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Natal Astrology A place to discuss yours and others' birth charts (after you post your own birth chart interpretation). Includes psychological and relocation astrology, houses, aspects, and planetary dignity and debility.

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Unread 12-26-2013, 06:58 AM
Birch Dragon's Avatar
Birch Dragon Birch Dragon is offline
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"Tree of Life:" Ascendant, Descent, Nadir, Midheaven

A common way to interpret the Ascendant, I've noticed, is as an individual's "face" in the world: literally what we look like, but also our outer personality. A common way to interpret the M.C., it seems, is as a point that indicates career, vocation and/or where we influence the wider, public world.
But then, I keep running into hints that there is something much deeper about these two fundamental axes in the natal chart.
Dane Rudhyar calls these two axes "the roots of individualized consciousness." Astrodienst calls these angles "our personal cross of matter" or our "tree of life." Martin Schulman advertises his book on the Ascendant (which I haven't read) by calling the Asc. one's "karmic doorway." I've seen forum member peircethevale call the Asc the "who", the Desc. the "where to," the I.C. the "how" and the M.C. the "why" of our lives. Forum member may28gemini in a recent post said it was a common mistake to conflate Asc. and M.C. with the 1st and 10th houses when in fact these axes speak to something deeper: our very essence.

I'll admit that at this stage - and maybe forever - I'm digging into astrology to dig deeper into myself. The impetus behind all of my questions on this forum are ultimately selfish. But comparing notes and beliefs on these two key axes might prove interesting and insightful all around.

My question to astrologers: How do you use these fundamental axes in your astrological readings, and why? What are the beliefs behind the way you think about these axes?

I understand what the axes represent astronomically. When I ask "why?" I'm asking about your specific approach to astrology - which, it seems to me as I read this site, can vary quite a bit between astrologers - and how those underlying understandings of astrology lead you to see the Asc., Des., I.C. and M.C. as you do.

Thanks for indulging. I'll be reading and learning...

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Unread 01-05-2014, 06:08 AM
Auraford Auraford is offline
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Re: "Tree of Life:" Ascendant, Descent, Nadir, Midheaven

Super cool thread. I'd like to think about this one for a while, but something that I always laugh at during readings as I rediscover the concept again and again is that paradoxical relationship between two opposing signs. Of course all points on the chart experience this duality (planets included), but the "tree of life" is defined by the perpetual notion of balance, and especially the search for.

Exploring the points themselves, the relationship between AC and the MC to me right now is like the sub-consciously surface characteristics of the body and its actions to the role that the person imagines themselves in the world. However, with the natural imbalance, I see the unconscious expression often weighting itself and acting from the DC side, and the world interpreting the individual by the IC position.

I really like the "Persona Chart" on, where you can read the personalities of each of the points and planets as unique charts of their own. The chart truly is an organism of nature when you are able to see it not just reinterpreted, but actually rearranged for the personality of a singular planet. That being said, I don't think that the designation of the AC or MC axis can be more or less important that any other point, as they too can be explored using a Persona Chart. However, they definitely represent a face or even superficial aspect to the astrology chart. Again, reading the Persona Chart for the AC would show the chart rearranged to fit the chart's rising signs cumulative meaning (as well as its relationship to the rest of the natal chart).

The AC/MC axis feel very Earthen to me, as if the skin holding in the charts programming, and our surface method of expressing our creativity as beings, making me think of "our personal cross of matter". Each of the significant axis in the chart seem to be a window into a different sort of dimension. How we approach them is representative of the time period and culture in which we our living. For example, the difference in approach of the nodes in Vedic astrology to Jan Spiller. Of course they are identical in essence and archetype, but each interpretation will paint a very different chapter.
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Unread 01-05-2014, 07:26 AM
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poyi poyi is offline
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Re: "Tree of Life:" Ascendant, Descent, Nadir, Midheaven

I had explained my theory/understanding after reading several books in several older posts. The Wheel of Life or Tree of Life, both as the Cycle of Perfecting the Soul.

I see 12th house as the unconscious Seed, that is still inclose of the cell of the seed, through the death of the seed, the life began as Sprout. Through the rapid growth from 1st to 3rd house as infancy to young childhood up to 3rd house as primary school, nearby every day community, playing with siblings and relatives. 2nd house we first learned about Me, what/who is me, the infant playing with her toes, fingers, and holding on all her toys.

Then the other phase of growth of extending the Root 4th, this is where the key survival laid if we have given enough internal private time to nurture and develop our root system. Later on we may then overcome various hardship that life may bring us. Our tension with our family, parents and heritage even the birthplace and the culture itself. What do we truly Need in life, where do we find comfort? The first time asking those questions, am i being loved by my family?

Then we enter into the phase of having close friends/puppy love which is 5th house while 11th house are more distance outsider friends (11th house as large community and large group of people). Then we slowly learning about the first lesson of work, giving out service to others, to work for living very likely the first part time job even we maybe unwilling but we have to.

The 3rd active phase of growth as the 7th house, when we are into the long term partnership that is when the tree growing branches sideways to extended our support system as more Leaves and stronger Branches that eventually reflecting the first phase of growth as Sprout. We had little leaves and our stems were weak and young unable to sustain weather changes and hardship on it own for long.

Slowly we enter into the learning of sharing resources with the others, even various debt, awareness of morality/limitation, our first fear of limitation as a being for entering first phase of adulthood so we may seek higher understanding/Education, bordering our mind, our spiritual/philosophical supporting system that is reflecting on the common sense and basic knowledge we had been gathering since the youth, we started to seek the other dimension of meaning and connection to something large than ourselves.

The 4th active phase of growth, our active will and action on achieving the Glory of our life, the reflection of the strength of our internal being of 4th house the internal quality is now projecting out in the open. Then we may again share our creativity, our wishes with the large community, our dreams, making friends with the people that are not necessary beneficial to us instead we giving ourselves away for the greater good for others. And learn to accept ideas that are different to us the opposition of the Self Ego 5th Leo, and 11th Aquarius the fall of Sun.

11th house is the Fruit of Life. What we are as a person what we had produced since the first awakening of our physical life and entering into the consciousness. In and out between the internal 4th/8th and external 7th/10th sides of life. 12th house if we had learned our lessons and achieved the Great Glory/Honor and Fruits of life then we may finally gain the Unity with the collective Unconsciousness once again. Our self being of the 1st house of Aries is no longer important, we returned back to the solid as a seed, after the Flower 10th and 11th Fruit finally died down.
I believe there is something of the divine mystery in everything that exists. We can see it sparkle in a sunflower or a poppy. We sense more of the unfathomable mystery in a butterfly that flutters from a twig--or in a goldfish swimming in a bowl. But we are closest to God in our own soul. Only there can we become one with the greatest mystery of life. In truth, at very rare moments we can experience that we ourselves are that divine mystery. --Jostein Gaarder, Sophie's World
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ascendant, descent, midheaven, nadir, tree of life

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