Mars in Detriment = More competitive

Leon

Well-known member
iwonder said:
In short, No.

Is that what my reply reads like? :eek:
Right here.
iwonder said:
I am not into sports, never really have been. But I am competitive in whatever else I do. I want my project to be chosen, I want my presentation to be the most wowing, etc. I want to be the best (at least for myself), and if I know I wont, I will not try. Losing is very painful. When I know someone my age or younger being more successful, it makes me somewhat restless and I try harder. On the other hand, while I am bothered by competitiveness, acting upon it is another issue. Sometimes I only think about it, but eventually do nothing. Libra :rolleyes: When I compete, I do it hard, but I don't always choose to compete.
I wonder how it feels for people to use jealousy as a driving force to motivate themselves. I never been a jealous person despite the Four Scorpio planets, Three being personal, in my chart.:confused:

I've heard that line before, people saying they won't be "competitive" anymore if they know they can't be the best. Maybe it's a female thing? Lower testosterone. Who the hell knows.

Leon
 

iwonder

Well-known member
Leon said:
Right here. I wonder how it feels for people to use jealousy as a driving force to motivate themselves. I never been a jealous person despite the Four Scorpio planets, Three being personal, in my chart.:confused:

Leon, in these two lines you 1) labeled me jealous, 2) implied that all people with emphasized Scorpio are jealous.

I won't go into the details regarding your comment, but for starters I suggest you research the difference between competitiveness and jealousy so not to confuse the two.

I've heard that line before, people saying they won't be "competitive" anymore if they know they can't be the best. Maybe it's a female thing? Lower testosterone. Who the hell knows.
It's Mars thing. Energy out in the open is vulnerable.

I decided to come back and edit.

By vulnerable I mean open to attacks from others, where wins are as possible as defeats are. No matter where Mars is, its is that kind of energy.
 
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Astrologer4U

Well-known member
Leon said:
You should read about the Pisces effect. It's a website with PROVEN studies on which signs are great at which sports. Ali has his Sun in Capricorn. Capricornians came back as the champs for boxing. Plenty of prize fighters, boxers, have the Sun in Capricorn.

Anyways regarding why having a Taurus Mars could be helpful for boxing. Just look at the sport. It takes patience, discipline, and even some stubbornness. You have to wake up early in the morning to go run the streets while everyone is flat out asleep, there's no one telling you to go do it, and no "teammates" to motivate you. Then you drill in the same old movements over and over, countless repetitions. Now here's the fun part, the fighting. Most people typically get their asses beaten during the first few sparring sessions, and fights. This is where the stubbornness comes in, because this is where the average person will quit the sport. They realize that they "don't like to get hit", so boxing isn't for them.

Speaking for Ali his Mars is in his 10th house, so of course he's going to get easier recognition from the world for being a warrior.

Becoming good at a sport takes serious time, dedication, discipline, and effort. It's no joke. It's dangerous to assume some random person will become good at sports just because they have their Mars in some harmony loving signs, so they "struggle".


Leon, interesting what you have said...Very good observation on your behalf. I have Mars in Taurus, at the time this particular incident took place in my life, I didnt' know anything about mars in taurus, didn't even know I had Mars in taurus. Let me not forget, my sun is in Cap as well...

http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showpost.php?p=119299&postcount=14
 

Leon

Well-known member
iwonder said:
Leon, in these two lines you 1) labeled me jealous, 2) implied that all people with emphasized Scorpio are jealous.

I won't go into the details regarding your comment, but for starters I suggest you research the difference between competitiveness and jealousy so not to confuse the two.



It's Mars thing. Energy out in the open is vulnerable.
so you don't want to take risks?:confused: Whenever I read about Mars I think of testosterone. More testosterone makes people more more inclined to take risks. Now that you mention it I know a Libran fellow with his Mars in the same sign. It can be a self-esteem thing too, people who suck at it are more likely to feel that they'll get the negative outcome. He's afraid to take risks due to fear about the results not coming out "good". Anyways regarding "keeping up with the Jones", do you guys feel things are out of balance once they one up you since Libra believes in "equality"?
 

Astrologer4U

Well-known member
iwonder said:
I won't go into the details regarding your comment, but for starters I suggest you research the difference between competitiveness and jealousy so not to confuse the two.


This is just an opinion based on my observations. Generally jelousy leads to competition. The one who wants to compete against the other, has seen something about the other, that may make him, ( the jelous one) not shine as much. Through beating out and winning in some kind of competition against the (The one the other is jelous of) the one who is jelous now has no reason for being jelous... Unless he is not acknowledged for beating the one he is jelous of. For a scorpio, he does not have to be acknowledged for his winnings, unless he has something in fire, Aries, Leo or Sag, more than likely Aries or Leo.
 

iwonder

Well-known member
Leon said:
so you don't want to take risks?:confused: Whenever I read about Mars I think of testosterone. More testosterone makes people more more inclined to take risks.

I do, but it is not as much Libra Mars that make me want to risk as my 8th house Sun, I think. I like the thrill, whatever it maybe.

Now that you mention it I know a Libran fellow with his Mars in the same sign. It can be a self-esteem thing too, people who suck at it are more likely to feel that they'll get the negative outcome. He's afraid to take risks due to fear about the results not coming out "good". Anyways regarding "keeping up with the Jones", do you guys feel things are out of balance once they one up you since Libra believes in "equality"?

For someone with Libra influence acting up involves weighing things, as I mentioned before. Potentially, Librans can (or think they can) shake everything around with their actions. It can be disastrous, so Libras spend much energy on keeping from disbalancing things, some may see it fear or indecisiveness. It maybe the case, I don't know. When used positively, it is diplomacy. You don't have to fight to get your way.

Equality as being like Jones - no. I was talking about different type of equality, meaning fairness and justice. Being like Jones has nothing to do either with Mars competitiveness the way I see it, nor with equality in a Libran sense.
 

iwonder

Well-known member
Astrologer4U said:
This is just an opinion based on my observations. Generally jelousy leads to competition. The one who wants to compete against the other, has seen something about the other, that may make him, ( the jelous one) not shine as much. Through beating out and winning in some kind of competition against the (The one the other is jelous of) the one who is jelous now has no reason for being jelous... Unless he is not acknowledged for beating the one he is jelous of. For a scorpio, he does not have to be acknowledged for his winnings, unless he has something in fire, Aries, Leo or Sag, more than likely Aries or Leo.

Yes, jealousy is directed against someone, competitiveness in this case is driven by the desire to make other(s) look worse.

Don't tell me all those who put energy into reaching their goals do so because they want to beat those who are also successful.
 

tsquare

Well-known member
Kobe Bryant
http://www.astrotheme.com/portraits/57xAX7erQ9Yw.htm
Kobe_Bryant_Biography_3.jpg


Julian CASABLANCAS
http://www.astrotheme.com/portraits/te8R5ggKK376.htm


Same birthday, very different people.
Both have mars in Fall conj. pluto.


Bryant is a world class athlete.
Casablancas is the Strokes front man.

No birth time for either.

John Lennon had mars in Libra.
http://www.astrotheme.com/portraits/Lsz9Cn4Lmx33.htm


The current Dalai Lama has mars in Libra as well.
http://www.astrotheme.com/portraits/J37d37qw984x.htm
I think he may retire soon.

Will Ferral has mars in Libra....
http://www.astrotheme.com/portraits/ZR7xjrT92NRg.htm

Blades of Glory: Legend of Chaz Michael Michaels
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fUiQkApDQoE&feature=related


Bud Light Commercial.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ej9wCko6dR4
 
iwonder said:
Ray,

My Mars is in Libra. I wanted to say, my fights are for justice, if anything, but then I read your last post :D You know, it is true. I do want to argue (Mars also rules my 3rd house, Aries), and I often do it to shake things up, throw them off balance. Well, my Mars is in tight conjunction with Pluto and not so tight with Virgo Sun. But I sincerely stand for justice and equality and fight for it.

I am not into sports, never really have been. But I am competitive in whatever else I do. I want my project to be chosen, I want my presentation to be the most wowing, etc. I want to be the best (at least for myself), and if I know I wont, I will not try. Losing is very painful. When I know someone my age or younger being more successful, it makes me somewhat restless and I try harder. On the other hand, while I am bothered by competitiveness, acting upon it is another issue. Sometimes I only think about it, but eventually do nothing. Libra :rolleyes: When I compete, I do it hard, but I don't always choose to compete.

I think Libra Mars spends its energy weighing its actions. Person cannot (whether for innate reasons or due to environment requirements) act on impulse, as pure Mars energy would want. My husband has Mars/Sun conjunction in 1st house Scorpio. I could never get by with what he can: showing off his temper, openly imposing his will and such. I want (and the environments requires me) to be more diplomatic and considerate. And to maintain the drive while yielding to others requires a great deal of Martian energy. So in people with Mars in fall/detriment, what you see is only a top of the iceberg :)

Hi iwonder,

Thanks for explaining how you have experienced Mars in Libra working in your life. What I posted was just an observation it's not fact, but I just thought there was more to Mars in detriment than the usual readings. I just wanted to understand what motivates Mars in detriment how does it affect their actions and whether or not they can be are competitive. Everyone's Mars can be competitive in different ways. I have an air Mars but in Aquarius we probably both fight for the ideal in some way, but with different motives. Mars in Libra or Aquarius probably will be motivated to act on behalf of others, in the name of freedom or justice. I hate violence of any sort, I hate to see inhumanity or brutality. You made a good point that Mars in Libra would require more energy, as it's not a forward action like Aries. But Libra can use charm offensive. :D

All signs use different tactics to get what they want. Pisces can elicit sympathy for themselves or make others feel guilty. Aries can be pushy, cancer is probably similar to watery Pisces and uses emotional blackmail. Gemini can be witty & use the gift the gab to get what they want. I am making an evil list :p . All signs use different ways to get what they want either by force, diplomacy, sympathy. There are a lot of methods to get what you want or win.

Anyway back on topic, I like what you have written it makes a lot of sense.:)
 

J.Lily

Well-known member
My marriage chart has Mars in Taurus, we rarely fight:) I am a Libra I do like Peace, he is Aquarius he has Mars and Moon in Leo. Opposite Saturn conj his Aq Sun in his 12th. A Pisces ASC neptune in the 8th. He never starts arguements doesn't complain its been 3 yrs all has been well. I hope it stays that way because we do have an Aquar ASC and Uranus is in the 1st.:eek:
J.Lily
 
I have Mercury opposed Mars in synastry with my partner, but we rarely argue. It's weird he's mercury in Leo in my 12th opposed my Mars in Aquarius 6th. Maybe the 12th house influence keeps his thought silenced with me. :D He used to argue all the time with his ex lol. Or maybe she should argued with him :p .
 

gaer

Well-known member
My wife has Mars in Cappy. Mine is in Scorpio. When I get angry, I get quiet. When she gets angry, she gets quiet. Being quiet together is painful, so we are very careful not to fight. :)

In natal charts I think of planets in detriment or fall more as acting in a more indirect way than being weak. For instance, you expect Mars to take action. Taurus to me is about not taking action, being calm. But among other things, Mars in Taurus can absorb and absorb energy, just staying in place, until others wear out. ;)

Mars in Libra? It wins in another way!
 

rogue_red

Well-known member
gaer said:
My wife has Mars in Cappy. Mine is in Scorpio. When I get angry, I get quiet. When she gets angry, she gets quiet. Being quiet together is painful, so we are very careful not to fight. :)

In natal charts I think of planets in detriment or fall more as acting in a more indirect way than being weak. For instance, you expect Mars to take action. Taurus to me is about not taking action, being calm. But among other things, Mars in Taurus can absorb and absorb energy, just staying in place, until others wear out. ;)

Mars in Libra? It wins in another way!

Haha you clever man.:D Mars in Taurus here and yes its the staying power of the Bull that gives mars in Taurus an edge. Given that I have venus in aries and mars in taurus I'll take the initiative like a pitbull with a bone:D
 

The_Sundance_Kid

Well-known member
I always forget Mars in Taurus is a detriment, because I think it works quite well in general. Mars in Taurus natives I think have a consistent and fixed Martian energy with stamina, and are among those my girl friends think are the most good looking. I think the earthiness of Taurus really helps here. But I don't see competitiveness over and above any other Mars placement.

Mars in Libra I'm not so sure about... I think, like Gaer said, it makes the planet work more indirectly. But I think this filters out alot of people who don't want Mars to be indirect. So alot of people with this placement are less likely to live up to their Mars potential. So people who have Mars in detriment or fall and who do achieve Martian greatness, I would have to say I think they worked harder to get it than anyone else.

I also think the strength or importance of Mars is the determining factor. So a strong Mars by rulership and house, when being in Libra, Cancer or Taurus, might have a greater urge to express Mars but can't do it directly. This might create the competitivenes etc and over-compensation.

But if Mars is generally less important in the chart, I think the normal rules apply.

So Iwonder, how strong or important is your Mars in general... do you have Aries or Scorpio planets? Is Mars angular or elevated? Solitary? Dispositor tree thing etc etc...
 

iwonder

Well-known member
My Mars, I think, is important, but not overly so. It is in conjunction with Pluto and Sun (which makes it stronger, even though in its indirect Libra way), it is in the 8th house (good position for Mars, but not angular). Rules Aries 3rd house and co-rules Scorpio MC.

It is important because my chart in general has little fire. So Mars' conjunction with the Sun, even not a fiery one, compensates for it.

I don't consider myself an overly competitive person, no. I even used to deny it. But when I think about it, I see my competitive spirit to kick in surprisingly often. It doesn't show, maybe, from the outside. I don't appear aggressive. Not only because my Mars is in Libra. Since it is so close to Virgo Sun, the way I compete has Virgo flavor - I win by perfecting, paying attention to details and polishing things; and to Pluto/8th house - I research and dig deep like nobody else around.

So all in all, I think Mars is still Mars, wherever it is - it is the energy to get what a person wants. The sign shows how it will be applied. Maybe the way I experience competitiveness comes more from the conjunction with Sun, not from Libra placement. But I also think that planets in detriment/fall do need more of their energy to come to the level of expression they would have in another sign. Aspects will show if there is help available.
 
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Idrew

Well-known member
My mars is in Pisces which is not considered a good placement. But it is very tightly opposed my Sun and Jupiter both conjunct in Virgo and trine my Moon in Scorpio. I am very competative and I like contact sports.
 

gaer

Well-known member
Idrew said:
My mars is in Pisces which is not considered a good placement. But it is very tightly opposed my Sun and Jupiter both conjunct in Virgo and trine my Moon in Scorpio. I am very competative and I like contact sports.
A while ago I tried to collect as many charts of famous players as I could find. I don't have time of birth for them, but for Mars you only need date of birth.

Borg had Mars in Pisces. While he was dominating the world, he did it by outlasting every other player.

Chris Evert, same thing.

Then for a "weak" Sun, Libra, with a "weak" Mars, Pisces, there is Martina Navratilova, who is still playing. Of course I am joking.

But such details make me very skeptical of the idea of "weak placements" based on signs. :)
 
I do think there is more to it. I posted an article on my xanga about detriments a few weeks, it's here on my wordpress blog Delinquents. Everyone has their own view. I guess it's what works for you. I am not comfortable saying a person's Mars is in bad condition, weak, it acts differently because it's not in it's natural habitat, I'm getting in to wildlife talk now lol. Another analogy.
 
I know it's quite old a thread, but it's also very informative. I've found that what iwonder says fits me very well (Mars in Libra in the 1st conj Saturn in a stellium with Pluto) - I want to be the best and when I cannot be, I don't bother to take any action. And that also applies:

I think Libra Mars spends its energy weighing its actions. Person cannot (whether for innate reasons or due to environment requirements) act on impulse, as pure Mars energy would want.
However, I've found a way to circumvent it. It's true that I am able to ponder on wheter I should go out or not until it's too late. But for sometime already I'm "switching off" thinking. The truth is that between the impulse (or the thought)to do something and the action we usually begin thinking it over. And the trick is to go after the impulse the very moment you notice it and DON'T stop until you're in the middle of doing it. For example, If I'd think - go out or not, I can find the impulse for "go!!" somewhere there. And then I'm immediately on my feet and preparing myself to go out which is totally different story because then I might be wondering for example what to wear.
It's working, and it's working better every time I try this. The key is, to go after something **before** thinking switches on. Go after impulse!

I hope I made myself clear in this regard.

The other interesting thing is that very recently someone told me (after some time having worked together) that I seem manipulative at times. That is because I want to get a specific result and don't want to seem harsh or rude or whatever, so at first I ask nicely. I someone does this my way, splendid. If not, whole campaign begins: "Of course you can do it your way but perhaps if you'd notice this and that" and "we can leave it at that but have you considered another option" (that option is of course mine). And this campaign might last till someone does it my way, or refuses straight... and even then there might be some diplomacy. One might call it "phony war"... we are not bombing ourselves but you'll finally do what I want.
And of course some people really could see it as manipulative, never stating straight what we want, just beating around the bush.
Any other libran Mars to share something? :biggrin:
 

mjackieward7

Well-known member
i have mars in pisces, so no detriment here, but it's a strange position for mars, i could say that it is some dualistic position, energies are like silent waters or furious "charybde & scylla " waters. Sometimes you can't even do the easier things to do in life and sometimes you can do the only-god-things-u-can't-do-on-earth : i have a mars square neptune, i always underestimate me, though i have few great moments when i succeed that makes me feel so empyrean, coming to any challengers trying to defy me or not, telling: " you can't defeat me !"

Hey there,

I am new to horoscopes but I been reading alot and find out I have a really "Bad Mars" thank you for opening this topic since I been asking about a bad mars which I read it indicates violence, death, and just a whole lot of violent traits that I do not think I have. My Mars is in Pisces and according to articles it is very very negative but then again, I am still trying to memorized the symbols of the zodiac signs so bare with me..
anyone comments or sugestions would be welcome....

forgot how to post my chart but is in my profile....sorry
 
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