a time to rethink your relationship to, and way of going about, higher education.

Since this is in your ninth house, and Sagittarius to boot, there could also be a message about travel and escapism and using travel to escape your problems--but from what you've said, it sounds like education is the big issue right now. That's something you can't escape from.

If you were somewhere else during your solar return, those planets would still be in your natal ninth house, so you really wouldn't be able to escape that. By staying put, you're keeping Saturn on the SR ascendant, which puts that issue front and center for you this year. If you had managed to get away, so that Saturn were "safely" away from your ascendant, all that would do is push the issue to the background. Which would only serve to make you unhappier because you wouldn't be doing anything about the real problem.

Osamenor said:

[...] To me, it seems obvious that what you need to do is look for what you can do that would be immediately productive. That's apparently what you haven't been doing. You've just been following the empty promise of university, haven't you, even though it's not working for you? [...]

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You know, today I have seen the taxes of university to pay. It was for me a bad sensation.Am I paying so much for this empty promise? You know, I felt myself got tricked: that by learning more I would have been of more position, better... more developed... I have to learn... and learn... then at one point, I felt myself looked upon as one who has to learn and learn, and so as if one unable to work something. I am really tired of this. I will answer slowly to your posts, because what you had written deserves longer consideration.

I haven't read all the replies on this thread. Just a few here and there.

I am kind of wondering how much of this is Saturn talking in your posts. Rather than the "reality". which is kind of oxymoronic to say, since saturn is the harsh light of day.

But I noticed you have Sun square Saturn natally, Saturn placed in the 10th, Saturn transiting the 9th currently. Sun in square to saturn is the perpetual self doubter, biggest enemy is self defeatist thinking. With saturn in the 10th. Showing restriction and a house that will require much effort on your part to really master which typically comes after the 1st saturn return. Your saturn return will be in the second week of January 2018. So there is some time yet. With uranus and neptune there as well in the house of career. -Technology studies seem like a good idea, and there is guaranteed work since we live in such a technological world now. But saturn requires a great deal of persistence in this house, career won't come without effort on your part.

A 9th house Sag, speaks of doing well with higher education such as university studies. Jupiter in Taurus- in my opinion means capable of the hard work. I really like Osamenors description of jupiter in taurus, being hands-on, interesting makes a great deal of sense since it's taurus, very tactile sign.

But with Fire luminaries - sun aries- moon leo both are action oriented, ego oriented. the "look at me, I'm here" kind of theme. And with the sun in square to saturn - the universe won't permit you an ego without your hard earned work for it. (sun/saturn). So you can feel something like "look at all my hard work and where is my reward for it." (ego) but the universe says just keep working..

Just an aside, something to reflect on.. If you leave university and if you ever wish to return you might feel too old to return at a later date. I am speaking from experience.
If you study outside university, such as getting occupational studies in computer science for instance... make sure to master it, get some kind of credentials in paper format, such as a certificate/diploma. Employers do care about such things. Regardless of what country your from.

"For mastering occupational studies in computer science" are you telling at the university?


You know, for perpetual self-doubt sounds to me more like Neptune-Sun, for what I perceive.

Marcoilrosso said:

"For mastering occupational studies in computer science" are you telling at the university?

You know, for perpetual self-doubt sounds to me more like Neptune-Sun, for what I perceive.

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I was referring to studying outside of university, if that is what you choose to pursue. As a degree from university is easier to navigate when trying to prove your skill set with employers.

Neptune/Sun ... Let me state, very clearly IMO..is boundary issues. difficulty in seeing yourself clearly.

Sun/Saturn is like the little guy that sits on your shoulder that doesn't believe in you, your talents, your skills. The struggle is to prove him wrong or knock him out.

ashriia said:

I was referring to studying outside of university, if that is what you choose to pursue. As a degree from university is easier to navigate when trying to prove your skill set with employers [...]

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Yes, I am interested in it.

Osamenor said:

[...] "I need to be doing something," not just learning something. As for learning itself, Jupiter's placement tells us about your approach to learning, and you have it in Taurus, which is a very physical, hands-on, concrete sign. On the cusp of your second house, it suggests that the best way for you to make money is by doing something concrete, maybe working with your hands. Venus in the second adds a Venusian message.

Is there something you want to do that would be physical and hands-on, and would make something beautiful/more harmonious? That seems to be the message of your second house. And all that fire in your chart would suggest creativity, will, and passion.

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I dedicate to sport, even if I don't know how to put in a job, particularly for general health improving. Yes, that would include me the liking for massage, physioteraphy, similar.

Marcoilrosso said:

I dedicate to sport, even if I don't know how to put in a job, particularly for general health improving. Yes, that would include me the liking for massage, physioteraphy, similar.

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Perfect fit for your second house!

I don't know how you qualify for those jobs in Italy. Is a university degree required? Or are any of those something that you could qualify for by taking a short term course that just offers a certificate? Here in the US, physical therapists have to have degrees, but regulation of the various professions is left up to the states, and in most (maybe all) states, you can become a massage therapist with just massage school--much shorter and cheaper than a university education.

I also notice that you have the moon right at the cusp of your sixth house. That seems to me to be saying that you need your day-to-day work (sixth house) to fit with your deepest desires (moon). And since your moon is technically on the fifth house side of the cusp, there's also something a bit fifth house about it. I'm inclined to interpret that as turning a hobby into a job. Since this is in Leo, the fifth house idea, that this needs to be something you enjoy, would be emphasized.

However, your moon also squares your Jupiter. Perhaps that would indicate different pursuits that, at best, enhance each other, or at worst, make you feel conflicted over which to do. With that spread out chart, you can't be satisfied by just doing one thing. Even if you just have one job, you need lots of other interests and activities in your life.

Jupiter trines your tenth house planets. That suggests that Jupiter's indicators are the best help you can have in pursuing a career, whatever that career is.

Osamenor said:

Perfect fit for your second house!

I don't know how you qualify for those jobs in Italy. Is a university degree required? Or are any of those something that you could qualify for by taking a short term course that just offers a certificate? Here in the US, physical therapists have to have degrees, but regulation of the various professions is left up to the states, and in most (maybe all) states, you can become a massage therapist with just massage school--much shorter and cheaper than a university education.

I also notice that you have the moon right at the cusp of your sixth house. That seems to me to be saying that you need your day-to-day work (sixth house) to fit with your deepest desires (moon). And since your moon is technically on the fifth house side of the cusp, there's also something a bit fifth house about it. I'm inclined to interpret that as turning a hobby into a job. Since this is in Leo, the fifth house idea, that this needs to be something you enjoy, would be emphasized.

However, your moon also squares your Jupiter. Perhaps that would indicate different pursuits that, at best, enhance each other, or at worst, make you feel conflicted over which to do. With that spread out chart, you can't be satisfied by just doing one thing. Even if you just have one job, you need lots of other interests and activities in your life.

Jupiter trines your tenth house planets. That suggests that Jupiter's indicators are the best help you can have in pursuing a career, whatever that career is.

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For physiotherapy in Italy yes, and for this fact I don't think about it. Well, I like to work in gymn, even by doing sheer sports.
Perhaps the message is what Charles Carter calls the principle of Cosmic Variety for the planet, or concept of one branch developing into many ramifications.
My brother and my father always told so.
You are right ashriaa, but I need something more immediately productive for now. Perhaps I will continue university side-to-side.

Thank you everyone.
I wanted to ask this: where do you consider physicians, dentists, hospitals... in a map?

Marcoilrosso said:

"For mastering occupational studies in computer science" are you telling at the university?


You know, for perpetual self-doubt sounds to me more like Neptune-Sun, for what I perceive.

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I think that is your south node in virgo you're over analyzing and falling back into the comfort of social practicality. With a north node in the 12th, you should absolutely trust those gut instincts you spoke of earlier. You can always go back to school when and if you feel it is truly the necessary path for you.

Marcoilrosso said:

Thank you everyone.
I wanted to ask this: where do you consider physicians, dentists, hospitals... in a map?

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The 6th house, Sun or Venus would do well in such careers ...
Your Sun in 12th house holds great compassion for others, which can indicate doing well in those areas too, but better in a more secluded form like psychiatrics.

Mfroyer said:

The 6th house, Sun or Venus would do well in such careers ...
Your Sun in 12th house holds great compassion for others, which can indicate doing well in those areas too, but better in a more secluded form like psychiatrics.

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Thank you Mfroyer. Well, I was asking it for health issues: you know, last time my dentist was a bit rough with me, and I had remembered this episode yesterday without having consciously thought about it. So I am asking myself if is appropriate to change him.

What do you think about the rest of the return?

I see Mercury highlighted very strongly, on multiple counts. What Mercury represents, and the houses it rules for you, are likely to be big this year. To break down what I see:

- Mercury rules your natal IC and DC, and also rules your SR DC

- Mercury is angular in all three of the charts you posted: conjunct the AC in your natal and progressed charts, and the IC in your SR chart

- You asked about profections. That's a traditional technique, which I'm not very familiar with, my knowledge of traditional astrology being very minimal... but in traditional astrology, not all planets are activated all the time. What activates a planet is such things as a prominent position in the solar return and progressions, and the time lord technique. Every year from birth through age 11 is ruled by the corresponding house and its ruler: first house from birth until your first birthday, second house from your first birthday to your second, third house from your second to your third, and so on. When you turn 12, the cycle begins again. Whenever you turn a multiple of 12, another cycle begins... so age 24 is a first house year, 25 a second house year, and so on. Since you're 28, this is a fourth house profection year for you, which makes Mercury your time lord for the year.

- Even without considering profection, you have Mercury highlighted several times over, so it's definitely important.

Now, looking at what it represents: since Mercury rules your SR seventh and fourth houses and your natal fourth, and is on the IC in your SR chart, I would expect the themes of home and partnership to be up right now. The most likely interpretation is, of course, marriage. If you're single, I would expect getting married, or moving in with a partner, to be in the offing... either it happens this year, or it comes under very serious consideration. If you're living with a partner but not married, maybe this is the year for tying the knot (or at least giving it very serious consideration!), and if you're already married, that relationship is going to be front and center for you in some way. Probably, this is something you're already seeing.

Since Mercury is on both your natal and your progressed ascendants, I would expect this home/partnership theme to play into your sense of identity very strongly.

Yes, I am single. I have an unresolved thing with a girl. Of which end possible, obviously, I can't know about until it comes... but I will not surprise if this thing turns into an enmity.

Correction to my post above: this is a fifth house profection year for you, not fourth house, so your time lord for this year is the moon, not Mercury. However, all those other Mercury indicators still stand.

I think even the axis 9th-3rd in someway gets related to relationships and family. What do you think about this in the return?

Marcoilrosso said:

I think even the axis 9th-3rd in someway gets related to relationships and family. What do you think about this in the return?

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Possibly. Siblings are one of the third house's indications. However, looking at your SR chart, what I see is lots of emphasis in the SR fourth house. Fourth house is the house of home and family. If you're seeing family issues as a prominent part of your life right now, that emphasis in fourth house reflects it.

Your fourth house in this solar return chart overlaps with your natal first. I would expect whatever is happening for you right now with a fourth house theme (home, family), is also tightly connected with your sense of self and your relationship to the world (first house). Since Uranus is part of this picture, I wouldn't be surprised if there's some sort of shakeup going on. Or, maybe you're planning to move within the next year? Uranus in the SR fourth could indicate a change of residence.

Osamenor said:

[...] I wouldn't be surprised if there's some sort of shakeup going on. Or, maybe you're planning to move within the next year? [...] could indicate a change of residence.

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Definitely. It is one of the motives (or perhaps the first) of because I'm searching for something more immediately productive. It was subconsciously growing through time: perhaps that position means I am willing to actualize. I hope I am on a right track. A shakeup is started, but I think it will be very ardent near the end of april.