Is Astrology a Religion?

[Monk]

Hi David Starling,

Sorry i've been very ill, and not cheered up by the UK Budget 2016 about disablement, no doubt Jup has been looking!

I liked your private message, but Spanish i have difficulty with, however i have worked there many years ago, so got the meaning, obviously i'm better at Latin, Ha Ha!

I love Lady Weybread, but superstition can rule in religion, it is best that astrologers don't look that way, but can matter in our religious birth, that comes out in Electional astrology!

There is a concept, that Plato caused this in religion, i have no idea if he is right, he thought that every soul has a companion star that it returns to upon death, so long as it has lived a just life, however killing others i would deem not just, we will come to that later....religion is a mixture that can be influenced by astrology, if allowed by electional astrology....i'll be back, i'm feeling stronger!

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.ph.../StarsAreSouls

[Monk]

Hi David,

You have talked of "Prophetic Visions" in Religions, i'm not keen if attached to the stars, it seems too much like electional astrology, and not rare clairvoyance:-

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clairvoyance

Example below, but i'm not keen on Opus Dei, "Work of God" and all the whips...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opus_Dei

Josemaria Escriva de Balaguer says he experienced a Prophetic Vision on 2nd October 1928 to start God's Work, in Madrid, meaning Opus Dei!!!

As the Sun rose on that day at location, perhaps JA can guess what star was culminating? I will show astronomy later today! Many in religion follow the ancient philosophers in secret at a top level, ha ha!

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by Monk

Hi David,

You have talked of "Prophetic Visions" in Religions, i'm not keen if attached to the stars, it seems too much like electional astrology, and not rare clairvoyance:-

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clairvoyance

Example below, but i'm not keen on Opus Dei, "Work of God" and all the whips...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opus_Dei

Josemaria Escriva de Balaguer says he experienced a Prophetic Vision on 2nd October 1928 to start God's Work, in Madrid, meaning Opus Dei!!!

As the Sun rose on that day at location,
perhaps JA can guess what star was culminating?

I will show astronomy later today!
Many in religion follow the ancient philosophers in secret at a top level, ha ha!

One of the usual suspects Monk

[arya ishtar]

Originally Posted by david starling

Science and Math are Neutral!

my bad. let me rephrase that: do science and math seem to *prove* or *disprove* said beliefs? i.e., the belief that the world is 6000 years old...

[Monk]

Hi Jup,

I'm a lot better, but have one leg and a bar of soap, so not exactly right, but diagram below, i need to go to sleep now...

It must be noted that Josemaria Escriva is controversial, he is a saint by catholic means thus canonized!

I have a long history of being involved in Clairvoyance/ ghosts etc, my personal input is that JoseMaria Escriva isn't truthful about vision, he chose day because Sirius was culminating at location at sunrise on 2nd October 1928, in Madrid, thus electional astrology!

Jup knows that Sirius in belief is crucial in religion about souls!

Astronomy picture on private members download below:-

[david starling]

Originally Posted by arya ishtar

my bad. let me rephrase that: do science and math seem to *prove* or *disprove* said beliefs? i.e., the belief that the world is 6000 years old...

Atheists attempt to USE Science to disprove Religious beliefs. Fortunately, Astrologers don't have to get involved. Except, maybe, to try to figure out what Chart factors might incline someone to prefer Atheism to Religion, or vice versa.

[arya ishtar]

Originally Posted by david starling

Atheists attempt to USE Science to disprove Religious beliefs. Fortunately, Astrologers don't have to get involved. Except, maybe, to try to figure out what Chart factors might incline someone to prefer Atheism to Religion, or vice versa.

thought this was a thread about whether or not astrology *is* a religion. what i was trying to say was, astrology is rooted in math and science. heck, it was the *first* science. so by contemporary definition of a religion, it is not, as religion is based on faith, not facts. but thousands of years ago, it was the language with which man expressed what they saw as the movements in god(s)' domain, so yes.

to summarize: no. and yes.

[Monk]

Hi Arya Ishtar,

There is no doubt i follow ancient Philosophers, although i seek debate, i see that your thread name involves Ishtar, a Babylonian Goddess, Isis was a Goddess too!

We can debate, but poor David Starling you are burning, perhaps you may want debate from me, please note, easy target, half dead...ha ha!

I should be sleeping by now, eekk!

[Monk]

Obviously i'm weak in debate due to health, but be careful, i might be an "ITSY BITSY SPIDER"...roll the dice, who knows?

I'll be back soon, with my religious spider ha ha!

[arya ishtar]

huh... nothing i said struck me as being terribly debatable.

but then i spent a few minutes in supplication to ishtar, queen of heaven, the clouds parted, and my prayers were answered.

she sez, "belief structure."

all hail the queen?

[david starling]

Originally Posted by arya ishtar

thought this was a thread about whether or not astrology *is* a religion. what i was trying to say was, astrology is rooted in math and science. heck, it was the *first* science. so by contemporary definition of a religion, it is not, as religion is based on faith, not facts. but thousands of years ago, it was the language with which man expressed what they saw as the movements in god(s)' domain, so yes.

to summarize: no. and yes.

Astrology is rooted in math and science, and religion is rooted in Astrology.
Believe it and/or Not!

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by david starling

Astrology is rooted in math and science,

and religion is rooted in Astrology.

Believe it and/or Not!

OBSERVE it or not - Astrology is rooted in observations of celestial bodies over millenia - Monk is a mathematician and astronomer

[thelonelyguest]

all gringos wrong
10 planets 12 signs
22 major arcana
22 paths tree of life
ponder on it!

[david starling]

Originally Posted by thelonelyguest

all gringos wrong
10 planets 12 signs
22 major arcana
22 paths tree of life
ponder on it!

Green Grow the Lilacs!

[david starling]

Math and science are rooted in Symbolic Language. So Poetry is at the root of math and science, Astrology, and religion. Monk is a Free Verse poet!

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by Monk

Hi Jup,

Your link is old, look to uk budget 2016 and disability links, the budget was yesterday, they are gonna get me oops!

Wish it was the bankers getting it, ha ha!

after some research....
'.....The House of Lords has been unable to stop a planned £30-a-week cut to disability benefits
forced through by Government MPs. This will cripple those in receipt of these benefits,
leaving many in literal poverty.
The government must reverse this decision. Lives are at risk.....'


There's an online petition on the issue now Monk
the petition has 117,282 signatures and counting


REVERSE THE ESA DISABILITY BENEFIT CUT https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/124016


Parliament considers all petitions that get more than 100,000 signatures for a debate
Petitioners have been waiting for 1 day for a debate date


Government responds to all petitions that get more than 10,000 signatures
Petitioners have been waiting 8 days for a government response

[JUPITERASC]

Hi Monk

DONALD DUCK AND SACRED GEOMETRY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kVTPwPh7ioU

[arya ishtar]

Originally Posted by david starling

Astrology is rooted in math and science, and religion is rooted in Astrology.
Believe it and/or Not!

ahh, but should we not judge a tree by it's *fruit*, not its roots?

in present times, all manner of religious and secular peoples the world over put up "christmas" trees. you can't tell by looking at a *tree* if the owner has put it up as a christian religious practice, or just as a pretty decoration.

and *at its root* (heheh) it is a pagan practice of peoples forced by christian persecution to bring their groves and their worship indoors, away from prying eyes. are all these people now pagans? of course not.

so, i guess you would have to be able to see "the heart" of the practitioner, to see *their* intent, as things started thousands of years ago *rarely* carry with it the original intent, and become rote practices.

so, i guess you *could* make it your religion, but seems more like a practice that *stems from* the gods than a hierchical structure of dogma and rules that defines most current religions.

or, like buddhists, you could make *everything* a meditation, doing even the most mundane of tasks as "for the buddha."

but buddhists say buddhism is not a religion, but a belief system. very sticky stuff here. but nifty to cipher.

*goes to do dishes as to buddha*

[Monk]

Sorry, so long to reply, i'm ill and trying to do a lot of work!

Thank You Jup for Video, i love cartoons, and i think your find is the best to find the origin of Math, THANX, very funny, but very informative!!!!

I don't have a religion regarding beliefs and rules of behaviour, math only show there are calcalations in all living things, for me it shows a god, but we work out the rules of behaviour ourselves!

I don't like war or terrorists!

You know how i work out intended religious acts that kill, many that do so think their soul will go to Sirius the Isis Star or Alnilam, Belt of Orion, the Osiris Star, so these acts are aligned by usaully start of day by these stars, i thought i would start easy, by our start of day and today by midnight, my programme shows this by 00:00 in astronomy by location.

Today, 19th March 2016, there was a terrorist suicide bomb in Istanbul, please read below:-

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/March_...tanbul_bombing

I'll continue soon!

[Monk]

So if electional astrology was used by an individual to kill others, he might want to go to Sirius or Alnilam, by ancient secret beliefs, usaully this is done by midnight day marker a modern approach to the day by paran, or Roman and Ancient Egyptian day start being sunrise, or ancient Greek day start being sunset previous at exact location by paran, which is the same as modern astronomy!

I feel recent examples give the idea, better than any debate regarding religious belief and what happens in the world of the "Electional"!

The four directions are used, so on 19th March 2016 in Istanbul, the horizon in the West was used for terror, MIDNIGHT DAY MARKER WAS USED to mark the day, Sirius was Setting at location in the WEST, graph on private members download:-

[noraleader]

a free floating concept you can work into your dance card if you like..

akin to buddhism (as intellectual practice) i like to reference "epistemological solipsism" a lot, which, like bits in my sig, is really the idea that being habituated to not knowing may be more effective in the application of thought than being habituated to knowing..

eg. in chinese literature we observe "sun wu kong", "monkey awakened to emptiness" .. to the idea that life is illusion, unknowable..

.......may i put forth that, as you know in math, the "zero" is said to conceptually increase the worth of mathematical practice most profoundly.. let's then liken this to the "zero" in knowledge .. epistemology.. (..science?!) ..

..consideration of the doubtful nature of knowledge profoundly increases our ability to parse given a set of informations..

[Monk]

I'm just getting my life in gear again, so don't think i'm finished regarding previous dates in Turkey in March, i'm afraid the Itsy Bitsy Religious Belief Spider may shock you, i'll be back when i can!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lkTxXxhgoo

[Monk]

Hi Noraleader,

I'm not religious, i follow Math, but understand PARANS to fixed stars, which is the oldest beliefs...please note i'm only showing others beliefs, not my own!!!

Parans are the oldest of astrology beliefs regarding fixed stars, so could be crucial to Soul destiny, however projected fixed stars are extremely inaccurate, where as parans are exactly right with astronomy at location, i'm making a case for electional religious astrology for so many dates being chosen BY PARAN, i'm not making a case that astrology shows god by fixed stars, there are big differences!!! PARANS usaully mark the day, but can sometimes mark the time, but perhaps that is intended...can you understand that? Electional secret religious astrology????

So we go backwards in March 2016 to 13th March 2016 in Ankara, Turkey, where modern midnight was used again to mark the day in belief...please note i'm always giving examples...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/March_2016_Ankara_bombing

At midnight day marker on 13th March 2016 in location of Ankara, Turkey, by astronomy, Alnilam, Belt of Orion, and Osiris Star, was setting along horizon in west, i feel day was intended and chosen by secret religious belief and electional...

Astronomy Graph on private members download...obviously being a mathematician and astronomer i give many examples???? All are correct!

The religious spider is just symbolism to real strange beliefs!

[noraleader]

..something for my own dance card thank you

with very little other relevant data, i can volunteer that ataturk is recorded as being a mason of rank (33rd?) so i would not be surprised to hear of anything in connection regarding that nation being synchronised. they seem to like that sort of thing.

beyond trig, my practice of mathematics comes from audio dsp; i see little, it does seem as if math is often fantastically creative and becoming, eg. actualised/becoming true by discovery.. perhaps a difficult concept for some or more simply, "funny patterns in things seem to occur all the time".

[JUPITERASC]

Originally Posted by noraleader

a free floating concept you can work into your dance card if you like..

akin to buddhism (as intellectual practice)

Originally Posted by noraleader

i like to reference "epistemological solipsism" a lot, which, like bits in my sig,
is really the idea that being habituated to not knowing
may be more effective in the application of thought
than being habituated to knowing..

eg. in chinese literature we observe "sun wu kong", "monkey awakened to emptiness" ..
to the idea that life is illusion, unknowable..

Originally Posted by noraleader

.......may i put forth that, as you know in math,
the "zero" is said to conceptually increase the worth of mathematical practice most profoundly..
let's then liken this to the "zero" in knowledge .. epistemology.. (..science?!) ..

..consideration of the doubtful nature of knowledge
profoundly increases our ability to parse given a set of informations..